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Messages 181 - 200 of total 418 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
TomCochrane

Trad climber
Santa Cruz Mountains and Monterey Bay
Jul 19, 2014 - 11:08pm PT
Washington is doing everything possible to promote a war with Russia and China to save the dollar, so we don't have to pay off the $20 trillion national debt......and under the misconception that it is possible to win a nuclear war...

...and disregarding that Russia, China, and India contain contain well over half the world's population, while the USA is a much smaller population percentage.

China is financially stronger than any country in history, and the USA is far deeper in debt than any country in history.

Washington's incentive is that as soon as the dollar collapses from being the world reference currency, the USA loses its privileged position and can no longer print money to fight wars of aggression, and sinks to being a third world country as the BRICS takes over.

Putin is doing everything possible to look the other way and avoid war with the USA...as practically speaking a nuclear exchange between major powers means the end of modern civilization...so far he has successfully sidetracked several USA attempts to spark World War III...and this is just the latest such provocation...

Putin is betting all our futures on the hope that European leaders will see the light and not go along with Washington's provocations.

It is not clear that the clouding turmoil in Europe and Washington's bribery of its leaders will permit them to see what is at risk...
Braunini

Big Wall climber
cupertino
Jul 19, 2014 - 11:09pm PT
lol where do you find this sh!t
scrubbing bubbles

Social climber
Uranus
Jul 19, 2014 - 11:13pm PT
There's a lot of old climbers on this site who probably sustained some pretty serious knocks to the head, long ago
ß Î Ø T Ç H

Boulder climber
extraordinaire
Jul 19, 2014 - 11:27pm PT
They only had 2 planes in their fleet, and they both crashed.
Randisi

Social climber
Dalian, Liaoning
Jul 19, 2014 - 11:41pm PT
Washington is doing everything possible to promote a war with Russia and China to save the dollar

And they did this by shooting down a Malaysian plane?
Braunini

Big Wall climber
cupertino
Jul 19, 2014 - 11:52pm PT
Let him go, he's on a roll
Tvash

climber
Seattle
Jul 20, 2014 - 12:19am PT
This may, indeed, turn out to be the Shot Heard Around the Weird.
scrubbing bubbles

Social climber
Uranus
Jul 20, 2014 - 01:29am PT
Yeah this shitt is all tied to the IMF the World Bank the Rockefellers and Michelle Obama wearing a strap-on at an Illuminati orgy
TGT

Social climber
So Cal
Jul 20, 2014 - 06:58am PT
http://theaviationist.com/2014/07/20/inside-buk-telar-images/
Chuckcar

climber
CityByTheBay
Jul 20, 2014 - 08:30am PT
A "black" box found...

http://www.cnn.com/video/data/2.0/video/bestoftv/2014/07/20/nd-mh17-malaysia-black-box.cnn.html
klk

Trad climber
cali
Jul 20, 2014 - 08:43am PT
Paul Craig Roberts - wrong yet again. I can't believe folks keep quoting him.

prolly just couldn't find a david icke rant linking mh17 to the the jewish-reptilian alien conspiracy
Gary

Social climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
Jul 20, 2014 - 08:51am PT

We once had a president that knew how to deal with murderers!

Hahahaha!!! Yeah, he knew how to deal with terrorists. Cut and run!


When he wasn't selling the terrorists missiles himself, of course.
Majid_S

Mountain climber
Karkoekstan
Jul 20, 2014 - 09:40am PT
here is the fuel for whats happening out there .

http://www.azcentral.com/story/news/politics/2014/07/18/mccain-us-cowardly-ukraine-plane-shot-down/12844427/
vlani

Trad climber
mountain view, ca
Jul 20, 2014 - 10:16am PT
He is still Arizona senator? Shame to the people of Arizona.
Reilly

Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
Jul 20, 2014 - 10:19am PT
Luckily, he is as a lone voice howling in the wilderness that is the US Congress.
Ken M

Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
Jul 20, 2014 - 11:30am PT
So, Rong, Mr. American Opinion, I asked you before:

WHAT SHOULD BE DONE about the airliner shootdown?

Or are you just what everyone says you are: a full-on racist that only lives to be opposed to ANYTHING that the President does, and has to reserve your opinion, just to make sure that you never, ever suggest the thing that he does?
Jeremy Ross

Gym climber
Jul 20, 2014 - 12:12pm PT
I'm curious, what should be done?





-JR
HighTraverse

Trad climber
Bay Area
Jul 20, 2014 - 12:25pm PT
Paul Craig Roberts
I've never heard of him. Fortunately.
Reading the long quotation from him, I counted at least 4 known factual errors in the first 8 paragraphs.
Perhaps I've not heard of him because he's so obviously unreliable?

Washington’s propaganda machine is in such high gear that we are in danger of losing
the facts that we do have.
So what about Russia's propaganda machine and the deleted online separatist videos?
One fact is that the separatists do not have the expensive Buk anti-aircraft missile system or the trained personnel to operate it.
FALSE
As I noted earlier, Al Jazeera reported a few days earlier they had captured a Buk launcher.
Another fact is that the separatists have no incentive to shoot down an airliner and neither does Russia.
True Statement #1
Anyone can tell the difference between low-flying attack aircraft and an airliner at 33,000 feet.
ABSOLUTE BS. Later he claims they might have thought it was a Ukraine transport, not a low flying attack aircraft. Which is it? However as I noted earlier consider one of our best anti-aircraft ships: USS Vincennes which mistook a Boeing airliner for an F-14. Wikipedia is your friend in case you don't remember 1988 as well as I do.
The Ukrainians do have Buk anti-aircraft missile systems, and a Buk battery was operational in the region and deployed at a site from which it could have fired a missile at the airliner.
questionable. The nearest Ukrainian bases are many miles to the west. Ukraine is a BIG country, not some potty little place.

