Discussion Topic |
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le_bruce
climber
Oakland, CA
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Topic Author's Original Post - Oct 2, 2013 - 09:00pm PT
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Grrrr. What's the straight dope here. Can I park outside the 140 entrance and hoof it up to Arch?
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WBraun
climber
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It's closed. Not OK
That means everything inside the park boundaries.
What part of closed do you guys not understand?
If someone gets hurt then you call sar for participating in a closure area?
You will will be completely hosed and the fines exorbitant.
No one one likes or wants this total fubar here but we have to live with it.
Resources are at rock bottom minimum to deal with anything.
That's why it's closed .......
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susan peplow
climber
Joshua Tree, CA
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^^^ Exactly, thanks Werner! ^^^
We have local bandits in JTree asking similar questions. Just move along people, nothing to see or do here..........for now anyways.
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le_bruce
climber
Oakland, CA
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Topic Author's Reply - Oct 2, 2013 - 09:28pm PT
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God damnit, Braun.
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Clint Cummins
Trad climber
SF Bay area, CA
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It will be open again someday. In the meantime we can go elsewhere.
Werner is stuck with the skeleton crew and I hope that it does not turn epic due to the usual idiots.
I love the Valley in October, and have plans, but it looks like we are gonna switch to SoYos unless this Shutdown gets fixed.
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TrundleBum
Trad climber
Las Vegas
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I empathize with all the employees and the BS they will have to deal with, but...
Then again, I guess 'Public lands are not Public' at all are they ?
This time the National parks.
Then it will be all BLM land.
Then just good ole 'Martial Law' !
I say it's time to put the reigns on Washington and the FED in general !
Federal level politicians live a lifestyle few of us will ever know and They do this off tax revenues and corporate lobbyist money
(a polite way to say bribes!).
All the while they get very little done other than bickering and deliberating over new scenarios to bolster the coffers of their corporate pimp's pockets !
If I got paid what Senator or Congressman made, relative to what they produce, then I would get paid $182.67 for every bolt I nutted up !
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Kalimon
Social climber
Ridgway, CO
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Werner,
Are you personally allowed to climb while the park is closed?
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John M
climber
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Not even supposed to go hiking.
During the 95 closure things eased up after about a week, but right now the rangers seem to be taking it serious.
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Todd Eastman
climber
Bellingham, WA
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Climbers think they are special...
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Juanito
Social climber
San Diego, CA
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I'm hearing that people are able to drive into the valley so long as they don't get out of their cars. Supposedly only the roads to Glacier and Mariposa are completely closed. Is this true? If so, is this just until all the campers are pushed out? How are they enforcing this?
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Fritz
Trad climber
Choss Creek, ID
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The Republican people that are closing down our Public lands don't want those lands to be under: "Government-Control."
Please!
Think about what happens when our climbing areas are owned by "Corporate America"
-------whose managers don't think that climbing is a "profit-center."
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Brock
Trad climber
RENO, NV
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So I guess they are not rounding up all the backcountry hikers either? Man, I think of all the climbs in the middle of no where I've climbed and in complete knowledge of no help if I get into trouble. So how does closing Yosemite to a complete self contained climber/hiker effect anyone? Go for it. Guess they will try to fine you so they can pay for the days they are not getting paid too.
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Michelle
Social climber
1187 Hunterwasser
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If you can't find a way in untooled, you don't belong there.
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Juanito
Social climber
San Diego, CA
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I've read in the Oakhurst paper that Tioga road is open. You can still enter from Oakhurst, drive into El Cap Meadow and then head over the pass. I wonder if you can drive from El Portal to Oakhurst via the Valley or do they force you over Tioga?
Just thinking out loud, but you could get someone to drop you off and then pick you up later when you're done. Just grab your backpack or haul bag and go!
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Wade Icey
Trad climber
www.alohashirtrescue.com
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who would respond to SAR at Parkline?
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WBraun
climber
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Parkline is inside the park boundaries.
This isn't about sar, me or you.
I gave an honest answer to the original question.
It's up to you people to be responsible.
If you end up being irresponsible and stupid then you'll eat the repercussions of those actions if you get caught.
It's that simple .......
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apogee
climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
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Master, you should absolutely go climbing in the Valley tomorrow. Better yet, get hurt there.
"Think about what happens when our climbing areas are owned by "Corporate America"
-------whose managers don't think that climbing is a "profit-center."
+1.
+10.
+$100.
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Todd Eastman
climber
Bellingham, WA
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National Parks and National Forests are not the same and will be operating under rules regarding the closures of facilities, pay for employees, and how those impact management of the lands...
... more frequently than not, Parks can close gates and limit access more readily than Forests.
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i'm gumby dammit
Sport climber
da ow
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Currently, it's a rock just like any other rock as far as I'm concerned. The government can take away the perks like bathrooms and rescues but THEY CANNOT TAJE IT AWAY. It belongs to the people not the government.
F*#k anyone who says orherwise
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Dr.Sprock
Boulder climber
I'm James Brown, Bi-atch!
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where can i get a ranger uni?
gonna chop the locks on the entrance booth and collect 12 bucks a car,
should be able to bag about 1000 bucks before the tazer boys show up,
climbers get in free, if they have weed,
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Kalimon
Social climber
Ridgway, CO
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Ophir wall is open folks . . . no fools and no tools. Might be a bit cold tomorrow though.
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WBraun
climber
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Werner, why is there even a "get caught" in the conversation?
It's closed to all recreation and that includes climbing.
Not my idea and I have nothing to do with it either.
I'm just telling you since you're so dense. (Just plain stupid)
Do what ever you "think" you need to do.
It's your choice .......
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bergbryce
Mountain climber
California
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i didn't choose to have diarrhea this evening
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Dr.Sprock
Boulder climber
I'm James Brown, Bi-atch!
