Funded!!!! Obama caved!!!

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Russ Walling

Social climber
from Poofters Froth, Wyoming
Topic Author's Original Post - Oct 1, 2013 - 07:53pm PT
You heard it here first!
monolith

climber
SF bay area
Oct 1, 2013 - 07:57pm PT
Wake up and change the sheets, Russ.
Ken M

Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
Oct 1, 2013 - 07:57pm PT
yep, remember who was the stupid one
TGT

Social climber
So Cal
Oct 1, 2013 - 07:59pm PT
philo

Trad climber
Is that light the end of the tunnel or a train?
Oct 1, 2013 - 10:47pm PT
photo not found
Missing photo ID#323561
couchmaster

climber
pdx
Oct 1, 2013 - 10:52pm PT
The republicans will cave first. You heard it here for the 100,000 time or so. LOL

Russ, one of is will be right, you see any kind of a potential bet here?
zBrown

Ice climber
Brujo de La Playa
Oct 1, 2013 - 10:55pm PT
Correction. It's what the insurance companies don't want you to know. The repubs don't take the time to know anything, they just keep cashin' their distributions.
Reilly

Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
Oct 1, 2013 - 11:02pm PT
What none of y'all seem to be aware of is that the US Treasury is still printing money as we
speak so everything will be funded when they catch up.
patrick compton

Trad climber
van
Oct 2, 2013 - 09:47am PT
Credit: patrick compton
philo

Trad climber
Is that light the end of the tunnel or a train?
Oct 2, 2013 - 10:11am PT
^^^^^^

At the rate the TeaBaggin GOPers are firing up the "Torch and Pitchfork" mob we may get to see his complection change from that sick eerie orange to a more appealing burnt ochre.
whitemeat

Big Wall climber
San Luis Obispo, CA
Oct 2, 2013 - 10:28am PT
so are the natl parks still closed?
Gunkie

Trad climber
East Coast US
Oct 2, 2013 - 10:54am PT
What Philo posted...

I can attest that I contributed directly to the health insurance profits. I've been an independent contractor for many parts of my career and had to pay for my family's health care from 2000-2006.

In 2000, I paid about $6000/year for very good coverage.

In 2006, I paid about $16000/year for good coverage.

I am currently paying $1700/month ($20,400/year) for good coverage.

I can't wait to enroll in the health exchanges.

locker

Social climber
Some Rehab in Bolivia
Oct 2, 2013 - 11:12am PT

"In 2000, I paid about $6000/year for very good coverage.

In 2006, I paid about $16000/year for good coverage.

I am currently paying $1700/month ($20,400/year) for good coverage.."
...


^^^

And people want THAT to continue???...

Why???...


patrick compton

Trad climber
van
Oct 2, 2013 - 11:43am PT
they dont, and teapublicans know they will lose votes from people with the above scenario... so they shut down the govt like a bunch of babies.
Dr. F.

Trad climber
SoCal
Oct 2, 2013 - 11:56am PT
Funded! Republicans caved!!!!
you heard it here first....

Democracies don't operate by Hostage taking.
You can never negotiate with terrorists, because they will only do again, and again.
kc

Trad climber
the cats
Oct 2, 2013 - 12:10pm PT
So--Ii just got my 'new' coverage and rates from Blue Shield. My premium is up $200 a month with really just terrible coverage. Much worse than I had before. Nice 'improvement'.
Snowmassguy

Trad climber
Calirado
Oct 2, 2013 - 12:26pm PT
So I carry coverage for my family and separate coverage for me. I have a " pre existing" condition...injured years ago when buried in a large avalanche. My policy is underwritten by the state so I end up with great coverage for a reasonable rate. My family policy is also reasonable as we are still considered young and healthy.

As of Jan 1 both my policy and my family policy are CANCELED. So much for being able to keep your insurance if you want to. Speaking with brokers has led me to believe that the cost of my coverage will increase dramatically under Obamacare. So much so, it is likely I will not be able to afford coverage. Nice......

locker

Social climber
Some Rehab in Bolivia
Oct 2, 2013 - 12:28pm PT


Right...


Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Relic MilkEye and grandpoobah of HRKRNH
Oct 2, 2013 - 12:33pm PT
Been looking at the various sites this am on the ACA..Good friggin grief ..

estimates of 30 million will STILL go un insured for years ahead. 30 MILLION.

Then throw in the debacles over medicaid for the poor. And toss in those on SS that will have their SS attached. And then theres those that make just a wee too much and CAN NOT afford the "rates" whatever those may be.

Not one site can give me MY figures. They are as functional as the program it seems. Those not qualifying for any subsidy thus far that i know of have had their rates soar.
GhoulweJ

Trad climber
El Dorado Hills, CA
Oct 2, 2013 - 12:36pm PT
Obama care... In one long sentence how f'ed up our politicians are.
This is funny... and sad.

EDIT: Yo! lib fanatics, ignore the Romney poster. It's a good/funny listen.

apogee

climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
Oct 2, 2013 - 12:36pm PT
Get some goddam insurance, Ron. Stop sucking off the social program teat, and take some personal responsibility.
locker

Social climber
Some Rehab in Bolivia
Oct 2, 2013 - 12:40pm PT


"Been looking at the various sites this am on the ACA..Good friggin grief ..

estimates of 30 million will STILL go un insured for years ahead. 30 MILLION."
...


Exactly!!!...

Just one more reason why we NEED "Universal Healthcare"...

I think you can blame the Republicans for that one...

Had they not BLOCKED as they do so often...

the above may not be...



Snowmassguy

Trad climber
Calirado
Oct 2, 2013 - 12:41pm PT
All I know is I am F***ed
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Relic MilkEye and grandpoobah of HRKRNH
Oct 2, 2013 - 12:42pm PT
Apogee tell me what social program TIT im on..? I have NEVER been on a social program tit.



GhoulweJ,, that was PERFECT and the best explanation of the ACA ever.!
Norton

Social climber
the Wastelands
Oct 2, 2013 - 12:44pm PT
well well

I see Ron is finally coming on over to our side

he is now lamenting that so many Americans do not have health insurance and just go to the
emergency rooms who then bill the government which Ron pays taxes into

I agree Ron, it is now day TWO of the ACA, how come everyone is not signed up yet!

this is an outrage I tell you!

I agree with Ron, this IS about taking personal responsibility instead of sucking off Ron
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Relic MilkEye and grandpoobah of HRKRNH
Oct 2, 2013 - 12:49pm PT
ibiiduh ibbiduh ibbiduh Norton.. I cant sign up even if i wanted and could afford to - the sites arent working. Good start to a non functional program me thinks. And since my clientele shall be screwed and tattooed with their health care costs, i can certainly count on even less business than now. In fact ive been finding out the my average clientele shall be hit the worst.

Yes,, so now NON affordable insurance will be FORCED upon us. Things like luxury items, disposable cash and recreation will go down the tubes. And is doing so right now.

locker

Social climber
Some Rehab in Bolivia
Oct 2, 2013 - 12:53pm PT


"Good start to a non functional program me thinks"...

The program is getting bogged down with people signing up...

;-)

apogee

climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
Oct 2, 2013 - 12:56pm PT
"I cant sign up even if i wanted and could afford to"


Bullsh#t, Ron. If I can afford it, you can afford it.

If/when you get hurt or ill, you are not going to be able to pay for all of the care that is provided to you. Guess who will get to pay for that? Yep, that would be us.

You know, your argument would hold just a little more credibility if you had personal responsibility to insure yourself, and make sure your problem doesn't become everybody else's problem.
climbski2

Mountain climber
Anchorage AK, Reno NV
Oct 2, 2013 - 12:56pm PT
LOL if Obamacare was so bad the republicans would not be trying to block it.. they would let it go in effect and destroy the democrats. Methinks they doth protest too much

Oh and WTF does all this have to do with funding the government? Is Obama trying to shove tax hikes on the rich by attaching it to a basic budget?

Nope its ONLY the republicans trying to attach unrelated demands.

You cannot tell me the republicans are afraid of something as bad as they claim obamacare is when if it really was that bad it would only stick to Obama... since it's His legislation.

They would let it go through and laugh all the way to the polls.

Repubs are clearly liars or political idiots. I see no other possible analysis of the situation.

The fact is they are trying to kill it before it happens because they are very afraid people will like it once they actually have it. It's hard to tell people how bad a peperoni pizza is once they have eaten one.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Relic MilkEye and grandpoobah of HRKRNH
Oct 2, 2013 - 12:58pm PT
Wrong locker,, NONE of the calculators function period. And wont for some time to come. It has to do with the fact this whole shytshow is tied directly to the IRS. Wanna talk functionality??


46M un -insured in the US right now. After full implementation there will still be 30 M uninsured. Because they CANT AFFORD THE AFFORDABLE HEALTH CARE ACT,, oxy moronic to the letter.


edit: Apogee you have no clue what i can or cant afford. NONE,, ok..?


Climb2ski-- So we should just let ridiculous plans be forced upon us just to make political sides look bad?? I hope you dont VOTE on that premise.
climbski2

Mountain climber
Anchorage AK, Reno NV
Oct 2, 2013 - 12:59pm PT
So 16M more insured is bad?
locker

Social climber
Some Rehab in Bolivia
Oct 2, 2013 - 01:00pm PT
"Things like luxury items, disposable cash and recreation will go down the tubes"...

Talk about SPOILED, "Stupid Americans"...

...

We have it so fuking GOOD over here!!!...

We could be SUPPOSEDLY fuked, and be a million times BETTER off...



Be happy that others (FELLOW STUPID AMERICANS!!!) now will be able to get the coverage that before was unattainable to them...


Dave Kos

Social climber
Temecula
Oct 2, 2013 - 01:01pm PT
Repubs are clearly liars or political idiots. I see no other possible analysis of the situation.

It's really just desperation. They have no viable long-term political strategy.
pyro

Big Wall climber
Calabasas
Oct 2, 2013 - 01:01pm PT
Obama care=bullshit!
I love the price of the packages they offer.
They must think we have lots of money.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Relic MilkEye and grandpoobah of HRKRNH
Oct 2, 2013 - 01:03pm PT
Yur RIGHT Lokcer, we are spoiled,, so SELL YOUR CLIMBING GEAR AND GIVE IT TO KENYA. G-damm climbers are the most spoiled self centered of all. Get on that would ya!
climbski2

Mountain climber
Anchorage AK, Reno NV
Oct 2, 2013 - 01:05pm PT
No Ron the republicans could do an honorable job trying to stop Obamacare.. one could argue they have done so.. up until now when they have decided to throw the baby out with the bathwater.. now they have gone too far even if you agree that Obamacare is bad. They are doing more harm than good.

That's the problem now.
Snowmassguy

Trad climber
Calirado
Oct 2, 2013 - 01:05pm PT
Healthcare is and will continue to be a joke in the U.S. for DECADES to come. Now we will just add bureaucracy to the mix. I typically wake up in the Am and say...man the government runs in a finely tuned and efficient manner. I bet they will do great with health care lol
I see a huge shortage of primary care physicians being an issue. I work with/around many physicians. None of them want their own children to pursue medicine. The other advice I hear is if they do, go into a specialty that has little to do with insurance( cosmetic etc).

I also see 2 classes of care in the future. The wealthy will get access to the best doctors and the rest of us will be left with long waits and possibly not the best care. Actually, it is already happening with many primarys offering their "concierge service". My primary kicked me to the curb because I will not pay him an $1800 per year fee just to be able to be one of his patients.

Good times!

Now I am off to apply at Costco or some other retailer where I can receive medical benefits. Honestly thinking it is time to close up my fairly successful small business and work for the MAN.( ie health benefits)
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Relic MilkEye and grandpoobah of HRKRNH
Oct 2, 2013 - 01:08pm PT
I hear that Snowmass! But here we have 3000 applicants for a lousy entrance shelf stocker position of which many have degrees.
apogee

climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
Oct 2, 2013 - 01:08pm PT
Ya know, Ron, when I first got into my line of work, I couldn't afford a lot of stuff, including medical insurance. A few, well-intentioned 'tough love' friends of mine told me that if my line of work doesn't allow me to cover basic personal responsibilities (like insurance), perhaps I need to find a different line of work, or figure out a way to take responsibility for myself.

Capiche?
Dave Kos

Social climber
Temecula
Oct 2, 2013 - 01:10pm PT
None of them want their own children to pursue medicine.


Most people don't want their kids to pursue the same profession. Many of us are blinded by the "grass is greener on the other side" phenomenon.

Even Warren Buffet doesn't want his kids to be billionaires.

locker

Social climber
Some Rehab in Bolivia
Oct 2, 2013 - 01:13pm PT


"Even Warren Buffet doesn't want his kids to be billionaires."...

I read that one too!!!...

To quote:

"I don't want my kids to be Billionaires!!! They're just going to have to settle for being Multi Millionaires"...
Snowmassguy

Trad climber
Calirado
Oct 2, 2013 - 01:14pm PT
The crazy thing is that I could afford it when purchased on the open market. If what I am seeing/being told is true, my cost to insure my family will at least....double.

Recently, I was doing contract work for a Fortune 500 company. Their yet to be announced plan is to transition from 80% ft employees to 50%. So thousands will be getting their hours cut and will lose corporate health benefits. Sucks to be them!

