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khanom
Trad climber
Greeley Hill
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Topic Author's Original Post - Aug 19, 2013 - 07:08pm PT
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Just a heads up for those headed to the valley. Caltrans says:
SR 120
[IN THE CENTRAL CALIFORNIA AREA & SIERRA NEVADA]
IS CLOSED FROM THE NORTH JCT OF SR 49 TO 7.5 MI EAST OF GROVELAND
(TUOLUMNE CO) - DUE TO A WILD FIRE - A DETOUR IS AVAILABLE
Inciweb says it's closed from 4 miles east of the ranger danger station to east of Buck Me-adows.
I'd guess the detour is to torture yourself taking Hwy 49 down to Mariposa. Yeah right.
This is almost certainly to move equipment around since the fire should be well away from Hwy 120. Hopefully it's very temporary.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 19, 2013 - 08:24pm PT
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Aug 19 2013 3:04PM [52] 61-004 FOREST SVC HAS CLOSED SR120 AT THIS TIME BECAUSE THE FIRE HAS JUMPED SR120 JWO BUCK MEADOWS
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Clint Cummins
Trad climber
SF Bay area, CA
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Aug 19, 2013 - 09:07pm PT
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[Click to View YouTube Video]
There's a sign on the highway and a plaque at the Rim of the World overlook, naming this section of 120 the "Eva Marie Schicke memorial highway".
This video describes the 2004 accident where she died - the location was close to where the current fire is.
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Aug 19, 2013 - 09:14pm PT
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Did this fire start yesterday afternoon. I thought I saw a distinct column of smoke driving out north of town around 2:00 or so. Then I wwnt to where I could take a shot of it and the T clouds swallowed it and I could not see it again.
My eyes may have played tricks with me, but I know a smoke column when I see it.
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SCseagoat
Trad climber
Santa Cruz
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Aug 19, 2013 - 09:47pm PT
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Got turned around there
Came over Sonora Pass. Currently in Bridgeport
Susan
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Aug 19, 2013 - 09:54pm PT
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bummer, dude.
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abrams
Sport climber
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Aug 19, 2013 - 10:07pm PT
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Imagine a bunch of that giant mutant manzanita is burning there.
Nearly as bad as the smoke from coastal range fires. Aaaack!
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Dr.Sprock
Boulder climber
I'm James Brown, Bi-atch!
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Aug 19, 2013 - 10:52pm PT
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hooch farmers start this one?
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Aug 20, 2013 - 12:20pm PT
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October 5, 1988: "Patsy Hamm will always remember the day the Smith Peak Forest Lookout burned to the ground.
The lookout burned Aug. 31, 1987, in the Stanislaus Complex Fires that destroyed 147,095 acres in Tuolumne and Mariposa counties. A wood frame building atop a metal two-story tower, the lookout burned within a couple hours of when Hamm abandoned it about 1 p.m.
Now, rising like a Phoenix out of the ashes, the lookout has been rebuilt and is nearly ready for use again in the Groveland Ranger District of the Stanislaus National Forest." (Merced Sun-Star)
This is the fire I remember. Jeff was photographed as a long-haired evacuee on the porch of the Buck Meadows store and it was published in the local firestarter.
Smith Peak:Groveland Ranger District, 3,877' elevation.y 1910, Smith Peak, two miles from the Groveland Ranger Station, was used as a fire lookout. Smith Peak was selected as an administrative site in 1931, and soon after a wooden lookout tower was built. In 1952, a metal lookout tower was constructed, along with a garage. The tower burned down in the 1987 Stanislaus Complex Fire, and was replaced in 1988. Smith Peak is used every summer as one of the two staffed fire lookouts on the Groveland District. Photo: 1943.
Then there was the complex fire which came down to the back doors of El Portal in the next few years.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 20, 2013 - 12:22pm PT
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hooch farmers start this one? they haven't reported a cause.
Crap. This is the third big fire I can think of at Buck Meadows in the last 20 years or so. Not a good place to put down stakes.
http://www.inciweb.org/incident/3660/
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Aug 20, 2013 - 12:33pm PT
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man, i hope the moisture beats out the lightning.
wind out of the sw, it could make a long run up the clavey.
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 20, 2013 - 01:55pm PT
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hey there say, timid... oops, i just posted about the fire... and now just saw this...
say, where is my brother matt? how is his place, have you heard?
thanks for any info...
will be in a bit, i am late to start chores around here...
god bless... hugs to you and nita...
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Ward Trotter
Trad climber
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Aug 20, 2013 - 02:20pm PT
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The MODIS satellite fire mapping data of the Rim Fire
The red squares are areas generating the most heat.
This fire seems to be more active in a SE direction at this time.
The yellow squares at the lower right are Tuolumne Grove ( slightly above the green line) and El Portal (due south)
Here is the Rim Fire in relation to Yosemite Valley.
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Ward Trotter
Trad climber
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Aug 20, 2013 - 03:47pm PT
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The most recent update of the Rim Fire.
This thing is taking off and has been picking up in a more easterly direction
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Aug 20, 2013 - 05:10pm PT
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Godspeed, Khanom.
Keeping the fickle fingers crossed it doesn't get to SSR.
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Aug 20, 2013 - 05:54pm PT
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Jeff and Denise live out further than you do by lots. Denise's house, though, is just off Feffetti.
Check in with you tomorrow.
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Ward Trotter
Trad climber
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Aug 20, 2013 - 06:23pm PT
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The 3 pm update.
This thing is still spreading primarily east and southeast.
The separation of the hot zones seems to indicate there are a lot of wind blown embers traveling east and southeast.
In the last few hours this fire seems to have spread out somewhat but has not gotten worse in intensity overall.
Good luck to the firefighters.And to local residents.
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Strider
Trad climber
ಠ_ಠ
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Aug 20, 2013 - 06:39pm PT
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Ward, which website are you going to for that map? It is actually the most updated map I have seen. The Inciweb map is old as is the willandfire.maps.arcgis map.
So far things around here are OK. I live at the Evergreen Lodge and while there is a little bit of smoke in the air, we are not evacuated and I think it is unlikely the fire will make it this far. Regardless, we are prepared to evacuate at a moments notice. San Jose Camp, Camp Tawonga and Camp Mather are currently evacuated.
Let's see how this goes. Good luck on your end Eric.
-Nick
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Ward Trotter
Trad climber
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Aug 20, 2013 - 06:55pm PT
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Ward, which website are you going to for that map?
To get the data I have posted you must have Google Earth.
Although the Active Fire Mapping program can provide data in several ways.
Go to: http://activefiremaps.fs.fed.us/
On menu at left choose " Fire Data in Google Earth"
Once at that site go down to " AFM KML Bundle" click on" current"
If you have Google Earth these links will allow you to access fire data gathered from the MODIS satellites
http://modis.gsfc.nasa.gov/about/
I'll get off the thread and allow you locals guys to communicate.
Good luck and stay safe.
Watch for wind blown embers.
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WBraun
climber
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Aug 20, 2013 - 07:06pm PT
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Best wishes khanom.
I know your area very well.
I drove by your house a couple of months ago and was tempted to steal a carrot from your field :-)
Anyways I really hope this fire does not go near your area.
I have friends who live there too .....
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Mungeclimber
Trad climber
Nothing creative to say
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Aug 20, 2013 - 07:12pm PT
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Nick, just texted you. Was hoping to ask you how bad the smoke is over the res and NE of you. Glad it doesn't seem like it will go your way.
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Impaler
Social climber
Berkeley
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Aug 20, 2013 - 07:13pm PT
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Saw this thing starting on Sunday evening while driving back home from Bridgeport. It was already night. Closest thing that I've seen to Mordor in my life. Glad that we got through before the road was closed. Good luck to those near it.
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Strider
Trad climber
ಠ_ಠ
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Aug 20, 2013 - 07:22pm PT
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Munge, still no cell service up here so no text will arrive. The smoke isn't bad although just in the past hour we have had the wind shift and are getting more smoke now.
So far the fire seems to have stalled today. It exploded over night from 1000 acres to 10,000. Hopefully it sleeps tonight and gives the fire guys some time to get lines arranged.
For us here at the Lodge, this one is still no where near as bad as the one at Early Intake in 2005 or 2006. You couldn't see 100' in front of you and it was raining ash. As the crow flies that one was about 3 miles away.
By contrast this fire is about 6 or 7 miles as the crow flies with plenty of roads and potential fire lines between us and the fire. I am fairly confident the Lodge will be just fine.
Unfortunately it looks like Liliskoog Lodge is having a bad time of it. Don't think it was burned down but the fire went right over the top of it. Keeping my fingers crossed for those folks.
Time to serve dinner to the guests. I'll let you guys know if anything changes later tonight.
-n
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Mungeclimber
Trad climber
Nothing creative to say
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Aug 20, 2013 - 07:32pm PT
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thx hombre!
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nita
Social climber
chica de chico, I don't claim to be a daisy.
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Aug 20, 2013 - 07:38pm PT
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Thanks Strider....
neebee, please read Striders^ above post.....He works at Evergreen Lodge.
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 20, 2013 - 09:12pm PT
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hey there say, nita.... thanks... i just saw it... i will email him later, i know he knows matt, too...
thanks so much!!!
prayers for all...
edit:
say, strider, please email me, say, '
have you seen matt, give him my message
of love and hugs... and prayers...
god blesss...
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 20, 2013 - 09:29pm PT
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hey there say, khanom... i just realized something...
i had an address for you that was not calif...
did you move, or, is this an areas you are in and staying, due to work?
if you move, oh my, hope your place will be okay, :O
hope all is going to be well,for everyone...
very sad the fire got bigger so fast, :O
will be praying for all the folks and fighters...
my brother matt is up, somewhere in the 'them there hills'
of groveland...
and last i heard he was going to evergreen lodge...
ps, for strider:
(heard from our mom, last night... if i hear from you strider,
i will not need to call her, again, tonight)...
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JOEY.F
Gym climber
It's not rocket surgery
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Aug 21, 2013 - 12:01am PT
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Hope the farm is ok Khanom, scary, all the best.
Edit, the best to the Evergreen folks, Strider...
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Aug 21, 2013 - 12:20am PT
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Very hot in the valley today, like 98, so these may be only cumuli of the normal variety. No guarantees.
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TrackerTodd
Mountain climber
CA
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Aug 21, 2013 - 12:49am PT
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Thx Strider good luck and I love your joint!
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Strider
Trad climber
ಠ_ಠ
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Aug 21, 2013 - 02:28am PT
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Howdy,
The "recommended evacuation" of Camp Tawonga, Sawmill Mtn rd, Spinning Wheel and Hardin flat rd. turned into a hard evacuation. So far that is all that has changed. On our end of the fire (the opposite side from khanom) which I will call the north-east flank has made a little progress toward us but not much. The south flank of the fire appears to be where the action is. This includes Hardin Flat rd and Pilot Ridge. A lot of hot spots in that direction. I have no real information on the West (Groveland/Ferretti) & Southwest (Smith Station/Greely Hill) flank. Nobody gives a crap about the North flank of the fire since there is nothing there of human importance (although I would HATE to see the forest gone up there, beautiful country).
Evergreen is still open for business but again, we are just awaiting the word to evac. And the decision to stay open has nothing to do with money and everything to do with taking care of our guests and employees who have nowhere else to go. There are ~375 people here tonight and a reactionary evac would serve no useful purpose in my eyes. PLEASE understand, these are my opinions and not that of my employer.
neebee, last I heard (about an hour ago) your brother is safe but Sawmill mtn has been evacuated. The confirmed sighting of him was that he was driving his truck, horse hitched to the back, leaving his house. Safe and sound.
Safe night to everyone.
-n
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Ward Trotter
Trad climber
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Aug 21, 2013 - 02:46am PT
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Wow this beast has expanded in every direction since the last time I looked, especially north and northeast.
It's starting to look real nasty.
Hopefully the weather and suppression efforts can get a handle on this thing tomorrow.
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 21, 2013 - 03:40am PT
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hey there say, strider/nick... thanks...
i will be praying for all... and the evergreen folks at your
resort place there, too...
wow, sure hope matt's cabin does not burn down, :(
prayers and best wishes for all and safety, as well,
which is top priority...
night now...
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Dr.Sprock
Boulder climber
I'm James Brown, Bi-atch!
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Aug 21, 2013 - 04:31am PT
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not much to burn north of the T river is there? i thought that soil was sterilized, looked pretty barren last time i was down there,
south side had plenty of timber,
some kayakers were running the T one year when that big fire came roaring up the canyon, jumped the river, they almost got smoked out,
maybe the fire dept will improve the road to lumsden bridge,
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 21, 2013 - 11:04am PT
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Inciweb update last night
Evacuations
Communities along Ferretti Road from Highway 120 to Clements Road, Highway 120 at Cherry Lake Road west to Smith Station, Sawmill and Spinning Wheel campgrounds and Tawonga Camp have been evacuated. Evacuation centers are at the Sonora Fairgrounds and Greeley Hill Community Center.
now at 16000 acres.
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Melissa
Gym climber
berkeley, ca
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Aug 21, 2013 - 11:30am PT
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Strider, khanom, and neebee & Matt...I hoping for best outcomes for you.
Keep us posted that you're ok if you can.
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 21, 2013 - 12:36pm PT
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hey there say, melissa...
i am going to try to call matt in a few hours, as, it is still early there, however, i'm sure he is up...
will call my folks if i don't get hold of him, just for more info that he may have had, and is getting, as to his area, and he evergreen lodge, area, as well... they said he might? head in that direction, but then
nick may have seen him, as he was moving on elsewhere, too--will find out...
i am just wondering, now, how it is going, just the above post on
that it is spreading northeast, now...
prayers, for all, and for safety of firefighters...
thanks for sharing, melissa...
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Vitaliy M.
Mountain climber
San Francisco
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Aug 21, 2013 - 01:45pm PT
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Anyone know if it will be open by Friday evening? Or is 108 the only way to the east side?
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Ward Trotter
Trad climber
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Aug 21, 2013 - 02:15pm PT
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The Rim Fire is looking a lot better today. Some of the hot areas are showing a downgrade to cooler, less active orange and yellow.
The overall area has not expanded that rapidly .
Looks better than late yesterday, at least form a few hundred miles up.
Lets hope it stays on a downward trend.
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Clint Cummins
Trad climber
SF Bay area, CA
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Aug 21, 2013 - 02:19pm PT
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Anyone know if it will be open by Friday evening? Or is 108 the only way to the east side? Vitaliy,
Another option is 140 to the Valley, then 120 to Crane Flat and over Tioga.
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Vitaliy M.
Mountain climber
San Francisco
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Aug 21, 2013 - 02:25pm PT
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Clint, even though that IS an option, it is not faster than 108 right?
Hope that fire quits resisting. For sake of people in the area and my selfish plans...
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Ward Trotter
Trad climber
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Aug 21, 2013 - 02:26pm PT
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They always look better in the am. Peak burning time is around 2:00 pm.
True. But it's my guess, baring unlucky shifting factors, that they're getting a handle on this demon.
We'll know by late this afternoon whether it is going to lay down or not. At least for the near term.
Btw this thing looked somewhat worse in the earlier AM, about 12 hrs ago:
Again,".. at least from a few hundred miles up."
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Mungeclimber
Trad climber
Nothing creative to say
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Aug 21, 2013 - 03:03pm PT
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108 is definitely faster than going thru the Meadows with all the redirected traffic.
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Strider
Trad climber
ಠ_ಠ
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Aug 21, 2013 - 03:39pm PT
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Still here. Smoke is a little worse today but it comes and goes.
Here's to hoping for a quiet day.
-n
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Aug 21, 2013 - 04:04pm PT
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An Advisory Evacuation for all of Pine Mountain Lake has been issued.
--from InciWeb, over 30 mins. ago.
Jeff and I just talked and Denny's house is OK. Her mom lives just up the hill from there--so they all know about the evacuation advisory--and there were authorities going up and down the streets contacting all residents yesterday.
the Rev said that unless there's a shift in wind, his Camp Runamucka should be safe as rain.
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mtnyoung
Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
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Aug 21, 2013 - 04:28pm PT
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From a local news station a few minutes ago:
Officials with the Rim Fire are advising residents in the Pine Mountain Lake subdivision to evacuate.
Forest Service officials report that the fire has jumped over the containment line. The incident base camp is also in the area.
This is turning into a pretty serious event in this county; we've got lots of friends in the fire area.
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Chicken Skinner
Trad climber
Yosemite
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Aug 21, 2013 - 05:58pm PT
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This was the view from the north end of Midpines as of about a half hour ago. It is starting to pick up again. Be careful out there people.
