Rancher +Militia vs BLM,trouble on the range.(OT)

Search
Go

Discussion Topic

Return to Forum List
This thread has been locked
Messages 2501 - 2520 of total 3753 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
philo

Trad climber
Is that light the end of the tunnel or a train?
May 2, 2014 - 11:25am PT
Because Survival Dems are not Rong about everything.
survival

Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
May 2, 2014 - 11:34am PT
Fear runs so deep in those militia types,its kind of mind boggling. I'm just so damn glad that I live in a great country where the government cares about its citizens and tries to do right by them. The good news is that my country is better than the country the white supremacists live in.
Norton

Social climber
the Wastelands
May 2, 2014 - 11:44am PT
LAS VEGAS -- Tensions have subsided and the crowds of armed militia around rancher Cliven Bundy have largely dispersed, but the situation is far from resolved.

Federal officials are exploring their legal options, and Metro Police confirm that an investigation is ongoing. What has not been made public is just how close things came to an all-out gun battle. Some of those who were on the front lines spoke exclusively to the I-Team's George Knapp.

When the Bureau of Land Management mobilized to go after Bundy's cattle two years ago, they did so under an administrative order. This time, it was considered a criminal matter, and the I-Team has learned that order went all the way to the White House for approval.

When it became apparent that things were not going well in Bunkerville and hundreds of armed Bundy supporters were on the scene, Metro found itself right in the middle, a very dangerous place to be.

"We didn't show any fear that day, but I can tell you, we all thought in the back of our minds, we all thought it was going to be our last day on earth, if it went bad," said Sgt. Tom Jenkins of the Las Vegas Metropolitan Police Department.

He is more familiar with the craziness of the Las Vegas Strip, which is where he and his squad usually work to keep the peace. But when things began to turn ugly in Bunkerville earlier this month, two squads of patrol officers, along with a SWAT unit, were dispatched to the scene.

"We were told, we're going to go down there and we're going to get between the BLM and the protesters. We were going, okay, we've been there before, but as we were driving up, it was like a movie set. It didn't look real; people in the back of pickup trucks with rifles and shotguns," Jenkins said. "It was hard to grasp that at the beginning."

Approximately 30 Metro officers stood between a crowd of 400 heavily armed, self- described militia and the federal employees who had gathered a few hundred head of Bundy's cattle. As the crowd swelled and tempers flared, many in the crowd tried to goad the police, hurling taunts and insults.

"They had no respect for authority. Everything that you can think of to call a human being, animals, everything," Jenkins said.

One person in the crowd even asked Jenkins if he was ready to die.

"I don't know his name. He was wearing a Pittsburgh Steelers jersey. I'll never forget that," he said.

Shuttling back and forth between the Bundy forces and BLM was Assistant Sheriff Joe Lombardo, who'd been left in charge by Sheriff Doug Gillespie. He was trying to keep everyone calm.

"The bottom line is, bloodshed over cattle, unacceptable. Nobody wanted to go in that direction," Lombardo said.

But the police were to learn, some in the crowd did want to go in that direction. Even Lombardo was on the receiving end.

"It was a scary point in itself. They were in my face yelling profanities and pointing weapons. The Bundy son himself, that I was negotiating with, Dave, he did not do that, but all the associated people around him did do that," Lombardo said.

Metro officers deal with large crowds all the time, but nothing like this. The crowd included former military men and ex-cops, people with various motives, their fingers poised just above the triggers of powerful weapons. With so much firepower in so many hands, a small incident could have set off a bloodbath and left nearly two dozen officers dead.

Assist. Sheriff Joe Lombardo:"We were outgunned, outmanned and there would not have been a good result from it."
I-Team reporter George Knapp: "A lot of scenarios could have played out that would have left a lot of dead officers."
Assist. Sheriff Joe Lombardo: "If you just have a backfire, somebody pops a firecracker, then it's over. We're done. We are going to lose that battle that day."

Metro pointedly did not allow officers to put on helmets or protective gear for fear it might be seen as a provocation. At the urging of Cliven Bundy, the crowd moved toward the BLM compound. Rhetoric grew more heated, and guns were pointed at officers.

One Bundy supporter summed it up, "Had to happen sometime, might as well happen now, right?"

"Some of them, there's no doubt from talking to me, want it, to get a chance that day to fire upon a police officer or authority period. I don't think it mattered if it was BLM or us," Jenkins said.

As the crowd closed in on the BLM compound, and tensions approached critical mass, Lombardo made the call to release the cattle and diffuse the situation.