EDIT: Sucks to be me too. I supported it initially. As Obama said...If you like your health insurance, you can keep it. Nope, it goes Bye Bye on Jan 1 and I pay wayyy more.

Typical politician BS. Tell the people what they want to hear and then change it later.

Not much trust of the government in our household these days!
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Relic MilkEye and grandpoobah of HRKRNH
Oct 2, 2013 - 01:16pm PT
Apogee, that responsibilty thing you keep throwing at me is hillarious. You also talk like im on some social program tit too. Wrong and wrong buddy.

I have been PAYING my medical bills,, without ANY assistance from any social friggin program. I TOOK RESPONSIBILITY to do so capiche?

And i also want an opportunity to continue to make a living capiche?

That means the thousand of companies turning their employees into PART time to avoid costly coverages arent going to help ANY of us stay in business.
locker

Social climber
Some Rehab in Bolivia
Oct 2, 2013 - 01:17pm PT


Just don't sign up and take the fine at the end of the year...

Case closed!!!...

Jebus H Bomz

climber
Peavine Basecamp
Oct 2, 2013 - 01:18pm PT
Health tied to work. Kinda antiquated in an age where there is no worker/workplace loyalty anymore.
Snowmassguy

Trad climber
Calirado
Oct 2, 2013 - 01:20pm PT
Just don't sign up and take the fine at the end of the year...

Case closed!!!...


Thinking about it. Having a couple sub 18 year old kids make it difficult. More likely will need to take a shi**y job with bene's in addition to my FT job.
locker

Social climber
Some Rehab in Bolivia
Oct 2, 2013 - 01:22pm PT

For those complaining of having rates go up???...

You MUST be making some pretty decent money then...

Quit CRYING!!!...

You've had it WAYYYYYYYYY too good for too long!!!...



;-)





EDITED:

In the meantime...

While you're all enjoying WORK...

I'll be out CLIMBING!!!...

LOL!!!...

Fuking A!!!...

apogee

climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
Oct 2, 2013 - 01:22pm PT
"You also talk like im on some social program tit too."

Good on ya for 'paying as you go', thusfar, Ron.

Problem is, even if you never have a serious accident, you will very likely require significant medical care in the later years of your life. Even if you turn down the majority of the options, you are going to need care you won't be able to pay for.

Unless you've got a nice little nest egg for just such an occasion, you need to take some personal responsibility (like most of us) and get yourself insured.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Relic MilkEye and grandpoobah of HRKRNH
Oct 2, 2013 - 01:23pm PT
"Thirty million is a lot smaller than the 48.6 million Americans who lack insurance coverage right now. It's also, as Woolhandler points out, not exactly breaking news: The Congressional Budget Office estimated over a year ago that between 26 million and 27 million Americans would not have insurance under the expansion."





^^^^^^^^^^^^They have known for some time the failings of this program..
Dave Kos

Social climber
Temecula
Oct 2, 2013 - 01:24pm PT
[...] you will very likely require significant medical care in the later years of your life.


The Obamacare death panels will prevent that from happening.
locker

Social climber
Some Rehab in Bolivia
Oct 2, 2013 - 01:25pm PT


"^^^^^^^^^^^^They have known for some time the failings of this program.."...

NEWSFLASH!!!...

Obama wanted a LOT more for the American People as a WHOLE...

The Republicans can be blamed for what we ended up with...

Snowmassguy

Trad climber
Calirado
Oct 2, 2013 - 01:30pm PT
The death panel will take care of locker when he gets the blue butt plug stuck and seeks medical care
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Relic MilkEye and grandpoobah of HRKRNH
Oct 2, 2013 - 01:34pm PT
Locker, go find the utube of obama saying electricity prices will skyrocket under his GW plans. Then go find the utubes of him talking about the reduced cost of healthcare for americans. THEN compare those to actual people telling you what is happening right here in this thread. Youll find NO pattern of "support" for the american people. But you will find increased costs of everything and another 10,000 IRS agents to seize money and property.
TGT

Social climber
So Cal
Oct 2, 2013 - 01:34pm PT
Hey, there's still money for Barry's massage chair.

http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/despite-govt-shutdown-army-awards-2163-contract-massage-chair_759085.html

The chair was ordered for Fort Belvoir in Virginia, the site of many of President Obama's local golf outings. The classification is "Furniture," so it is not clear if the chair is intended as a rehabilitation tool, or just a relaxation aid.

Is Barry's caddy an essential government employee too?
blahblah

Gym climber
Boulder
Oct 2, 2013 - 01:35pm PT

Problem is, even if you never have a serious accident, you will very likely require significant medical care in the later years of your life. Even if you turn down the majority of the options, you are going to need care you won't be able to pay for.

Unless you've got a nice little nest egg for just such an occasion, you need to take some personal responsibility (like most of us) and get yourself insured.

He gets Medicare when he's 65--assuming he's a citizen :)
We call that "insurance," although taxpayer funded health care would be a better way to describe it, same thing that, in a way, most Americans with "insurance" get.
I put "insurance" in quotes because what is called "insurance" now, and even more so under Obama-care, isn't really what the word "insurance" means, although there's an element of that.

Anyway, you can't really blame anyone for failing to pay free market rates for something where the government has prevented a free market from functioning.
locker

Social climber
Some Rehab in Bolivia
Oct 2, 2013 - 01:41pm PT


"Locker, go find the utube of obama saying electricity prices will skyrocket under his GW plans"...


NO!!!...

I don't feel like it...

;-)



But if you'd like to since you brought it up???...

jstan

climber
Oct 2, 2013 - 01:43pm PT
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RIJfDn60FpA

This amazingly informative account of contributions to western culture coming from the Arab
world during Sumerian and Babylonian times poses us an urgent and very timely question.

How is it such a rich and creative culture has sunk to that which we see today in that part of the
world? In just 7000 years you are very unlikely to see genetic drift adequate to explain.

A hypothesis. The Muslim world places huge value on conformity; so much so as to suggest death
to all those not conforming. Just as Rush Limbaugh believes conformity confers strength for the
next election, perhaps Mohammed was a vehicle for achieving short term strength in the face of
renaissance Europe. Presently that conformity has however caused shutdown of the US
government at no real benefit to anyone (least of all to its authors) and unchecked religious
warfare throughout the Arab world.

While conformity may provide short term strength, I wonder if conformity is not a disaster long
term.

If this is so, the chaos we see here on ST may actually be a good thing - long term.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Relic MilkEye and grandpoobah of HRKRNH
Oct 2, 2013 - 01:47pm PT
WHen the GOVT does: Stop payments , aid money and arms to ALL ME countries, and removes our forces from conflicts non of OUR business, and stops the rampant govt growth of agencies like the IRS, THEN we might have the money needed to really pull of a healthcare system that would work for all. Im not holding my breath though. And i would TRULY love to see such a thing happen. But now i only see many future bankruptcys, closing businesses, reduced hours for employees and disposable cash a thing all but extinct.
Dave Kos

Social climber
Temecula
Oct 2, 2013 - 01:48pm PT
Anyway, you can't really blame anyone for failing to pay free market rates for something where the government has prevented a free market from functioning.

You can't have a free market for healthcare OR health insurance.

Pretty much every textbook market failure applies to both. Information asymmetry is a biggie, as this thread illustrates, and there are many others.

I'm a free market kind of guy, but there are areas where purely free markets just cannot work. Healthcare is the biggest of these.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Relic MilkEye and grandpoobah of HRKRNH
Oct 2, 2013 - 01:51pm PT
Im certainly relieved that obama will have a nice MASSAGE CHAIR at his fav golf course. This is a most essential thing after all. Never mind the closing parks, and the little people who now suffer from lost wages..Our prezidunt has to have a massage chair over any lost wages..
locker

Social climber
Some Rehab in Bolivia
Oct 2, 2013 - 01:52pm PT


It's about BALANCE...

and the scales have finally TIPPED in a better direction...



EDITED:

"Never mind the closing parks, and the little people who now suffer from lost wages"...

Uh...

Who forced that closure again???...

TGT

Social climber
So Cal
Oct 2, 2013 - 01:55pm PT
From the RFQ



The NARCO - Fort Belvoir requires the following items, Brand Name or Equal, to the following:
LI 001: Black OSAKI OS-6000 Leather Deluxe Massage Chair
? Relaxation chair with massage cababilities ? Recline functions for recumbent positions ? Ability for zero gravity position ? Multi-roller capabilities ? At least 30 air bags around the neck, arms, legs, back, hands, and feet ? Automatic and manual vibration programs ? Controller for adjusting programs and settings ? Various methods of massage including: rolling, tapping, and kneading ? Various massage speed settings ? Auto-timer ? Adjustable footrest ? MP3 music integration

Zero Gravity positions you back to minimize pressure along the spine. The chair is equipped with twin rollers to mimic the feel of human thumbs & Fingers, enhancing the massage experience. MP3 player with Music sync with two speakers in the backrest. LED light in the side panel create one kind of nice environment. Designed with a set of S-track movable intelligent massage robot, special focus on the neck, shoulder and lumbar massage according to body curve. Uses twin rollers to mimic the feel of the human thumb, thereby enhancing the massage experience. 51 air bags around the neck, shoulder, back, seat, arms, palms, soles for extra comfort as it cradles the body like a glove for increased massage effectiveness. Automatically detect the whole body curve as well as make micro adjustments, which brings more humanistic and scientific massage enjoyment. Six unique auto programs: Anti-stress, Stretching, Full Air and more! Automatic massage for the upper body (the shoulder, neck, back and the lumbar); the lower body (buttock, thigh, calves and the feet). Manual massage for the upper body with three options, namely Full, Partial and Spot options; Six methods, namely Polling, Kneading, Tapping, Clapping, Shiatsu, Swedish with five levels of speed, intensity and three kinds of width adjustable respectively. The buttocks vibration massage offers air bubble-like massage to your skin through gentle rhythmic vibration that helps eliminate weariness and improve overall health. The footrest can be extended for various heights between 59" to 75", It comes complete with an auto-sensor button to scan the soles for a comfortable fit and extend its leg-rest to accommodate various heights. The LCD displayer with wireless mini-controller. Auto-timer 5-30 minutes options
Zero Gravity Design: ? Most ergonomically correct inclining position, taking all the burden of gravity off your spine. It cradles you like a baby and leaves you feeling weightless and deeply released ? Helps relieve back pressure - Helps reduce muscle tension ? Helps correct spinal alignment ? Helps expand lung capacity ? Helps decrease stress on the heart, 1, EA;

Solicitation and Buy Attachments
Dave Kos

Social climber
Temecula
Oct 2, 2013 - 01:57pm PT
Yup, and drones are less costly to operate than manned aircraft.

Kudos to Obama for cutting government costs!
Snowmassguy

Trad climber
Calirado
Oct 2, 2013 - 02:00pm PT
I can buy me one of those chairs with the 1-2 payments I am not going to make to Obamacare. Remember, it takes us young healthy people to buy into the system to pay for the old broken down Locker types hehehe
apogee

climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
Oct 2, 2013 - 02:00pm PT
Hey, TGT...do you have medical insurance?
patrick compton

Trad climber
van
Oct 2, 2013 - 02:02pm PT
irony: climbers that don't want single-payer health care.
TGT

Social climber
So Cal
Oct 2, 2013 - 02:06pm PT
The National Park Service has ordered the closure of a Virginia park that sits on federal land, even though the government provides no resources for its maintenance or operation.

The Claude Moore Colonial Farm announced on Wednesday that NPS has ordered it to suspend operations until Congress agrees to a deal to fund the federal government.

According to Anna Eberly, managing director of the farm, NPS sent law enforcement agents to the park on Tuesday evening to remove staff and volunteers from the property.

“You do have to wonder about the wisdom of an organization that would use staff they don’t have the money to pay to evict visitors from a park site that operates without costing them any money,” she said.

The park withstood prior government shutdowns, noting in a news release that the farm will be closed to the public for the first time in 40 years.

“In previous budget dramas, the Farm has always been exempted since the NPS provides no staff or resources to operate the Farm,” Eberly explained in an emailed statement.

“In all the years I have worked with the National Park Service … I have never worked with a more arrogant, arbitrary and vindictive group representing the NPS,” Eberly said.

The farm is an historical reenactment site, which “authentically portrays the life of an 18th Century American family building a life on the nearer edges of civilized society,” according to its website.

Farm staff repeatedly asked the NPS to allow the farm to remain open. “Every appeal our Board of Directors made to the NPS administration was denied,” Eberly said.

She called the decision “utter crap.”

“We have operated the Farm successfully for 32 years after the NPS cut the Farm from its budget in 1980 and are fully staffed and prepared to open today. But there are barricades at the Pavilions and entrance to the Farm,” Eberly explained.

Previous federal funding battles have threatened the farm’s operations. A group of citizens in 1980 formed the Friends of Turkey Run Farm, established a $500,000 endowment for the farm, and negotiated a 30-year no-fee lease.

According to Eberly’s statement, farm staff have been in contact with Reps. Frank Wolf (R., Va.) and Jim Moran (D., Va.) in an attempt to reverse NPS’ decision. Neither congressman returned a request for comment.

