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NutAgain!
Trad climber
South Pasadena, CA
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Topic Author's Original Post - Dec 16, 2014 - 11:15am PT
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Hey folks, I'm a skiing n00b. I went on lifts two times about 20 years ago, then a year or so ago I went 3 or 4 days in a row. I went back-country skiing once with my wife- skins on the skiis up something easy, then skins off to go down- Maggies Peak near Tahoe or something like that. My kids are really into downhill skiing/snowboarding- they've had week-long ski vacations with mom a few times, taken lessons, and they managed to make it down a black diamond (accidentally) without falling as their first run of the year this year.
So I'm looking at season tix for Badger Pass rather than 3-4 days of tix at June Lake. Are the kids going to get bored quickly at Badger Pass? My daughter still prefers easy runs even if she survived an accidental encounter with the black. My son might be more aggressive and into terrain park stuff for snow boarding. But I pretty much suck and will be satisfied for at least a season in easy-ville.
Back to my main point- seems like a good time for me to consider buying gear for myself to save future rental costs. The kids are still growing like weeds so it's harder to justify buying stuff for them.
Is REI or AnyMountain a good place to buy stuff if I'm a ski idiot and don't have advanced performance requirements? I don't see pushing myself to daredevil ski exploits or advanced technical runs. I do see myself doing winter ski approaches to climbing stuff, and would like to share equip between that and downhill skiing to the extent possible or reasonable.
Thanks!
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this just in
climber
Justin Ross from North Fork
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Dec 16, 2014 - 11:24am PT
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I learned at Badger through my school. The cool thing is there was never a crowd, but if your kids are advancing fast they will get bored with that place quickly. Might look at China Peak (used to be Sierra Summit and before that was China Peak) above Shaver Lake, I think their passes are good for a few resorts now.
As far as buying gear, go with craigslist for your kids stuff, cause like you said they will just grow out of it so soon and probably save over renting costs this way. You could find some newer stuff for yourself cause whatever you buy will last you a long time.
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NutAgain!
Trad climber
South Pasadena, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Dec 16, 2014 - 11:33am PT
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Thanks for the heads up on Badger Pass and kids getting bored. Probably better to go to a place where my son can shred the gnar and tell me all about it after my daughter and I cruise down the milder stuff.
For my equip: assuming I'm not looking for world-class performance, is it a commodity type purchase to optimize for price and boot comfort? (For reference, I like to wear socks with my climbing shoes to be more comfortable)
Are there specific ski or boot or binding parts that break easily where it's better to spend more money?
Do I really need to rent for a handful more times paying attention to specific details to understand my preferences for a purchase? Or is it just a matter of getting something that fits reasonably well and saving $100-150 on rentals next week?
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Jon Beck
Trad climber
Oceanside
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Dec 16, 2014 - 11:35am PT
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I am a tightwad, but for my son I rent, lot less hassle not having to lug his gear and mine too, and they grow out of boots every year. Down side is you gotta get to the mountain before the rental shop gets crowded. Now that he is almost twelve I might buy some skis for him. Craigslist and thrift stores have piles of gear dirt cheap.
Mammoth had a Mammoth/June/Bear Mt/Snow Summit season pass for 800 bucks if you bought early, hell of a deal for anyone in So. Cal.
You might want to demo some trad skis and parabolics. Parabolics seem to rule the mountain, I prefer trad. Modern gear is pretty tough, I broke a binding once and shattered a very old boot when I jumped off a curb in a parking lot. But generally the modern gear is pretty durable.
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John M
climber
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Dec 16, 2014 - 11:39am PT
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I presume that you live near the park? Otherwise season tickets at badger don't make a lot of sense. Unless you get the really cheap preseason price. And even then, unless you have a cheap place to stay, its probably isn't a good idea.
Yes to buying gear for yourself. REI.. not so much unless you find a sale and have someone who can help guide you. . Find someone who knows gear and get them to help you buy used skis. Buy new boots. Fit is important. Though not so much for beginners. But still, you will be in them all day, so its important that they at least don't hurt your feet.
My 2 cents for you..Buy
Used skis
New boots.. unless you know how to fit them. Then it is possible to buy used.
Cheap ass poles because you will bend and break them
A couple of pairs of cheap waterproof gloves that you can change out when one pair gets wet.
Don't forget the eye wear. UV protection is a must.
The kids will get bored at badger. But more days at badger for a year is better then just a few days at a ripping place, in my opinion. At least for beginners/ intermediates. also.. if they are really hooked on skiing, then get them some lessons. Bad habits can be hard to break.