Ken
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 21, 2013 - 06:40pm PT
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hey there say, all...
strider, or khanom, perhaps?
did the fire go through sawmill mt road...
or being i don't know how long it is, did it ever
get into that area... that is where matt had to leave,
so i am just curious how it faired in those areas...
i can find it on a map, but the dial up is so slow, nothing
loads around it, :(
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Strider
Trad climber
ಠ_ಠ
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Aug 21, 2013 - 07:21pm PT
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Well that sucks. Fire jumped cherry lake rd and is on top of Tawonga as we speak. Mandatory evac for all of evergreen rd. find out the next day or so if I have a home.
Updates as I find out more. Chillin in curry parking lot now
-n
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Aug 21, 2013 - 07:48pm PT
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Some photos I shot today from a great distance of the area of the fire.
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nita
Social climber
chica de chico, I don't claim to be a daisy.
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Aug 21, 2013 - 08:20pm PT
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Mr K, Having big trees that close to your home is not a good thing.
When the fire storm happened in i989 (?) Foresta fire, Rick Cashner's home did not burn.......He cut down most of the big pines trees that were next his home.
Stay safe...and good luck.
...............................................................
Strider, aka, Saint Nick.... So sorry to hear this terrible news...)-;.....
take care...
damn, all my favorite places threatened ...Tawonga, Evergreen Lodge, and Camp Mather..aka Strawberry.....argg.....
Thinking about all the fire crew ...Hoping for no fatalities...
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Aug 21, 2013 - 08:35pm PT
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Please protect those delicious root veggies, Khanom!
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msiddens
Trad climber
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Aug 21, 2013 - 09:54pm PT
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ugh, heart goes out to thre folks impacted here. Hoping for some wins
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CF
climber
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Aug 21, 2013 - 09:57pm PT
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from hwy 120 this afternoon
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 21, 2013 - 10:04pm PT
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hey there say, khanom... oh my, :O
very sad to hear this... as to the worse and historic...
glad to hear the sawmill mt rd, may be okay then...
oh, my, :O if i was closer, nick, you could stay here,
:(
prayers even harder now, for evergreen, all the folks, and
hope you will be well, and the ranch area, khanom...
say, nick, can you put a taco post up, and let folks here know, that you may need a place to stay??
someone well known by all, nearby, may be able to???
dear lord, please help my friends, :O
i sure do not like that word "historic" :(
you are not forgotten, even if many of us are just not
there to help...
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 21, 2013 - 10:08pm PT
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hey there say, mouse and all with the neat photo shots...
wow and man oh man, i sure wish those BILLOWS were clouds, to fill with rain and not smoke... oh my...
say--we just got thunder here and are getting a bit of rain...
dear lord, i sure wish and hope rain will move out to you all from
SOMEWHERE.... my mom, also in san jose, got rain last night,
a 'freaky' phenomena' as to aug weather...
she and us all, remember when rain never showed in aug...
wow....
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murcy
Gym climber
sanfrancisco
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Aug 21, 2013 - 10:48pm PT
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Not a "heartwarming" or "cozy" type of fire, it seems.
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Ward Trotter
Trad climber
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Aug 21, 2013 - 10:52pm PT
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Wow this thing is cranking -- especially towards the NE.
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bergbryce
Mountain climber
California
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Aug 21, 2013 - 11:58pm PT
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It poured rain on our attempt at Sun Ribbon yesterday and today. Also rained almost the whole way home from Bishop to Topaz.
There was a very healthy south -> north flow of precip with not that much lightning. Is none of that moisture landing on the west side of the crest?
Best to all in or near harms way.
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10b4me
Ice climber
Wishes-He-Was-In-Arizona
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Aug 22, 2013 - 12:31am PT
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Tropical depression forming south of Baja, but expected to move north early next week, and settling over SE California Sunday /Monday. Hopefully, some of that moisture moves north.
Enough rainfall is expected in the deserts that they are warning of flash floods.
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Clint Cummins
Trad climber
SF Bay area, CA
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Aug 22, 2013 - 12:38am PT
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Maybe donate to the fire crews if you can't sell 'em.
Would be a tasty diversion from the MREs.
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Mungeclimber
Trad climber
Nothing creative to say
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Aug 22, 2013 - 12:44am PT
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Such a good idea!
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nita
Social climber
chica de chico, I don't claim to be a daisy.
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Aug 22, 2013 - 01:22am PT
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Mr K , Two years ago i volunteered at a fire Evacuations center . We accepted all food donations..Including people bringing in food from their gardens...
Was it just the fire crews that said no? Maybe try the Sonora Fairgrounds were the evacuees will be staying .
Khanom edit... http://www.mymotherlode.com/news/local/2218666/Evacuees-At-The-Fairgrounds.html
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John M
climber
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Aug 22, 2013 - 11:54am PT
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from 16000 acres to over 53000 acres in one day. whoa..
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Aug 22, 2013 - 12:16pm PT
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munge,
there were big fires back there in '73 and again in 87. but each had a different coverage area. granite basin burned in '73.
judging from this morning's maps, it burned again yesterday. if it heads up the clavey, there's basically nothing to stop it. the fuel loads back there are insane, and there's no good basing territory for the northern perimeter.
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Melissa
Gym climber
berkeley, ca
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Aug 22, 2013 - 12:26pm PT
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I'm trying to understand the map. What do the MODUS-thermal dots mean? Why are there so many outside of what is marked as the "fire perimeter"?
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pvalchev
Social climber
Truckee, CA
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Aug 22, 2013 - 12:32pm PT
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Does anyone have news on Sawmill Mtn Road/houses there? The map has expanded a bit in that direction.. but still not over it, I don't think? Best of luck to everyone affected!!
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RP3
Big Wall climber
Sonora
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Aug 22, 2013 - 12:37pm PT
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The smoke is unbelievable downtown this morning. This pic is from out my front door. Good luck to all those directly affected. Be safe firefighters!
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Aug 22, 2013 - 12:40pm PT
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I'm trying to understand the map. What do the MODUS-thermal dots mean? Why are there so many outside of what is marked as the "fire perimeter"?
the map is an approximation of several moments in time that represents heat intensity. you can never see a single fire "line" from above, partly because of the smoke plume but also because a fire like this isn't defined by a single, unified edge.
the fire advances in large part by downdrafts of superheated air and burning material dropping into unburned fuels around the fire's outskirts.
the "line" in many places will be a messy patchwork of burned and unburned fuels, with new fires constantly spring up, some as small as a single manazanita bush, others a few acres, and each of them at some kind of threat for becoming an advance edge of the main body.
since the thing jumped the road, folks have been out there on the ground frickin gunnysacking, trying to extinguish the smaller advance fires.
unreal dangerous. chaotic on the actual ground, with the smoke and terrain. and a fire this large will create its own winds, often unpredictable.
once it jumped the road, there was basically a clear path of heavy fuel to pine mt. lake.
if pine mt. is still there tomorrow morning, it'll be partly because we got really lucky with the winds and weather, and partly because folks on the ground are out there working in hell right now.
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WBraun
climber
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Aug 22, 2013 - 12:45pm PT
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Thanks for that nice explanation on "modus" klk.
All the fire guys next door are all gone and out there so I couldn't ask them as I didn't know what that meant either .....
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Melissa
Gym climber
berkeley, ca
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Aug 22, 2013 - 12:58pm PT
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Thanks for the explanation and link!
Sending my best wishes to everyone who lives/has property there.
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Ward Trotter
Trad climber
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Aug 22, 2013 - 01:40pm PT
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Wow, this thing is really looking mean.
30+ hrs. ago I thought there might be a chance of getting this thing under some control by the weekend. My guess was wrong.
To residents and firefighters--good luck, stay safe, and watch for embers.
In CA and the entire west, firefighting resources are currently stretched thin. I think this is part of the problem here.
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crusher
climber
Santa Monica, CA
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Aug 22, 2013 - 01:41pm PT
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Any word on how this started? Inciweb just says "under investigation"...you guys hear anything else?
Stay safe everyone.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 22, 2013 - 01:59pm PT
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Was talking with a CalFire chief Tues night.
The MODIS imagery is from the 2 MODIS satellites. Shows fire, vegetation, smoke, snow etc.
It's somewhat over sensitive. Can show a few "hotspots" that don't exist. CalFire flies over them in a spotter plane to check.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moderate-Resolution_Imaging_Spectroradiometer
I think it makes two passes a day in daylight.
There's also an experimental satellite that shows lightning strikes both cloud to cloud and cloud to earth. CalFire subscribes to that data as well. The Monday night lightning storm here in the SCruz mtns produced a large number of satellite observed "strikes" to ground. CalFire found and extinguished 2 or 3 fires on the ground and then Tues AM overflew this entire area to be sure there was nothing else.
man…this is some NASTY fire.
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Aug 22, 2013 - 02:17pm PT
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 22, 2013 - 02:44pm PT
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The latest official report: 8:00 AM
The Rim fire has transitioned into unified command with Cal Fire and Forest Service on August 21 at 2:00 p.m.
Fire continues its eastward spread along Packerd Canyon Road and Pilot Ridge. Structure defense continues for San Jose Camp, Spinning Wheel and Tawonga Camp as the fire moves up the middle fork of the Tuolumne.
The fire continues to spread northwest burning past Butcher Knife Ridge and moving into Grapevine Creek; northeast up the Tuolumne River Drainage from the Gravel Range past Jones Point Lookout; and continue to spread southeast edge along Hwy 120 to the east.
Firing operations have begun on Ferretti Rd. as the fire progress west towards the community of Pine Mountain Lake. Direct suppression methods have been successful.
The availability of fixed wing air craft is pertinent to the success of suppression operations. The use of Maffs C-130s and the V-LAT DC-10 has greatly improved suppression efforts. Use of Military Rotary wing aircraft continues today.
In the next 24 hours the fire is expected to continue up the Tuolumne River canyon, and continue its spread to the north and east.
Due to inaccessible, steep terrain and active fire behavior a combination of direct and indirect attack will be used on this incident. Direct line suppression efforts are impeded by difficult access and steep inaccessible terrain. Active fire behavior today raises safety concerns for crews adjacent to the fire’s edge. Smoke exposure within the deep drainage of the Clavey River will be an issue for fire crews as well.
Not looking good. At least they seem to be holding it at Ferreti Rd. Everything north and east seems at risk.
54,000 acres and 2% containment.
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Strider
Trad climber
ಠ_ಠ
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Aug 22, 2013 - 02:55pm PT
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Not much new info so far. The fire seems to have stayed away from Hardin Flat rd so far. Sawmill was overrun but last I heard only a few out buildings were lost, no mention if homes destroyed. Tawonga was also over run but also no update on structure damage there. Still several miles from evergreen lodge and Mather. Report from a PG&E worker that 40 some odd poles are down so electricity will be a while coming.
neebee, I wish I had more to tell you about Matt but last I heard he was headed out with his horse. The direction he was going has plenty of exit routes so I am sure he is safe.
-n
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Adamame
climber
Santa Cruz
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Aug 22, 2013 - 03:50pm PT
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Any word on how this started? Inciweb just says "under investigation"...you guys hear anything else?
Based on the fact it started on The Clavey River not far from the confluence with the T, I have friends that suspect it was paddlers who spent the night at Clavey Rapid. That is likely one of the most camped at spots on the river.
But I did hear that it may have started higher on Clavey Ridge, so maybe lightning caused? It could have been smoldering for days or even a week before it went up.
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 22, 2013 - 04:49pm PT
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hey there say, strider... i just got an email from a former supertopo poster... and heard he is with folks in the hardin flat area...
thank you for any and all info, strider...
prayers and love to you all...
oh my... i sure hate what fires do when out of control, :(
wishing and holding out, at the ol' prayer-front-line...
god bless to all...
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 22, 2013 - 05:09pm PT
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hey there say, ron anderson!! thank you for posting all that info for me...
thank you so very much and kindly!!
god bless...
got to go now... art-painting chores... :)
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 22, 2013 - 05:11pm PT
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hey there say, khanom.... hope all is going well for you...
got to go now... you are in thoughts and prayers, as all are, there...
hope the melons help folks, i mean, my oh my, they are plain ol'
melons... :O :)
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command error
Trad climber
Colorado
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Aug 22, 2013 - 05:29pm PT
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Oh no! Hope they can save the Penny Pines by Cherry Lk.
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 22, 2013 - 05:38pm PT
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hey there say, timid... i just got back on line, after calling my folks...
they heard this same info from mark:
that i just heard...
say, it DOES match what you said, my email from just a bit agao said that he was with the nichols... is THIS the same folks you mentioned, and yes, it was at sunset inn... so i know he is safe then... and with dear horse...
please keep in touch, on this... thanks so very kindly and soooooo very much, dear andy!!!!!
praying and crying for all the folks... i love for folks to have their homes and families, so this always makes me sad... and for the firefighters...
they did NOT have to chose this line of work... WHAT IF none, ever did...
we are so indebted to folks that chose this work, and god watch over them, amen...
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murcy
Gym climber
sanfrancisco
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Aug 22, 2013 - 07:41pm PT
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If reports on twitter are to be believed the area just east of and adjacent to PML airport and Unit 12 of PML (if that's different) are being mandatorily evacuated. The airport's east-northeast facing webcam seems to refresh every 15min
4:35pm:
Now (live):
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dave729
Trad climber
Western America
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Aug 22, 2013 - 08:03pm PT
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Can anyone explain why there is a white cloud above the darker smoke cloud?
Could it be water vapor from fire suppression water drops rising through
the smoke to condense into a cap cloud thousands of feet above?
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WBraun
climber
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Aug 22, 2013 - 08:17pm PT
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View from Yosemite Helli-tack at Crane Flat hour ago ..... grim.
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Radish
Trad climber
SeKi, California
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Aug 22, 2013 - 08:20pm PT
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Don't know if this link has been added yet.. http://wlfhotlist.com/threads/36507-CA-STF-Rim/page10 Some cool News Helicopter stuff and a great resource for alot of other fire info too. The nation is on Level 5 and Fire Resources are just strapped all over. I'm not sure in my 10 years of fire that I have seen it at that level!
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nita
Social climber
chica de chico, I don't claim to be a daisy.
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Aug 22, 2013 - 08:46pm PT
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Mr K, Here is a picture of Matt.
How did the melon caper go?
edit: Mr K, glad you made some money and passed on some goodness...cool.
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dave729
Trad climber
Western America
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Aug 22, 2013 - 09:31pm PT
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Thanks for the link Murcy.
The white clouds above the darker
smoke just stood out and had to ask. Have to look back at other
recent fires to see if they had pyrocumulus clouds
RA sorry about your air quality. Those canyons have huge fuel loads
and with the wind make a terrible combination.
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 22, 2013 - 09:52pm PT
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hey there say, khanom, :)... i was off line, for a phone call from england...
nita got ol' matt up there...
he'd be with a horse, too...
had a good prayer session with the gal from england...
thank you so much, nita, :)
ps:
my folks had heard the same info that i heard, but they heard it from chappy, :)
see up thread, i think i got this post through, on dial up, earlier, pretty sure it took... :
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Dr.Sprock
Boulder climber
I'm James Brown, Bi-atch!
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Aug 22, 2013 - 09:58pm PT
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should start to slow as it hits more granite, less fuel and higher, cooler elev.
that part of the T canyon has always generated massive up canyon winds,
dang kayakers probably having a 420 "safety meeting" while scouting clavey falls,
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Ward Trotter
Trad climber
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Aug 22, 2013 - 10:19pm PT
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This thing is now starting to expand to the west and NW and continuing North and NE.
Tomorrow's winds are forecast to be out of the SSW at 5-10 mph. Not good for the northern flank.
The winds have been shifting around quite a bit the last few days. Not good. And probably a large part of the problem for firefighters.
Props and respect to the hard working firefighting crews on this difficult fire.
We know you are in harms way and we greatly appreciate your efforts. Stay safe.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 23, 2013 - 12:17am PT
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2500 structures threatened.
In a sparsely populated area, that's going to take a huge effort.
Awesome DC-10 pic. Thank Gov Jerry for committing to a season long lease for that beast early in the year. It's not exclusively for California but at least we have a new contract (the Legislature canceled last year).
http://www.10tanker.com/the-plane.html
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Mazzystr
Gym climber
Homeless...
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Aug 23, 2013 - 12:35am PT
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We're following along in the east (Raleigh, NC). We send our prayers for the safety the crew and civilians.
Those smoke plumes are colossal. We get storms that come up from South Carolina that track NE and parallel the Atlantic shore about 100miles in. The city of Wilson, NC gets their ass handed to them when they arrive. We can see the cloud plumes all the way in Raleigh and we're about 50 miles away.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cumulonimbus
I watched that Eva Marie Schicke video. Tragic. I watched an aerial battle with fire in Tuolumne Grove while hanging off the side of North Dome for 2 weeks in 06. I had no idea the danger and effort that went fire fighting in mountainous terrain.