News of the farm closure comes as controversy rages over the closure of the World War II memorial on the National Mall.

WWII veterans in Washington as part of the Honor Flight Network stormed the memorial on Tuesday, defying NPS, which insisted that the memorial was legally closed.

More Honor Flight veterans showed up on Wendesday, flanked by members of Congress from both parties. Republican members blamed Democrats for the memorial’s closure, and vice versa.

Some speculated that the decision to close the memorial was part of a concerted effort by the administration to play up the consequences of the shutdown in an effort to convince congressional Republicans to agree to a funding bill without preconditions.

That tactic is known as the Washington Monument Strategy, in reference to efforts by Nixon administration officials to inflate the consequences of budget cuts at the time
Cragman

Trad climber
June Lake, California....via the Damascus Road
Oct 2, 2013 - 02:09pm PT
We have such an informed citizenry.


http://www.ijreview.com/2013/10/83292-watch-jimmy-kimmels-hilarious-obamacare-prank/
Snowmassguy

Trad climber
Calirado
Oct 2, 2013 - 02:10pm PT
Why...because they can. Stupid American government. Let's make it hurt....pinkie to mouth Dr Evil style
Norton

Social climber
the Wastelands
Oct 2, 2013 - 02:12pm PT
Just don't sign up and take the fine at the end of the year...

yes, that will "work"

the first year the fine is only some $95 so yeah don't get health insurance and take the gamble

the second year it goes up to like 300 and another hike the next year

the goal is not have freeloaders who mooch off the rest of us who pay in

drive a car without insurance, sure go ahead as the ticket and court appearance are not painful

....until you are the non insured driver in an accident

then watch everything you have in life being taken away by the lawsuit

....we are all this together, and we ought to act like we know that
locker

Social climber
Some Rehab in Bolivia
Oct 2, 2013 - 02:15pm PT


"Remember, it take us healthy people to buy into the system to pay for the old broken down Locker types hehehe"...


THANKS!!!...

;-)

Snowmassguy

Trad climber
Calirado
Oct 2, 2013 - 02:15pm PT
Why are we in it together? Because the government tells us so? Of course, politicians know best.
locker

Social climber
Some Rehab in Bolivia
Oct 2, 2013 - 02:17pm PT


"....we are all this together"...


That surely DOESN'T appear to be the case (though it IS true of course)...







EDITED:

"Why are we in it together? Because the government tells us so?"...

Ever see those signs you drive by daily that has the Speed Limit???...





Snowmassguy

Trad climber
Calirado
Oct 2, 2013 - 02:21pm PT
Obamacare will go bust and require a MASSIVE tax hike 5-10years down the road because 20 somethings in good health will likely not buy into the plan to finance the aging boomers.

Prepare to PAY. At risk of plagiarism...stupid sheep.
apogee

climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
Oct 2, 2013 - 02:21pm PT
Hey, TGT...has this shutdown affected your company's business yet?

In one day, the impacts hit my business directly: loss of access to a primary site of operation, and the loss of business from a gov't agency who regularly works with my company.

How about you?
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Relic MilkEye and grandpoobah of HRKRNH
Oct 2, 2013 - 02:26pm PT
Right now there are a few million out there who dont look for work anymore as they are on full welfare. IF they take a job it would be a low wage one that wont cover them, so on the tit they remain.

This forced health extortion will be the exact same. Indeed many will prefer the cheaper penalty's, and the gubbmint WILL enact MORE LAWS to raise those. Just like the states did for those driving without insurance. In fact you can easily loose your license in many states now over non insured driving.

At each of these fiascos we see a decreased personal responsibility being replaced by govt forced rules.

Kinda of like N Korea really. They too are forced into the single line philosophy of herding sheep.
apogee

climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
Oct 2, 2013 - 02:28pm PT
Right now, Ron, I'm way more concerned about the fact that the House Republican gov't hostage tactics have cut deeply into my already modest income. F*#k those guys!
TGT

Social climber
So Cal
Oct 2, 2013 - 02:29pm PT
Rampant fraud on a New York City contract last year didn’t stop a major nonprofit from landing a slew of federal contracts to sign people up for ObamaCare.

Seedco, a New York-based community-development organization, was sued by the federal government for faking at least 1,400 of 6,500 job placements under a $22.2 million federally funded contract with the city.

Eighteen months later, the feds and Seedco are teaming up again, this time to help medical-insurance seekers maneuver through the maze that is the Affordable Health Care Act.

http://nypost.com/2013/10/01/fraud-firm-gets-ok-to-sign-people-up-for-obamacare/
Dave Kos

Social climber
Temecula
Oct 2, 2013 - 02:32pm PT
[...] MASSIVE tax hike 5-10years down the road because 20 somethings in good health will likely not buy into the plan to finance the aging boomers.

Tax hikes to fund the baby boomer's debts are going to happen regardless of Obamacare.
Norton

Social climber
the Wastelands
Oct 2, 2013 - 02:35pm PT
TFG was not aware of that
apogee

climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
Oct 2, 2013 - 02:35pm PT
Hey, TGT...how's the closure affecting your company?
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Relic MilkEye and grandpoobah of HRKRNH
Oct 2, 2013 - 02:37pm PT
Apogee i feel your pain.. Lyon County NV, the most unemployment, foreclosures and bankruptcy in the worst state in the union for all those.

I want a chance to survive in my business and buy my own damm coverage. Or be able to pay it off directly. Wouldnt that be nice?

This system ensures that more will become working poor and disposable cash extinct. Which means more on the govt tit down a short road. I cant help but think its a design for disaster.

apogee

climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
Oct 2, 2013 - 02:47pm PT
"i feel your pain"

No, you don't, Ron.

I appreciate your attempt for empathy, but the county where I live is in the country's top 2 worst hits for foreclosures...while our living areas might have similar economic impacts, you're ability to continue conducting your business hasn't been dramatically reduced in the matter of 24 hours. It's not the same, Ron.

And even with these impacts, I plan on paying my medical insurance this month. You know...being personally responsible & all that.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Relic MilkEye and grandpoobah of HRKRNH
Oct 2, 2013 - 02:58pm PT
Then your better off than me. Im wondering how my upfront bills will be paid about every month. Try a 75% loss of business on fer size. And with upcoming insurance extortion rates, this will INCREASE. On that you may rely.
Gimp

Trad climber
Grand Junction
Oct 2, 2013 - 03:06pm PT
In regards to Gunkie's and Philo's earlier posts.
The two absolutes are:
1. Insurance company profits will continue to rise.
2. Health insurance premiums will continue to rise.

In addition as I understand it you will now pay a 2.3% sales tax on your premium and in Gunkie's instance he will pay a "fine/tax" for having a good policy i.e. over a $10,000 dollar premium (reference data from the WSJ).

Another question is who will not demand supplementation such that they have the platinum plan versus the bronze plan that only covers 40% of your health care costs? This seems like a very complex issue in itself since those in need of the platinum that are currently uninsured certainly will not have the resources to pay their portion of this plan.

On a more personal, note my 85 year old mother (a fervent Obama supportor) has now been bumped by IBM to the exchanges for her medicare supplemental. Not something she planned on trying to negotiate via computer at this point in her life. Her physicians office has already notified her of the need to get this clarified pronto!!
Steve

Snowmassguy

Trad climber
Calirado
Oct 2, 2013 - 03:45pm PT
We are all Fu***'d.

I am going to drop out and go on the dole ( while climbing daily).

Government, please take care of me.
Ward Trotter

Trad climber
Oct 2, 2013 - 04:04pm PT
Yes that's why they all voted for it hahahaha

Twentysomethings didn't know what they were voting for. Most of them were too stupid, and don't know anything about the adult world. With Obama they thought they were getting The Lord of social media. This is what the media was telling them.

Wait until they find out otherwise--some of them already are.

In fact over the next year ordinary people are going to discover what Obamacare is really all about.
Up until now only a few wonks have been able to unravel this turkey.

Wait until ordinary Americans find out.

Next step is gov't cost controls on medical goods and services, then single payer

If this is true then this comment is a way of saying that Obama , who assured everyone that single payer was not the goal, is a bald-faced manipulative liar, who purposely misrepresented this looming train wreck.

And pretty soon now, there won't be any kind of repub obstructionism to deal with - the tea party will see to that.

This is the current bandwagon blog line that is a rather transparent attempt to marginalize growing numbers of ordinary Americans who are , and have always been , opposed to Obamacare and what it means for this nation and for themselves as individuals.
These Americans are letting their representatives know exactly what they think and feel.

The "tea party" is not a substantial player in this ---except as a straw boogeyman designed to fool people into thinking the opposition to Obamacare is extreme and fanatical and therefore not authentic.
Hoser

climber
vancouver
Oct 2, 2013 - 05:20pm PT
I want a chance to survive in my business and buy my own damm coverage. Or be able to pay it off directly. Wouldnt that be nice?

But I thought you already figured that out in the other thread ?

John Q public doesnt know i won in birds at a WORLD Competition nor do they know what that takes. What they ask is PRICE. And couldnt tell the diff between someone with 40 yrs and someone with 40 hours of "talent"..

If your product is no different than what I can get cheaper then you lose, thats pretty much the deal with any business...its not personal, everyone looks for the best product at the cheapest price.

Which is really why universal health care is the best.

I go to the doctors and he fixes me up just as good as the millionaire next to me.

I LOVE IT

Good Luck
Snowmassguy

Trad climber
Calirado
Oct 2, 2013 - 05:37pm PT
Unfortunately, the millionaire will get top notch, timely medical care while the masses will wait their turn for mediocre care at best.

We will see 2 classes of health care. Haves and have nots. Need an MRI sir...our next available appointment is 4 months from now.


Gary

Social climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
Oct 2, 2013 - 05:51pm PT
I am going to drop out and go on the dole ( while climbing daily).

Government, please take care of me.

Let us know how that works out for you.
locker

Social climber
Some Rehab in Bolivia
Oct 2, 2013 - 05:52pm PT

"Right now there are a few million out there who dont look for work anymore as they are on full welfare"...


Yeah...

they'll be CRUISING huh...

Such a great life!!!...

Easy street!!!...

Nice cars, fancy houses, each kid with an Iphone...

Heaven!!!...


pyro

Big Wall climber
Calabasas
Oct 2, 2013 - 05:58pm PT
G-damm climbers are the most spoiled self centered of all. Get on that would ya

lol!

soo true!
TGT

Social climber
So Cal
Oct 2, 2013 - 06:07pm PT


this guy shut the govt down seven times in eight years.

Dems weren't complaining then.
TGT

Social climber
So Cal
Oct 2, 2013 - 06:16pm PT




What right does the House have to do it?

They have more than a right, they have a duty that they were elected to perform!

Norton

Social climber
the Wastelands
Oct 2, 2013 - 06:20pm PT
by that logic, TGT

SO DOES THE SENATE AND THE PRESIDENT

duh
WBraun

climber
Oct 2, 2013 - 06:22pm PT
The same faces are always on both sides of the coin.

The Nortons and Hedges are those faces.

Stupid tools .....
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Relic MilkEye and grandpoobah of HRKRNH
Oct 2, 2013 - 06:24pm PT
if you want to look at harry reid-tards accomplishment level,, he has rode Nevada into the worst state in the union. nuff said.
Dave Kos

Social climber
Temecula
Oct 2, 2013 - 06:37pm PT
I miss the days when Nevada was the best state in the union.
Ward Trotter

Trad climber
Oct 2, 2013 - 06:38pm PT
To the extent that the entire right-wing anti-government philosophy is built around straw boogeyman issues, you're correct.

It's pretty obvious that a substantial % of wingnuts would vote for a 3rd-party,Tea Party candidate - that's why congressional repubs dare not cross them.

The is an example of the extremist tin foil hat stuff ratcheted up all over the political blogs and even the mainstream media right now.
The aim here is to get ordinary people to think that there is no credible , broad-based, grassroots opposition to Obamacare.
Sierra Ledge Rat

Mountain climber
Old and Broken Down in Appalachia
Oct 2, 2013 - 06:43pm PT
"In 2000, I paid about $6000/year for very good coverage.

In 2006, I paid about $16000/year for good coverage.

I am currently paying $1700/month ($20,400/year) for good coverage.."...


^^^

And people want THAT to continue???...

Why???...

Because, dumbass, it's not about you. It's about corporate profits. The sooner you learn to sacrifice yourself for corporate America, the richer the sharholders will be. Don't you get it? You need to become a team player with corporate America, or go live in Iran.
TGT

Social climber
So Cal
Oct 2, 2013 - 06:44pm PT
You really don't believe there will ever be Tea Party candidates?


Who do you think swept the House and numerous state legislatures in 2010?

locker

Social climber
Some Rehab in Bolivia
Oct 2, 2013 - 06:45pm PT

"Because, dumbass, it's not about you. It's about corporate profits. The sooner you learn to sacrifice yourself for corporate America, the richer the sharholders will be. Don't you get it? You need to become a team player with corporate America"...


I get it now!!!...

What the fuk was I thinking???...

;-)

Ward Trotter

Trad climber
Oct 2, 2013 - 06:45pm PT
You really don't believe there will ever be Tea Party candidates?