Is this a Christmas present for the kids? If not, then why not ask them which they would prefer?
The cool thing about season tickets and owning your own gear is that then you don't mind heading up for just a few hours, on those days when time is limited.
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Gorgeous George
Trad climber
Los Angeles, California
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Dec 16, 2014 - 11:49am PT
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Nut, what size boots do you wear? I'm in San Gabriel and have several pairs that I don't wear anymore. I'm the opposite of you, I'm a ski fiend, and have old skis laying around cluttering up my garage that skiid well before parabolics came into fashion.
I still rent for my kids because they are growing, but I bought 20 years ago and buy new sh#t every five years or so (I'm overdue).
Downhill skis won't work for winter approaches. I want to buy an outfit that's better for travel than locking the heal down and doing steep gullies, but haven't found what I want in that capacity either.
PM me off line and I'll hook you up. My boots are probably size 10-10.5.
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Splater
climber
Grey Matter
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Dec 16, 2014 - 12:24pm PT
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There is a whole new generation of robust AT gear now coming out that can work at a resort and backcountry.
You should not buy it at this point. Too new, too expensive, too many unknowns for what you want.
Since it's next week - it be easiest if you just rent at the mountain. Then they can fix any problems, or trade out the boot size.
Once that new robust AT gear is a bit more sorted out, I probably won't buy any more pure downhill gear, esp since my knees & back can't take too much aggressive resort skiing.
If you're not an aggressive skier, you would do ok with recent AT boots and a used ski + compatible AT binding. But that won't be nearly as cheap as used downhill gear. In the off season, (not now) stores like Mammoth Mtng sometimes have their previous rental skis with Dynafit bindings on rental baseplate for about $400.
One other thing about cheap gear. Do NOT buy old skinny 1980- early 90s type skis, often found on junk sales. They suck - are much harder to turn, less fun, sink in soft, are mounted with obsolete bindings that won't match modern DIN boots. They should all be turned into fence posts and benches.
You might consider some of the boots that have soles that can switch between downhill DIN and lugged. Some of them may not strong enough and the removable parts can fail.
There's also the really light (& expensive) AT gear, mainly for rando racing; some of the boots can be used on ice, but not ideal.
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nah000
climber
no/w/here
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Dec 16, 2014 - 01:45pm PT
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i'm with DMT...
ski gear has become so specialized that until you know what you want to spend the bulk of your time doing, you should just buy used...
ultimately, if you spend enough time in the game, you're going to want a quiver anyways...
haha.
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Tork
climber
Yosemite
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Dec 16, 2014 - 01:50pm PT
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If you're on the Eastside hit up the thrift stores in Mammoth. If that doesn't pan out go to the gear exchange in Bishop.
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Captain...or Skully
climber
in the oil patch...Fricken Bakken, that's where
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Dec 16, 2014 - 01:52pm PT
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Pawn shops rule for good cheap ski gear....here in Idaho, anyway.
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crankster
Trad climber
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Dec 16, 2014 - 02:02pm PT
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You live where?
Sounds like an AT setup is what you need. Here in Truckee, Dynafit bindings rule, along with a good AT boot that accepts Dynafit (they almost all do nowadays, but not so all used boots). Most folks are skiing a ski around 100mm in the waist and up. Downside..this stuff is pricey.
This setup would work at the resort and also allow you to backcountry ski, with skins, of course. The boot is the critical link. I'd suggest new boots and find a deal on a used ski. I've seen a lot of ski days ruined by ill-fitting boots.
A plan B would be to get some used downhill gear to make sure you're really going to get into it. Unfortunately, the ski swaps were in the fall. I also prefer a specialty ski shop over REI and Any Mountain.
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steve shea
climber
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Dec 16, 2014 - 02:15pm PT
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I would not buy yet. Try to find a ski shop that will do a season long lease. There are many. The lease should include skis boots and poles with the binding safely adjusted to you according to DIN standards. Start with something on the short side. Med/soft flex but stiff torsion. The ski will hook up easy and hold an edge. Most recreational skiers are on skis way too soft torsionally and the skis will not hold well on harder snow.
See if the lease program will grow with you allowing a switch to longer skis as you gain confidence. Some programs even have a maintenance add on for extra bucks. This will allow you to hit all the rocks you want and still return the skis for tune ups. Most recreational skiers do not tune or wax. It cannot be overstated how much a well honed and waxed ski adds to your on snow experience!!! Skiing is really pretty simple. You want the ski, tip, to engage at the top of the turn, hold across the fall line and into the belly of the turn, then release easily allowing for the start of the next turn. Tuning can make all the difference. Any good ski shop should be able to accommodate you if they really want the business and are experienced pros in ski industry.
