Poor Little Joey

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Messages 341 - 360 of total 372 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
squishy

Mountain climber
Oct 23, 2013 - 06:00pm PT
In the South Lake Tahoe Wilderness...You can see why this subject has crawled up my as#@&%e...I love those trees...
harryhotdog

Social climber
north vancouver, B.C.
Oct 23, 2013 - 06:10pm PT
Amazing pics of an amazing area. You people are so lucky down there to have that at your doorstep.
squishy

Mountain climber
Oct 23, 2013 - 06:21pm PT
Are bolts allowed in the Tahoe Wilderness?
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Relic MilkEye and grandpoobah of HBRKRNH
Oct 23, 2013 - 07:12pm PT
they are allowed ONLY by the localized policy of the USFS and BLM.. TECHNICALLY bolts violate title 36 code of fed regulations part 261.6 H i believe- which states " damaging ANY natural feature". I know from experience this is a catch all sub paragraph for 261 section.
Natural features being rocks, trees meadows and more.

It is only by the GRACE of land managers that bolts are here.
adrian korosec

climber
Tucson
Oct 23, 2013 - 07:19pm PT
The tree Joe Kinder cut down was a national treasure. There should be jail time and big fines.
squishy

Mountain climber
Oct 23, 2013 - 07:28pm PT
I just had such a great conversation with the access fund, some of the most constructive stuff I have heard on any subject. I will admit it helped me care about things which were beyond my own selfish anger.

The access fund is obviously disappointed by the cutting down of the tree and feel it's a very important issue. They agree with everyone that cutting the tree down was wrong, no excuses.

They are not ready to release any kind of public statement, they do not have any plans to do so in the near future. But I am willing to bet they will address it later depending on how it all plays out. I think they are best positioned within this community to address these kinds of issues and help spur change.

From what I can gather, this incident has the potential to become a historic event, mainly for the millennial generation. Whether or not Joe understands the magnitude of that statement, I do not know, but I think we'll find out.

Most people don't think so, and I have placed myself in that camp. But, I don't know him, only the image and character he plays. Till this sentence, I have been calling for his grindstone and for the community to shun him. I still don't think he should be sponsored by greedy companies, they have shown through their responses that stewardship is not as important as making money. BUT, I do think this is an opportunity for Joe to play a big role in climbing's future historiography. Based on what I have seen of him he's gonna need a lot of help and mentoring and I hope he reaches out to the right people. I won't ask for his head or expulsion, I'd ask the community to help him, whoever is best equipped and closest.

In order to change the culture of this newer generation of climbers he will need to capitalize on this event and use it to address the real problem. He has obviously learned (the hard way) what the problem is (utter ignorance of environmental ethics in climbing). Now we need to see if he has the maturity to endure a good bashing from dickheads like me, while turning around and addressing the problem in a positive way. Time to suck it up and drive on like you got a pair.






Joe,

If you step up and play this right, you will have my forgiveness and my gratitude (it's not worth anything by the way, I can only climb 5.8). Make this about the greater good and stop being so selfish (leave out what you think, what you did, and don't make excuses, stand tall by your mistakes, own them). The problem is a culture that doesn't respect it roots and I am not some old timer "has been" complaining from my deathbed, I am genX. Read the old climbing books, understand the history of environmental ethics in climbing, it's actually fascinating. Identify knowledge gaps within your corner of this community and go out there and fill them. You speak their language and you can translate the past into the future. You gotta shoot the moon Joe, but do you have the cards?

tradmanclimbs

Ice climber
Pomfert VT
Oct 23, 2013 - 07:44pm PT
Man you People up on you mighty high horses are fckin pathetic. Suppose you self richous hippys have never sat arround a campfire playing rosewood and mahogony guitars to the beat of hand drums made of koko bolo and exotic endangered brazilian wood..
tradmanclimbs

Ice climber
Pomfert VT
Oct 23, 2013 - 08:17pm PT
And NO I do Not think he should have cut the tree down but I do think that most of the folks on this thread are pileing on the hate without even realizeing that they are just going allong with the crowd..
squishy

Mountain climber
Oct 23, 2013 - 08:25pm PT
Then you don't understand the importance of environmental ethics in California climbing. Lets just call it ignorance and move on..
Chaz

Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
Oct 23, 2013 - 08:25pm PT
"most of the folks on this thread are pileing on the hate without even realizeing that they are just going allong with the crowd.. "



That's something Kinder should have considered before he cut down a National Treasure.

What did he expect? A pat on the back?
James

climber
My twin brother's laundry room
Oct 23, 2013 - 08:59pm PT
Why does everyone hate on the lumberjack? He gave you armchair climbers something to bitch about.
RyanD

climber
Squamish
Oct 23, 2013 - 09:10pm PT
^^^^

Jealous of the attention he's not getting.
GDavis

Social climber
SOL CAL
Oct 23, 2013 - 09:10pm PT
Holy sh#t, ANOTHER thread on this?



The Supertopo Flame keeps a-burnin'....



squishy

Mountain climber
Oct 23, 2013 - 09:14pm PT
did you really just notice this thread gdavis?
johntp

Trad climber
socal
Oct 23, 2013 - 09:34pm PT
Hey Joe, do those look like Junipers? I'm just guessing here but I bet many species of tree can get stunted and appear young while still being very old.

Hilarious!

The reason I keep beating the horse is because this is not something I feel should be swept under the rug and forgotten.

Hell, the "Climbing Down" thread went for what, 2,000+ posts? That route can be chopped and the holes filled. There is no restoring of those trees.

From what I can gather on the web, Joe is 29. Hardly young in my book, so I'm not in the camp to write it off as youthful stupidity. I don't hate Joe, it's not worth the emotion and I don't know him. I hate what he did.
Leggs

Sport climber
Tucson, AZ
Oct 23, 2013 - 09:36pm PT
holy sh#t balls...

someone needs to start a boob thread.
The Larry

climber
Moab, UT
Oct 23, 2013 - 09:40pm PT
Credit: The Larry
drljefe

climber
El Presidio San Augustin del Tucson
Oct 23, 2013 - 09:53pm PT
Credit: drljefe
Leggs

Sport climber
Tucson, AZ
Oct 23, 2013 - 10:06pm PT
Hahahhahhahahaa! Larry! You never let me down!
KP Ariza

climber
SCC
Oct 23, 2013 - 10:27pm PT
Squish, your first post today was at 10:46 and you're still at it. Get a life man.
Maybe you outta spend some time squishing the festering boils developing on your backside from sitting in a chair all day hen pecking your keyboard.
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