Yeah there are all sorts out there beating the bushes. You happen to be one on the opposite side of tea party bogeymen.
Ward Trotter

Trad climber
Oct 2, 2013 - 06:49pm PT
Is that a yes or a no, Ward?

Neither... It's a "yeah"
Read my posts carefully to save us both time.
Wade Icey

Trad climber
www.alohashirtrescue.com
Oct 2, 2013 - 06:53pm PT
if you want to look at harry reid-tards accomplishment level,, he has rode Nevada into the worst state in the union. nuff said.

He rode Nevada into Utah?..Huh.

I thought Texas was the worst state in the Union
Sierra Ledge Rat

Mountain climber
Old and Broken Down in Appalachia
Oct 2, 2013 - 06:55pm PT
I miss the days when Nevada was the best state in the union.

I miss the days when California was the best state in the union.
Ward Trotter

Trad climber
Oct 2, 2013 - 06:57pm PT
Would you ever vote for one? A legit 3rd party Tea Party candidate?

Probably not . But you never know.
I would vote for him if you personally were the alternative.

Then again, Halloween is approaching.

What kind of bogeyman will you masquerade as?

Norton

Social climber
the Wastelands
Oct 2, 2013 - 06:57pm PT
Who do you think swept the House and numerous state legislatures in 2010?

sure, the republicans win when there is very low turnout, like in 2010 when less than 10% voted

but then along came the big one, when everyone turns out to vote....last November

and then over 5 million people voted for the President over Romney

and over 1 million people voted for Democrats than Repubs in the House races

try again, ya still got nothing
Dave Kos

Social climber
Temecula
Oct 2, 2013 - 07:01pm PT
I miss the days when California was the best state in the union.


You can go back to those days any time. Just watch old TV shows from the 1950s and 1960s.

Life was good: Daddy had a good paying job at the plant, mommy stayed at home and took care of the kids. There were no dark-skinned people (except for a few very nice ones), everyone went to church and lived wholesome lives. Folks took care of each other.

You can convince yourself that it is reality.

Most republicans have done just that.
couchmaster

climber
pdx
Oct 2, 2013 - 07:23pm PT
Harry said:
"I miss the days when California was the best state in the union."

But things were different then.


Snowmassguy

Trad climber
Calirado
Oct 2, 2013 - 10:04pm PT
I would vote for him if you personally were the alternative.

hahahahahahahhahah
TGT

Social climber
So Cal
Oct 2, 2013 - 10:17pm PT
100 unintended consequences of Obamacare!

The category most effected? Education!

Categories in bold.

Tell me again how this is a good idea?


Corporations

1. IBM
Earlier this month, the computer giant, once famed for its paternalism, announced it would remove 110,000 of its Medicare-eligible retirees from the company’s health insurance and give them subsidies to purchase coverage through the Obamacare exchanges. Retirees fear that they will not get the level of coverage they are used to, and that the options will be bewildering.

2. Delta Air Lines
In a letter to employees, Delta Air Lines revealed that the company’s health-care costs will rise about $100 million next year alone, in large part because of Obamacare. The airline said that in addition to several other changes, it would have to drop its specially crafted insurance plans for pilots because the “Cadillac tax” on luxurious health plans has made them too expensive.

3. UPS
Fifteen thousand employees’ spouses will no longer be able to use UPS’s health-care plan because they have access to coverage elsewhere. The “costs associated with the Affordable Care Act have made it increasingly difficult to continue providing the same level of health care benefits to our employees at an affordable cost,” the delivery giant said in a company memo. The move is expected to save the company $60 million next year.

4. Caterpillar Inc.
In the law’s first year, the machinery manufacturer estimated before its passage, Obamacare would add more than $100 million in health-care costs. “We can ill afford cost increases that place us at a disadvantage versus our global competitors,” a Caterpillar executive wrote lawmakers, saying that the law would not meet the goal of providing good, inexpensive health care for all Americans.

5. SeaWorld
SeaWorld used to let part-time employees work up to 32 hours per week, but the company is dropping the limit to 28 hours to keep them under the 30-hour threshold at which it would be required to provide health insurance under Obamacare. More than 80 percent of the company’s thousands of employees are part-time and/or seasonal.

Medical-Device Tax

6. Stryker Corp.
Stryker Corp., a Michigan medical-device manufacturer, laid off about 1,000 employees earlier this year due to the Affordable Care Act’s 2.3 percent excise tax on medical devices. The company estimated that the tax would cost it approximately $100 million next year. “Stryker remains significantly concerned with the upcoming medical device excise tax and its negative impact on jobs and innovation and will continue to work with Congress to try to repeal the tax,” said the company’s CEO.

7. Welch Allyn
The manufacturer announced that it will have to cut approximately 10 percent of its 2,750 employees, 275 in all, because of the medical-device tax. The company also plans to consolidate manufacturing centers, moving some operations from Beaverton, Ore., to its facility in Skaneateles Falls, N.Y.

8. Smith & Nephew
The British company informed nearly 100 employees at its Massachusetts and Tennessee facilities that they would be laid off “in order to absorb [the] cost burden” of the tax on medical devices.

Hospitals, Nonprofits

9. Cleveland Clinic, Ohio
One of the world’s best-known hospitals announced in September that it would slash jobs and up to 6 percent of its annual $6 billion budget in anticipation of costs associated with Obamacare’s implementation. A spokeswoman for the clinic announced that approximately $330 million would be cut, but she did not say how many of the 44,000 employees the clinic would let go. The Cleveland Clinic is Cleveland’s largest employer and the second-largest employer in Ohio.

10. Wake Forest Baptist Medical Center, North Carolina
Last November, the Wake Forest Baptist Medical Center, in Winston-Salem, announced that 950 full-time-equivalent positions would have to be eliminated in order to make up costs from the health-care law.

11. Orlando Health, Florida
In that same month, the Orlando Health hospital system announced the biggest staff reduction in its almost century-long history, as part of a “broader effort” to manage the effects of Obamacare, according to the Orlando Sentinel. Orlando Health will cut as many as 400 jobs across the system, in areas ranging from administrative departments to children’s hospitals.

12. Louisiana State University Hospitals
In the same article, the Sentinel noted that LSU hospitals would cut nearly 1,495 positions in order to save $150 million, apparently because of expected reductions in Medicare and Medicaid payments.

13. Delaware Hospice
Due to new interpretations of the rules for reimbursing for hospice services, Delaware Hospice, the Ocean State’s only not-for-profit hospice provider, had to let 52 employees go earlier this year. “It’s really health-care reform in action,” a spokeswoman said. “This is affecting hospices across the country. We’re working through dramatic changes in terms of the hospice-care benefits.”

14. Lawrence + Memorial Hospital, Connecticut
The New London hospital announced earlier this month that Medicare cuts programmed into Obamacare had led to the firing of 33 employees. “L+M and other hospitals are contending with massive structural changes that are happening very rapidly,” the hospital’s president and CEO said.

15. Clifton Springs Hospital, New York
Fifty-eight non-clinical employees were let go from Clifton Springs Hospital in Rochester as the hospital prepared for the changes spurred by the Affordable Care Act. “No one really knows what the impact will be because it really is a very new way for reimbursing for health care,” the hospital’s CEO told a local news station. “So I think everyone is trying to prepare for a change, and a change with less revenue.”

16. Anthem Blue Cross Blue Shield, New Hampshire
The state’s only insurer approved to offer plans on the health-insurance exchanges in New Hampshire has cut the number of hospitals that will participate in the plan from 26 to 14 in order to reach “affordable premium levels,” according to the New Hampshire Union Leader.

17. Mexican American Opportunity Foundation, California
The nonprofit, which looks after 1,100 pre-K children at its eight Southern California child-care centers, has had to reduce the hours of dozens of employees who used to work 30 to 40 hours per week. “We’re fearful it’s going to be hard to negotiate health care in any contract,” one local labor leader said. “Overall [Obamacare] is a positive step, but on a micro level it’s not all roses.”

18. Carnegie Museum, Pennsylvania
A Pittsburgh news station reports that the Carnegie Museum “reluctantly” scaled back the hours of 48 of its 600 part-time employees to less than 30 hours a week to sidestep the mandate to provide health-care coverage.

19. Fort Smith Area Agency on Aging, Arkansas
The nonprofit revealed that all of its health aides and drivers will work a maximum of 28 hours a week, and that the plan it would offer to its remaining full-time employees would be “bare bones.” To make up for additional Obamacare costs, the organization is asking employees to take steps to save money, such as changing vehicle oil after 5,000 miles rather than 3,000.

20. Emory Healthcare, Georgia
A news station in Atlanta reports that Emory Healthcare, the state’s largest health-care system, will lay off more than 100 employees, in part because of Obamacare.

21. CoverTN, Tennessee
Thousands of Tennesseans will lose their coverage under the state’s health-insurance program because it does not meet Affordable Care Act standards for yearly expenditure caps. CoverTN, which was used mainly by small businesses, had a $25,000 yearly benefits limit. “It was all I had,” one Nashville small-business owner said.

State and Local Governments

22. State of Virginia
In February the General Assembly affirmed Governor Bob McDonnell’s decision to limit the state’s part-time employees to 29 hours per week.

23. Township of Middletown, New Jersey
Middletown has also cut the hours of 25 part-time public employees. “Any of those expenses [for insurance] are going to be passed along to the taxpayers, and so in order to avoid having to do that, we chose to modify the work hours,” said the township’s administrator.

24. Brevard County, Florida
Brevard County’s insurance director told a local television station that the county’s 300-plus part-time employees will be “capped at something less than 30” hours to save the county about $10,000 per employee in health insurance.

25. Township of Berkeley, New Jersey
The Sandy-hit Jersey Shore town said it will “take a hard line” in union negotiations in limiting part-time employees’ hours, because additional health-care costs “are out of the question.” “If it came down to shaving hours to save substantial dollars, that’s something that would have to be considered,” the township administrator said.

6. Chesterfield County, Virginia
An administrator with this southern Virginia county told the Richmond Times-Dispatch that “several hundred” part-time employees could have their hours cut back to 28. Most of the employees affected would be from the Department of Mental Health Support Services.


27. City of Lynchburg, Virginia
About 40 percent of the city’s part-time work force saw cuts to their weekly hours to ensure that their totals come in below the 30-hour threshold, according to the local News & Advance. The city’s human-resources director said some departments do not have the financial resources to add employees or raise wages to make up for the lost work time.

28. City of Mason, Ohio
Cut hours for 200 part-time workers or take a $3.4 million hit: That was the decision the southwestern Ohio city faced when it started weighing Obamacare’s impact. It opted for the former. Part-timers had regularly worked more than 30 hours, but the city manager told the JournalNews that their weekly workload has been reduced to 20 hours.

29. Township of Toms River, New Jersey
Government workers in Toms River pushing the 30-hour threshold will be bumped down to “below 25” to ensure that they are considered part-time employees, according to the Asbury Park Press. “I think this was not very well thought out,” the township’s business manager said of the Affordable Care Act. “There was this fallacy that the law provisions didn’t apply to municipal government. It sure does.”

30. Lee County, Iowa
Lee County “could be out a lot of money,” a local newspaper reported a supervisor saying, if the county doesn’t stick to its new policy of holding part-time workers to 28 hours.

31. City of Faribault, Minnesota
Employees working 30 to 38 hours per week with the Minnesota city will be bumped down to part-time status to avoid penalties and costs associated with the mandate.

32. Kansas Turnpike Authority
Three eight-hour shifts per week: That’s the new maximum schedule for part-time toll collectors in Kansas. While the state’s turnpike authority previously had part-time employees who worked more than 30 hours a week, a new policy will limit them to the new schedule.

Education

33. University of Virginia
Because of an additional $7.3 million in health-care costs next year, the University of Virginia alerted some of its employees that it will no longer offer health insurance to their spouses.

34. Community College of Allegheny County, Pennsylvania
The Pittsburgh-area community college informed about 400 part-time employees that they would see a reduction in their hours starting in January of this year to comply with Obamacare regulations. The school had to make this change a year before the law went into effect because Obamacare stipulates that the federal government must look back one year to determine an employee’s status.

35. St. Petersburg College, Florida
To avoid paying an additional $777,000 per year, St. Petersburg College told 250 adjunct professors that their hours would be cut back for upcoming terms. “I never thought it would impact me directly,” a math teacher told NBC News Investigations. “I was stunned when I got the email. . . . I love teaching at St. Pete College, but that is a significant cut.”

36. Hillsborough Community College, Florida
Hillsborough Community College may have to cut the hours of nearly 10 percent of its part-time work force, according to the Tampa Tribune. By keeping those employees under 30 hours per week, the college can avoid an additional $863,500 in total costs for health plans.

37. Hamilton Township School District, New Jersey
Substitute teachers will see their time in the classroom limited to four workdays per week, the cap set in place in June by the school district . The “strict limits” went into effect at the beginning of this school year. According to a report by the Trenton Times, other nearby districts also could consider similar provisions.

38. Purdue University, Indiana
Despite “pretty radical changes” to the university’s health-care plans for its roughly 27,000 employees, Purdue University still won’t be able to skirt $2.8 million in additional costs brought on by the Affordable Care Act.

