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Heisenberg
Trad climber
RV, middle of Nowehere
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Jun 28, 2016 - 05:38pm PT
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Have Brooke Inglehart chime in
He's super knowledgeable
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dikhed
climber
State of fugue and disbelief
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Jun 28, 2016 - 05:50pm PT
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Didn't he already have you pissing in your pants over this sh#t?
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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Jun 28, 2016 - 06:07pm PT
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Heisenberg, I know you feel that the great majority of people who comment on this subject are not knowlegeable from the point of view that they don't participate in wingsuit base. True, but the statistics seem to indicate that increased experience in wingsuit/base doesn't lead to increased saftey as it does in rock climbing.
It seems to me that increased experience/ability leads to shaving the margins of saftey in an already risky sport.
Full discosure...I have been a lifelong alpinict (no, I don't mean the Third Pillar of Dana) and the inherent objective dangers in alpinism make it more difficult for experience to mitigate risk.
I just don't buy the argument that you can't comment on something that you don't do..... statistics can tell a story
lastly, even more than Woot Woot I find "he/she was doing someting they loved" extremely annoying.
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thirsty
climber
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Jun 28, 2016 - 07:31pm PT
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Alpinism risk/reward calculations and BASE risk/reward calculations do not appear to commensurate. They appear to represent entirely different sets of life choices and life realities. I also consider myself an alpinist and know that 3rd pillar of Dana does not count. I have had many close calls in the mountains and a few situations where I spent time re-evaluating every decision I made (even after having succeeded on a route) because I thought my risk assessments were not as honest as they should have been. I am a person who has no tattoos because I don't see any benefit in light of the risks of heavy metal toxicity, future aesthetic regrets or even minuscule disease infection. From wht I have seen, serious technical alpinists rarely have tattoos – they care way too much about their health over the long run. Do BASE jumpers? I don't know any. I'm curious. It seems like alpinism and BASE jumping involve different life paradigms.
Statistics are B.S. and useless when trying to compare life-value across incommensurate divides.
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ß Î Ø T Ç H
Boulder climber
ne'er–do–well
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Jun 28, 2016 - 09:14pm PT
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Jun 28, 2016 - 09:46pm PT
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Haven't jumped in a bunch of years, but BASE doesn't seem particularly bad to me.
Proximity flying on the other hand, despite the intoxicating allure, doesn't seem to pencil-in from a risk perspective (as Donini notes). I personally chalk that up to the reality of operating in a high-speed envelope where the situational awareness and judgment requirements for 'safe' proximity flying (selecting proper flight vectors at a distance in advance) can easily and instantly exceed human perception/decision/reaction loop times.
Peregrines are wired for proximity flying, humans are not. We can do it; but past a certain proximity threshold our ability to judge and respond fast enough is far outstripped and it's at that point I think one is essentially gambling.
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chainsaw
Trad climber
CA
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Jul 11, 2016 - 01:11pm PT
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One of my best friends died wingsuiting in Utah recently. He was the best setter at Touchstone and one of the nicest people Ive ever known. He was a very hard worker and made everyone around him climb stronger. I followed him up Warp Factor just before he passed. The man climbed it like it was a cakewalk. ..... Base jumpers and free soloists in the valley jeopardize access for all of us. It took ten years and alot of time and money to reopen the ASRA to climbing after a thrill seeking bungee jumper died there. Please stay OFF PUBLIC LANDS if you intend to be a danger to yourself and others
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the Fet
climber
Tu-Tok-A-Nu-La
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Jul 11, 2016 - 06:27pm PT
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It took ten years and alot of time and money to reopen the ASRA to climbing after a thrill seeking bungee jumper died there.
Correction: a rope jumper died there.
I don't know the stats on rope jumping but bungee jumping is statistically much safer than rock climbing. I would guess rope jumping is statistically more risky than bungee jumping because anyone can buy a climbing rope and jump on it. It's very difficult to buy a bungee jumping cord without proof that you've completed training.
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Todd Eastman
climber
Bellingham, WA
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Jul 11, 2016 - 08:46pm PT
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Tough activity...
... complete multiple flights, yer a stud...
... you die, yer a fool.
Don't normalize the risks and define your own game; same as climbing.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Jul 11, 2016 - 08:53pm PT
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Peregrines are wired for proximity flying, humans are not.
Peregrines also have a flight envelope at least 100 times the area of the
best wing suit made which, if yer not versed in aerodynamics, means a vastly
greater margin of error. Just their L/D and wing loading are ridiculous
in comparison. And don't get me started on aspect ratio.