Wow! Amazing that there are DC-10's still in the air!
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the albatross
Gym climber
Flagstaff
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Aug 23, 2013 - 12:54am PT
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I posted this on May 6 on a different fire thread, but it seems worthy of posting again given the recent conditions. The article touches on some of the challenges fire managers are facing this year.
**California Girds for Severe Fire Season as Dry Lands Burn
**
By Michael B. Marois - 2013-05-06T04:00:01Z
Californians are preparing for a prolonged season of wildfires after an unusually dry winter that left millions of acres of scrub brush in the most populous U.S. state primed to burn.
The tinder-box conditions have sparked more than 840 wildfires since January, about 320 more than the five-year average, according to the state Forestry and Fire Protection Department, known as Cal Fire. A fast-moving fire in Ventura County over the weekend charred an area the size of San Francisco, forced the evacuation of a college with 4,900 students and threatened 4,000 homes northwest of Los Angeles.
Wind-swept fires across the state following similarly dry winter months in 2008 burned more than 1.2 million acres and killed 13 firefighters, according to Cal Fire. In 2007, firestorms swept through Southern California, destroying 1,500 homes, displacing almost a million residents and killing 17.
“It’s pretty shocking that we are having fires of this size already,” said Bill Stewart, a professor of forest economics and policy with the University of California at Berkeley. “It could be a big one. I wouldn’t be surprised if we surpassed 2007.”
The California Department of Water Resources announced May 2 that the state’s snowpack was 17 percent of normal. January through March was the driest first quarter on record for the state, according to the California State Meteorologist.
Budget Cuts
The dangerous conditions come as automatic federal budget cuts called sequestration means the U.S. Forest Service has to cut its budget even though the agency expects this year’s fire season to match and or possibly exceed last year, when 9.3 million acres burned. Forest Service Chief Tom Tidwell has said the cuts mean his agency will hire about 500 fewer seasonal firefighters than normal.
Governor Jerry Brown in 2011 signed a budget that reduced the number of firefighters assigned to each engine to three from four as a way save money and help erase what was then a $10 billion deficit. The move restored staffing levels on each truck to where they were before October 2003, when 14 separate massive firestorms scorched more than 750,000 acres, destroyed 1,700 homes and killed 24 people.
Brown told a panel of federal judges May 2 that one way he could comply with their order to reduce overcrowding in state prisons was to move 1,300 inmates to camps where they can be deployed to help on the fire lines. California currently has about 3,700 inmates in such camps.
1,800 Firefighters
More than 1,800 firefighters over the weekend battled a blaze known as the Springs Fire south of Camarillo in Ventura County. Strong Santa Ana winds spread the blaze to more than 43 square miles (111 square kilometers) before crews were able to stall its growth yesterday.
The fire, now mostly under control, had forced officials to evacuate California State University, Channel Islands, and close down portions of State Route 1, known as the Pacific Coast Highway. While no homes were destroyed, 15 were damaged, the Ventura Fire Department said.
Stewart said that even with the dry conditions, how long and often strong winds blow through the summer months will determine whether the state suffers the kinds of massive fires that struck in 2007 and 2008.
“It’s the high winds that really drives up the acreage and pushes the fires up into subdivisions,” he said. “We know we have dry fuel on the ground, we know it’s going to be warm, but what we don’t know yet is how often we are going to have winds.”
Red Flag
The National Weather Service had issued red flag warnings for most of Los Angeles and Ventura counties over the weekend because of the dry Santa Ana winds, which blow desert air toward the Pacific coast. The warning alerts area residents and firefighters that conditions are ideal for rapidly spreading wildfires.
Cal Fire has 4,700 full-time firefighters and foresters who are aided by another 8,700 seasonal and local workers. The state also uses prisoners to fight wildfires. The Corrections Department said 82 crews, consisting of 1,093 inmates and 97 guards, were assisting in battling 14 fires across the state.
“We have already seen a big increase in the number of fires that normally occur at this time of year, and summer hasn’t yet arrived,” Mark Ghilarducci, secretary of the California Emergency Management Agency, said in a statement.
Colorado Fires
Large wildfires aren’t limited to California. Colorado suffered its most destructive fire season last year, with dozens of blazes fueled by drought-ravaged grass and beetle-killed timber. Flames destroyed at least 600 homes and charred more than 116,000 acres. Damage was estimated at more than $450 million, with the Waldo Canyon blaze, which consumed entire neighborhoods in the foothills around Colorado Springs, becoming the most expensive fire in state history.
More than 153,000 acres have burned across the U.S. this year, though that’s half how much were scorched during the same period in 2012, according to the National Interagency Fire Center out of Boise, Idaho.
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Chicken Skinner
Trad climber
Yosemite
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Aug 23, 2013 - 01:56am PT
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I took this today at around 4.40pm. It was the largest and Easternmost of the three columns that I could see. I have seen some gnarly fires over the years and this appears to be one of the worst I have seen.
Ken
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Mungeclimber
Trad climber
Nothing creative to say
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Aug 23, 2013 - 02:31am PT
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my gawd that's huge
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Chicken Skinner
Trad climber
Yosemite
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Aug 23, 2013 - 02:44am PT
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Yes, it is huge and moving fast. That was the hottest spot and only part of the whole fire. Here are some others taken at the same time to give some perspective.
Ken
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Ward Trotter
Trad climber
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Aug 23, 2013 - 02:51am PT
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Looks like the wind has already shifted around to the SW. The separated red areas to the NE sometimes indicate wind blown hot spots.
This beast just keeps looking epochal
Sure would be cool if some rain fell. Not in the forecast. Although by Sat. the wind is backing off a bit. It will also be just a tad cooler Sun and Mon. We'll take what we can get.
12:30 am update
Man those western and NW flanks look scary getting close to Groveland.
My guess is that they are concentrating resources there and backing off the NE flank, relatively speaking.
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Blakey
Trad climber
Sierra Vista
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Aug 23, 2013 - 03:20am PT
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This looks grim,
We are recently back from a trip to the valley, in late June. Our accommodation was a rented cabin at Buck Meadows and we commuted into the Valley and Meadows.
In the face of the devastation this brings I hope all are OK - or at least safe.
Steve
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Aug 23, 2013 - 03:53am PT
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Edit:
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Dr.Sprock
Boulder climber
I'm James Brown, Bi-atch!
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Aug 23, 2013 - 06:19am PT
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where is that paraglider dude?
bet he could set a new record,
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Bad Climber
climber
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Aug 23, 2013 - 09:04am PT
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Damn, that's scary! Keep safe fire fighters!
BAd
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feralfae
Boulder climber
Montana
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Aug 23, 2013 - 09:31am PT
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Neebs,
Did you hear from your brother yet?
How are things?
I got your email, but wanted to post here to let you know I am watching and concerned
Things are quiet out here along the Divide in Montana right now. I'm heading down to the Winds soon.
Everyone take care out there in YNP, hope the fire on both sides of 120 is out by now, or almost out. At least controlled. Anything that is progress. I remember when the Bitterroot burned out here, and the smoke columns and billowing of smoke was not a fierce looking as you have out there in YNP right now. G*d keep you all safe.
Neebs, I'll email you in a while when I get back from coffee and breakfast with friends from Sweden, who are cycling through today on their way to Kamloops.
Mouse, you and everyone out there take care. I hope you get lots of rain any minute. You guys are in my prayers. Take care. Be safe.
Neebs, much Love and fairy dustings for you.
feralfae
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ruppell
climber
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Aug 23, 2013 - 09:56am PT
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Yikes. If that info is accurate that's a 50% increase in size in less than 12 hours. Epic.
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Aug 23, 2013 - 12:13pm PT
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this is really bad--
if i lived in san francisco, i'd be stockpiling water. heth hetchy looks likely to burn, and no one knows if the system will be fully operational after. and everyone who lives over on the nearby 108 corridor ought to be prepared to bail on a moment's notice.
it now has a clear run up the canyon to tuolumne city, and give the way it's spotting now, that means that even phoenix lake and twain harte could become threatened in the next few days. i don't think it's likely, but we're entering a world in which no one can reliably model this fire's behavior.
this is not just another seasonal sierra fire.
this report gives a fairly current overview of the literature:
http://www.fs.fed.us/pnw/pubs/pnw_gtr854.pdf
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Dr. Christ
Mountain climber
State of Mine
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Aug 23, 2013 - 12:22pm PT
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105,000+ acres and only 2% contained.
Is anywhere within 4 hours of Tahoe not smoky? My lungs cannot handle this.
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sneville
climber
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Aug 23, 2013 - 12:25pm PT
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How is the smoke on 108 all the way to the pass?
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Aug 23, 2013 - 12:29pm PT
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How is the smoke on 108 all the way to the pass?
a section of 108 was closed yesterday due to another, smaller fire.
if yr planning a crossing, i'd be checking status all the way there.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Aug 23, 2013 - 12:37pm PT
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Mouse, tell yer Nat Guard friend to have his FMS system checked - I'm thinking
that lowering the gear wasn't gonna help much. The FMS systems I'm familiar
with are more helpful as the nice lady says...
"Terrain, terrain, pull up you suicidal fuk!!!!!"
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Aug 23, 2013 - 12:47pm PT
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Word, Reilly, word.
Word for the day/week/month: Pyrocumulus/pyrocumulonimbus.
According to the Weather Guys--
A pyrocumulus cloud forms from rising air that results from intense heating of the surface by phenomena such as wildfires or volcanic eruptions. The fires that generate these clouds can be man-made or natural.
A big fire produces strong upward moving air currents that carry water vapor and ash upward. The water vapor can condense on the ash forming cloud drops. The vigorous upward motions produce these pyrocumulus clouds that look similar to thunderstorm clouds, which also form due to strong upward moving air. A pyrocumulus is a fire cloud.
In Latin, pyro means “fire” and cumulus means “pile up.” Cumulus is a type of cloud that is common in Wisconsin, particularly in summer. Cumulus clouds are those puffy-white clouds with tops that have a cauliflower appearance. Pyrocumulus clouds are grayish or brown in color because of the ashes and smoke of the fire. The tops of these clouds can reach as high as 30,000 feet. It is difficult to locate the bottom of a pyrocumulus cloud as it is often obscure by the ash generated by the fire or the volcanic eruption.
If lots of water vapor is available, the pyrocumulus can develop into a cumulonimbus, or thunderstorm. When a thundercloud forms, it is called pyrocumulonimbus. Like thunderstorms, pyrocumulonimbus can produce lightning because of the strong updrafts. Rain can also fall from these clouds, which could help extinguish the fire generating the cloud. Of course, the lightning might cause another fire.
//
The anvils haven't formed over these clouds we have been seeing the last several days, meaning the upper atmosphere, at around 30 thou, isn't sufficiently cold enough to cause an "inversion," or flattening out of the heated cloud vapor beneath a layer of much colder air, which cannot readily mix with the updrafts. Anvils are good things, to my mind. What saith the Taco's few resident expert Weathermen?
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hamersorethumb
Trad climber
Menlo Park, CA
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Aug 23, 2013 - 12:52pm PT
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photos of the start of the rim fire as seen from Pine Mountain Lake on Saturday August 17th.
We then went into Toulmne Meadows for some climbing driving right past the fire on Monday the 19th. We had a great time in the meadow. Thanks to all the firefighters and stay safe everyone.
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ecflau
Gym climber
CA
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Aug 23, 2013 - 12:59pm PT
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on the the CA.gov website (dot.ca.gov) it says 108 has no traffic restrictions.
anyone know how up to date this is? or is there a better website?
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adikted
Boulder climber
Tahooooeeeee
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Aug 23, 2013 - 01:02pm PT
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Does anyone know how it is up in the Meadows curretly smokewise? Does anyone think they will close the gates til this gets a little controlled??
Greg
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Aug 23, 2013 - 01:49pm PT
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on the the CA.gov website (dot.ca.gov) it says 108 has no traffic restrictions.
yeah, that's the site. i'd just check again or listen to traffic channel as you get closer to sonora. or watch the roadsigns/tune to the traffic channel in case it changes and you need to re-route.
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Dr. Christ
Mountain climber
State of Mine
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Aug 23, 2013 - 01:52pm PT
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Does anyone know how it is up in the Meadows curretly smokewise? Does anyone think they will close the gates til this gets a little controlled??
How is Bridgeport? Hulk? Mammoth? Beeshop?
Tahoe fuking sucks right now.
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Ward Trotter
Trad climber
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Aug 23, 2013 - 02:48pm PT
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Maybe I was right and they concentrated resources to work on that western flank closest to Groveland yesterday into overnight --things look better there, for now.
Tonight the wind stays SW less than 5 mph and it will be marginally cooler. Good news .
The N and NE flanks are really opening up. Slight drop off in wind strength from SW could help there.
Saturday around midnight the winds shift to NE and NW...hopefully this won't mean the SE flank opening up, and making a run for the thickly wooded slopes in that direction.
Good thing about the NE is it looks like the beast might run out of things to eat up there. Less oxygen too.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 23, 2013 - 03:02pm PT
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Tuolumne evacuation? That sounds unrelated to the Rim Fire
Interesting Modis info overlaid on Google Earth
Note the info in the legend at top right.
MODIS data is from 11:45 PDT today. Yellow squares are effectively "out". The rest are still active.
All the way to Lake Eleanor? Looks as if it's not near Hetch Hetchy quite yet, although the HH power lines to SF have been down for a couple of days.
The evening of Aug 19 (red line fire boundary), I mentioned this fire to our local (Santa Cruz Mtns) CalFire camp Chief and he was more concerned about the big fire off Foresthill Rd near Auburn. He already had most of his crews and equipment on that fire. Then this fire took off overnight. That must have caused a huge change in the CalFire order of battle.
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Aug 23, 2013 - 03:08pm PT
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Tuolumne evacuation? That sounds unrelated to the Rim Fire
Tuolumne City, not the meadows. Tuolumne City is on the 108 on the top of the canyon. 2 or 3 miles as the crow flies from Twain Harte.
Reasonable expectation is that it's likely to run up the canyon, and then folks will try to hold a line at the brow of the hill there at Tuolumne CIty and the 108.
Look at the perimeter map from this morning-- this fire has multiple canyons to blow up with no defensible lines until it reaches granite to the northeast and 108 to the n/nw
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Ward Trotter
Trad climber
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Aug 23, 2013 - 03:15pm PT
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Reasonable expectation is that it's likely to run up the canyon, and then folks will try to hold a line at the brow of the hill there at Tuolumne CIty and the 108.
Yep. Now that they've reasonably contained the Groveland flank they have no doubt been running additional crews and resources up to T City over the last 12 hrs.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Aug 23, 2013 - 03:40pm PT
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How in the world are two airplanes gonna even slow this thing down?
Talk about pissing into a hurricane...
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 23, 2013 - 03:58pm PT
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klk. Yes, I know where Tuolumne City is, my post was ambiguous. Thanks for catching it.
I was surprised!
They'll be focusing their resources on structure protection. Obviously the PML development but also probably trying to keep the fire from crossing the Tuolumne River below Hetch Hetchy and protecting Hetch Hetchy dam facilities.
At least the winds are light so far today.
CalFire has the other major fire to deal with: American fire east of Auburn/Foresthill At least SoCal is quiet….. for now.
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PellucidWombat
Mountain climber
Berkeley, CA
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Aug 23, 2013 - 03:59pm PT
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Really begs the question for those of us about to start our weekly weekend commute in a few hours:
Thanks for the status updates everyone!
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mtnyoung
Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
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Aug 23, 2013 - 05:16pm PT
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klk, I wanted to look over the complex fire map, but the link appears invalid now?
That was one big fire in 1987, but I don't recall it coming this far the the north and northwest.
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Aug 23, 2013 - 05:25pm PT
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thanks q.
just as well to download the fire history map now, since he's edited it since i posted the first link:
http://tiny.cc/hvfa2w
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mtnyoung
Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
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Aug 23, 2013 - 05:31pm PT
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It's starting to get nervous on this side of the river (Grroveland is south of the Tuolumne River, Twain Harte, Tuolumne and other communities are north of it).
Ponderosa Hills is under an evacuation advisory now - they may get an evacuation order. The fire seems like it is a long way away from this subdivision, but in those canyons...
We live seven miles from Ponderosa Hills and are giving some thought to thinking about some plans.
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Michelle
Social climber
1187 Hunterwasser
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Aug 23, 2013 - 05:45pm PT
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Brad, was the TH update meeting last night or tonite? Good luck and let's hope it doesn't get that far. So much for God's Bath..