39. Oneida Special School District, Tennessee
Most of the non-certified personnel in the Oneida Special School District, such as teacher assistants, janitors, and cafeteria workers, will not be allowed to work more than 29 hours a week.

40. Central Michigan University
Some of the 5,700 students hired as employees by Central Michigan University will be barred from working more than 25 hours a week. While students have said the new limits “will sting a little bit” and make it “increasingly harder” to pay for various expenses, CMU’s human-resources vice president told a local news station that the move would “align us with other schools” making similar adjustments. Without the limits, CMU would have to pay as much as a $5 million penalty for not offering student workers health-care coverage.

41. University of North Alabama
Graduate-student workers at this school in Florence, Ala., will be barred from working more than 29 hours a week.

42. Arizona State University
Associate faculty members will be limited to teaching six credit hours, or two classes, per semester as part of an effort to more clearly define full-time versus part-time faculty, according to the Arizona Republic. “It’s like getting a punch in the stomach,” said one religious-studies teacher. “For some people it’s a major financial setback.”

43. Ivy Tech Community College, Indiana
Ivy Tech Community College, where 60 percent of the professors work part-time, will limit its part-time professors to less than 30 hours per week.

44. Maricopa Community Colleges, Arizona
The Phoenix community-college system notified almost 700 adjunct professors and 600 other part-time workers of a new policy that will prevent them from working more than 30 hours a week. An adjunct professor said the changes would affect his personal finances, and he warned that “this is going to come back to bite us” because instructors won’t be able to fill in for one another due to the cap on hours.

45. Granite School District, Utah
Facing at least $14 million in additional health-care costs, the Salt Lake City–area school district, which operates 92 schools, reduced the hours of as many as 1,200 part-time workers. In a letter, the district warned that employees who violate the 29-hour limit for part-time work could be terminated.

46. Alpine School District, Utah
“I would have to look for another job, or we would lose our house,” a school-bus driver told Provo’s Daily Herald after the school district said hourly employees could no longer work more than 27.5 hours per week. “If they cut our hours to 27, we will be up the creek,” another driver said.

47. Fort Wayne Community Schools, Indiana
In May, 610 part-time teaching aides and cafeteria workers were informed by the Fort Wayne Community Schools that their hours would be cut to keep FWCS from having to provide health insurance to those employees. “It’s something that almost all employers with part-time employees are trying to resolve,” a district administrator said.

48. Papillion–La Vista School District, Nebraska
The Affordable Care Act would have added $2.5 million in new health-care costs — or $3.4 million in penalties — to the Papillion–La Vista school district if 281 part-time employees’ hours had not been limited to fewer than 30 a week.

49. University of Akron, Ohio
Already facing a budget deficit, the University of Akron will ask 230 of its part-time faculty members to accept a cut to their work hours to avoid having to provide health insurance.

50. Youngstown State University, Ohio
The university warned part-time faculty members that they will be fired if they surpass the new 29-hour-per-week restriction. “If you exceed the maximum hours, YSU will not employ you the following year,” the school said in an e-mail. “We will have no recourse.”

51. Tredyffrin-Easttown School District, Pennsylvania
In June, the district announced that it would have to “restructure hours” to avoid cost increases to health-insurance plans. A local newspaper detailed a handful of options for the district; almost all resulted in fewer hours for lower pay.


52. Southern Lehigh School District, Pennsylvania
The Lehigh Valley–area district reduced the hours of 51 part-time workers to comply with the 30-hour threshold. The cuts will affect employees across the district, including custodians, cafeteria workers, secretaries, health-services support-staff members, and special-education support employees.

53. Zionsville Community Schools, Indiana
One hundred instructional aides, coaches, and substitute teachers in the Indiana district saw their weekly workload restricted to 29 hours.

54. Spartanburg Community College, South Carolina
Adjunct faculty members taught more than half of the community college’s classes, and all but 23 of the 400 to 500 such faculty members will see their hours slashed to meet the part-time requirement. Otherwise the college would face the choice of paying penalties of up to $2,000 per employee to whom it didn’t offer health coverage or paying up to $1 million for insurance.

55. Finger Lakes Community College, New York
The upstate New York community college has set the maximum weekly work hours for adjunct faculty members at “under 30.”

56. Mount Ephraim School District, New Jersey
At a school-board meeting this year, the district announced that the cost of benefits will rise by 18 percent because of the Affordable Care Act, and the increase will be passed on to taxpayers.

57. Minocqua-Hazelhurst-Lake Tomahawk School District, Wisconsin
The northern Wisconsin school district took steps to ensure that its part-time employees work fewer than 30 hours per week, a local news station reported.

58. Rock Valley College, Illinois
As of July, the two-year Rockford school now hires new employees to work a maximum of 25 hours per week.

Big Labor

59. Teamsters, UFCW, and UNITE HERE
The heads of the International Brotherhood of Teamsters, the United Food and Commercial Workers, and UNITE HERE wrote to Democratic lawmakers in July to warn that Obamacare would “destroy the foundation of the 40-hour work week that is the backbone of the middle class.” While the labor leaders acknowledged their past support for the law, they remarked that their decision had “come back to haunt us.”

60. AFL-CIO
In an interview with Al Jazeera America, AFL-CIO president Richard Trumka conceded that the Affordable Care Act “does need some modifications to it” because companies are “restricting their workforce to give workers 29 and a half hours so they don’t have to provide them health care.”

Restaurants and the Food Industry

61. Cheesecake Factory
The chain restaurant’s CEO warned that while his company already covers its employees who work at least 25 hours, he expects the new law to “be very costly” for most companies. He predicted that if Cheesecake Factory has to expand coverage, the costs will be passed on to consumers with price increases or a lower level of service.

62. Papa John’s Pizza
After causing a stir among Obamacare supporters by suggesting possible price increases and/or cuts to jobs and hours, Papa John’s Pizza CEO reiterated: “It’s common sense. That’s what I call lose-lose.”

63. Buca di Beppo
Buca di Beppo employees across the country say managers told them in June that they would see their weekly hours reduced to less than 30. The founder of the company that owns the restaurants distanced himself from the comments, but employees insist that the Affordable Care Act is the root cause: “I guarantee you it has to do with what’s going on with our country and decisions being made with Obamacare,” said one worker.

64. Fatburger
The CEO of the burger-joint chain announced that franchises have begun making efforts to keep employees under the 30-hour threshold, including some franchises’ engaging in “job sharing.” For example, an employee at one Fatburger could work 25 hours a week at one location, and another 25 hours at a different location with a different owner, without falling under the Obamacare mandate.

65. Wendy’s
An Omaha Wendy’s franchisee alerted almost 100 non-management workers that their hours would be reduced to 28 per week in order to comply with Obamacare mandates.

66. Subway restaurants, Illinois
Employees at 15 Subway restaurants in central Illinois have begun to see a reduction in their hours. “We don’t like doing that,” the owner said. “But if we were to have to pay for everyone to have health insurance or pay the full penalties, we would be out of business.”

67. Subway restaurants, Maine
The owner of 21 Subway franchises in Maine told 50 of his workers that their hours would be reduced to a maximum of 29 a week. “To tell somebody that you’ve got to decrease their hours because of a law passed in Washington is very frustrating to me,” he told NBC News Investigations.

68. PoFolks restaurant, Alabama
The restaurant’s owner told a local news station that he will have to cut the number of full-time employees from 16 workers to four to meet the “great challenge” Obamacare poses to the company.

69. Joe Bologna’s, Kentucky
In order to limit employees’ hours and save money, a Lexington businessman has closed his restaurant on Mondays. He told a local news station that additional costs, which could be as high as $20,000, probably would have to be passed on to customers.

70. Five Guys franchises, North Carolina
The owner of eight Five Guys franchises in the Raleigh-Durham area said he will have to use all the profits from one of his eight stores just to cover “any added costs [that] are going to have to be passed on” by the health-care act.

71. Charco Broiler, Colorado
The Fort Collins restaurant informed three full-time employees that they would drop down to part-time work to keep the company under the 50-employee threshold, above which employers must insure all full-time employees.

72. Shari’s restaurant, Oregon
A Portland-area waitress told a news station that she has struggled to pay her bills after Shari’s relegated her status to part time due to one of the law’s mandates, cutting her schedule by almost ten hours a week.

73. Russ’ Restaurants, Michigan
Non-managerial employees are no longer allowed to work more than 25 hours per week.

74. Burger King, Washington, D.C.
“I’m not sure if Congress understood the devastating effect that this will have on businesses and on employment,” said a human-resources officer for the Maryland-based company that owns Washington, D.C.’s largest Burger King franchise. From the beginning of this year, the company has hired only part-time employees, who are “guaranteed no more than 29 hours per week.”

75. Taco Bell, Oklahoma
No employees at the Guthrie Taco Bell will be allowed to work more than 28 hours a week, resulting in a $200 reduction in one employee’s paycheck. “Several of the other people I work with, some of them are single parents, and we do the best we can, and 28 hours a week just isn’t going to cut it for the bills,” the worker said.

76. A Virginia Beach restaurant, Virginia
The owner of a Virginia Beach restaurant and catering company told Bloomberg that he has stopped hiring people to work full time and is even drawing back on part-time employees’ hours. “I can’t afford health insurance for everyone,” he said.


77. Jim’s restaurants, Texas

The San Antonio restaurant chain might be required to pay as much as $1 million more annually after Obamacare takes effect. In response, Jim’s, like many other companies, is considering a reduction in employees’ hours so it won’t have to provide them with insurance.

78. CiCi’s Pizza restaurants, Texas
Bob Westbrook owned the state’s three top-performing CiCi’s Pizza franchises but calculated that the costs of providing health care under the employer mandate would leave him about $78,000 in the red at the end of the year. Ultimately, Westbrook figured, it was most cost-effective for him to sell his franchises, after nearly 20 years.

Grocery Chains

79. Whole Foods Market
The CEO of Whole Foods may not know exactly what changes will take place when the Affordable Care Act is fully implemented, but he’s sure it will negatively affect workers. While he would like his company to continue offering health insurance to its employees, he said there might have to be a tradeoff in the benefits equation: “That just means there’s less we can pay for wages.”

80. Trader Joe’s
Even though it has previously provided health-care coverage for its part-time employees, an uncommon practice in the industry, next year Trader Joe’s will give employees who work less than 30 hours a week $500 to purchase a plan in the upcoming Obamacare exchanges. With federal subsidies and possible earnings from other employment, the company said, workers can find coverage that will be just as good. One employee described her soon-to-be lost coverage as “one of the best parts about the job,” and her reaction to hearing it would be dumped was “pure panic, followed quickly by anger.”

81. Wegmans
The New York–based grocery chain announced in July that part-time employees will no longer receive health-care coverage due to Obamacare. Wegmans previously offered insurance to part-time employees working at least 20 hours a week.

82. Trig’s Supermarkets, Wisconsin
Sixty-five percent of the 1,100 workers at the Wisconsin supermarket chain will see their hours reduced to below 30 per week. “Doing nothing was not an option,” an executive with the company said. “Within a year, it would have put us out of business.”

83. Waldbaum’s, New York
At least one of the New York City–area supermarket chain’s stores has told employees that they will now be part-time workers, with some seeing a reduction of 20 hours or more from their usual weekly total. Some of Waldbaum’s 100 employees affected by the change are now seeking second or third jobs, according to a local newspaper.

84. Royal Farms, Maryland
The company’s 146 convenience stores in Delaware, Maryland, Pennsylvania, and Virginia are transitioning to an almost entirely part-time work force, reducing even full-timers to fewer than 30 hours a week.

Small Local Businesses

85. Southern Hearth & Patio, Tennessee
Health-insurance costs have more than tripled under the Obama presidency, said the owner of Southern Hearth & Patio in Chattanooga. He’s had to offer smaller bonuses and lower pay raises because of the Affordable Care Act.

86. Tsunami Surf Shop, North Carolina and South Carolina
A manager for Tsunami Surf Shop told a local news station that the company will “have to control the shifts” from now on in order to ensure that employees are working fewer than 30 hours a week.

87. Kerns Trucking, North Carolina
The family-owned trucking company had to cut insurance benefits for 81 workers to avoid having to pay an additional $100,000 under the law’s tax.

88. AAA Parking, Georgia
Next year, AAA Parking will move half of its 500 full-time hourly employees (out of a work force of 1,600) to part-time employment. “Our executive team has spent extensive time evaluating the impact of this mandate, and the financial impact for AAA Parking is dramatic,” a company memo explained.

89. Circle K gas station, Georgia
An employee at the Savannah gas station told a local news station that a supervisor informed workers that they would now work a part-time schedule due to the mandate.

90. Maritz Research, Missouri
The business-research firm informed its 300 employees in July that, starting next year, the company would have to “proactively manage average hours worked on a weekly basis” and enforce a 25-hour threshold.

Premium Rate Increases

91. California
Individual-market premiums in the Golden State could jump as much as 146 percent, according to an analysis of the state’s exchange program by Avik Roy of National Review and Forbes. For example, the cost for a nonsmoking 25-year-old in California who purchases the second-cheapest plan on the exchange would go from $92 to $205.