"Sometimes in public safety, it is hard to back down. We are not trained to operate that way, but they took the better route, and it was the right way to go," Lombardo said. "It's all about lives. I mean, what is the better route to go? To be right or to be effective? "

If one tiny mistake had been made, the community might be attending funerals for slain police officers, law enforcement officials said. Dozens of people could have been killed if shooting had broken out.

The I-Team has learned that those who were involved in threatening the lives of officers are not off the hook, even if it takes a year or more to resolve.
http://www.8newsnow.com/story/25395552/i-team-police-faced-possible-bloodbath-at-bundy-protest
fluffy

Trad climber
Colorado
May 2, 2014 - 12:17pm PT
Fu ck them and the handful of losers here who have defended them as being the better people.

Seriously fu ck you.
philo

Trad climber
Is that light the end of the tunnel or a train?
May 2, 2014 - 12:19pm PT
Come on Fluffy don't hold back mincing words tell us what you really think. LOL
crankster

Trad climber
South Lake Tahoe, CA
May 2, 2014 - 12:19pm PT
Norton's post illuminates just how dangerous these militia groups are, Ron included. They are clearly deranged. Trying to have any kind of meaningful debate with them is impossible.
Bob D'A

Trad climber
Taos, NM
May 2, 2014 - 12:21pm PT
Ron's heroes...what a wonderful lot.
philo

Trad climber
Is that light the end of the tunnel or a train?
May 2, 2014 - 12:23pm PT
HighDesertDJ

Trad climber
May 2, 2014 - 12:32pm PT
http://www.esquire.com/blogs/politics/bundy-ranch-uncensored

BUNKERVILLE, Nevada -- At the Bundy camp last week, pundits and politicians descended on Bunkerville, Nevada, to throw in their American flag hats with the BLM protestors. A FOX news van had been parked by the side of the road for days. Up on the ridge, militia snipers kept a trained watch as Bundy held court, and disciples from far and wide came to share their personal theories as to why the government was enforcing a court order.

But on Thursday, we witnessed a mainstream exodus from Bundy’s flank. Sean Hannity, Bundy’s biggest booster, called his racist remarks “beyond despicable,” but maintained that they should not taint the supporters who “for the right reasons saw this case as government overreach.”

Exactly how difficult was it, though, to determine pretty early on that Bundy and his followers were using the threat of force to back up some terrifyingly misguided beliefs?

During the few hours I visited last week, this was what was said.

In the background, a singer with an American-flag guitar warms up the stage with a raspy hollering he explains as Tibetan throat singing. Suddenly noticing a man off to the side shaking maracas, he stops and grips the mic:

"Is there really a black man in the house?” A lone “whoo” goes up from the folding chairs. "You’re with the media, right?” The cameraman nods, and the singer returns his focus to the folding chairs. “So, are we racists here today? That’s how they’re trying to spin this one — this is good. Channel 13 came at me the other day — a cute little blonde, of course. They sent her at me, y’know, go get the story! Go get the radical…” The generator cuts out, silencing the mic, and the story about how he isn’t a racist is lost.

A militia member with the group Oath Keepers named Mark, who drove in from out of state by way of Zion National Park (“which was absolutely beautiful — you should go”), offers to explain to me the truth behind public land management.

"The assumption is that the BLM is part of the federal government. But we need to check the facts on that one. The BLM doesn’t work for the government: they work for the United Nations. They might as well be wearing blue helmets. If we find out there’s money being exchanged between Harry Reid and the Chinese government, no one should be surprised.”

A self-trained lawyer tells me the same. He adds that Bar-certified lawyers, like the ones who prosecuted Bundy, have sworn loyalty to the British government, whose statutes encourage sex with clients. “That’s what they do with all their clients.”

It’s dizzying and hot at the camp, and a very friendly man named Roy, wearing an Obama t-shirt with a joker smile painted on, hands me a cold bottle. He's from nearby Mesquite and has been a close friend and supporter of Bundy's these last few years. When I tell him I’m from New Mexico, the former cop says he has a very good buddy who used to work as a sheriff in my area.

“He got in a bit of trouble,” he chuckles. “He pulled over a carload of illegals one night, didn’t have room to haul ‘em all, so he put a chain around their neck and put a padlock through it, went to the next one, then he chained ‘em to a tree!”

He buckles with laughter as the story heats up. “Then he left ‘em and went to town to get his pickup to haul ‘em all back in. So, you might imagine, that didn’t play well — ha! You’re a young’un, but everything wasn’t against the law, way back when.”

He says it's now being proved that the BLM acted on orders from Troy and Harry Reid, who want to build a solar farm on the land — or a wind farm, he says. He recommends that I look up a Fox News segment that explains how the government is trying to put people out of work, “’Enemy of the State’, it’s called.”