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mtnyoung
Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
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Aug 23, 2013 - 05:48pm PT
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Brad, was the TH update meeting last night or tonite? Good luck and let's hope it doesn't get that far. So much for God's Bath..
It's tonight - Vicki's going.
I'm kinda proud of my oldest girl Katie. She's done with work and hasn't left for college and so she's been hanging around home.
She got in her car a few hours ago and headed to the evacuation center in Sonora to help "in any way she can."
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Michelle
Social climber
1187 Hunterwasser
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Aug 23, 2013 - 05:53pm PT
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That's bc you raised her well! Let us know what they say. My dad's not going.
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willm
Social climber
Oakland
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Aug 23, 2013 - 05:55pm PT
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Good to know about Conness, del cross. I was going to drive up there tonight and have a go. Smoke in the eyes sounds like a bad time.
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Aug 23, 2013 - 06:11pm PT
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brad, i would have stuff ready to go, just in case. if nothing else, the smoke could get bad enough to put ten years of age on yr lungs.
this is radder than the 87 complex fire. one of the fastest anyone's seen, and the convection is really scary. prevailing winds might not even matter.
the canyons are prime for blow up scenarios, that's why they've been prepping the t-city line for awhile now.
trying to get my mom to come down to the coast, but she doesn't want to leave the animals. she has the car ready to roll.
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 23, 2013 - 06:37pm PT
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hey there say, mtnyoung...
as to this part of quote:
She got in her car a few hours ago and headed to the evacuation center in Sonora to help "in any way she can.
wow, how very wonderful for her to think of others and do this, of her own
free will... >:D<
also, khanom... great to hear the update of these places... :)
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scuffy b
climber
heading slowly NNW
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Aug 23, 2013 - 06:37pm PT
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Yeah, it seems that it could really race up the North Fork to Tuolumne City.
QITNL, Kibbie is NE of Cherry, Laurel is NE of Eleanor, no?
Thanks for all these updates.
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wstmrnclmr
Trad climber
Bolinas, CA
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Aug 23, 2013 - 06:55pm PT
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Wow....Great air footage Mike, and great updates QITNL. Sure looks like the fire could get into the Valley...Yikes!
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mtnyoung
Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
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Aug 23, 2013 - 07:01pm PT
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Pelucidwombat: it doesn't look like you're going to be allowed to come up here!
From a local news station:
"The Advisory Evacuation has grown. Areas include Soulsbyville, Willow Springs and areas on the south side of highway 108.
Tuolumne County Sheriff Jim Mele says, "It is advisory and there are no mandatory evacuations in those areas at this time."
Also, roadways into Tuolumne City are being closed to the public. Only residents, firefighters and law enforcement are being allowed into the area."
Shit!
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murcy
Gym climber
sanfrancisco
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Aug 23, 2013 - 07:02pm PT
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From the current satellite hot spots it doesn't look like Mather/Evergreen Lodge and PML are out of the woods yet. Really scary how much wooded terrain there is in easy reach of this thing.
Obviously the water in Cherry and Eleanor will be affected--post-wildfire runoff has elevated levels of metals, etc. So far I don't think anything in the Hetchy watershed has burned (but it will certainly get some ash if the wind turns, if it hasn't already).
[edit: correct, this is the hetchy watershed map.]
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ecflau
Gym climber
CA
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Aug 23, 2013 - 07:27pm PT
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Pelucidwombat: it doesn't look like you're going to be allowed to come up here!
From a local news station:
"The Advisory Evacuation has grown. Areas include Soulsbyville, Willow Springs and areas on the south side of highway 108.
Tuolumne County Sheriff Jim Mele says, "It is advisory and there are no mandatory evacuations in those areas at this time."
Also, roadways into Tuolumne City are being closed to the public. Only residents, firefighters and law enforcement are being allowed into the area."
Shit!
For those who are bad at english (like me) ... does that mean 108 is closed, or "game time decision" ?
EDIT : sorry if that sounds cold, for people who this fire actually matters and affects their lives, and i'm just looking to have fun going out to play.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 23, 2013 - 07:42pm PT
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Right up to the entrance gate**
that really brings it home.
That would of course be the Hetch Hetchy gate, not the main 120 gate. At least not yet
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TrackerTodd
Mountain climber
CA
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Aug 23, 2013 - 07:45pm PT
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Man ,that is close. Thx for the updates everyone.
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monolith
climber
SF bay area
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Aug 23, 2013 - 07:46pm PT
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ecflau, Tuolumne City is about 3 miles(direct line) away from 108. Tuolumne Rd is the major road to Tuolumne City from 108 that has restrictions.
There is fire about 3 miles SSE from Tuolomne City.
Still, if there is another big advance overnight, 108 could have restrictions as well.
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Dr. Christ
Mountain climber
State of Mine
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Aug 23, 2013 - 07:54pm PT
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Great posts. Thanks for all the info.
murcy, that map you posted... that is just the watershed for Hetch Hetchy, right?
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mtnyoung
Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
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Aug 23, 2013 - 07:59pm PT
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ecflau: Monolith has it right - only Tuolumne City has restrictions for now and 108 is open.
But this thing seems to be racing toward that town! I've never heard of such a restriction there, even during another fire some years ago in which we could see flames from parts of town.
Still, it appears that they are making huge efforts now that will allow them to stop the fire in the North Fork Tuolumne River canyon. They'll let it burn up into that canyon and then stomp it in the canyon below town (at least that looks like the plan).
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mtnyoung
Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
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Aug 23, 2013 - 08:00pm PT
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Joe, your map postings are fantastic!
Can you post anything current from the northwest side of the fire (a little self-interest there)?
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mtnyoung
Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
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Aug 23, 2013 - 08:03pm PT
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ecflau, here's the latest about our roads:
"Tuolumne County, CA -- Unless you're a resident or members of the Rim Fire emergency response team you won't get into Tuolumne City. The advisory evacuations have expanded from the area known as Sherwood Forest to the east entrance of Twain Harte down Highway 108 to Willow Springs and Soulsbyville. Highway 108 is open to traffic.
That is not the case in Tuolumne City, Spokesperson Scott Johnson says, "The California Highway Patrol is manning road closures at all entrances into Tuolumne City unless you are a resident and can prove you are a resident."
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 23, 2013 - 08:03pm PT
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hey there say, khanom, strider, nita, and all...
matt called our dad this morning and he is safe with horse, in groveland now... not sure what is next, but this is good for now...
:)
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Strider
Trad climber
ಠ_ಠ
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Aug 23, 2013 - 08:10pm PT
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I am in SF right now and just finished setting up an ad-hoc network for the Evergreen server and computer equipment. Word came to us around 1pm that the Evergreen and Camp Mather are safe at this time with no loss is structures. The fire fighters were able to bump the fire around us. We are not completely out of the woods yet but this is the first official good news we have had so far. Camp Tawonga also escaped damage.
The bad news was the mandatory evacuation of Sunset Inn and Hardin Flat around 2 pm. They are now trying to focus efforts in the Tuolumne City direction as well as toward PML.
-n
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ecflau
Gym climber
CA
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Aug 23, 2013 - 08:11pm PT
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Thanks, all.
Best wishes to you guys that call that area home...
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monolith
climber
SF bay area
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Aug 23, 2013 - 08:17pm PT
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Here is the current west side.
The Tuolumne is Tuolumne City.
If you have google earth, go to:
http://activefiremaps.fs.fed.us/googleearth.php
Click Fire Detections(MODIS): Current
Then specify your Google Earth app when prompted. The map will update every 15 minutes.
Each time it updates it will zoom out, so place a marker to zoom back to.
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chappy
Social climber
ventura
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Aug 23, 2013 - 08:27pm PT
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Got an email this afternoon from Bill and Lauren that they would be evacuating Sunset Inn. My brother Matt and his horse Sharky made it out yesterday after two nights with Bill and Lauren. They were all allowed out west on 120 to Big Oak Flat. It looks like Sawmill Mnt got burnt and that the fire reached Matt's place on Sawmill Mnt Area Rd. Haven't heard of any structures lost there. Hopefully his place is OK.
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bergbryce
Mountain climber
California
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Aug 23, 2013 - 09:33pm PT
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Alpenglow Sports posted this....
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 23, 2013 - 09:35pm PT
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update 2 hours ago
The Southeast Blue Team assumed command of the Rim Fire on August 23 at 6:00 A.M. and will remain in unified command with CalFire. Approximately 4,500 structures are threatened. Fire continues to spread eastward. That's 2000 more homes at risk than this morning. I assume that reflects the new danger to the area south of 108
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dave729
Trad climber
Western America
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Aug 23, 2013 - 09:50pm PT
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Everyone with an eye for potential fire disasters has wondered
how those little villages along the Sonora Pass road could have
survived? The forest is thick, trees overhang most every building,
thick pine needle carpets on roofs. Defensible space is an alien concept.
Has their luck finally run out?
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wstmrnclmr
Trad climber
Bolinas, CA
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Aug 23, 2013 - 10:06pm PT
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Ron....Mother Nature seems to be taking care of it.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 23, 2013 - 10:15pm PT
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I've just spent 6 months managing a major wild land fuel clearance project. The goals are to slow the spread of fire, but more importantly to provide a fuel break that makes a safe space for the firefighters to work from. Incidentally it can also improve habitat diversity (which was one of our lesser goals)
We had three main approaches:
1) remove all brush at least 25 feet either side of the road.
2) Trim all tree branches as high as a power pole saw could reach: about 10 feet. Also from 25 to 50 feet either side
3) Remove all conifers (except redwoods) up to 8" diameter
4) Remove selected species of hardwoods up to 8", saving some. In my project we specifically saved about 1/2 the madrones, all the buckeye and about 1/2 of the "true oaks"
5) reduce or eliminate branches or trees that arch over the road. You can take away all the ladder fuel and still have a crown fire.
but you've got to maintain it. Another section we finished clearing nearly a year ago is now re-grown brush up to 3' high!
So now we're working on getting another grant for maintenance. We figure we'll have to re-work every bit of it every three years, 1/3 each year.
It's a huge and expensive effort. Even for my 2 miles.
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tom Carter
Social climber
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Aug 23, 2013 - 10:23pm PT
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Any updates on Bill and Lauren/Sunset Inn?
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climbski2
Mountain climber
Anchorage AK, Reno NV
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Aug 23, 2013 - 10:25pm PT
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That MAFFSs video is really something!
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dave729
Trad climber
Western America
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Aug 23, 2013 - 10:26pm PT
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I shouldn't joke but the people at Pinecrest Lake probably
don't even know there's forest fire coming because their air quality
always sucks like one is near by.
air quality rating: Hazardous PM2.5 >100.4 ?
http://www.deq.state.or.us/aqi/includes/aqi_FFscale.html
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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Aug 23, 2013 - 11:09pm PT
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I was in the meadows last week.
My thoughts on the drive both in and out through a completely fuel choked and unhealthy forest was that we've passed from the politically correct to the criminally negligent in the management of our forests.
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John M
climber
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Aug 23, 2013 - 11:26pm PT
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Thank you to everyone who is posting maps. My computer literacy is lacking so I appreciate what you are doing.
Here is a link to a video of the 1961 Harlow fire that burned from Stumpfield mountain in Mariposa county right up to Oakhurst. It burned 20,000 acres in 2 hours. It burned so fast that trees would be burnt on one side and green on the other. There are some incredible stories in the video.
http://firewisemaderacounty.org/the-1961-harlow-fire-mariposa-county/
I found it on another forum.
http://yosemitenews.info/forum/list.php?3
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monolith
climber
SF bay area
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Aug 23, 2013 - 11:52pm PT
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This seems like the easiest way to get fire maps: http://wildlandfire.maps.arcgis.com/home/
Click: Current U.S. Wildland Fires
Apparently the bay area has lost some electrical power due to the fire and has put out a warning.
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 24, 2013 - 03:45am PT
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hey there say, all... i can't get that link to work... apparently it takes
you to another link...
and well, dial up is just not doing anything tonight, just stuck,
everywhere and no links to any info are working, :(
night all..
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Aug 24, 2013 - 06:06am PT
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Compare these two maps, if you are unclear about the fire's exact location and the locations of places people have been mentioning. they are NOT ORIENTED in the same direction, but it's the best a mouse can do. neebee, here's a simple map for those with no intimate knowledge of the fire's area. It's made for tourism, to entice potential buyers.
Notice the three x marks. The orange x is Khanom's, Denise's ma lives up north from there in the cluster of streets, looking like what it is, a subdivision in the hills. Denise's house, which she no longer occupies, being occupied with the Rev, is in the furthest right group of streets on the south side of Ferretti Rd., before it intersects with Hwy 120 on the east end.
She and the Rev live on Manzanita Way, where the green x marks it.
Bill and Lauren and ANDY Nickell and the Sunset Inn B & B live at the small red x, approximately.
The fire's burning in the boxes at the top of this map, and it also is burning in the lands west of them and north of them and under the boxes on the right side, which is in YNP.
That help?
The small scales of the fire maps, compared to this size, are confusing if you don't have context. That is how Google Earth works.
This is brought to you by musmiddleearth.sage/wow-this-is-a-revoltin-development/all-fake.stfu
The Nickell's daughter, Amy, I believe her name is, having met her as an sdult only one time, lives on the north side just on Ferretti Rd., between Denise's house and 120, closer to Sunset Inn.
What slays me is that when the Rev and I visited Khanom's farm a couple of weeks ago, the next day we drove into Groveland from the east end of Ferretti Rd., where there is a VERY STEEP road leading down to a bridge on the river at a spot called Lumsden, a starting point for river trips, and it's, pardon, probably WAS a beauty of a place, with great fishing, too.
As we drove in along Ferretti, the view expanded when the road came near to the drop to the river and the northern Yosemite peaks, Conness and all, were RIGHT THERE IN FRONT OF US! I'd never been on that section of Ferretti after the turn-off to Lumsden, ever. I like to think I could go out there and take photos this winter, when the snow covers some of the damage, but it will be a sad, sad journey, I am sure...DANG!
I spent most of this afternoon out in the hills north of Merced and have pictures of the pyroculmulus cloud rising and collapsing and then rising again.
I'll be posting them up shortly on The Flames thread, in order to save this thread from invasion by mice. You guys have enough problems.
"I just said, 'Good luck.'"--Bob's 115th Dream
And that goe for you, neebee, with your internest problems, too.
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Aug 24, 2013 - 10:31am PT
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prolly called "rim" fire because the starting point was just about visible from that big view pullout on 120 called "rim of the world"
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Charlie D.
Trad climber
Western Slope, Tahoe Sierra
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Aug 24, 2013 - 12:03pm PT
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Another amazing image showing the scale of the Rim Fire in comparison to the American Fire:
Here's a picture of the American Fire plume north of our place in Camino, scary stuff:
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 24, 2013 - 12:35pm PT
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hey there say, mouse!!! mouse you are wonderful ... i been trying to do and see this myself, and i can't :(
no maps will load and if they do , they get stuck and i can't move them...
:(
this is exactly what i wanted and needed :)
thank you so very much... :)
will go back and take a longer look, now that i posted for you
to thank you, can you enlarge it just a tad? or will it not cover
all the 'so called bases' ... you could put the larger one
in THE FLAMES... then... I CAN see the 'x's okay though...
just wanted to see the printing of words better, but i will ]
zoom my browser, too...
god bless..
khanom, i did not backtrack yet, HOW are you and girlfriend doing there
with the ranch???
earlier, i had heard the sunset inn was still okay, is it
STILL okay now? and the evergreen, too??
(my brother matt's, place, as chappy mentioned, is questionable)
thanks all...
edit:
mouse, WHERE IS sawmill mt road , on that map??
is it shown??
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 24, 2013 - 12:47pm PT
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hey there say, mouse... i just did the click-to-enlarge on teh map,
and it worked...
:)
edit:
so from seeing this, then:
evergreen lodge, and sawmill mt
are UNDER the boxes and can't be seen?
RE-EDIT:
okay, WAIT.... I SEE evergreen and most likely the lodge area
on the edge of yosemite now, just UNDER one of the boxes...
and i see a VERY VERY blurry word, at the far WEST END of
old yosemite road, does THAT say sawmill rd?? or not???
can't see where else it runs to?? if it does...
edit:
so khanom, then, i was perhaps right the first time, when i thought
it was hidden by the boxes, on mouse's map...
i will try to find it and see how far it run...
thanks!
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 24, 2013 - 01:06pm PT
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hey there say, khanom... thank you so much for sharing...
say, where is THIS... sawmill mt...
i am just guessing, at this point...