92. Colorado
Colorado’s cheapest health plans, which are generally geared toward younger people, are expected to rise dramatically in price next year, according to The Hill. Consider a nonsmoker under 30 years old. This year, this Coloradan could have purchased the cheapest catastrophic plan for $56 per month; next year, the cost is expected to climb to $135.

93. Florida
Florida regulators say the average premium for individuals will increase by 30 to 40 percent. For small businesses, the rates will be between 5 and 20 percent higher.

94. Massachusetts
According to a study by the Massachusetts Association of Health Plans and Blue Cross Blue Shield of Massachusetts, well over half of the state’s small businesses will see a rate increase, with some prices potentially doubling.

95. New Mexico
In a study conducted by the Manhattan Institute for Policy Research, by a team including our own Avik Roy, New Mexico was rated the state that would see the largest average hike in premium costs, at 130 percent.

Snowmassguy

Trad climber
Calirado
Oct 2, 2013 - 10:19pm PT
TGT^^^That list will me much longer in the not too distant future.

Also...Impressive tantrum Norton. Way to be liberal and open minded lol
Cragman

Trad climber
June Lake, California....via the Damascus Road
Oct 2, 2013 - 10:21pm PT
Credit: Cragman
Gary

Social climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
Oct 2, 2013 - 10:28pm PT
I miss the days when California was the best state in the union.

It's not?
Snowmassguy

Trad climber
Calirado
Oct 2, 2013 - 10:35pm PT
Nope^^

Not if fiscal health is a criteria
Wade Icey

Trad climber
www.alohashirtrescue.com
Oct 2, 2013 - 10:49pm PT
since when is fiscal health a criteria...
dirtbag

climber
Oct 2, 2013 - 11:00pm PT
Boy the righties here sure are delusional.

Republican negotiating tactics:

Snowmassguy

Trad climber
Calirado
Oct 2, 2013 - 11:14pm PT
since when is fiscal health a criteria...

Maybe it isn't. Lets keep running in the red and see what happens. Spending what you do not have always leads to positive a outcome.
dirtbag

climber
Oct 2, 2013 - 11:16pm PT
Yeah, that's it, cragman. Obama is just a kenyan marxist chicago thug. An angry black man for sure, using black brute force to impose obamacare.

You do know that Obamacare was passed in Congress, survived a supreme court challenge, and 40 attempts to overturn it?

Dipsh#t.
locker

Social climber
Some Rehab in Bolivia
Oct 2, 2013 - 11:16pm PT


"since when is fiscal health a criteria..."...

Credit: locker
...

rottingjohnny

Sport climber
mammoth lakes ca
Oct 2, 2013 - 11:23pm PT
TGT...here's the solution....Single payer...
Norton

Social climber
the Wastelands
Oct 3, 2013 - 12:00am PT
Snowmassguy thoughtlessly said:
Nope^^

Not if fiscal health is a criteria

how typical, how predictable, that you who vote and obviously think "republican" ....

that you do not even know that now that California has rid itself of every single Republican holding State office, that the Democrats there have turned a 27 billion dollar deficit into a balanced budget

just think how flat out wrong you are on so many other issues

http://www.sfgate.com/news/article/Gov-Brown-proudly-signs-balanced-state-budget-4628307.php
climbski2

Mountain climber
Anchorage AK, Reno NV
Oct 3, 2013 - 01:23am PT
Democracy disciplined and enlightened is the finest thing in the world. A democracy prejudiced, ignorant, superstitious, will land itself in chaos and may be self-destroyed

Ghandhi
BLUEBLOCR

Social climber
joshua tree
Oct 3, 2013 - 01:48am PT

Democracy disciplined and enlightened is the finest thing in the world. A democracy prejudiced, ignorant, superstitious, will land itself in chaos and may be self-destroyed

Here Grandi expresses the true nature. To everything there are two sides to every coin. Making the ONE coin.

Now it's YOUR choice to respond to which is enlightened, and which is prejudiced.
BLUEBLOCR

Social climber
joshua tree
Oct 3, 2013 - 01:57am PT

Democrats there have turned a 27 billion dollar deficit into a balanced budget

Norton, you don't understand numbers any better than you understand laws!

Riley, ur an idiot!!!!!!!!!!
Gary

Social climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
Oct 3, 2013 - 10:43am PT
Facts are stupid things, eh, blueblocr?
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Relic MilkEye and grandpoobah of HRKRNH
Oct 3, 2013 - 10:45am PT
from ,local news this am,, "NV health exchange has numerous bugs in the system"..


Thats putting it mildly..
pyro

Big Wall climber
Calabasas
Oct 3, 2013 - 10:50am PT
I love how u can ask a random stranger what would they prefer ACA or obamacare¿

So many think they are two seperate plans.
Werner is right stupid americans
Snowmassguy

Trad climber
Calirado
Oct 3, 2013 - 10:51am PT
Norton, you are good at making assumptions about me and my beliefs. I am a realist not a blind repug or demotard. Sorry but reality is a MF'r.

Pretty easy to sell DEBT and call it a balanced budget. Hey look...I took out a loan to pay off my credit card debt....I can now go buy a shiny new rack and a bunch of Sh**.
Yep...California politicians are good a polishing a turd.


"On Thursday, the state sold $5.5 billion of this debt, known as “revenue-anticipation notes.” The total was down from ten billion dollars last year, signaling that the state’s finances were so improved that it didn’t need as much short-term help"


In the wake of Proposition 13, two things have happened. First, of the hundreds of new initiatives that have passed, many have promised a tax cut or an expanded service without compensating financing, so much of the budget was allocated before the legislature even had a chance to negotiate. Second, the requirement for a super-majority for any tax increase made it almost impossible for policymakers to raise revenues. The consensus appears to be that California has become unmanageable.

Here is some reading for you Norton.
http://blogs.marketwatch.com/encore/2013/08/28/why-california-cities-are-in-fiscal-trouble/

http://www.newyorker.com/online/blogs/currency/2013/08/the-california-comeback-myth.html
locker

Social climber
Some Rehab in Bolivia
Oct 3, 2013 - 10:56am PT


""NV health exchange has numerous bugs in the system"..


Thats putting it mildly.."
...




Dude, you'll grab at ANYTHING it seems...

LOL!!!...




EDITED:

By the way...

I saw on the news last night that the issue with the system shutting down at least here, was do to so many people signing up...

Just like I originally said when you said I was wrong...

Pretty sure that's what happened elsewhere as well

;-)


couchmaster

climber
pdx
Oct 3, 2013 - 11:05am PT
Pretty decent cartoon apropo the subject:-)

Snowmassguy

Trad climber
Calirado
Oct 3, 2013 - 11:11am PT
^^^ Wrong, try again.
Norton

Social climber
the Wastelands
Oct 3, 2013 - 11:32am PT
"NV health exchange has numerous bugs in the system"..
which because you have been a strong opponent of the ACA from the beginning.....
we know what you are really saying.....you can't stand the exchanges being..busy

because that means the ACA is a resounding success, and you hate that from all your postings



because........lots and lots and lots of people actually, LIKE YOU, are INTERESTED

clue: this is not a bad thing, this is a ......good thing

I will put it more simple terms: when Apple introduces a new Iphone, should they
be criticized by Known Dubfuks because people line up around the block to buy their Iphones?

jesus fuking christ you guys are just relentlessly stupid, and so you...must.vote..republican
TGT

Social climber
So Cal
Oct 3, 2013 - 11:35am PT
Need health insurance? The Obama administration has you covered. Simply dial 1-800-F*#KYO to reach the next available health-care provider.

Far from being a mistype, that’s the official number that Health and Human Services wants Americans to dial when seeking health care. Obamacare’s national call center really did list its number as 1-800-318-2596, helpfully spelling out President Barack Obama’s tendency to blatantly flip the bird in plain view.

After allowing for the lack of letters attached to 1 on a traditional American telephone keypad, the number spells out a clear message. For every duped voter, every young invincible weighing the cost of a penalty versus a newly tripled yearly deductible, every ailing old granny in a wheelchair (whom, remember, Paul Ryan wants to push off a cliff) who needs adequate and affordable health care, Obama’s message is:

Snowmassguy

Trad climber
Calirado
Oct 3, 2013 - 11:38am PT
System bugs will work them selves out. I tried to get on Colorado's site. The system "barfed" and produced an error message when trying to set up an account.

These are IT issues that will work out once the journalists and others that are really not even trying to sign up stop overloading the system.

Like I said the government has lots of motivation.....YOUR MONEY.

Let's sit back and watch government efficiency at its finest. As we all know, our government is efficient and can certainly spend our money better than we can. HAHA


Yep it is the fault of those stupid Democrats. No wait, it is the stupid Republicans.

Hiding behind an outdated ideology is why we are Fu**ed. Use your brain people ( sheep).



Randisi

Social climber
Dalian, Liaoning
Oct 3, 2013 - 11:38am PT
Aw Christ, first world problems!
10b4me

Ice climber
Soon 2B Flagstaff
Oct 3, 2013 - 11:40am PT

""NV health exchange has numerous bugs in the system"..


Thats putting it mildly.."...




Dude, you'll grab at ANYTHING it seems...

LOL!!!...




EDITED:

By the way...

I saw on the news last night that the issue with the system shutting down at least here, was do to so many people signing up...

Just like I originally said when you said I was wrong...

Pretty sure that's what happened elsewhere as well

;-)



Well said Locker

Edited:
I am agreeing with Locker again!!
Snowmassguy

Trad climber
Calirado
Oct 3, 2013 - 12:16pm PT
Damn, Norton is genius. I bow down.

Obama care will not be a cluster F that drags our economy down and provides less than stellar care for an inflated government price. It will be our glorious savior!!!!

It will work out great, we will have top notch care from the best medical minds in the world. Obama has OUR best interests in mind.

His ego, political and legacy ambitions have nothing to do with Obamacare. His rough and tumble upbringing at Punahou School opened his eyes to the fact that many rich folks are smart but Americans in general are stupid sheep.

Worship me minions. I know what is best for you. Don't like it, tough luck as I am smarter than you. Now log on to the internet and give me money. In return, I promise sub par care for an inflated government price. Yes...lower middle class it is time for you to pay up. Heck, I am in my second term and could care less about re-election. You dumb F's elected me hahahahahah

Obamacare will be just another success story ( OK get your partisan boxing gloves on now)
just like:

The Postal Service
The War on Drugs
Social Security
Freddie Mac
No Child Left Behind
The War on Poverty
The Department of Energy
Head Start

The list goes on and on. Remember sheep, government is good.

OK, I am done now. Off to work( at my employer that is dropping employee coverage like it is hot) to make money so I can give a larger percentage of my very modest income to the government. Oh wait, I am a contract employee now....no corporate health coverage.Yes, the government needs my money. My children/family are secondary. Bow down.





guyman

Social climber
Moorpark, CA.
Oct 3, 2013 - 01:07pm PT
Snowmassguy.... +100

patrick compton

Trad climber
van
Oct 3, 2013 - 01:12pm PT
Uh yeah, cuz 'socialized' health care has failed in Canada, uk, and every other first world country?

Why are Repbublicants always on the wrong side of history?
Dave Kos

Social climber
Temecula
Oct 3, 2013 - 01:18pm PT
IF WE HAVE SINGLE PAYER THE USA WILL BECOME A SOCIALIST HELL HOLE LIKE SWEEDEN!!!!!!!!!!1111
ontheedgeandscaredtodeath

Social climber
SLO, Ca
Oct 3, 2013 - 01:19pm PT
In the 50 billion threads I've seen on single payer health care and "socialism/communism OMG!" I've never seen one post from a citizen of another country denouncing their system and advocating what we have here.
patrick compton

Trad climber
van
Oct 3, 2013 - 01:28pm PT
Credit: patrick compton
hellroaring

Trad climber
San Francisco
Oct 3, 2013 - 02:56pm PT
REtardPUBLICANS...the hillbilly inbred when it comes to social issues and compassion. Yeah, it does seem like they frequently stand on the wrong side of history. Must all be born with some sort of dumbf*#k gene. Not claiming the other side gets a brilliance award, just not as many "haters" in their ranks.
Hoser

climber
vancouver
Oct 3, 2013 - 03:38pm PT
In the 50 billion threads I've seen on single payer health care and "socialism/communism OMG!" I've never seen one post from a citizen of another country denouncing their system and advocating what we have here.

Hello From Canada, we love our health care!!! Do you know how many corner stores have coin boxes to help out folks who got sidelined by health problems


ZERO

Which is the same amount of people in Canada who have gone bankrupt from health problems

Norton

Social climber
the Wastelands
Oct 3, 2013 - 03:47pm PT
^^^^

oh no, that kind of stuff really pisses em off, sends them into a rage

why, it's like proving them WRONG and they just can't stand that sh#t

ya gotta dig in, insist until the cows come home that two plus two is five
Snowmassguy

Trad climber
Calirado
Oct 3, 2013 - 04:32pm PT
Got to love the name calling. Makes my 3rd grader look quite mature.anyway...

Canada....... a climbing buddy of mine is a spinal surgeon born and educated in Canada. He is one of the top guys in his specialty. He moved to the US because of frustration over government red tape.

He now makes big $$ serving the Canadian rich as well as those that REALLY need surgery and can scrounge up cash. They travel to the US to have their very necessary surgery.