Soon enough, a handful of junior politicians and the Bundy family are ushered on stage with a full compliment of assault-weaponed militia and a man with binoculars.

The crowd, fresh off their victory at the Battle of Bunkerville, gives Bundy a standing ovation. But he doesn’t seem pleased. He reproaches the crowd for failing to follow the word of God – to the letter – which he says is being delivered through him. They failed, for example, to follow his instructions to tear down the toll booths at Lake Mead and disarm the Park Service.

"The message I gave to you all was a revelation that I received. And yet not one of you can seem to even quote it.”

Cliven continues, sermon-like: "The records of our bible — how long have they been kept? Thousands of years. They’ve been turned over generation after generation, buried, and all kinds of things happen to ‘em. And yet, here, something I felt was inspired [by God] and yet we haven’t even carried it forth for even a couple of days. Shame on us.” Smattering of clapping.

He goes on to explain that, although they managed to deter the BLM, they failed to do it "within one hour," as the revelation had prophesied. So when an hour passes, he decides to get in his bulldozer and march on the BLM himself. The dozer gets stuck in the mud and he receives another revelation.

“It come to my mind real plain — the good Lord said, ‘Bundy, it’s not your job, it’s THEIR job.’ So we come back over here and heard that they had brought some cattle back. So I want you to understand,” he said. "This is not my job, it’s YOUR job.

"This morning, I said a prayer, and this is what I received. I heard a voice say, 'Sheriff Gillespie, your work is not done. Every sheriff across the United States, take the guns away from the United States bureaucrats.’” Lots of clapping for this.

Bundy goes on for a good while and militia members are forced to leave their chairs to walk around and get water.

A former Arizona sheriff turned Texas political candidate, Richard Mack, speaks next.

“I don’t believe the BLM has any authority whatsoever — they have no law enforcement authority in Clark County.” In conclusion he yells into the microphone, “(William Wallace!) FREEEDOOOOOM!"

After the speeches, Nevada Assemblywoman Michelle Fiore steps off the stage. Wearing a diamond-studded pistol pendant, she raises her eyebrows in the direction of a shadowy government operation. "When you really look at this, it’s not about the environmental stuff — it’s a lot deeper than what’s coming out in the media.”

In the downtime, a group of men laments the way the world has changed. Obama, a Muslim Kenyan, doesn't let kids say the pledge in school anymore. Steve, from Beaver, Utah, says it’s all down to regulation and changes that happened during Vietnam. “I want it to be like it was growing up in the fifties. I want it to be just like that — for [the kids]. Though it can’t be just like that, because they have the internet.”

"That's what's wrong: the Internet," agrees another.

Behind us, an older man, whose face is cut up from tumbling down a hill during the protest, gets into his beige sedan to leave. It's covered in lettering:

IF YOU WERE BORN IN 1980 AND AFTER. YOU MAY BE IMPLANTED WITH A GOVERNMENT MICROCHIP WITHOUT YOUR KNOWLEDGE: GOOGLE DOCTORS THAT REMOVE MICROCHIPS.

"Google MKUltra,” he says cryptically, “Then you’ll find what I’m about.”

Before leaving the Bunkerville trenches, I watch Sean Hannity's Bundy segment that aired the day before the militias took up arms against the BLM. Hannity mistakenly asserts that the federal government is trying to kick him off state land — and then he says something that only makes sense in the context of the Bundy camp.

“I’m worried about the lies that are told to us about the NSA, about the IRS, about what happened in Benghazi, and the lies that sold healthcare. I’m frankly concerned that the government is making a deal over someth—" before going too far, Hannity cuts himself off and changes course. "I don’t know why they’re taking a stand here. Has anyone given you any information why?”

Welfare negroes, the United Nations, sexually devious lawyers, satan, a Chinese solar farm, microchips, secret-agent NPS, a Muslim-Kenyan president, hippies, illegals. Take your pick.


philo

Trad climber
Is that light the end of the tunnel or a train?
May 2, 2014 - 12:46pm PT
Look Out Murika, Clivin he's a revelatin' now.
Gawd is speakin thru him. Yippeeeeeeeeeeee
survival

Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
May 2, 2014 - 01:12pm PT
Another priceless post from HHDJ.

What say ye Ronbraham? Oh wait, you can't comment, you're out there at the ranch taking your shift on the wall.
HighTraverse

Trad climber
Bay Area
May 2, 2014 - 01:13pm PT
The Vegas I-TV (Investigative TV?) piece quoted above is good reading.
Nothing that I didn't already know or strongly suspect. But good to have it all in one place.
The I-Team has learned that those who were involved in threatening the lives of officers are not off the hook, even if it takes a year or more to resolve.
Not even this surprises me.