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 24, 2013 - 01:26pm PT
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hey there say, khanom... GLAD you are safe and sound!! :)
say,
if matt has not left groveland, with his horse, for somewheres... you may just run into him...
check out nita's picture, again...
if you do, let him know i been 'with him in spirit' and praying, through all
this >:D< and send my love...
SAY folks not sure if these are even worth reading, if hype, if
good info, or what, etc... but:
i cannot read anything anywhere, :( and browser never work again, :(
even opera... :(
but the taco works, so i posting these here to see if it will work for me to read from here... if not, perhaps some of you can read them and put in quotes ANYTHING that is worthy and worth knowing as to fire info:
http://www.sanluisobispo.com/2013/08/24/2648144/despite-rim-fire-yosemite-valley.html
http://sanfrancisco.cbslocal.com/2013/08/23/rim-fire-rages-out-of-control-into-yosemite-100000-acres-burned/
http://www.montereyherald.com/ci_23928253/rim-fire-hits-yosemite-friday-and-explodes-one
well, i got to read two of them, but you know:
you ALL are providing much better, ;)
:)
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 24, 2013 - 02:55pm PT
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The MODIS fire map as of 20 minutes ago.
The red and orange squares are active within last 24 hours.
I've added Pins for Hardin Flat Rd and Sawmill Mt Rd.
Tuolumne City is just to the left of the picture.
108 crosses the top left corner
Hetch Hetchy dam is just at the campground symbol near the upper east front of the fire.
Camp Mather is at or near the campground symbol at the lower east front of the fire.
Pine Mt lake is the lake just at the left edge of the image, below center
Groveland is about 5 miles west of the fire just beyond the left side of image.
From the last Inciweb report, about 11:15
The very high potential for long range spotting however remains a significant concern for fire to advance beyond the retardant lines and allow for fire spread into the communities of Tuolumne City, Twain Harte and Long Barn.
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 24, 2013 - 03:17pm PT
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hey there say, high travere, wow, thank you...
got to go babysit now, the little boy is here...
:)
thank you all at supertopo, for sharing all you know,
and from the 'near front' lines, as to khanom and all...
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Aug 24, 2013 - 03:22pm PT
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the fire is now in position where it could run up two major drainages, north fork of the tuolumne and the clavey.
deep canyons like n fork can work like chimneys-- that was how this thing blew up so dramatically a few days back. one potential scenario is that n fork blows up-- then you can have spotting anywhere, which would suck resources away from folks out on the various lines as well as clustering air support.
fingers crossed here.
this site is now aggregating some of the useful links:
http://www.mtdiablocam.com/activefires.htm
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Aug 24, 2013 - 03:26pm PT
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if there was any doubt about the situation, here's a sign:
the wal-mart in sonora just closed.
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Aug 24, 2013 - 03:27pm PT
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That should help. It's from the DeLorme California Atlas & Gazeteer.
"Gazeteer long and hard, she's a naughty hottie."
Sawmill Mtn. Rd. is shown.
This is just awful. Horrendous. The shits. There are some pics showing on The Flames, but I need to go help the Simon Brothers deal with a dead battery, so I gotta split.
Enjoy. Everyone loves a good cry.
When I spoke on the phone a while ago with the Rev, he said yesterday was spent helping the Nickells move their cargo down to a house they've scored in Big Oak Flat. They're all fine, but the Inn is going down, the way this is looking.
I'm sure they rescued Lauren's chickens, somehow. Eggs Ackley how, I can only guess, but I'd consider BARBECUING THEM!
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Michelle
Social climber
1187 Hunterwasser
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Aug 24, 2013 - 03:50pm PT
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Having hiked and played all up and down these drainages, I concur, it's some steep shizznit. I'm at a loss for words and feel like my childhood home is burning down. The one you think, maybe, that you can return too. Some of the best days of my life have been spent lolling in the sun at the Clavey.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 24, 2013 - 03:54pm PT
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awww Michelle, must be tough seeing this all.
I've gotten two things out of this:
I'd never heard of the Clavey. And a greater appreciation for the fire risk in the canyon that falls away from my back deck.
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10b4me
Ice climber
Wishes-He-Was-In-Arizona
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Aug 24, 2013 - 03:57pm PT
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HT, the Clavey is a great kayaking stream, and I believe where Walt Shipley lost his life.
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Ward Trotter
Trad climber
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Aug 24, 2013 - 03:57pm PT
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Wow the beast is looking considerably improved since yesterday.
This may be due to ,wind shifts , slightly cooler night temps ,and fuel profile changes up slope( N andNE, )and the very hard work and successful work of firefighters in harms way.
The wind is expected to shift coming from the north. As I predicted up thread , the SE flank might make a run for those thick slopes in that direction. Good news there is that wind will be out the East after midnight and then back out of the SW Sunday.
See that's the problem with this beast are these frequent constant f*#king wind shifts. It's like being in a room with a power fan in every corner ,turning on and off sequentially
The wind must be already shifting out of NW . Note the heat-up on the southeast flank.
Lets hope when the wind shifts coming from the east after midnight that the western flank doesn't get heated up too bad.
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micronut
Trad climber
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Aug 24, 2013 - 04:04pm PT
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Hope things get knocked down soon. And 10, I think Walt Shipley died in one of the big hydraulics on Dinkey Creek, up out of Fresno/Shaver.
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 24, 2013 - 05:50pm PT
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hey there say, all...
very sad to hear this... as to the sunset inn of the nickles (nichols) not sure, i saw it spelled both ways...
thankful to god that folks helped them move out, i think?? i had hear that they had critters already or in process of evacuated, the other day, but
NOT completely sure, as i heard that from someone else... not from me talking to someone...
say, one of these links, forgot which one, ALSO showed a very good but small map...
am babysitting, will check in later, but still praying...
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10b4me
Ice climber
Wishes-He-Was-In-Arizona
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Aug 24, 2013 - 06:54pm PT
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thanks micronut, and Cragman
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Michelle
Social climber
1187 Hunterwasser
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Aug 24, 2013 - 07:51pm PT
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It would eat Tuolumne City alive! Used to be a crazy dump but is actually a neat town. my mom owned the hair shop in town for many years. Let's hope it doesn't get to that point. Sending vibes to my wildland friends for safety. And less crazy wind.
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Aug 24, 2013 - 08:51pm PT
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just got back from the community meeting with fire officials at miwuk.
they seemed really confident about the southwest-- pml and groveland. it's his job to project confidence and hope, but i don't think it was bluster.
west side on the 108 corridor there wasn't anything not already known to anyone following on the scanner and hotlist. crews down in the canyon are building a line from paper cabin to duckwall mountain in hope of turning it away from the north fork canyon and towards the clavey. they hope to have the line finished tomorrow.
if it jumps that line, the contingency line is on the canyon rim along the south edge of tuolumne city. they've painted the sh#t out of that rim and have stacks of resources. but if it jumps the pc-dw line, it would prolly run as far as conditions permit and we're f*#ked
this is basically conditions dependent-- if it goes nuclear like it did a few days ago, in similar terrain, it could run until it wants a beer and a sandwich. some of the forecasts suggest monsoon moving in tuesday-- if we could move that up a day, and then get through tomorrow, we can all start breathing easier.
best news i had all day was the temp-- i went up to p-crest and up aways toward dodge and then back down to twain harte. everywhere i went today the temps were about 10 degrees less than i'd expect this time of year, and no big convection columns.
the net is getting touchy, so you'll either have to terrain map for the images or maybe someone else can post the location maps.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 24, 2013 - 08:56pm PT
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Some good news for PML and Buck Meadows.
Evacuation Advisories Lifted for Pine Mountain Lake and Buck Meadows
Release for Saturday, August 24, 2013/Time: 2:00 PM
Evacuated residents from Highway 120 east to Buck Meadows and residents of Pine Mountain Lake, with exception of Graham Ranch Road beyond the cattle guard, will be allowed to return to their homes beginning on Saturday, August 24, 2013 at 6:00 P.M. Residents along Graham Ranch Road, beyond the cattle guard, can expect to return as soon as fire conditions allow. Only residents and those that can prove they have legitimate business in the area will be allowed in. Pacific Gas and Electric has restored electrical service to all areas of Pine Mountain Lake impacted by the Rim Fire, with the exception of residences along Graham Ranch Road beyond the cattle guard.
Which means they will/are shifting resources to more needed areas.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 24, 2013 - 09:09pm PT
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5:45 PM today MODIS update
I've added a few pins for those who aren't familiar with the area.
Orange and Red have been active in the past 24 hours.
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 24, 2013 - 11:06pm PT
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hey there say, khanom... as to this:
Neebee, I ran into Matt at Mountain Sage. He's optimistic about his cabin.
thank you soooo much, for sharing this...
:) means a lot, just to know you seen him...
we are hoping the best for his cabin... :)
just a tiny one, but it's his home... :)
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Dr.Sprock
Boulder climber
I'm James Brown, Bi-atch!
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Aug 24, 2013 - 11:47pm PT
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spooky lookin pic dave,
looks like a frickin wildfire tsunami coming over the ridge,
lots of insects and reptiles lost, squirrels are pretty quick,
bet there are stampedes of deer and bear trying to flee,
trees are in bad shape, bark beetles and warmer climate,
only good thing about clear cuts is they might help a bit in situations like this,
bad fire around the north merced a few years back will help out in that area,
backburn from Briceburg? sheesh! they must be getting desperate,
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Ward Trotter
Trad climber
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Aug 25, 2013 - 01:50am PT
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The latest MODIS is indicative of winds out of the north and northwest. The SE and ESE flank is openin up.
After Midnight the wind shifts from out of the east. This may not be good for the western flank near Groveland. Good news is that eastern winds won't last long.
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Aug 25, 2013 - 08:59am PT
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Looks to be moving south by the direction of this ground plume.
Taken at 5:52 a.m. this morning by Brian B. Prompt.
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Aug 25, 2013 - 11:31am PT
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SF is a classy town and they need to think they are drinking a classy glass of water.
Evian I know that.
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de La Playa
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Aug 25, 2013 - 12:22pm PT
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water ya thinkin', sayin' sumthin like that?
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Brandon-
climber
The Granite State.
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Aug 25, 2013 - 02:11pm PT
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Hahaha.
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Aug 25, 2013 - 02:26pm PT
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Well, pilgrim, it's what Hollywood drinks on the set;
ya know--that water from Sierra Eastside and the Big O.
And they have North Hollywood, like Castro in SF, ya bet;
but they have a long ways yet to go, to catch a fart in ol' Frisco.
ANY NEWS ON THE FIRE?
Do they need some Evian on the lines?
"And ZB,, Huh?"
Give it time, Ron, and his message might sink in. Don't want to drain your mental battery so fast. read my grin
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abrams
Sport climber
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Aug 25, 2013 - 02:28pm PT
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Crystal blue perfect skies south west of the fire.
I'm sure this sort of pollution is breaking dozens of federal and state laws.
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Brandon-
climber
The Granite State.
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Aug 25, 2013 - 02:46pm PT
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Really, WBC said that?
I'm not into hating, but those people push me right up to the edge with their words and actions.
Positive thoughts beamed out for those affected.
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 25, 2013 - 03:34pm PT
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hey there say, khanom...
oh my, as to this, yeah, you don't really realize in these terms:
Everyone in Greeley we've talked to is super paranoid about the southern expansion down Pilot Ridge. Many were here in 1987 and know to remain on alert. Things can change very rapidly... and you know, I didn't put this together until just now -- at it's peak the fire was moving 3 miles an hour.
In that worst-case scenario we'd have like 2-3 hours
and even then, it could start a 'race' and kick it up a bit :O
wish it desired overnight parking, as its 'engine dies', and folks
can enjoy a huge victory for all these dangerous, loyal work and faithfully had gut-wrenching perseverance...
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Jelf
climber
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Aug 25, 2013 - 04:02pm PT
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Rim fire - Online map showing most recent perimeter and wind data
The following link will always display the most perimeter of the Rim Fire straight from the GeoMAC server. This is the same server that also provides data to the crews on the fire line. Sometimes the data on the InciWeb site is not as current as the data that comes from the GeoMAC server. (The InciWeb site gets its data from GeoMAC.)
The map also shows wind speed and direction. Note that the wind data is always 3 hours old.
For more information regarding this map, you can follow the “About” link in the upper left corner of the map.
http://www.mappingsupport.com/p/fires/2013_rim_fire_map.html
Joseph Elfelt, the Gmap4 guy
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 25, 2013 - 04:09pm PT
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5:45 PM yesterday (top image) compared to 12:45 PM today
Yellow hasn't burned in more than 24 hours.
A lot less burning on the NW towards 108, A big move east past Mather Camp into Yosemite and a small move SE towards the Big Oak Flat park entrance,
Generally holding to the West, North, South and NE.
Not much movement along Pilot Ridge.
Lack of roads in the Yosemite area will greatly reduce crew access. But then there are few (no) structures to protect.
They spent all yesterday doing fire lines and back burns between the fire and Tuolumne City. That, and the wind direction seem to have made a big difference. To the NE, there is much less fuel load where the land rises to the granite domes.
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Darwin
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Aug 25, 2013 - 04:55pm PT
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This is well away from Chapman's, right?
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chappy
Social climber
ventura
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Aug 25, 2013 - 05:21pm PT
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Darwin,
What I have heard about my brother Matt's place on Sawmill Mnt Rd is that the fire burned through there but they saved the structures.
Chappy
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de La Playa
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Aug 25, 2013 - 05:22pm PT
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uh huh, uh huh - I like it. That's the way.
Run and get a bucket get the baby some water.
Apparently they finally found a good use for that plane they pulled out of Lower Merced Pass Lake. Glad to see that all that failed drug dealing has benefitted the real world.
[Click to View YouTube Video]
Kidding aside, this is some serious sheeit. Wish I could help someway.
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dave729
Trad climber
Western America
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Aug 25, 2013 - 05:36pm PT
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Anyone know what the real formula for that red fire retardant dust is?
Google says its ammonium phosphate which is what? An explosive? No.
Says fertilizer. Not flammable but irritating to people exposed.
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snowhazed
Trad climber
Oaksterdam, CA
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Aug 25, 2013 - 05:53pm PT
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This is around 8 PM on 8/24 flying home to SF. I had been off the grid and hadn't heard a thing. Quite an intro
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Aug 25, 2013 - 06:02pm PT
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Ron, you ever been creamed by retardant?
That shyt is death on paint, apparently.
We got plastered once on the Chowchilla River in '66 and the driver had me man the hose to clean it RIGHT NOW before it dried.
We also hit the District Ranger's green unit.
Pumper's the best gig going on a line, in my aged opinion.
I hated crawling through manzanita and PO in the dark because you had a lamp, but you couldn't avoid being poisoned. Not to mention sharp, pointy dead branches.
Thank Jesus for hard hats, too.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 25, 2013 - 06:18pm PT
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That NASTY old Borate stuff is no longer used
Borate salts used in the past to fight wildfires have been found to sterilize the soil and be toxic to animals so are now prohibited.[18] Newer retardants use ammonium sulfate or ammonium polyphosphate with attapulgite clay thickener or diammonium phosphate with a guar gum derivative thickener. These are not only less toxic but act as fertilizers to help the regrowth of plants after the fire. Fire retardants often contain wetting agents, preservatives and rust inhibitors and are colored red with ferric oxide or fugitive color to mark where they have been dropped. Brand names of fire retardants for aerial application include Fire-Trol and Phos-Chek. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aerial_firefighting
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 25, 2013 - 07:28pm PT
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hey there say, khanom.... oh, so good to hear this! say, perhaps keep a few things, though, ready... just in case...
wow, mark, i was so happy when dad called and let me know that, ...
was relieved through matt's adventure coming safely to somewhere,and the cabin being well, tops it off...
praying and hoping for many others now, too...
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Ward Trotter
Trad climber
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Aug 25, 2013 - 07:44pm PT
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Some of these crews have gone way past recommended times on the line, but in dire circumstances, they will drop the safety requirements back some to accommodate needs. So if you see some fireman that seem to be draggin azz, its because they truly are beat. You get to a point where you just act on auto pilot. May the FORCE be with them...
K,, not to be a pain,, but that ISNT the worst case scenario by a long shot. This is still a big and very capable beast. If it gets wind driven you may not have an hour. Stay on yur toes..
Two great points Ron.
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Aug 25, 2013 - 08:09pm PT
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khanom, yr source wasn't far offbase: dogville getting ev'd.
A Mandatory Evacuation has been issued for residences north of Old Yosemite Road (Forest Road 2S01).