Wait time for MRI's and surgery approval literally puts many at such a risk that these poor Canucks dig into their life savings to have surgery here. Cash money baby!

The government does not care about you. If you think they do, your a fool. When someone you know dies because your paperwork is covered in government red tape, Obamacare might not be viewed as the savior you Fu**tards think it is. Haha, now you have reduced me to your 3rd grade level.

Hanging around ST is sending me into a state of devolution. Keep on hatin'.... your friendly government will bail you out.

Enjoy your wait in line at the DMV. Oh sorry , I meant DR office.

dirtbag

climber
Oct 3, 2013 - 04:37pm PT
Zzzzzz^^^^^
Snowmassguy

Trad climber
Calirado
Oct 3, 2013 - 04:41pm PT
Dipsh#t.
LOL


YEP, a little cut and paste "dirtbag" name calling. Now I feel like one of the tribe.

Dave Kos

Social climber
Temecula
Oct 3, 2013 - 04:47pm PT
Funny, I had appointments at the DMV and the Dr.'s office last week.

DMV wait was 20 minutes.

Dr. was 1 hour 15 minutes (past my scheduled time, and that was just to have them take my vitals, another 20 minute wait to actually see the Dr.)

Oh yeah ... and if I showed up that late to an appointment I would be charged as a "no show."

I'm looking forward to the doctor being more like the DMV.

dirtbag

climber
Oct 3, 2013 - 04:48pm PT
SM you guys don't care about facts so why bother?
Snowmassguy

Trad climber
Calirado
Oct 3, 2013 - 04:56pm PT
Good luck with that. I love the DMV too. A life time of positive experiences whooopppiiieee

Too bad you wont be seeing the DR at future appointments. It will all be about the P.A.

You are either for or against Obamacare. Not many folks are changing their opinion at the moment.

Personally, I see it being a disaster down the road and not at all what it was marketed to be.

I hope I am wrong. I voted for Obama and regret it . Obamacare fails, your best repug friends will be in power real quick.

Only time will tell.





Since you guys are smarter than me and have had so much first hand experience with Obamacare, it must be awesome..right ? Our gov't is such an efficient administrator, I cant wait to see what is in store !!!


Peace out. Gonna get on the rock this afternoon before winter blasts Colorado! Going to....BOULDER(not in Boulder). If I turn an ankle, at least I still have health insurance.







hellroaring

Trad climber
San Francisco
Oct 3, 2013 - 05:10pm PT
Snowmassguy by all means welcome to the tribe...name callers of all spectrums united by our love of climbing and emotional immaturity.
hellroaring

Trad climber
San Francisco
Oct 3, 2013 - 05:19pm PT
Snowmass did not see your last post...Colorado huh...Climbed at Eldo and Lumpy in August, what awesome places!! Politics and climbing what a weird combo @ times
the Fet

climber
Tu-Tok-A-Nu-La
Oct 3, 2013 - 05:30pm PT
Just like a popular climb, get to the Dr. early in the morning! I used to go later in the afternoon, but went early once and saw the doc, got blood work, and got stuff at the pharmacy in 40 minutes total.

My health care is EXACTLY the same as last year. But I know people with pre-existing conditions who can now purchase health insurance and they are stoked.

BUT THE SHUTDOWN CONTROVERSY IS NOT ABOUT OBAMACARE. It's about one party using coercion to try to get what they want. Obama needs to nip this sh#t in the bud, or it will just being modus operandi for congress moving forward, dem or repubs. It's the radical right doing it now and you may agree with them about Obamacare, but next time it could be the loony left wanting free abortions or THEY will shut down the government or refuse to raise the debt limit and screw over the whole world's economy.

Anyone who thinks this Repubs are doing the right thing needs their heads examined.
Snowmassguy

Trad climber
Calirado
Oct 3, 2013 - 05:42pm PT
Hellroaring...glad you were able to get out to Eddo and Lumpy before the floods. Cant get to Lumpy and Eldo is as screwed as my health insurance policy. Sad.
StahlBro

Trad climber
San Diego, CA
Oct 3, 2013 - 05:49pm PT
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/08/29/most-efficient-healthcare_n_3825477.html

This is all about the huge amounts of money health insurance, heathcare and pharmaceutical companies are making off the current system to give us substandard care. Doctors and healthcare providers want to do the right thing, but they have to carry around 100lb parasites.

The GOP fanatics are willing to fly the plane into the ground to protect their profits.

Obama/RomneyCare isn't the problem. Repealing will do nothing to fix it. It is a convient "shiny thing" to distract those with a short attention span from the real issues.
Hoser

climber
vancouver
Oct 3, 2013 - 07:23pm PT
He moved to the US because of frustration over government red tape.

He now makes big $$ serving the Canadian rich as well as those that REALLY need surgery and can scrounge up cash

You see the problem, thats what you stand for, doctors that can serve the rich...and fundamentally thats not what I, Canada, or I suspect may who support Obama feel. We feel that all humans, rich or poor should have access to health care, the same health care that my rich friends get.

Yes your friend would have loads of red tape to deal with in Canada if he wanted to serve the highest bidder in a multi tiered health care system.

I dont have to phone my insurance provider before dailing 911, the ambulance just gets me like everyone else, its quite civilized you know.

locker

Social climber
Some Rehab in Bolivia
Oct 3, 2013 - 07:50pm PT


I predict that in the not too distant future when all has settled and things are flowing nicely, that the Republicans will do a total turnaround and claim that the whole idea was theirs in the first place...

dirtbag

climber
Oct 3, 2013 - 07:53pm PT
And locker, they'd be right!
locker

Social climber
Some Rehab in Bolivia
Oct 3, 2013 - 07:54pm PT

Yep...

TGT

Social climber
So Cal
Oct 3, 2013 - 08:28pm PT
Pathetic!

http://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2013/10/democrats-pay-union-members-to-protest-world-war-ii-vets.php
Pepe Le Poseur

Social climber
Parts North
Oct 3, 2013 - 08:30pm PT
they were for it, before they were against it...
WBraun

climber
Oct 3, 2013 - 08:34pm PT
Norton -- I highly doubt you voted for President Obama

because IF you did, then he is delivering damn near everything he said he would

and you would be liking it, like tens of millions of Americans who voted FOR him like it

What stupid brainwashed moron.

No wonder everything is so fuked up ......
Pepe Le Poseur

Social climber
Parts North
Oct 3, 2013 - 08:48pm PT
Everything has been "so f*#ked up" to somebody since the Romans...

Only truism is that the more f*#ked up you think "it" is, the further you are from the mainstream....despite the mainstream all thinking that "things" are f*#ked up. Ponder that.

SteveW

Trad climber
The state of confusion
Oct 3, 2013 - 09:13pm PT

Locker, get your a$$ back and work on those shoes
so we can go climbing again!!!!

Be quick about it!
philo

Trad climber
Is that light the end of the tunnel or a train?
Oct 3, 2013 - 10:23pm PT
StahlBros post is spot on.



Oct 3, 2013 - 02:49pm PT
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/08/29/most-efficient-healthcare_n_3825477.html

This is all about the huge amounts of money health insurance, heathcare and pharmaceutical companies are making off the current system to give us substandard care. Doctors and healthcare providers want to do the right thing, but they have to carry around 100lb parasites.

The GOP fanatics are willing to fly the plane into the ground to protect their profits.

Obama/RomneyCare isn't the problem. Repealing will do nothing to fix it. It is a convient "shiny thing" to distract those with a short attention span from the real issues.
philo

Trad climber
Is that light the end of the tunnel or a train?
Oct 3, 2013 - 11:33pm PT
photo not found
Missing photo ID#323854
Snowmassguy

Trad climber
Calirado
Oct 3, 2013 - 11:44pm PT
Sheep. Believe the all powerful Obama. You are going to love your new deductibles when you do need major medical services. Have fun boys and girls.
mrtropy

Trad climber
Nor Cal
Oct 3, 2013 - 11:45pm PT

Butch Matthews is a 61-year-old former small business owner from Little Rock, Arkansas who used to wake up every morning at 4 A.M. to deliver canned beverages to retailers before retiring in 2010. A lifelong Republican, he was heavily skeptical of the Affordable Care Act when it first passed. “I did not think that Obamacare was going to be a good plan, I did not think that it was going to help me at all,” he told ThinkProgress over the phone.


But after doing a little research, Matthews eventually realized how much the law could help him. And on Tuesday, his local Blue Cross Blue Shield (BCBS) provider confirmed that he would be able to buy a far better plan than his current policy while saving at least $13,000 per year through Arkansas’ Obamacare marketplace.



http://thinkprogress.org/health/2013/10/02/2721501/butch-matthews-obamacare-convert/



It turns out that pre-Obamacare, Matthews was paying $1069.per month with a $10,000 deductible. Matthews’ doctor visits went from a co-pay of $150 to $8. Matthews has a simple message to all Americans. He says,

I would tell them to learn more about it before they start talking bad about it,” he noted. “Be more informed, get more information, take your time and study and not just go by just what you hear on one side or the other. Actually check the facts on it.
Snowmassguy

Trad climber
Calirado
Oct 3, 2013 - 11:49pm PT
For any young person making more than $20,000 a year, insurance premiums -- not even counting deductibles of several thousand dollars -- would cost more than paying the penalty for not getting insurance.

That raises the prospect of young people deciding the plan makes no sense for them.

That possibility could be critical, because the administration is counting on signing up enough young, healthy people to offset the cost for the older and less healthy.

If that doesn’t happen, the costs of ObamaCare could soar.
rottingjohnny

Sport climber
mammoth lakes ca
Oct 4, 2013 - 12:07am PT
No mass...I have an australian friend who practices anathesiology in California.. He practiced in Australia and Canada and in his opinion thinks their health care systems are superior to Americas' health care system... he's almost a John Bircher...My other friend is a retired anathesiologist , an American and he thinks the American system is pitiful...He use to be a republican but finds the current party incompetent...
Snowmassguy

Trad climber
Calirado
Oct 4, 2013 - 12:08am PT
Not so sure on this one. Those punk kids might not subsidize you old geezers.
Enjoy your large deductible.
Reilly

Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
Oct 4, 2013 - 12:23am PT
RJ, anaesthesilogists have the highest drug abuse rate in the medical professions. Jess sayin'.
Snowmassguy

Trad climber
Calirado
Oct 4, 2013 - 12:41am PT
Sad thing is in 20-30 years, Obamacare will be viewed as the single largest social and fiscal mistake our country has ever made.
The uninsured will not sign up, the younger folks living just above the poverty line/lower middle class will not be able to afford to sign up, the boomer generation will bleed it dry ( unless the death panels fix that issue), it will no longer be normal for business to offer health care benefits, the quality of care will decline, the economy will not recover. The ER's will still be filled with uninsured people. The list goes on...

Just one more factor contributing to the decline of our great country. Hey but the supporters of Obamacare can flaunt their egos now and claim to be smarter that anyone that disagrees.

By the way I pay $11,592 per year in premiums. My new annual premium is estimated at over 18K per year with a 8K deductible.

Good luck with your ego Hedge. Amazing a dumbf**ck like you can even operate a computer HAAAAAHAAA

rottingjohnny

Sport climber
mammoth lakes ca
Oct 4, 2013 - 12:41am PT
Reilly...So do climbing shoe re-solers...RJ
apogee

climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
Oct 4, 2013 - 12:43am PT
"By the way I pay $11,592 per year in premiums. My new annual premium is estimated at over 18K per year with a 8K deductible."

Yeah, well, congenital brain malformation is pretty expensive to treat. Be proud, though...you can actually type a sentence on a computer!
Reilly

Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
Oct 4, 2013 - 12:50am PT
The 'shut-down' was described today as a bump in the road. The impending debt default is a reinforced concrete wall in the road.
FRUMY

Trad climber
Bishop,CA
Oct 4, 2013 - 12:54am PT
Rep. Cruz from Texas said " It's no different than the weekend. The Gov. is closed on the weekend."
tioga

Mountain climber
pac northwest
Oct 4, 2013 - 12:55am PT
So, now one is REQUIRED to have health insurance....or PAY A FEE to the government...Is this sh##$ even real...?

There's no any kind of remote likeness of freedom left in this country, obviously..

I grew up under Commies but even they weren't nearly as bad... they at least PAID ALL your healthcare expenses.
What kind of f$$# Alice in the Wonderland is that?? Required to have insurance TO LIVE??? And what's coming next?

I'm going to go all the way prepper now methinks, guns, preparedness and all.

By the way, a FEE originally meant something one paid to their FEUDAL owner. So, there's a fee on living here now?
tioga

Mountain climber
pac northwest
Oct 4, 2013 - 01:02am PT
I'm thinking "a good bunker in the boonies and a few guns, off the grid" looking at this Obamashurance thing...this is only a first sign of times to come.
TMJesse

Mountain climber
Olympia, WA
Oct 4, 2013 - 01:07am PT
Sad to see Boehner go to such depths just to stay speaker and then get booted anyway. I've always thought of him as an American. But with the tea bag anarchists running the show at gunpoint, I guess Boehner is the one who caved in order to protect his family.
tioga

Mountain climber
pac northwest
Oct 4, 2013 - 01:08am PT
So you think sending everyone w/o insurance to the ER is cheaper, or that you don't end up paying more overall for health care because of that?