The Esquire piece is really good!

Blundy's revelations?
WOW that is news.
But no surprise. Whacko Mormons (only a tiny tiny percentage of Mormons) are often revelators. That's how the polygamists just up the road from Blundy know which 13 year old girls to take as wives. (see Krakauer etc etc, plus I actually know one from high school)
Elcapinyoazz

Social climber
Joshua Tree
May 2, 2014 - 01:15pm PT
I'm just so damn glad that I live in a great country where the government cares about its citizens and tries to do right by them.

Duuuude! I had no idea you'd moved to Denmark...or is it Sweden?
survival

Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
May 2, 2014 - 01:20pm PT
HT, I know lots of Mormons from spending a few years in _ _ _ _ _ New Mexico. 99% are wonderful hard working people that would not take up arms against their own government, at least without something a helluva lot more severe than illegal grazing. These militia dudes are all just waiting for an excuse to hate their own ELECTED government.
Strange, I haven't seen a single one of my Mormon friends in Bundy's Special Forces.


Edit:
Duuuude! I had no idea you'd moved to Denmark...or is it Sweden?


Duuuuuude, I would never live in one of those gdamn socialist gdamn communes. Wait, they have lots of hot chicks right? Ok, maybe I would....
Hell it might even be better than whack job fundamentalville.



Edit part dos: "drone strike" BWA HA HA HA HA hahahahahaaaaaa!!!!
My f*#kin stomach hurts. You can't make this sh#t up.



Edit part tres: Is Ron a deserter even though he hasn't actually been there? So confusing being a freedom fighter.
philo

Trad climber
Is that light the end of the tunnel or a train?
May 2, 2014 - 01:20pm PT
Survival, Rong can't go back to Bunkerstan. Didn't you read about the Oath Breakers and their desertion. He's a traitor to the cause now, a man without a country only a gun shop.
HighTraverse

Trad climber
Bay Area
May 2, 2014 - 01:33pm PT
survival
indeed. I tried to be clear that 99.99% of Mormons are fine people. I grew up in SLC and 90% of my friends until college were Mormons. A good friend of mine was run over by a tractor on his mission a month after graduation. One of my good friends converted to LDS in college (aaack!).
Bundy has mentioned his Mormon ancestry more than once. I'm not calling him a polygamist. Just pointing out that revelations are a common occurrence among the fringe including the polygamists. I mean if god tells you to do it you must do it! It's also well known that the polygamists have settled along Utah's borders with Idaho and Arizona/Nevada for over 100 years to escape "persecution". I knew that 30 years before Krakauer wrote "Under The Banner Of Heaven".
survival

Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
May 2, 2014 - 01:36pm PT
I hear you man. I have a very similar background.
HighTraverse

Trad climber
Bay Area
May 2, 2014 - 01:41pm PT
I've been wondering about the good people of Mesquite being tarred by the Bundy bunch.
The only person I've ever known from Mesquite was a good friend of my dad's. A retired Vietnam War airborne special forces colonel who moved there with his wife, I knew them pretty well. A very heads up guy from Kentucky. I'm sure Roy's clawing at his casket eager to go toe to toe with the Blundyites and dress them down for what they are.
survival

Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
May 2, 2014 - 01:45pm PT
Yeah, none of the Oath Keepers I served with are out there.

Weird.





Karl Baba

Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
May 2, 2014 - 01:51pm PT
Pretty interesting how short sighted people are.

I mean, when a bank robber or some hijacker takes a bunch of hostages, do they ever think about how many times in history that strategy has ever worked out?

Bundy is over in his ranch, having hundreds of Yahoo guests, now stressed amongst themselves. Do they really think the federal government will just go away and allow this precedent to be set?
Do they really think that if it comes to force, that they will win and get what they want? Wouldn't they have to overthrow the entire federal government for that?

I don't always agree with Obama but he's no pacifist ultimately and his MO is clear, no in your face war but rather a strategic targeted response (even if there is collateral damage)

Funny the Benghazi cry comes up. Were those same people calling for investigations over Tilman's friendly fire killing (lies and coverup) the falling of Saddams statue, massacres here and there, fake rescue of Jessica Lynch, Iran Contra and the rest?

Nobody is saying the government attacked itself in Benghazi and since when does the military (not to mention CIA etc) like to announce everything that happened and what they are up to

Peace

Karl
Messages 2501 - 2520 of total 3753 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
Return to Forum List
 
Our Guidebooks
spacerCheck 'em out!
SuperTopo Guidebooks

guidebook icon
Try a free sample topo!

 
SuperTopo on the Web

Recent Route Beta