An Evacuation Warning has been issued for all residences north of Bull Creek Road (Forest Road 2S02), Bondurant Mine Road, Texas Hill Road, and Wampum Hill. The Mandatory Evacuation and Evacuation Warning has been issued by the Mariposa County Sheriff’s Office. For more information please contact the Mariposa County Sheriff’s Office at: 209-966-5325.
as per inciweb
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the albatross
Gym climber
Flagstaff
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Aug 25, 2013 - 08:54pm PT
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This is one of the tools that firefighters use on wildland fire. If there is a water source nearby these beasts are very handy, particularly for structure protection. They deliver up to 1200 gallons or more per drop.
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lostinshanghai
Social climber
someplace
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Aug 25, 2013 - 09:33pm PT
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Go to Rim Fire last update from command central shows maps as of 09 00 am Aug 25
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JOEY.F
Gym climber
It's not rocket surgery
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Aug 25, 2013 - 10:08pm PT
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Following along and wishing the best to Erik and the rest of the people in the area. I wonder how the non humans are doing.
Edit below,
Thanks SteveW
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Ward Trotter
Trad climber
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Aug 25, 2013 - 10:27pm PT
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The recent winds out of the north has gotten the SE cooking. The winds have shifted back to the SW, which is probably somewhat good news, in the overall scheme of things-- it will have the effect of pushing the fire in a direction , NE, where the fuel profile is scarcer. But it will also inflame the due north areas , which will be a replay of a few days ago. At least now firefighters and residents have had time to regroup there.
Terrible thing about the SE flank is the abundance of primo fuel.
Be a shame if more sequoias get nailed.
Hope the wind doesn't shift to the north anytime soon
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SteveW
Trad climber
The state of confusion
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Aug 25, 2013 - 10:39pm PT
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Joey
Usually the animals just move out of the fire's way.
In some cases they'll get caught just like the Arizona hotshots
did, but research from the Yellowstone fires of 1988 showed
most animals survived without any issues.
Hoping that they get this thing under control (or rain or snow
falls soon)!
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 25, 2013 - 10:46pm PT
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it's rushing the papercabin-duckwall line Another new one for me. Roughly where is that?
The advantage of the SW winds is it will help keep the fire away from Greeley hill etc.
To the NE the fire's running up onto the granite where the fuel is much less dense.
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bob
climber
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Aug 25, 2013 - 10:58pm PT
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Here is a pic from Sherlock Rd, just off of Whitlock near Midpines. Whoa
This evening around 6:30
Bob Jensen
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Aug 25, 2013 - 11:10pm PT
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Another new one for me. Roughly where is that?
it's the line they set in the canyon below tuolumne city in hopes of turning it back toward the clavey. if it breaks that line the contingency line is basically 108, and that means a whole lot of stuff up in smoke. seriously, if it jumps that line, then pondo hills and possibly everything up to miwuk are gonna get hard evacs.
sounds like they got heliloads dumped on the saddle down on paper cabin ridge, and its calmed down.
props to the folks who are spending the night on the dozer line down there in hell as that smoke plume falls back.
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SalNichols
Big Wall climber
Richmond, CA
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Aug 25, 2013 - 11:26pm PT
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The scale of this thing is mind boggling, and the tools used to fight it seem almost inconsequential. How much area does 1200 gal of retardant cover anyway?
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nita
Social climber
chica de chico, I don't claim to be a daisy.
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Aug 26, 2013 - 12:13am PT
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An old friend that i used to work with in the Meadows, took this video of a DC 10 dropping the orange right over his place in Tuolumne co.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0HS05Bw7rR0
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mtnyoung
Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
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Aug 26, 2013 - 12:13am PT
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We've now adopted a fire crew and truck from San Diego. They're here doing reconnaissance and playing deep backup to the main lines. They pulled into the big driveway of out-of-towner's second home to sleep for the night.
Nice Guys. One of them is a serious climber. We gave them showers and birthday cake.
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Mtbphoto
Trad climber
Mammoth Lakes, Ca
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Aug 26, 2013 - 12:33am PT
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Drove over Sonora Pass this evening. Never been over it before, but it was a ghost town, no surprise though. The smoke got so bad we were coughing with all the windows rolled up in the car.
Saw about 20 firetrucks including 5 or so trailers with bulldozer on them. Also lots of "Thanks Firefighters" signs which I am sure are much appreciated.
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Tobia
Social climber
Denial
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Aug 26, 2013 - 06:59am PT
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Erik,
Best of luck to you; prayers sent. I know you have worked hard to get that place established.
Certainly some kind tacoians will offer you a safe haven; just don't wait too long to get out.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 26, 2013 - 10:41am PT
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Yesterday afternoon 5:30 PM PDT
This morning, 0715 PDT. 14 hours later
It's gobbling up the hills on the south bank of Hetch Hetchy. Has obviously jumped the road there.
Moving east of Mather Camp in the Park in a big way.
Right up to 120 and the Park boundary outside the Big Oak Flat entrance.
More movement up Pilot Ridge and NE towards Hell's Mt. Looks as if there was major spotting up there.
Great thing about Yosemite is there are so few back roads. All wilderness. Great until you have to fight a fire. No way to get enough men/women in there for effective backfires. Which aren't much use in heavy timber anyway. So it's up to hotshot crews, where it's safe, (let's not forget Arizona a few weeks ago) and the aerial attack. But also very few structures to have to protect.
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nita
Social climber
chica de chico, I don't claim to be a daisy.
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Aug 26, 2013 - 12:17pm PT
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From my friend in Twain Harte...sorry if this is a repost.
Remember - BBQ for the firefighters. The BBQ is in the parking lot of Coldwell Banker Realty at 5:30 this evening. If you want to help or bring food you can call Danelle Rodgers at 743-4226.
https://www.facebook.com/thankyourimfirefirefighters
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Aug 26, 2013 - 12:21pm PT
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Sunset In 'n' Out Burgers.
Lookin' to the future with the Cooking Channel's Lauren Nickell.
"Everybody got some change comin' sometime. I gave you TEN dollars, Bill."--TM Herbert just weeks after his sex change next year (what a bitch)
If I were to predict serious sh#t, it would happen. Seriously.
Best of the future, Bill, Lauren, Andy.
Count yer blessings (I'm sure you must)
And count yer chickens (boom or bust).
That BOOM! is the sound of those large pines in back.
Paint It Black.
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10b4me
Ice climber
Wishes-He-Was-In-Arizona
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Aug 26, 2013 - 12:25pm PT
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Let's hope the wind does not come straight out of the west
Seems like Hetch Hetchy will serve as a barrier.
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Adamame
climber
Santa Cruz
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Aug 26, 2013 - 12:41pm PT
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The fire has already moved past Hetch Hetchy.
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Greg Barnes
climber
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Aug 26, 2013 - 12:49pm PT
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Tuolumne, yesterday about 2pm:
The view from the base of East Cottage dome about 3pm:
Close up:
Crystal clear - for yesterday at least!
Still pretty much smoke-free past Glen Aulin:
The view from 120 near White Wolf around 7pm:
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 26, 2013 - 01:08pm PT
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^^^^^^ dyamn!!!
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Aug 26, 2013 - 01:20pm PT
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Good pics, bro!
Happy you got to enjoy the mountain air, too.
From KQED, the home of raider scum. Trash-talking, you bet.
Same peaceful spot in May, FWIW; the big long sunset-viewing turnout above Wawona Tunnel.
It won't get burned again. Or will it?
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Aug 26, 2013 - 01:34pm PT
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Let's hope the wind does not come straight out of the west
actually, if there's gonna be wind, everyone is hoping it does come out of the west. any other direction and there's gonna be major residential and commercial destruction and probably folks dyin.
better to hope for no ambient winds and a whole lot of monsoon moisture but w/o the lightning.
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Aug 26, 2013 - 01:49pm PT
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This was in May.
Kiss it goodbye.
Edit: I just got off the phone with the Rev, who has no computer, so he hadn't heard the news about Berkeley Camp.
His words: "Holy shit!" As I posted earlier, the Nickells are fine; daughter Amy has moved back to her place on Ferretti Road for a couple of days now. Denise's and her mom's are fine, according to the Rev if Amy has been allowed back to the same neighborhood about a mile or so distant.
He has promised to call and let me know any news he hears from now on.
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lostinshanghai
Social climber
someplace
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Aug 26, 2013 - 04:47pm PT
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Khanom
Great post. The CC [Central Command] would like the people to go to that site for information. They have been having problems with everyone on Facebook, twitter and calling in since it is screwing up [overloading] their communications. People getting wrong info and spreading incorrect information. They had one guy call in from the UK and asked if his daughter who lived in Modesto is OK. So they are trying to get the word out go to their site that you just posted and will get correct info. That is one.
Nice job
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 26, 2013 - 04:54pm PT
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hey there say, timid... sad to hear that... will and am, still praying...
and a hey there, out to khanom...
say, mouse... thanks for the updates... and prayers,for all of them...
i keep checking in and hoping for better news, :(
wow, it (fire) is like 'looking for any and all' ways to 'feed itself'
bad bad... :(
dear god, please just let up 'up and fall over' like a dead bug...
and go no more... oh my...
nita, wonderful to hear a post to give out info for helping the firemen...
you are always so refreshing and how much more so, in the midst of this fire...
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lostinshanghai
Social climber
someplace
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Aug 26, 2013 - 05:10pm PT
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Khanom
Problem is people are people and they panic. They have their act together and will be there and tell people to leave or not to leave. People are giving out incorrect info on the web. It is also tying up communications because they cannot get through fast enough. Like everyone is on the phone, when they had the earthquake in Northridge phones went down because everyone was on them. They need to get access so they can reverse 911 to call you. In some cases they can not get through.
Here is yesterdays
Believe me they will give plenty of time to tell you in person when to leave or not to leave.
Let the professional people do what they are there for.
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 26, 2013 - 05:16pm PT
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hey there say, feralfae... wow, i DID SEE THIS message from you... just now...
i was babysitting so just dropped in fast here to 'post and run'
:)
already posted, that he got out, with help from good friends...
:)
as to this:
Neebs, I'll email you in a while when I get back from coffee and breakfast with friends from Sweden, who are cycling through today on their way to Kamloops.
hope to hear from you soon.... god blesss...
GREG, thank you for the photos here... sure wish they were REAL rain clouds and not fire clouds, :(
once again, too, mouse, i am rooting for your friends...
say, if you know the nickels, well, THANK them for taking care of matt, when they did, and i hope all will be well for them...
all for now...
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John M
climber
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Aug 26, 2013 - 05:16pm PT
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Believe me they will give plenty of time to tell you in person when to leave or not to leave.
not certain that I would believe that, especially if a you say, they can't get through on reverse 911.
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lostinshanghai
Social climber
someplace
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Aug 26, 2013 - 05:18pm PT
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On their web site
“Due to high demand, this Web site may become unresponsive. We are working to address these issues. Thank you for your patience.”
INCIDENT UPDATED 54 MIN. AGO
So you can see where the problem is, I agree that you want information and I say that their will be someone with a crew there if the case comes to it.
And yes Central Command told the news that very thing this morning on the radio so listen to 92.7 as well.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 26, 2013 - 05:36pm PT
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“Due to high demand, this Web site may become unresponsive. We are working to address these issues. Thank you for your patience.” Unfortunately that message has been at the top of the website for MONTHS (as long as I've been using it)
So it's pretty hard to say what it really means.
The "last updated" time always makes sense when I check the page.
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Aug 26, 2013 - 05:37pm PT
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Jay and Khanom, thanks for the mappage, there.
The current map shows the fire's almost on Bill's doorstep. The black x between the "a" and "n" in Branch III is the location, before their section of Hardin Flat Road gets to Crocker Meadow or Rush Creek.
I see little hope, unless the fact there's a large meadow there for staging at the Inn, not to mention a turnaround for large equipment, can help out the crews.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 26, 2013 - 05:49pm PT
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Since this morning all the activity seems to be on the SE side. Moving quickly towards White Wolf
Also growing SE just N of the Big Oak Flat entrance. A spot fire on Crocker Ridge.
Not much growth on the other fronts where they can get equipment and boots on the ground and use backfires to contain it.
Odd that it's moving SE with a SW wind. I suppose it's being driven by topography, up the Tuolumne River basin.
MODIS update 30 minutes ago
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 26, 2013 - 05:54pm PT
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mouse
unfortunately it looks as if west section of Hardin Flat Rd got toasted end to end yesterday and Saturday. And there's still a lot of burning along it.
The fire crews are of course doing everything they safely can to protect property.
Good luck to your friends.
EDIT: that would be the west section of Hardin Flat Rd. East section not so bad, yet.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 26, 2013 - 05:58pm PT
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Hardin Flat road area.
Remember yellow squares haven't burned in last 24 hours.
Also, the squares are really giant PIXELS centered at the dot. No way to tell what's going in inside a square. After all the MODIS satellite is 705 Km above.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 26, 2013 - 06:06pm PT
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Big Oak Flat entrance.
So far, nothing near Tuolumne or Merced groves.
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lostinshanghai
Social climber
someplace
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Aug 26, 2013 - 06:07pm PT
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Mouse
Just called them, left a message hope they are OK. My truck is packed and ready to go was go to use it on my property but safe since I have the whole state and some across the street. As for Bill for me to get in there would have to go through Mariposa; have foam that will help out for their ground and that will help and as for their structures a little tricky for the fire retardant it lasts for 24 hours and needs to be applied at the right time.
Still checking
By the way for the best source of news are these guys, thought about spraying them, better news crews coming in now.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 26, 2013 - 06:20pm PT
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As for how often they update the Inciweb site. The managers on the ground have plenty to do assimilating incoming information and directing the fire crews and air resources.
They have direct contact with county Sheriff, CHP, county emergency services, etc. Also very likely the local CERT teams. That's how they'll get out the info when people need to evacuate. On the ground, door to door.
The Inciweb site is really for the press and us bystanders.
The MODIS satellite info is a major source of info for them.
There is also, on site, a Fire Behaviorilist. This person is usually an experienced wild land fire fighter with specialized training in fire behavior. They work out their fire forecasts from MODIS, weather, fuel moisture, vegetation type, soil type, creeks, ponds, etc. They use modeling software. They give up to the minute forecasts to the Incident Commander. (A neighbor did this on the big Croy fire behind Gilroy about 10 years ago. He felt that the results he got from the models were largely accurate and invaluable)
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ontheedgeandscaredtodeath
Social climber
SLO, Ca
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Aug 26, 2013 - 06:20pm PT
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khanom,
I agree that you should look out for yourself. Dunno if the fire is threatening your place, but, if it is, this is what I would do: Keep everything as wet / moist as possible, especially the roof and eaves of your house-- embers getting sucked up from the column and thrown from the main fire landing in fruitful ground is how big fires get bigger. Fires throw fire out in front and then draw towards the new heat. Or, they also back into good fuel. In any event, there is a lot you can do.
I know from your posting that you have some sort of farm?? It's unlikely that you would have to evacuate because of any real danger to yourselves, as opposed to being evacuated en masse because you live where you live.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 26, 2013 - 06:25pm PT
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I'm sure khanom knows exactly what to do and when to do it.
The uncertainty of the fire behavior would wear on anyone's nerves after this length of time.
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lostinshanghai
Social climber
someplace
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Aug 26, 2013 - 06:30pm PT
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That was a joke guess you do not look at my posts sometimes. Spraying them with what?
Stay safe, problem in the morning people not wearing masks all the hospitals here are filled no room because of the smoke. Moisture dew plus smoke for the lungs is good for you.
That is a joke. Take it serious a few years from now people will have some issues.
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ontheedgeandscaredtodeath
Social climber
SLO, Ca
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Aug 26, 2013 - 06:31pm PT
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Fire behavior is pretty predictable . This fire will make big runs until monsoonal moisture arrives. It's just weather at this point.
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Aug 26, 2013 - 06:32pm PT
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yeah, all of the maps run behind depending on sat passes and the different kinds of software.
you can listen to the scanners if yr trying to stay current. if it really blows up, the hotlist threads will prolly have more timely stuff, although some of it will be wrong.
you can get a sense of what the convection is doing from some of the webcams.
plume-dominated fires are notoriously unpredictable, and this one is an especially spectacular one in really bad terrain. anyone offering firm predictions on anything is a fool.
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WBraun
climber
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Aug 26, 2013 - 06:40pm PT
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anyone offering firm predictions on anything is a fool.
I firmly 100% predict the fire will still be burning tomorrow ........
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John M
climber
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Aug 26, 2013 - 06:44pm PT
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Lost.. Khanom is right in the middle of it. He is concerned about his property and life. And his neighbors and friends. And has been for days now. So perhaps you could understand if he missed your very slim joke.
