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tom woods
Gym climber
Bishop, CA
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Jul 31, 2014 - 07:01am PT
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The comments section is entertaining.
If they are going to talk about damage, they ought to show it.
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stevep
Boulder climber
Salt Lake, UT
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Jul 31, 2014 - 07:06am PT
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Holy cow. A whole lot of East Coasters in that comments section that seem awful concerned about a relative handful of rope swingers and not all concerned about the other much bigger potential impacts on wilderness out here.
I agree that the GoPro idiots can be pretty obnoxious, but its a minor issue compared to oil and gas development and real estate development.
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stevep
Boulder climber
Salt Lake, UT
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Jul 31, 2014 - 08:24am PT
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The story isn't about oil or real estate development.
Duh.
The story is about extreme sports in the Moab area. And the commenters are up in arms about perceived damage to wilderness caused by those extreme sports. I was attempting to point out that:
A. There's not a lot of options to do similar kinds of things on private land.
B. The damage that they are so concerned about is a drop in the bucket compared to other potential impacts. If they are so concerned about wilderness, perhaps they should have suggested turning the Jersey shore into a wilderness area.
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Mojomonkey
climber
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Jul 31, 2014 - 08:33am PT
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Human catapults sound interesting :)
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tom woods
Gym climber
Bishop, CA
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Jul 31, 2014 - 09:04am PT
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Yall know its going to get shut down, right?
DMT- I agree- by the time a story makes the New York Times, it's over.
Impact is always the reason, it is the easiest rationale to push. What one sees as insignificant impact, another sees as significant- very open to interpretation.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Jul 31, 2014 - 09:07am PT
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Give it all back to the First Nations.
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stevep
Boulder climber
Salt Lake, UT
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Jul 31, 2014 - 09:58am PT
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Some of it has already been shutdown. There were commercially guided trips being done for the swing on Corona Arch. Pretty sure that has already been kiboshed, in part because of the death mentioned in the article.
And yeah, I am a little indignant about a bunch of east coast city dwellers commenting on things they know relatively little about.
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overwatch
climber
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Jul 31, 2014 - 10:05am PT
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Good, I can't think of anything much dumber than guided rope swinging. I guess anything to make a buck pursuing your "passion"
Looked at my post again and wish to add that I didn't mean good that the guy died.
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The Larry
climber
Moab, UT
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Jul 31, 2014 - 10:07am PT
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overwatch
climber
Jul 31, 2014 - 10:05am PT
Good, I can't think of anything much dumber than guided rope swinging. I guess anything to make a buck pursuing your "passion"
At least they know that ropes stretch.
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Charlie D.
Trad climber
Western Slope, Tahoe Sierra
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Topic Author's Reply - Jul 31, 2014 - 11:13am PT
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"Human catapults", does sound interesting, a lot of hard landings....
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overwatch
climber
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Jul 31, 2014 - 11:21am PT
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Combined with a wing suit parachute combo?
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rgold
Trad climber
Poughkeepsie, NY
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Jul 31, 2014 - 11:59am PT
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Hmm. Not at all clear that "Eastcoasters" are the primary protestors. There seems to be a range of opinion from all over the country. That said, the article is in the NY Times, so you might expect it to reach a disproportionately large number of "Eastcoasters" and so provoke a disproportionate response from that region.
Another thing not known: some "Eastcoasters," like for example me, have spent an enormous amount of time out West, enough in some cases to almost be "locals" in some areas. Such people are not making remote judgements uninformed by experience at all, and we have no idea how many of them are represented in the comments.
The comment about oil and gas drilling is just plain silly. For all we know, every single East Coast poster has been active in trying to limit that kind of damage---that type of information is not part of the piece. But beyond that, the existence of large evils does not justify turning a blind eye to small evils, especially small evils that have the capacity to grow extensively.
At the end of the day, we have to ask about the purpose of setting aside such lands, and whether or not new activities are consistent with that purpose. Unfortunately, climbing does not get a free pass when viewed from this perspective, and climbers need to think themselves about whether their actions will ultimately get them banned from some areas.
Personally, I have no problem with banning things that, in my opinion, fall into the stupid outdoor tricks department, and arch-swinging is one of them for sure. But trying to distinguish between arch-swinging and climbing, for instance, is not all that easy a proposition.
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Charlie D.
Trad climber
Western Slope, Tahoe Sierra
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Topic Author's Reply - Jul 31, 2014 - 01:04pm PT
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At the end of the day, we have to ask about the purpose of setting aside such lands, and whether or not new activities are consistent with that purpose. Unfortunately, climbing does not get a free pass when viewed from this perspective, and climbers need to think themselves about whether their actions will ultimately get them banned from some areas.
rgold hits it on the head. These special places are much more than a trapeze.
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tom woods
Gym climber
Bishop, CA
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Jul 31, 2014 - 01:49pm PT
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I'm with rgold.
One thing that I hate to see are the comments about government land vs. the land that belongs to "the American people."
If it was private land, good luck- tell me how it works out.
Public land- aka "government land" is amazing, and makes my life better than it would be without.
We can make decisions about public land- which impact is significant vs. which is not. Which is worth it vs. which is not.
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High Fructose Corn Spirit
Gym climber
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Jul 31, 2014 - 08:19pm PT
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I'm with rgold...
I'm with rgold... and I'm NOT with rgold...
"Personally, I have no problem with banning things that, in my opinion, fall into the stupid outdoor tricks department (okay), and arch-swinging is one of them (false) for sure (ha!). But trying to distinguish between arch-swinging and climbing, for instance, is not all that easy a proposition." (true)
It appears, once again, we are all over the map, lol!
These special places are much more than a trapeze...
Oh, Charlie, usually I'm with you 100 per cent. And even on this one, it's close. "These special places are much more than a trapeze." That's so true but moreover, they are ALSO a trapeze for those who see them this way. Let the fun and adventure and outdoor thrills continue!! Whether it's climbing or flying (rope soaring), I am for it, as long as there's minimal impact on environs which this seems to be.
As climbski2 says below... Have fun kids! Just respect the setting by looking after it and all's good. You crazy dawgs!!
Need more girls, though! Where are the girls?! a ten to one ratio needs improvement, lol!
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climbski2
Mountain climber
Anchorage AK, Reno NV
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Jul 31, 2014 - 08:25pm PT
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I don't have a problem with any of these activities in and of themselves. Maybe certain indivuals approachs to them.. same as in climbing. Looks like fun to me. Damage.. if so then measures should be taken to mitigate damage. New sports evolve.
Have fun kids.. hope you remain free.
I hope they are given time to develop responsibly. It took climbing a while to get there too. We sure are not perfect either... seen supercrack lately? Read any accident reports lately?
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kk1982
Trad climber
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hmm, popular sandstone rappel routes have significant gouging from all the rope pulls. Seems like all those jumps must be rubbing off quite a bit of sand. Whoa, I wonder how long it'll take to saw through? yeah, they better ban it before its too late!!
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