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butt plug?
blue?
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Rhodo-Router
Gym climber
sawatch choss
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What Michelle said.
Figure it out.
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guyman
Social climber
Moorpark, CA.
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So .... Lets look ahead say 10 years.... with O-Care firmly in place and giving the health care we all need...
and some president, who ever, whatever party in power and some minority party say- 40%- won't go along with "majority" ....gets the government to
"SHUTDOWN"... gasp!
It won't be your Nat Park lands getting closed. It will be the HOSPITAL that is shut down. With armed tools standing outside, to keep you locked out.
Wake up people.
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WBraun
climber
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Because it's CLOSED. Are you really that dense??
I'm not stopping you from anything! I didn't make the rules you retard!
You have a brain? If so use it.
I can't do anything here either.
I'm in the same boat you are, as are thousands of others also.
God you really are stupid.
If you want to interpret it any way you want then do so.
You already did a long time ago anyways.
It's your choice and free will.
Unbelievable a guy like you can't even think ......
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ß Î Ø T Ç H
Boulder climber
extraordinaire
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One strategy might be to approach Tuolumne from east slope via 120 - have somebody drop you off with a bike, stash it, climb something, then coast back down Tioga.
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WBraun
climber
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Why?
Because you made the original mistake.
You're TheMaster and you don't know?
What kind of master are you anyways?
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WBraun
climber
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I don't see where I made "the original mistake"
I already knew you would say that before I posted that.
It will take you hundreds of lifetimes before you will completely realize the answer to that.
You will one day or a lifetime in the future ......
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WBraun
climber
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The original question was "ok or not ok?"
I directly gave "not OK". "Closed"
You did not like any of them and started ranting about it being "bullsh!t" "Our park" "Question authority" "Why" "It doesn't have to be this way"
"I'm like them in Washington" "I should entertain thoughts" etc etc.
I just plain gave direct uninterpreted simple answer ....
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John M
climber
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The original question was "ok or not ok?"
I directly gave "not OK". "Closed"
You did not like any of them and started ranting about it being "bullsh!t" "Our park" "Question authority" "Why" "It doesn't have to be this way"
"I'm like them in Washington" etc etc.
I just plain gave direct uninterpreted simple answer ....
Swish.. all net baby... all net.
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BuddhaStalin
climber
Truckee, CA
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There's a lot of fine goddamn places in this state and country to climb that are not affected by the shutdown. Go find 'em. You wont have to look very hard.
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Deekaid
climber
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The only true Master I know fights the title for all he is worth.
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John M
climber
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Werner's comments reflect the pervasive mentality among people who work for NPS that this is not our Valley. We are allowed to visit when they say, but ultimately we're like children in the kitchen -- supervised at all times for our safety and protection and that of the dishes
Nope.. Werner is just being practical. The park is closed. If you do go in, you risk arrest and fines. That has been his point all along. Way too many people have been encouraging people to go climb in the park by saying things like "its okay". Werner is just giving a clear warning that there is a risk.
He never responded to Pseudomaster. ( can't call him master because I see no mastery in him ) Why didn't he respond to Pseudomaster's question of "why". Because that wasn't the original question and arguing with someone like Pseudomaster is pointless, plus it muddies the water for those looking for practical beta. Psuedomaster just argues because he wants to argue. Plus Werner was likely partially yanking his chain by only answering the original question of the thread.
If you want to ask" Why is the Park closed", then that is a different question then the original question and has multiple levels.
Khanom, would you risk your job and home to stand up to the powers that be in Washington over something like a park closure? Its sucks and Werner and I have both said that it sucks. Werner has no power to change what they are doing in Washington and to expect him to stand up to them is just plain mean because it is foolish. You want change? then you have to look deeper then Werner's response that the park is closed. He isn't even the park superintendent. He just works for SAR.. On this forum we respect SAR, but in the politics of the park, they are peons. They have very little power to effect anything but search and rescues. They effect no other park policy. So you are asking someone with little to no power over the closure to go to their slaughter over something that will be resolved in a few weeks. What does that say about you?
Did you go to the "Occupy Yosemite" event in the meadows? Did anyone here? Some are asking Werner to risk his livelyhood and his home. What are they risking? Sneaking into the park is not the same.
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Roger Brown
climber
Oceano, California
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Well said John,
Why can't some people figure this stuff out on there own. Of course they have to control access. What is it, 10-20 thousand visitors a day during a normal October? There is no money to pay the workers so they were sent home. There are no bathrooms, no one to empty thrash cans, no one to keep tourons from driving in the meadows or parking in the street blocking traffic. Without some kind of control, the tourons would destroy our park in no time. It is not the rangers, or the NPS, or the president. It's Congress. Our Congress. We voted them in and we can vote them out. Those that come on here, talk sh#t, call other people names, while hiding behind a phoney name, probably don't even vote.
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Gene
climber
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I give up.
Good. Thank you.
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John M
climber
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I addressed part of the "why" of why does the park service close the park on another thread. Roger Brown just gave a synopsis just above your post. I will just add that maybe you know how to leave no trace but most humans don't. The park services mandate is to protect the park from those people. They also have the mandate of creating access. So it could be argued that staying open is necessary for them to fulfill their mandate. But then lots of government entities are not fulfilling their mandates because Congress has shut off their funds and if they do anything but spend money on only absolutely necessary items, then they can face serious consequences.
Most people don't know how to "leave no trace". That is the simple answer.
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splitclimber
climber
Sonoma County
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I don't really see why werner has to answer your WHY question.
Can't anyone answer that or give their opinion?
Why do you think the park is closed, master?
His responses make perfect sense to me.
you're barking up the wrong tree here, me thinks.
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| Messages 1 - 40 of total 40 in this topic |
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