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Aug 26, 2013 - 07:10pm PT
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I firmly 100% predict the fire will still be burning tomorrow ........
heh
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lostinshanghai
Social climber
someplace
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Aug 26, 2013 - 08:08pm PT
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Last I heard fire is heading north. Most likely from winds from the south pouring down rain to the East. That means I just heard. People that are in the area [spotters].
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Aug 26, 2013 - 08:34pm PT
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http://www.jta.org/2013/08/26/news-opinion/united-states/yosemite-rim-fire-reaches-jewish-summer-camp
I was kinda hoping that the oak that dropped its limb on the counselor would get burned, but that's even stupider than the bickering here.
UNITED, Guys.
Too much stress, that's the truth, Jeequues B. Bombed.
Khanom, L.I.S. is a hyper-sensitive guy, only trying to help relieve our woes. Give each other a hug and let's just stay on alert.
I've accepted the loss of the Inn. I knew it was gone in my bones this morning.
For all the guys here who've given good dope, maps, and encouragement to both us sideliners and the heaviest losers, thank you, God bless you, too.
I'm not done grieving, there'll be time later on for that.
My load's not nearly what that of Lauren's (and many others) must be. She might surprise me, though, she's an unflappable personality, resourceful, and savvy--and she's been through all this before, except for the ending, of course.
So...best of luck with the new cooking show, gal.
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lostinshanghai
Social climber
someplace
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Aug 26, 2013 - 09:11pm PT
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Khanom
Sorry for not cutting you some slack. Thursday I was in Sacramento and girlfriend called saying about Tuolumne going to be evacuated and was not concerned just then until she called back 10 minutes later and updated info then left got to my studio and loaded my truck with a machine that is usually not for putting out fires but a few modifications can save a couple of structures mostly mine. So I can understand your concerns. I was going to stay even though we were in evacuation mode for 48 hours.
A lot of things to think about that’s for sure. What about your goods or personal property in your house, do you leave the lights on, lock or unlock the doors, what about drifters stealing your most valuable things that you could not stuff into the car. Insurance or none?
We were lucky. Gov. Brown sure had his s&it together and we got it. No National Guards but would have been next if we had to go. Have noticed all the druggies and homeless packed up and gone. But they will be back soon.
Taking a guess a few hundred sheriffs and Highway Patrol. Then for the fire fighters coming and going, sleeping and eating around 1,500.
Tuolumne is in lock down well only to the people who live here; we can move and do what we do every day. The casino is helping out so I can imagine how they feel with no ding, ding going on. Business’s all around the corridor is stopped and can imagine all theirs woes as well.
Anyway sorry for the snap just wish that storm to the east could move its way west.
Reason they picked our town is because easiest to the fires or they pretty much know. Then again things always change.
There are three other maps that fire guys look at posted one will try to blow up opps make larger.
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nita
Social climber
chica de chico, I don't claim to be a daisy.
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Aug 26, 2013 - 09:16pm PT
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Mouse, Is the above news a fact?..Is that what Mathis told you?
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 26, 2013 - 09:17pm PT
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Conrad's brother Steve and sister Denise run Priest Station. It's been in the family for at least 3 generations.
Now more than ever, this is a great place to eat on way to/from Yosemite.
I'll definitely stop in Groveland proper more often.
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 26, 2013 - 09:42pm PT
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hey there say, mouse, sorry to hear that, as nita wonders, so do i...
is it really gone, the inn?? how is the family, may they stay safe...
:(
also, khanom... i did not realize the FULL punch of loss of business, as to this crucial time frame... i only knew the tail-end, :O ...
wish i could help, later, when folks need it... will think ahead, and keep praying...
rigth now, please know, you are in my prayers...
hopeing your ranch will make it...
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Aug 26, 2013 - 09:46pm PT
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No, nita, honey.
the Lost Mouse knows how to read maps. I see very poorly the small letters, so I just looked at section lines. One runs down to the label Branch III on the map from yesterday that the Lost Vet in Tuolumne posted, and I compared that to the one from today that Khanom posted, or I think that was the one.
"Too many Silvas," they say in the Portuguese community here.
In our little campfire of watchers and waiters and players, there is a plethora of maps and unless you are used to seeing them it is a bit confusing, especially when a Mouse feels his age by being a little blind.
Keep smilin', you two. I'm cryin' inside, fer sure.
I been knowing (as they say in the redneck comminity here) the Nickells since the mid-seventies, just before the plane ditched in the high country with the weed cargo.
Like you two, there are memories involving me, my daughter, numerous friends and adventures and many-many Budweisers.
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Aug 26, 2013 - 09:49pm PT
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neebee, :)
It's all right Ma, I'm only bleedin'.
Short memories around here.
The Ferguson Slide last decade on 140 devastated the Mariposa economy.
At least the Mariposans are reaping the grain the folks on 120 were expecting from tourons.
It's not Tuolumne County South, however.
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Aug 26, 2013 - 09:58pm PT
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it looks like duckwall held today--
really good news on the t city flank.
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John M
climber
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Aug 26, 2013 - 10:01pm PT
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Just because it burned through that area doesn't mean the inn burned. The Tuolumne Family camp burned because the fire crowned when it passed the camp , and the camp was overgrown. The firefighters couldn't stop it because it burned at 2 Am, so no aircraft support.
If they were able to douse that area around the inn with fire retardant, then it could still be okay.
Inciweb says that as of 8 Am this morning that 24 structures have been lost to date, but I believe that includes outbuidlings. Its hard to know if that includes Tuolumne Family camp, or what that really means.
Here is a webpage with a video of the family camp.
http://wawonanews.com
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John M
climber
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Aug 26, 2013 - 10:04pm PT
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uolumne is in lock down well only to the people who live here; we can move and do what we do every day. The casino is helping out so I can imagine how they feel with no ding, ding going on. Business’s all around the corridor is stopped and can imagine all theirs woes as well.
Lost.. Sounds like you are in Tuolumne city. I hope that they can stop the fire before it gets to you.
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nita
Social climber
chica de chico, I don't claim to be a daisy.
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Aug 26, 2013 - 10:06pm PT
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Mouse, We haven't heard contrary so will still be pulling for them and remain optimistic. The trees may burn but the fire fighters will do everything they can to save their place.
that's our hopes and we're stickin' to them.
Edit:TMJessie, did you see the video that Bob Newton( aka, Slow Bob ) put up with the spotter plane & DC10. here it is if you missed it. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0HS05Bw7rR0
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 26, 2013 - 10:31pm PT
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hey there say, nita... i will keep my hopes with you, then...
>:D<
say, as to ONE camp, mentioned, earlier, but wayyy back, in the evacuation
notices:
when we were kids, our folks took us to san jose family camp...
as you can see, we NEVER FORGOT the love of the greatoutdoors...
hope that ALL the camps will someday be 'well again'...
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Risk
Mountain climber
Olympia, WA
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Aug 26, 2013 - 10:39pm PT
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A little while ago I received a text that the fire was within 5 miles of Twain Harte.
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murcy
Gym climber
sanfrancisco
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Aug 26, 2013 - 10:45pm PT
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[My quick estimates of the distance removed...]
Like a lot of us, I'm following closely and thinking about khanom and others in the heat of it.
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dave729
Trad climber
Western America
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Aug 26, 2013 - 10:58pm PT
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I get a bad feeling about this.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 26, 2013 - 11:07pm PT
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My annotated MODIS fire map as of 1945 today (15 mins ago)
Not much advance in any direction.
Those firefighters must be damned near exhausted and in for another long night when the aerial attack is off.
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Aug 26, 2013 - 11:18pm PT
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Thanks, nita. I needed that big-time.
Think Hank Stamper.
"Never give a inch."--Ken Kesey
neebee, can you glom on to that ABC news link?
It reported Camp Tawonga and San Jose Camp were spared, while Berkeley Camp is flattened.
I hope the Rev's Camp Runamucka will not be threatened. You've seen the photos of how much growth he's gotten cleared.
Smart man, that Mathis.
I am calling him shortly.
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John M
climber
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Aug 26, 2013 - 11:21pm PT
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Mouse, I just watched that movie last night on netflix.
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Aug 26, 2013 - 11:24pm PT
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LOVED THAT FINGER!
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F10
Trad climber
Bishop
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Aug 26, 2013 - 11:27pm PT
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Great weather and climbing in Tuolumne today,
Hopefully some headway is being made and everyone is safe
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John M
climber
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Aug 26, 2013 - 11:27pm PT
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LOVED THAT FINGER!
LOL.. yep.. that was funny.
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Aug 26, 2013 - 11:45pm PT
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From my conversation with the Rev just moments ago.
Matt Chapman's garage is gone, with all his tools, and so it the barn.
The fire burned right up to Ferretti Road for about a mile but they stopped it there, not dead-stopped, though. There was an outbreak up the hill in one spot there that they managed to "beat down."
He drove out on Ferretti yesterday. I think he was checking Denny's house. The view from Ferretti is one of "complete devastation as far as the eye can see."
He spoke with Bill Nickell (two "L's", neebee, like in gill, silly) and he was down the other day but now he's up in spirits and that's our Bill, who was never a quitter.
Godspeed everyone, especially the tired combatants in this duel.
the Rev said seven percent containment on this big a fire is nada, and he's right. We need some precipitation and I need some sleep.
I asked him to compare the Complex fire in '87 to this one. "Much much worse."
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Dapper Dan
Trad climber
Menlo Park
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Aug 27, 2013 - 12:02am PT
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In that MODIS fire map , what is the big unburned area in the middle of all the yellow mean ?
just an area the fire spared ?
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 27, 2013 - 12:46am PT
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hey there say, mouse, thanks for sharing... as to matt... they knew the house made it through, so my folks told me, but we did not
know about the shed or barn... thank you for sharing...
say, does 'the rev' know matt... ?
or did he hear from double-l nickells, :)
just curious --yeah, i know... but i LIVE with cats... and you KNOWw what they say about cats... *curiousity does not kill cats, by the way, though, as long as they have good owners... :)
but yeah, they are curious... :)
and thus, taught it to me, :))
well, night all, got some past-gift stuff i been working on...
ps: for later down the roadL
say, if anyone needs anything i can share, later, for fund raising, etc, i will try to do whatever i can...
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nita
Social climber
chica de chico, I don't claim to be a daisy.
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Aug 27, 2013 - 12:52am PT
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there is a reasonable chance your friends' cabins may be safe, even if the fire overburned it, similar to what happened at Camp Mather.
QITNL, Thanks... That is exactly what many of us former T.M. & Ahwahnee employees are hoping for.......
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Aug 27, 2013 - 03:23am PT
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I could only sleep a little. I am very keyed-up over this.
1573 is the Sunset Inn.
thank you thank you thank you
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Dr.Sprock
Boulder climber
I'm James Brown, Bi-atch!
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Aug 27, 2013 - 06:08am PT
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won't jump the merced, at least from briceburg to red bud, all logged out for yosemite railroad back when grandpa had his teeth, easy to start grass back fires that will race up the hill,
might go around it on the south side, but winds would have to be weird,
hate to see The Bug get torched, but that would be 5 days away,
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 27, 2013 - 10:58am PT
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In that MODIS fire map , what is the big unburned area in the middle of all the yellow mean ? You can read the legend at the top left of the MODIS Google Earth maps.
Yellow has burned WITHIN the time frame of 6 days ago up to the last 24 hours. All the orange and red is within the last 24 hours.
Clint: There's good road to White Wolf, and some old rough roads near it. The original Tioga road went through White Wolf and is pretty decent for a ways below the store. I'm sure they'll make a strong stand there. The fire could bypass WW in the canyon.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 27, 2013 - 11:07am PT
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The morning MODIS image:
Yesterday about the same time for reference
Moving NE up the Clavey River and past Eleanor and Cherry Lakes.
Continuing to move east towards White Wolf.
Now burning right up to the Big Oak Flat entrance.
It's easy to get fooled. The RED doesn't mean burning hottest, just that it's active within the last 6 hours.
Note the increasing area in the center with no squares. This burned more than 6 days ago.
It looks as if the actual amount of area burning in the last 6 hours has gone down. Indicating it may not be growing outward as fast as yesterday.
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mtnyoung
Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
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Aug 27, 2013 - 11:15am PT
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The smoke here this morning is also definitely the worst it's been yet. Here's looking up the driveway at 8:00 a.m.
And sorry Clint, but I'll take your "bet" (which I know is one you want to lose): I don't think Twain Harte or Tuolumne are going to go up (and for what it's worth, our house is significantly northeast of Highway 108; there are hundreds of homes between us and the fire). Yes, in a worst-case scenario it could happen. Yes, we've got a family plan for evacuation. But I don't think it will go there.
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mtnyoung
Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
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Aug 27, 2013 - 11:17am PT
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And Fred, thank you so much for posting and reposting the updated maps. Those maps are great, and it's so nice to see them together with other information all on one thread. I've always maintained that Supertopo can be a great news source :) :)
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Chewybacca
Trad climber
Montana, Whitefish
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Aug 27, 2013 - 11:27am PT
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My heart is with all you folks in the path of this monster. I can only imagine the stress you are going through.
And thanks for all the timely information. I'm getting better info from this thread than from the news.
Coincidentally the '87 fire was the last fire incident I worked on. Switched to trail construction and reforestation after that.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 27, 2013 - 11:33am PT
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Brad, I'm thinking of you and your family, as well as all the others I don't know. I'm pleased to be providing useful information. Some day my canyon will burn. Trying to pay it forward a little bit.
Hope to see you in 3 weeks time.
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mtnyoung
Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
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Aug 27, 2013 - 11:41am PT
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Hope to see you in 3 weeks time.
Yes, that would be nice, especially if this thing is "in the rear-view mirror."
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Melissa
Gym climber
berkeley, ca
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Aug 27, 2013 - 11:42am PT
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Note to you locals who may have friends who lost their homes or in case someone who did sees this thread...
I lost my home to fire a few years ago. It's a big pain to deal with insurance, and I felt like there was a lot to learn quickly before the insurance-provided clean-up crews made it difficult to make our maximum claim. I was really grateful at the time for the advice of total and near-total strangers who'd been through it, and I want to offer to be one of those folks for anyone who needs it now. Feel free to e-mail me at the address linked to my Supertopo account.
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aspendougy
Trad climber
Los Angeles, CA
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Aug 27, 2013 - 12:41pm PT
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Dear Timid Tightrope:
My family owns a cabin at Aspen Valley, and if you hear anything more about the White Wolf/Aspen Valley portion of the fire, please let me know.
Sincerely,
Douglas Gray
aspendougy@gmail.com
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Aug 27, 2013 - 01:03pm PT
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thanks, melissa
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Aug 27, 2013 - 01:18pm PT
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ok, this is some funny sh#t. it is remarkable how wildly ignorant californians, including journalists, are of the basic physical geography of their home region. i have plenty of sympathy for the complaint here.
http://www.therimfire.com/2013/08/24/truth-rim-fire.html
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dave729
Trad climber
Western America
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Aug 27, 2013 - 02:11pm PT
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I'll believe my own eyes mostly.
Thermal map shows the fire is into that over grown forest close to the Hwy 120 Yosemite entrance station? Did it jump the dozer lines?
Looks like if it does cross Hwy 120 there will easily follow
the abundantly fueled Crane Creek valley eastward up to the Yosemite Institute at Crane Flat. The Crane Flat Helibase lookout cam is back online.
Brutal!
http://www.mtdiablocam.com/sierralookouts.htm
There has been an evacuation advisory issued from Mi-Wok to Pinecrest along the Highway 108 corridor. This advisory has been issued by the Tuolumne County Sheriff's Office.
http://cdfdata.fire.ca.gov/incidents/incidents_details_info?incident_id=889
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 27, 2013 - 02:13pm PT
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hey there say, all... just checking in to see how things are going...
and adding a thank you to all the folks sharing info here...
i did not know what was going on, in these crucial areas, 'til
i kept checking here at your thread, khanom...
prayers, still...
thank you for all that are helping here...
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John M
climber
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Aug 27, 2013 - 02:28pm PT
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Do they think we are too stupid to sift fact from conjecture?
I'm sure that wasn't pointed at you Eric, but there are plenty of people who aren't able to sift fact from conjecture. Enough that it does cause difficulties. If the phone lines get jammed and someone who has a genuine need to know can't get through, then that can be bad. I have been amazed at the number of phone calls that I have gotten from people who were worried that Wawona would burn. Most of these were older people and they aren't stupid, just misinformed by the media and they mostly aren't very computer literate.
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Michelle
Social climber
1187 Hunterwasser
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Aug 27, 2013 - 02:34pm PT
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Is this a social media site? Lol
But seriously, I guess I just know where to look.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 27, 2013 - 04:27pm PT
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1300 PDT today.