Wikipedia: The most capable radar, assuming it has a line-of-sight (no terrain between the radar and the target), can track targets (depending on size) as low as 100 feet (30 meters) and a far as 85 miles (140 kilometers). The most capable missile can hit targets as far as 30 miles (50 kilometers) and more than 80,000 feet (25,000 meters) in altitude.
Consider that the separatists control nearly all the real estate within 50 miles of the crash site and it's within a few miles of the Russian border.

Just as the separatists and the Russian government have no incentive....
True statement #2
One Russian general familiar with the weapon system offered his opinion that it was a mistake made by the Ukrainian military untrained in the weapon’s use.
Very questionable. Consider the source and the distance to main Ukraine troops.
The general said that although Ukraine has a few of the weapons, Ukrainians have had no training in their use in the 23 years since Ukraine separated from Russia.
BS again. The Ukrainian military has been modernizing these weapons over the years
Wikipedia: The An-24 and An-26 aircraft, as well as the anti-aircraft artillery systems S-300 and "Buk M1", have been continually modernized, and their service life has been extended.

Ukraine has been cozy with Russia on an off several times in that period. They even have been training with Russian troops.
Wikipedia: The combined training of the Air Force of Ukraine and the Russian Air Force in the practical control of their air defense Stand-by Forces has become more systematic. Moreover, interoperability has been achieved between the forces of Ukraine and the command and control elements of the Air defense of the Russian Federation during the detecting, tracking, and neutralizing of air targets during simulated terrorist attacks.
Wikipedia, Ukrainian Air Force


The general thinks it was an accident due to incompetence.
"accident" is a strange thing to call a deliberate act even if the target was mistaken.
That would let off a lot of murderers.
The problem with the general’s explanation is that it does not explain why the Buk anti-aircraft missile system was deployed near or in a separatist territory. The separatists have no aircraft. It seems odd for Ukraine to have an expensive missile system in an area in which it is of no military use and where the position could be overrun and captured by separatists.
True statement #3
What intended use? News reports and circumstantial evidence provide two answers. One is that the ultra-nationalist extremists intended to bring down Putin’s presidential airliner
Highly unlikely
The planes were 37 minutes apart. If they were looking for Putin's plane they were completely incompetent.
The following paragraphs are just propaganda and distortions.
for example
The circumstantial evidence easiest for non-technical people to understand is the on cue news programs organized to put the blame on Russia prior to the knowledge of any facts.
the propagandist accusing others of propaganda
Somehow the information got on a video and on youtube before it reached the Ukrainian government or Washington
This is a surprise? And so what? It's more telling that the video was pulled down.
The evidence that Putin did it is a video made prior to the attack on the airliner.
No one has claimed evidence that "Putin did it". It's easy enough to infer but there is nothing in the video I saw to suggest Russia knew about it in advance.
Indeed the entire Western media spoke as one: Russia did it. And the presstitutes are still speaking the same way.
This nonsense speaks for itself.
I use absurd made up words like Republitards. Precisely because I'm expressing my own absurd and snide opinion. I'm not pretending to be a journalist.
The flaw in Putin’s diplomacy is that Putin’s diplomacy relies on good will and on truth prevailing. However, the West has no good will, and Washington is not interested in truth prevailing but in Washington prevailing. What Putin confronts is not reasonable “partners,” but a propaganda ministry aimed at him.
Is this a deliberate propagandist inversion or is Roberts really this idiotic?

One more totally bogus statement:
Israel claims that its air attack and invasion of Gaza is merely Israel’s attempt to find and close the alleged tunnels through which Palestinian terrorists pour into Israel inflicting carnage. Of course there are no tunnels and no terrorist carnage in Israel.
He's obviously not keeping current. There are videos all over the internet by Hamas showing their troops in tunnels. Yesterday several Hamas and IDF soldiers were killed in battles at the tunnel outlets in Israel.
Certainly the power and casualties are terribly one sided but that doesn't absolve a "journalist" from being factually accurate.

By the way, he left the WSJ in 1980
He is certainly colorful and prone to exaggeration and strange conclusions
.....all over the west. There is no democracy, there are oligarchies, some of these smaller European countries are not even run by their own governments, they are run by Wall Street... There is probably more democracy in China than there is in the west. Revolution is the only answer...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Craig_Roberts
TGT

Social climber
So Cal
Jul 20, 2014 - 12:32pm PT
Walter Duranty reincarnate.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Walter_Duranty
vlani

Trad climber
mountain view, ca
Jul 20, 2014 - 12:50pm PT
HighTraverse, Ukrainian Buks are deployed in the area. This is a fact none is trying to deny.
Separatist do have 1 SU-25 bomber, and they proudly reported it been used in the battle.

The training of Ukrainian military personnel must be pathetic, given the state of Ukrainian military in general.

If you remember they did shot down Russian passenger plane about 10 years back. It was not intended, true act of incompetence. Not much changed since.
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