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Footloose
Trad climber
Lake Tahoe
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Topic Author's Original Post - Sep 30, 2014 - 02:41pm PT
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Is it safe to consume this amount of elderberry,
as a single serving for as long as a couple weeks with cereal and such. Nothing green or unripe. These are uncooked not cooked. Anyone know?
I know there are many botany experts here. Appreciate any info you can give me in this regard. I'm concerned about cumulative effects (arsenic, alkaloids, being the principles, I think) if there are any. They are very tasty uncooked. Hence the question.
They were harvested from the Sierra, Alpine Co, just days ago. Also, there are many species of elderberry, anyone know exactly what this Sierra species is?
Thanks in advance.
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Footloose
Trad climber
Lake Tahoe
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Topic Author's Reply - Sep 30, 2014 - 02:49pm PT
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Thanks, ekat!!
I was hoping you'd be around when I posted.
Do you have any personal experience eating them raw, not cooked?
Apparently cooking them destroys an alkaloid toxin (but I have
no idea what species or species this applies to; article didn't say).
I'll check out your link. Thanks again!
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snakefoot
climber
Nor Cal
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Sep 30, 2014 - 02:57pm PT
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had them raw in the valley in the mid 90's, about that amount and i felt horrible for about 4 hours...I do not recommend raw.
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NutAgain!
Trad climber
South Pasadena, CA
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Sep 30, 2014 - 03:08pm PT
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I ate a raw handful last year- about 25% - 50% of amount in the photo, and felt a little weird afterwards. Didn't get sick or vomity, just a little weirdness in the mouth (I don't remember specific symptoms now, I remember wondering at the time if I was stupid to eat them). No other issues.
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SC seagoat
Trad climber
Santa Cruz, or In What Time Zone Am I?
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Sep 30, 2014 - 03:12pm PT
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Elderberries grew crazily around where I grew up.
We ate them (after slight cooking), made juices, jams and jellies out of them, and man did they stain....permanently.
My grandmother showed us how to make ink out of them and said that was a common ink when she was very little (1890s to early 1900s).
Have fun! They look good!
Susan
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Footloose
Trad climber
Lake Tahoe
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Topic Author's Reply - Sep 30, 2014 - 03:12pm PT
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Appreciate the advice!
Over the last couple weeks, I've eaten a handful just a couple times. Didn't eat more only out of caution. The results: No ill effects from these single helpings. Most importantly, ekat, they were very surprisingly sweet and delicious right off the bush and into mouth! Maybe I got lucky? But any rate that's my interest I guess for just eating them raw and uncooked as they are - these already super sweet as is and I have a couple quarts more!
But I will continue my research...
Thanks!
SC, you would eat them raw, too? and maybe by the handfuls?
NutAgain,
"I remember wondering at the time if I was stupid to eat them." LOL. Me, too!!! But in the end I experienced nothing strange. Maybe yours were still on the unripe side perhaps?
Main concern right now is cumulative effects - eating them all - a couple quarts worth - across a couple weeks.
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DaveyTree
Trad climber
Fresno
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Sep 30, 2014 - 03:14pm PT
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I eat those things like crazy every time I see them. In fact I took my kids in the hills one weekend when they were small. They didn't like the food I brought so they ate nothing but Elderberrys for two and half days. They were fine beside a some squirts anyone would get when eating that much fruit.
Good stuff
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SC seagoat
Trad climber
Santa Cruz, or In What Time Zone Am I?
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Sep 30, 2014 - 03:17pm PT
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SC, you would eat them raw, too? and maybe by the handfuls In small amounts as we picked them. Never encountered problems. Of course they were cooked when made into jams, jellies etc. There are a wide variety of elderberries and I believe toxicity varies from variety to variety.
Susan
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Footloose
Trad climber
Lake Tahoe
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Topic Author's Reply - Sep 30, 2014 - 03:30pm PT
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Thanks you guys for the info.
I'll go research all this stuff now.
Maybe I'll just spread it out over the entire
winter/spring just to be safe.