Lemme see, which costs me less...paying for uninsured people to go to the ER, which is the most expensive and least cost-effective form of health care...or requiring them to pay into the system, and be covered, and keep the out of the ER's...which costs less: an oil change, or a rebuild when the pistons freeze up because the oil never got changed...hmm...

Sending someone to the ER?
What "Costs" less? (the keywords: cost, sending)
No!

This is about f$$## damn basic FREEDOM to LIVE and DIE on Earth the way you want to and choice not to be "sent", hooked on tubes, or "cost" or pay a fee to live or otherwise be controlled by the Big Brother, Commies, pencil pushers from big city, "cost of your live estimators", or whoever.

What the f##$ happened to this country and its original basis and constitution?

I used to think preppers and militias were going a little overboard, but seeing this stuff I no longer think that...
bit'er ol' guy

climber
the past
Oct 4, 2013 - 01:24am PT
there you have it GOP tools

and worshipers of the uber wealthy (it's never gonna happen for you so get over it)

LESS guberment?

nows your chance to rake it in $$$$$$$ w/ uncle sam out of your way

thats what you wanted right?

smaller guberment?

so stop bitchin'

if its BIG guberment thats been keepin you down

stop whinning and....



prove it!



The Healthcare reform act of is a law.

it was deemed constitutinal by the supreme court years ago.

It survived a presidential election.

if the people didn't want it Mit (really? Mit?) would be in charge.

so NOW...

years later!!!

is not the time to negotiate.....

if you hero george W wasn'tsuch afukup a black dude named Hussain Obama would never be president and

and

GET RE-ELECTED!



s0..

do we still pay taxes during the 'shut down'?
philo

Trad climber
Is that light the end of the tunnel or a train?
Oct 4, 2013 - 02:02am PT
Out-of-control health care profiteering

This is exactly the root problem and why the vested interests have poured so many millions of dollars into an insidious disinformation campaign.
Bruce Kay

Gym climber
BC
Oct 4, 2013 - 02:29am PT
By the way I pay $11,592 per year in premiums. My new annual premium is estimated at over 18K per year with a 8K deductible.


you pay how much? You have to pay a deductible?

Have you guys by any chance ever considered a single payer system?

Have you ever considered gun control?


Oh never mind.....
Pepe Le Poseur

Social climber
Parts North
Oct 4, 2013 - 08:02am PT
Riley - now come on, that's a little over the top. You don't need to SH#T in those empty pumpkin shells as well. A more lucid critique serves better....although I would not discourage Tioga from heading to his bunker in the boonies and staying there -- for a long time.
coastal_climber

Trad climber
north island
Oct 4, 2013 - 10:06am PT
I pay 50$ a month for the two of us. Canada = win
locker

Social climber
Some Rehab in Bolivia
Oct 4, 2013 - 10:17am PT


ONLY problem I had with your rant Riley is the use of the word "Cu_t" in the below...


"You stupid cu_ts .."...



It's offensive and implies that woman are Stupid...



Never liked that word!!!...

and that's my RANT...

;-)






Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Relic MilkEye and grandpoobah of HRKRNH
Oct 4, 2013 - 12:47pm PT
So the site for nevada finally works a little- i went shopping LMAO!


my rates for shytty coverage with enormous deductibles: 621.00 to 14,00.00 per month ROFLMAO!.

So if i go to the hospital and PAY my bills off to them rather than getting partial coverage or NONE at all due to deductibles,, how in the hell is that going to work for me? Answer: it ISNT.

Consider your average ER or Hospital visit. One ER visit a few years ago cost me 2100.00 I made arrangments with the hospital to pay them installments at a easy to pay rate. Cheaper for me all the way around. Kinda like when you buy a car or other things, that may require a payment schedule. You got service and you pay for it.

And i would STILL be paying for that visit under the ACA as that is nowhere near the deductibles levels. So now i would pay the monthly ACA extortion and not have a DIME to pay the hospital and my required portion (all of the ER visit)..

Yes the lower middle class shall become poor and the poor shall become poorer...
jammer

climber
Oct 4, 2013 - 01:08pm PT
"46M un -insured in the US right now. After full implementation there will still be 30 M uninsured. Because they CANT AFFORD THE AFFORDABLE HEALTH CARE ACT,, oxy moronic to the letter."

Agreed about the oxymoronic part thus far, but wouldn't logic dictate that in order for those 30 million to afford health care (these are likely the poorest 30 million Americans), the costs of healthcare would HAVE have to drop? Wouldn't we unanimously demand, in one big voice as a united nation, that heath care costs MUST be rational and reasonable?

Perhaps this, in addition to the general feeling of political empowerment and re-enfranchisement many people would feel from this, is what is feared by the people who maintain the current status quo.
Wade Icey

Trad climber
www.alohashirtrescue.com
Oct 4, 2013 - 01:58pm PT
Riley - Your use of the C word to describe these people is an insult to the female anatomy...but otherwise spot on.

Edit: meant to say ....otherwise the RANT was spot on ...Not the use of C word.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Relic MilkEye and grandpoobah of HRKRNH
Oct 4, 2013 - 02:31pm PT
edit: almost let RILEDUP drag me into his gutter...




edit: Instead ill just ask what entity's will benefit MOST from the ACA?



answer: INSURANCE COMPANIES.....

THEN wait a few years until DANGEROUS HOBBIES ARE included in ones policy.. OhhhwwwwSHYT eh!
locker

Social climber
Some Rehab in Bolivia
Oct 4, 2013 - 03:11pm PT

"Riley - Your use of the C word to describe these people is an insult to the female anatomy...but otherwise spot on."...


Again I find myself disagreeing....

The C word = FANTASTIC female part...

My question...

How can a PIECE of SH!T = something so COOL???...

;-)

Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Relic MilkEye and grandpoobah of HRKRNH
Oct 4, 2013 - 03:37pm PT
Locker,, i think Riley just has his HOLES mixed up..;-) U know,, "pank and stank"..?



Norton,, harryreid tard is greatly responsible for riding NV into the dirt. Our longest rep ever, and as it happens the WORST the state has ever been.. I would eat ten day old vomit before voting for that SOB.. Thanks to him and the rest of the counterfeit c*cksuckers, i dont have a chance at making it in business so i guess i can thank them for adding me to welfare roles right?.. Cheezu freekin rice.


Hedge,, if i ended up with a huge bill,, id simply pay on it in SMALL easy to do installments for the rest of my time. You know,, like a mortgage for many folks that will pay until death.. Which beats to hell and back paying $$$$$$$$ per month for the rest of my times.


Jebus H Bomz

climber
Peavine Basecamp
Oct 4, 2013 - 03:40pm PT
NV is doing me fine.

That the working poor have it hard hasn't been a secret to me since I was goldurn baby, Ron. Cept, maybe you cry more about it than I did.

My dad is as hard working as they come and dire circumstances still landed us briefly on the teat. It is what it is. I'm glad my pops is looking at a solid retirement now, but there were years of us not even owning a car and, well, the ones we did get were headed to the car grave. Waaaaahhhhh!!!

I don't know, the moral? I guess it's hard to be poor and proud, bucko. Crying about it and doing nothing about it isn't proud either.

NV has been in the dirt ever since California's big business and lawyers took its gold and shoved its face there way back when, so don't play that either. I'd say it's been in the dirt ever since it decided to make casinos and titties a big staple of the economy. What do you expect? Whore your daughters, and teach your sons only trades of the servile industry, you get what you get. Come to Nevada, you can dump your depleted uranium and your load while yer at it!

They don't teach philosophy and logic in the schools around here, I hear. It shows. Blame the Gubbmint 101 is thriving, however.
SteveW

Trad climber
The state of confusion
Oct 4, 2013 - 03:50pm PT

Locker
Quit ranting and get back on those shoes--finish 'em up
so we can go dangling again.
PRONTO!!!
locker

Social climber
Some Rehab in Bolivia
Oct 4, 2013 - 03:57pm PT


I dangle daily...



EDITED:

and I just fuked someone's shoes up...

What's real strange, I am pretty sure they're Prods...




Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Relic MilkEye and grandpoobah of HRKRNH
Oct 4, 2013 - 03:58pm PT

locker

Social climber
Some Rehab in Bolivia

Oct 4, 2013 - 12:57pm PT

I dangle daily...








so sayeth,,,the,,,,,,,PORTOBELLO...


signed,, Milkeye..
locker

Social climber
Some Rehab in Bolivia
Oct 4, 2013 - 04:06pm PT


I am fully enjoying being back in the heavy GLUE fumes and still don't understand why other resolers ventilate...

;-)

Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Relic MilkEye and grandpoobah of HRKRNH
Oct 4, 2013 - 04:17pm PT
I love a bondo breakfast...




Sooooo ok,, im told to do the "responsible thing" and GET ON THE TIT with some voucher i may receive for my healthcare. Which will be paid by those NOT on vouchers. Yur tax dollars in other words. But that is somehow better than me paying a hospital directly in payments? That is somehow better than just abusing the ER laws getting treated and have the hospital get a tax deduction from that loss?
SteveW

Trad climber
The state of confusion
Oct 4, 2013 - 04:23pm PT

Couldn't a been Prod's --they're in Santiago--no, knot KARMEN!!!
tioga

Mountain climber
pac northwest
Oct 4, 2013 - 04:43pm PT
In any case, sickening, fake, overinflated hospital bills have very little to do with remote likeness of actual costs + reasonable profit involved even with a very generous margin. (15K for one CAT scan and 10-min doc convo?...Reeeeally?)

Perhaps go after MEDICAL MAFIA instead? No? 2+2 is 5?

This society is being divided in terms of being on one or another side of "da voucher" more and more...;) US jobs are being replaced by temp, contract, low hourly pay and outsourced/h1b visa and other foreign slave labor. Yet, it's the middle class--that is in the process of being actively exterminated--who's required pick up "da voucher" tab.
Sounds like sh$$#.
Had downloaded "Eadible Insects", "Well drilling", etc yesterday...gud stuff, there got to be a place without watchful yes, etc.
tioga

Mountain climber
pac northwest
Oct 4, 2013 - 04:55pm PT
At least with insurance, though, people can get preventive care, which is infinitely less expensive than waiting till something that could have been caught and treated early requires an extended hospital stay.
Preventive care? Wouldn't banning Dunkin' Donuts, McDonalds and most restaurants, plus horrible, toxic food substitutes that take up 95% of shelf space in most US stores be actual preventive care (versus fake one, that only enriches already fat medical leeches, PAYING them for said "preventive care")? (plus, banning harmful no-script pharmaceuticals, toxic cosmetic products, etc) Haha...nope, for the government 2+2 = 10.

Let's fatten 'em, sicken 'em, INSURE THEM and milk that cow! Things are getting Orwellian
monolith

climber
SF bay area
Oct 4, 2013 - 05:25pm PT
locker

Social climber
Some Rehab in Bolivia
Oct 4, 2013 - 05:43pm PT

"But I will take note that there is something YOU find offensive ..
Lol"
...



I get your point...

LOL!!!...

You got me there...




EDITED:

".. I love the word nigger too.
My black friends even let me say it all the time..."
...

IF you could please refrain from saying it to my Grandchildren and Son in Law it would be greatly appreciated...

They, like myself DON'T like the word...

;-)

dirtbag

climber
Oct 4, 2013 - 08:00pm PT
^^^ good one! ^^^
couchmaster

climber
pdx
Oct 4, 2013 - 08:04pm PT
LOL ^^^You mean since he caved to the mullahs so they can continue processing and heading towards a bomb, he should be caving to the Republicans too?

hahahaha Good one. Not.


not funny really.
TGT

Social climber
So Cal
Oct 4, 2013 - 08:05pm PT
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Relic MilkEye and grandpoobah of HRKRNH
Oct 5, 2013 - 01:56pm PT
Discussed this obamacare thing last night with my Hospital mngr buddy.

We took it step by step. We figured it WOULDNT benefit me to continue to look for work or more work to the shop due to my medical situations and the upcoming forced extortion rates. Even if i do increase my retail intake, between taxes and taxes and now more taxes it is quite likely that i will end up even poorer than now while working twice as hard. So the best thing FOR ME ,, is to stay at my poverty level, jump on the tit and suckle her dry- getting ALL my aliments fixed on the gubbmint dime.. They have welfare, food stamps and all manner of benefits that ive ignored all my life, in favor of working for a living.





^^^^^^^^^^^^ This was just a scenario. BUT ill bet it is one that is being examined by millions right now. From the young to the old. The hospitals shall have a million or more new MEDICAID folks. Medicaid that pays the lowest to the hospital of all programs..

Karl Baba

Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
Oct 6, 2013 - 03:26am PT
Yeah Ron but it seems you're making up scenarios based on no facts.

And you'd be happier if those million people (did you make up that number too?) had no insurance and just got sicker until the system had to take care of their serious illness for nothing because all their money was gone by then?
Peace

Karl
Dr.Sprock

Boulder climber
I'm James Brown, Bi-atch!
Oct 6, 2013 - 06:18am PT
which cave did they lock Obama in?

is he going to turn into Jesus?
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