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Flip Flop
climber
Earth Planet, Universe
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Jul 11, 2016 - 08:57pm PT
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Heroes give their lives for a cause.
Fools die for no reason.
The bro bra cheerleaders get their nuts off when someone dies.
It feeds their pathetic egos.
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Lurkingtard
climber
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Jul 11, 2016 - 10:32pm PT
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Flip flop you are such a hypocritical idiot. I feel sorry for your kid.
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overwatch
climber
Arizona
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Jul 11, 2016 - 10:39pm PT
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oh oh, you're the next on the hitlist
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Gnome Ofthe Diabase
climber
Out Of Bed
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Aug 11, 2016 - 08:16am PT
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Bringing back the porn. . .
I had to wonder . . Curiosity Killed the Cat,
chainsaw, Trad climber CA. Jul 11, 2016 - 01:11pm PT
One of my best friends died wingsuiting in Utah recently. He was the best setter at Touchstone and one of the nicest people Ive ever known. He was a very hard worker and made everyone around him climb stronger. I followed him up Warp Factor just before he passed. The man climbed it like it was a cakewalk. ..... Base jumpers and free soloists in the valley jeopardize access for all of us. It took ten years and alot of time and money to reopen the ASRA to climbing after a thrill seeking bungee jumper died there. Please stay OFF PUBLIC LANDS if you intend to be a danger to yourself and others What Was ASRA, it sounded familiar?
Nice write up,
History
Technical rock climbing has been practiced in the Old Limestone Quarry located in the ASRA since the late 1980’s. The original climbers established approximately seven rock climbing routes, which required some amount of fixed protection; pitons and protection bolts. From all accounts, early climbers were not discouraged or refused recreational opportunities at this time. Early climbers included Dale Christenson, Eric Kohl, Kirk Arens, and the Hatchett Brothers. On November 18th, 1998, Kirk and friends were practicing rope jumping on an elaborate rigging system. Kirk misjudged the length of his rope jump and was killed in the resultant impact. From this point forward 'til 2003, climbers were discouraged from using the Auburn SRA for technical rock climbing, but it was not technically illegal to climb there. In 2004, the ASRA created a memorandum banning technical climbing which was in effect until October 2012, where through the hard work of CRAGS (Climbing Resource Advocates for Greater Sacramento), the Access Fund, and local climbers the ban was lifted and climbing could legally resume in the Quarry. Climbers in the early 2000’s started re-exploring the area for rock climbing routes and currently there are almost fifty established routes within the Auburn State Recreation Area. These routes cater to climbers of all levels from easy, moderate, and hard levels of climbing.
Climbing
The remaining rock cliffs left after the conclusion of active quarrying present a perfect opportunity for performance of technical rock climbing. The rock is highly featured limestone along with other sedimentary rock mixed in. The actual quarrying process itself has created large features, which are ideally suited to climbing.
It is not uncommon to see the Placer County Sheriff use the Old Quarry as a practice grounds for their Search and Rescue Team. So don't be surprised if on occasion you see a large group of folks rappel and jugging the Scale Wall. Please respect their right to use the area for this purpose and find a different wall to climb on until they are done
From here;
https://www.mountainproject.com/v/cave-valley-aka-auburn-quarry/105733941
I love that region and wanted to find the tale of the "Thrill-seeking bungee Jumper"
I bet there is so much more to that sad chapter, tuff story, regards and sorry for having looked it up
Respect to the fallen!
It was the best learning zone, before all the info was easy to come by.
You learned by doing trying ,backing off, retrieving gear, learning by doing in the vertical.
Learning to read where a climb, but more importantly How to climb safely where you don't want to be, and should not climb.
We went up, we didn't need no yellow dots on a HD picture!
( double negative intended ) I started up some very wrong "starts" that others had obviously done & some so fresh, crux features fell off on the 4th accent .
Anyway chainsaw, I envy your location.
Growing into something you do well is usually it's own reward, not so in the case of Flying pursuits.
Demonstrators of that & Ideas for the music to accompany some of the rad videos.
[Click to View YouTube Video] just watching , my fingers hurt half way through,
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Gunkie
Trad climber
Valles Marineris
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Aug 21, 2016 - 07:36am PT
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Everytime I see this thread I go to the BLINC BASE fatality list. It's a bit of morbid curiosity. The number of listed killed BASE jumping just went through 300 (now 301). So right now #302 is out there alive and well.
Don't be #302.
http://www.blincmagazine.com/forum/wiki/BASE_Fatality_List
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Aug 21, 2016 - 03:32pm PT
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There was a base fatality in the Chamonix area last week, along with a parapente tandem
guide, whose client was able to land after the guide fell out of their rig!
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