Don't want no arsenic poisoning interfering
with my climbing activities, ha!!
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snarky
climber
Hoisington
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Sep 30, 2014 - 03:30pm PT
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The toxicity is relative to ripeness of the berry, and thankfully the cyanogenic glucosides in elderberries are readily apparent when you taste a few less-than-ripe ones (bitterness). When the berries are really ripe and taste sweet, you're generally fine to go crazy (though, if you're concerned, spit out as many of the tiny seeds as you can). I've eaten them off the trees most of my life all over California, especially when I'm out running. I believe that the benefits: lectins, flavonoids, alkaloids, sterols, fatty acids and vitamins (not to mention anti-influenzal properties that have been lab studied) far outweigh the minor risks, which would be primarily from eating unripe berries or other parts of the plant.
Caveat: Some will be more susceptible to cyanide intoxication. The acute lethal dose of hydrogen cyanide for humans is reported to be 0.5 to 3.5 mg per kilogram of body weight. So get out your lab kit and find out how much is in each berry and go from there...
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Footloose
Trad climber
Lake Tahoe
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Topic Author's Reply - Sep 30, 2014 - 03:33pm PT
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Thanks snarky!
"especially when I'm out running"
that describes my circumstances exactly. And these are very ripe, perfect
I'd say, and very sweet as is. Definitely no sugar needed.
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dave729
Trad climber
Western America
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Sep 30, 2014 - 03:38pm PT
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You eat Yogi and Booboo's elderberrys they may pay
your camp a visit looking for an alternate
calorie source.
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NutAgain!
Trad climber
South Pasadena, CA
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Sep 30, 2014 - 03:40pm PT
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"Say can I have some of your purple berries?"
"Yes, I've been eating them-
for six or seven weeks now,
haven't got
sick once"
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snarky
climber
Hoisington
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Sep 30, 2014 - 03:43pm PT
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I forgot to add that I pick a couple buckets full each season, clean them and then simmer for long enough to get rid of any cyanics (low evaporation point, thankfully) from errant greenies and stems, then press out the juice, bottle and freeze for the season. I'm not sure if it's helped keep flus at bay, but you get these nutrients in abundance. Just add it to juice.
If you're on the Eastside, we'll start seeing gooseberries soon, too. Good combo with a few elderberries. (And don't forget Miner's lettuce.)
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msiddens
Trad climber
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Sep 30, 2014 - 03:47pm PT
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Footloose- think of the weight savings on those car to car outings!
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Wayno
Big Wall climber
Seattle, WA
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Sep 30, 2014 - 03:53pm PT
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When I was kid in upstate New York it was a yearly ritual to pick elderberries for the best pies my mom ever made.
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dave729
Trad climber
Western America
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Sep 30, 2014 - 04:04pm PT
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A handfull tastes good while on the trail. But they have
a sharp acid bite. Suspect if you mash some up and submerge
strips of copper and zinc you could charge your cell phone.
Like a lemon battery.
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Footloose
Trad climber
Lake Tahoe
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Topic Author's Reply - Sep 30, 2014 - 07:16pm PT
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From ekat's link,
"Avoid unripe, green berries, they'll get you sick. Even raw ripe elderberries make some people nauseous. Cooking or drying dispels the offending substance, and greatly improves the flavor.
Baking this fruit in muffins, cakes and breads imbues them with a piquant crunchiness. They become the central ingredient whenever you use them in baked goods. Elderberries aren't sweet and contain no thickeners. Rely on other ingredients for these elements, especially if you're making the European favorite, elderberry jam."
http://www.wildmanstevebrill.com/Plants.Folder/Elderberry.html
"Another use for the wine goes back to the movie: "Arsenic and Old Lace." Two old ladies laced it with arsenic to put lonely old men out of their misery!"
Inspired, I'll probably give it a go several different ways. I'll try cooking a batch tomorrow to see how it affects the taste. They are pretty sweet already but I'll try to squeeze out even more then! Thanks everybody for the info!!
My batch appears to be Sambucus cerulea (the blue elder).
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