A similar lease here in JH is less than 200USD for the season. These are not high end demos but good modern rental gear. If the gear looks older than three years do not do it. Ask. Also take a couple of lessons from a certified instructor just to get you off of the level you are on and they will give you things to work on. This way you do not plateau like so many who just go out and flop around. You will improve fast if you are diligent about it, above all have fun.
The switch to side or backcountry will be easy and a lot more fun if you learn the fundamentals with lift serviced skiing. Repetition!! Then when you get in funky snow you can encounter off piste you'll be prepared. Hell I could have learned to surf if there was a tow back out through the line up. Repetition.
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steve shea
climber
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Dec 16, 2014 - 02:25pm PT
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If you can afford it, who cares? The fun of skiing with your kids is priceless and not matched, IMHO, by much except climbing with them. Go for it! We were all NOOBs once.
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goatboy smellz
climber
लघिमा
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Dec 16, 2014 - 03:39pm PT
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Ski boots are like climbing shoes, everyone has a favorite, it's best to rent several styles before committing to buying. Same goes for ski length, I can ride anything between 180 to 198 depending on ski profile and snow conditions.
Listen to Steve, find a lease program from a local retailer and figure out what ski boot best suits your style and foot type along with ski length and binding.
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujò de la Playa
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Dec 16, 2014 - 04:17pm PT
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Go out to intersection rock and browse through the cars?
OK - don 't buy new. There are lots of places to get used. I bought alot of new stuff which cost so much I could never throw it away. No, it's not for sale, I could never get a high enough price.
See what it can do to you.
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StefanS
Trad climber
Leavenworth WA
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Dec 16, 2014 - 04:53pm PT
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My kids love downhill skiing, it our family thing to do. We get our gear thru a combination of hand-me-downs, horse trading and ski swaps. If you can plan ahead getting stuff in the off season is a way to go. Renting for the season is good, it saves time when you get to the hill, and then it goes away during the summmer.
We try and commit to buying early bird season passes also. It totally demoralizing for me to buy a lift ticket at the start of the day, especially when you have to get four or five. Some areas have recip deals with other areas so you can check out other hills for less. Depending on how old your kids are I would worry about them getting bored, kids are able to be creative if needed. If there is a terrain park, no problem.
Some of my favorite days in the mountains have been skiing with my family. Whats not to like about ripping 30 Mph down the hill.
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujò de la Playa
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Dec 16, 2014 - 05:40pm PT
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^There are a couple names that appear on the ST from time to time (one who occasionally posts and another who can't) that might say that the only thing not to like is that it is not fast enough.
I'm sure there a couple or few more who could credibly agree, though I'm not one of them.
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kunlun_shan
Mountain climber
SF, CA
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Dec 16, 2014 - 06:51pm PT
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I agree with Chim-Chim. Personally I would never buy or recommend buying used boots, as they will fit someone else's feet and NOT yours. Boots are a critical piece of equipment, no matter your ski ability. If your boots are moving around inside of your boots, they are not controlling your skis. And if you have pressure points on your feet, you will probably not have fun. I'd invest money on good boots, and buy them at a place that employs good boot fitters. I drive all the way to Tahoe to get ski boots fitted as I have not found a decent ski boot fitter in the SF Bay Area.
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rlf
Trad climber
Josh, CA
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Dec 16, 2014 - 07:02pm PT
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Skiing is easy.
First, buy the cheapest crap you can find. Then do what I do, strap on the two sicks of death and go downhill wildly out of control screaming "GET THE F*#K OUT OF MY WAY" and hope your bodies bone count doesn't triple by the time you reach the bottom.
Now that's not complicated!
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climbski2
Mountain climber
Anchorage AK, Reno NV
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Dec 16, 2014 - 07:37pm PT
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Boot fitting is a huge key to happy skiing and quick progression in your skill level. Used is ok if you know what you are looking for have a good selection know how to fit or have a real experienced boot fitter helping you out.
ei..I'm not sure how someone in your position can really find a proper pair of used boots. Luck maybe
Steve Shea gave some beautiful advice. It is possible to get a decent pair of season lease boots at some shops. I worked at a shop that prided itself in its season leases and if someone asked we would go the distance in getting them into a good fitting season lease pair of boots even doing some custom work.
If you are going to be doing this for several seasons spring for a pair of good custom footbeds also.
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