The dark red squares are fire activity within the last 6 hours. In other words, the new spots.
some hot spots
NW across Clavey River towards 108
In the Tuolumne canyon below Hetch Hetchy
South around Big Oak Flat entrance, Crocker Ridge and Pilot Ridge
Inexorably east towards White Wolf.
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Aug 27, 2013 - 04:32pm PT
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Most of these were older people and they aren't stupid, just misinformed by the media and they mostly aren't very computer literate.
yeah, and they weren't victims of social media because they don't know what they are much less how to use them.
the guardian can sukit
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nita
Social climber
chica de chico, I don't claim to be a daisy.
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Aug 27, 2013 - 05:05pm PT
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Thanks Mr K, that's the news i was hearing behind the scenes...
HOOT!!!!.....If Lauren was at the Inn right now, she would be cooking the fire crews delicious meals... and fabulous desserts too.
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Aug 27, 2013 - 05:11pm PT
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Anyone know more about the situation there?
duckwall seems to be holding, which is the really big news of the last 24 hrs. they seem to have got dozer lines/paint around the major spots above the line as per what i could get off the scanner.
and they've had another 24hrs now for dozers and backburn. if conditions hold, i'm now more optimistic that it holds. it'd also allow free some resources to cap the clavey drainage. it's gonna make a big run up the clavey and assoc ridgeline, and they went door-to-door in miwuk telling folks to be ready.
gonna need a lot of air support-- and they've apparently activated castle air base, which may increase the number of possible drops.
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 27, 2013 - 06:18pm PT
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hey there say, khanom... thanks for sharing!!!!
say, nita, wow, is this sooooooooo happy news, or what, >:D<
still hoping and praying... wow, if prayers and hopes SOUNDED like
cheerleaders cry-outs, i wonderrrrrrrrr WHAT we must sound like, :)
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Dr.Sprock
Boulder climber
I'm James Brown, Bi-atch!
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Aug 27, 2013 - 07:23pm PT
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Geranimo Hotshots are on the way, this thing will be out in 3 days,
some badass mofos right here,
Apache, the most blood thirsty axe throwin tribe in the US.
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Aug 27, 2013 - 07:26pm PT
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I heard it on YeeHaw just now...is it true? Can I rely on this?This is happy news, that the Inn is saved. I can call it karma, but it is hard work on the part of firefighters.
As to the media and coverage, it's all about the sources and most reporters sent down to cover the fire haven't any worth beans.
The fact that the leak came through just means the news is like gold, it's where you find it.
Casual observation, lax editing, no sources on the local level. what do you expect from a National Medium? Miracles?
I blame it on our need to know now, right now. They try to cater to that need and fall flat most times.
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wstmrnclmr
Trad climber
Bolinas, CA
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Aug 27, 2013 - 07:46pm PT
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Echoing what Khanom said. Park source friend says 120 closure from Crane flat coming.
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Clint Cummins
Trad climber
SF Bay area, CA
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Aug 27, 2013 - 07:54pm PT
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this map is money Yep - thanks for sharing.
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lostinshanghai
Social climber
someplace
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Aug 27, 2013 - 07:57pm PT
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Great news on the Inn.
Now to get them ready for anything. Mouse recall the sand pit down at the entrance. Now to give them the chemistry which I do not need [lasts for ever], all they would need to rent or get would be a used shotcrete/gunite hose/gun. Sand would need to be sized out.
Happy on the news about it.
They did a or three burns up the hill yesterday, one got away but now have it under control. The smoke this morning was like have 30 guys smoking cigars in a 10x10 enclosure no windows or air. They had us on evacuation for a few seconds. Smoke from the south.
Hoping that weather or moisture from the East comes by.
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command error
Trad climber
Colorado
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Aug 27, 2013 - 08:32pm PT
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Say it ain't so? KCBS radio on the drive home just now.
Unbelievable.
"Fire fighting helicopters forbidden to dip into Hetch Hetchy water
by order of San Francisco water managers."
Are all surface waters off limits to fire fighting efforts in Yosemite?
Or just HH?
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 27, 2013 - 08:42pm PT
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MODIS at 1730 (10 minutes ago)
Spotting ahead of the Eastern front towards both White Wolf and Tioga Rd (120) and towards(not near) Twain Harte.
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Strider
Trad climber
ಠ_ಠ
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Aug 27, 2013 - 08:44pm PT
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Drove into the Evergreen Lodge via Hwy 120 & Evergreen rd. with an escort yesterday.
The overall news is good. Evergreen Lodge, Camp Mather, Dimond O and Peach Growers have all so far made it through unscathed. Camp Tawonga experienced 1 structure loss, cabin 12 on the edge of camp.
The crews were actively fighting the fire on Hwy 120 about 1.5 miles East of Evergreen rd. there was also active fire fighting on Evergreen rd. on the last mile before you reach the Ackerson Meadows curve. Ackerson Meadow is untouched but Bald Mountain behind it was being consumed.
When you get to the Erikson Ranch buildings, they are untouched but it looks like they did a backburn in the meadow to prevent a runup to the buildings. Bear mountain, South of the Erikson ranch was untouched. Passing Peach Growers and Dimond O, they are untouched on the left/west side of the rd but the right/east side was burned.
The sad news of the day was that the last mile before the Evergreen was torched. Trees were black sticks and the ground was only ash. But right before you get to the Lodge you re-enter virgin forest and find the Lodge untouched. Past the Lodge down to Camp Mather is also an oasis.
neebee- I saw Matt going into his property with an escort. He was well and in good spirits despite the circumstances. Unfortunately I only got about 20 seconds to chat before his caravan moved on.
Aspendoug- the next few days will be the test for Aspen Valley. I wish I had better news but you are up next in the fires path. But the goods news was that I saw a flatbed trailer and a dozer getting parked on Aspen Valley road when I was leaving. Fire fighter priority is structure defense so they will give it their all. If you are half as lucky as the Evergreen then you should come through fine. Good luck brother.
The drive on 120 from Feretti to evergreen rd was not as bad as I expected. There is a lot of damage but it is not a moonscape and the forest is still largely there. Only time will tell if the trees survive this but if they do then much will be the same I suspect.
I have Gopro video of the drive in and out as well as almost 100 pictures. I am in a remote place on Hwy 4 and no computer to help post pictures. Just my little iPhone. But if I can figure it put I will post pictures later.
Good luck to everyone still in the path of the fire.
-n
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 27, 2013 - 08:47pm PT
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Strider
great report from "boots on the ground"
Inciweb on tomorrow's Tioga Rd closure, tomorrow noon.
A portion of the Tioga Road, from Crane Flat to White Wolf, will be temporarily closed to all vehicular traffic beginning tomorrow, Wednesday, August 28, 2013, at 12:00 noon. The closure is necessary for firefighters to perform fire suppression activities along the road. This portion of the road is anticipated to be closed at least through Labor Day Weekend. The park will issue an update as conditions allow for the reopening of the road.
“The work that will be performed over the next few days is instrumental in suppressing the Rim Fire within Yosemite. The safety of the firefighters working along the road is our paramount concern,” stated park Superintendent Don Neubacher.
Tamarack Flat and Yosemite Creek Campgrounds, both located along the Tioga Road within the closure, will remain closed during the fire suppression efforts. White Wolf Campground and White Wolf Lodge will remain closed. The Tioga Road will remain open east of White Wolf to the Tioga Pass Entrance. The Porcupine Flat Campground, the Tuolumne Meadows Campground, and all visitor services within Tuolumne Meadows will remain open.
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nita
Social climber
chica de chico, I don't claim to be a daisy.
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Aug 27, 2013 - 08:52pm PT
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Nick< WOW...Thanks!!!
Can't wait to see the pictures..
Cheers.
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Powder
Trad climber
the Flower Box
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Aug 27, 2013 - 08:53pm PT
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Viewed from Hwy120 east of Tamarack Flat at 11:18pm on Aug 25, Sunday.
Best wishes to all who reside in the area and who have families and friends living in the area. Thanks to all the fire crews who have been fighting this ridiculously stubborn and fierce monster!!
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lostinshanghai
Social climber
someplace
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Aug 27, 2013 - 08:54pm PT
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Vultures are already and waiting as soon as they can get in lumber people want to harvest the wood. Want the red tape lifted so they can make $$$$.
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GhoulweJ
Trad climber
El Dorado Hills, CA
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Aug 27, 2013 - 08:58pm PT
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What started this fire?
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 27, 2013 - 09:04pm PT
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What started this fire? Unknown, at least to the public.
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TGT
Social climber
So Cal
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Aug 27, 2013 - 09:04pm PT
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lumber people want to harvest the wood.
Nothing wrong with that.
I'm sure the treasury could use the funds to recoup the expenses and the cleanup will help with the recovery.
Maybe if there's been a little more harvesting on the front end we wouldn't be facing the present disaster.
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Clint Cummins
Trad climber
SF Bay area, CA
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Aug 27, 2013 - 09:16pm PT
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Great news on Evergreen and Mather, Nick! Thanks for sharing.
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Aug 27, 2013 - 09:17pm PT
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lost and tgt, take the political crap to one of the f*#ktard threads.
some of us are in harm's way. some of us have family and friends in harm's way. we don't need this thread to become the usual st clusterf*#k.
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lostinshanghai
Social climber
someplace
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Aug 27, 2013 - 09:22pm PT
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I agree on the harvest but the ones that want to do it are not your clean up and plant new seeds. If they went in and shred their cuttings and manage it right no biggie buy these guys are from old school and just want the logs, no helping the county and giving back our resources that belong to us.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 27, 2013 - 09:26pm PT
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Let's try to keep this thread informative and factual. Please take political rants (I have plenty of my own) elsewhere.
A lot of people reading this thread may soon be in harm's way or have cabins or friends in harm's way. The last thing we should be doing here is rattling our chains. (end of my rant)
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 27, 2013 - 09:36pm PT
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hey there say, nick/strider... just saw the last few post here and am so very happy to know about evergreen!!! wow...
so happy for the owners, and all the folks ... will go back
and see the post you did, then...
thankful for good saves in the midst of such hardship...
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JOEY.F
Gym climber
It's not rocket surgery
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Aug 27, 2013 - 09:48pm PT
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From what I read, Nick and the Evergreen and KRanch are ok. Best of luck to your friends Timid and Nita. Looks like Neebs brother is ok too.
Can't imagine what its been like on the scene...
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 27, 2013 - 09:53pm PT
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hey there say. nick/strider,
as to this:
neebee- I saw Matt going into his property with an escort. He was well and in good spirits despite the circumstances. Unfortunately I only got about 20 seconds to chat before his caravan moved on
THANK YOU so very much!!!!!!!!
:)
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John M
climber
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Aug 27, 2013 - 10:34pm PT
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The wind has been out of the SW all day.. so why are we getting smoke here in Wawona?
Not that its anything like what you guys closer to the fire are dealing with. Just curious.
..
Eric, have you found a place to land if you have to evacuate?
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 27, 2013 - 11:30pm PT
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part of the "official" bulletin from Inciweb, 6:30 PM, about 2 hours ago
Incident: Rim Fire Wildfire
Released: 1:07 hrs. ago
RIM FIRE INFORMATION
Update #17
Release for Tuesday, August 27, 2013/Time: 6:30 PM
Incident Statics
Acres Burned: 184,481 Structures Threatened: 4,500
Containment: 20% Structures Destroyed: 111
Fire Start Date: August 17, 2013 Injuries: 2
Fire Cause: Under Investigation Total Personnel: 4,081
Cost to date: $33 Million
Fire Update
Firefighters made progress on spot fires in the Reynolds Creek drainage and burning operations south of Duckwall Mountain to Skidmore. Crews also were preparing for additional burning operations on the north side of the Tuolumne River. Firefighters secured line from Pilot Ridge west towards the Yosemite boundary along Old Yosemite Highway. Aircraft were used to support operations throughout the day. Firefighters will continue with contingency line construction in advance of the communities in the Highway 108 corridor, as well as providing structure protection. For tonight, crews will continue with line construction, structure defense and preparing for burning operations. The recent increase in structures destroyed is due to structures lost at Tuolumne Berkeley Family Camp, which include 3 commercial properties and 85 tent cabins and outbuildings. 184K acres, 4,500 structures threatened! 111 destroyed (includes tent cabins and outbuildings)
containment 20%
4,081 personnel
Crikey! (English slang for a foul phrase)
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 28, 2013 - 09:46am PT
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hey there say, all...
bump for ol' patrick, in ireland...
:)
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Aug 28, 2013 - 11:44am PT
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WTF--
take the politard crap to a politard thread.
folks are hitting this thread on phones in places with bad signal trying to find out if their homes are about to fry.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 28, 2013 - 12:05pm PT
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The morning MODIS Image, 0845 (12 minutes ago)
Looks like it's now a 2 front fire
--- Yosemite and along the line SW down to Pilot Peak
A LOT of movement towards White Wolf and Tioga Rd
---Facing 108 and Tuolumne City
some current activity at Cherry Lake
Pilot Peak to Big Oak Flat entrance and towards Aspen Valley (I don't know precisely where AspVal is)
Yesterday morning for comparison
Yellow squares burned between 6 days and 24 hours ago.
The orange/red squares have burned in last 24 hours. Bright red in last 6 hours.
See the legend top left of the photos.
If you have particular places of concern, send me their coordinates or approx locations and I'll add markers for them.
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mtnyoung
Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
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Aug 28, 2013 - 12:13pm PT
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Fred, thanks again.
BTW, the red ("new fire") marks that seem to be moving toward Twain Harte are (I think) the back-burning they're doing down off Paper Cabin Ridge.
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Climbnc
Trad climber
Carrboro, NC
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Aug 28, 2013 - 12:33pm PT
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Obsessively tracking this fire from the East coast as we're headed to the Valley in a couple of weeks.
Looks like they are closing 120 up to Tuolumne this afternoon, I think for controlled burns down from Hetch Hetchy:
http://www.nps.gov/yose/planyourvisit/rimfire.htm
Beginning at noon on Wednesday, August 28, the Tioga Road (Highway 120 through the park) is closed from Crane Flat to Yosemite Creek. The only access to the Tuolumne Meadows area is via Highway 120 from near Lee Vining.
Best wishes to all in the path, stay safe.
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le_bruce
climber
Oakland, CA
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Aug 28, 2013 - 02:35pm PT
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Hard for me to discern in the maps, but did the fire cross over the Golden Arrow Rd where it joins the 120 outside of the park? Looks like it, can't tell.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 28, 2013 - 02:55pm PT
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Mark. Nice work.
Brad, khanom, I'm sure you guys will be OK now. Hang in there.
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command error
Trad climber
Colorado
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Aug 28, 2013 - 03:43pm PT
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Is Hetch Hetchy water still off limits to fire fighting helicopters?
Still looking for any pictures of helicopters dipping water out of
Hetch Hetchy to drop on the near by fire.
Would be spectacular images.
Hard to believe cannot find them if they exist.
Perhaps they do not.
Short hauling, max bang for the buck of fuel consumed for fire suppression.
Thinking such images do not exist because San Francisco will not let
helicopters use their water.
Are helicopters scooping Siesta lake or Harden lake to drop on the fire up by White Wolf?
And if not what's the reason?
Harden lake
Nameless lake 2.5 miles east of Harden lake
Lukens Lake
Siesta Lake
Nameless lake 0.1 miles south of Siesta lake
Nameless lake 1 mile west of Siesta lake nearest the fire.
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Clint Cummins
Trad climber
SF Bay area, CA
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Aug 28, 2013 - 03:51pm PT
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Water bucket drops from helicopters are only useful for spot fires or small fires.
Not helpful on a fire with a wide front.
Big fixed wing tanker loads instead.
And tanker trucks for when the perimeter is near a road.
[edit:] khanom, yes, the water bucket is useful for parts of the fire perimeter where there's a defensible line. (Pilot Ridge is a good example). I was thinking more about the wide fire front above Hetch Hetchy and Evergreen Road, with the uphill slope to Crane Flat.
P.S. Sorry about the overly broad initial statement - I was trying to get in a quick reply. Should have been more careful.
I was trying to say something along the lines of "you can't just pour water on a forest fire to put it out" (there's not enough water delivery logistics to do that - you have to make dirt roads around it instead).
Crane Flat webcam - can it be stopped at the top of the slope?
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TwistedCrank
climber
Bungwater Hollow, Ida-ho
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Aug 28, 2013 - 04:06pm PT
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Run for your lives, bishes.
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lostinshanghai
Social climber
someplace
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Aug 28, 2013 - 04:22pm PT
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AS for what caused the fire: not known but:
Not confirmed so that means this might be incorrect information:
As for the fire getting out of hand a cell tower company was coming in from the valley to set up for communications for Groveland to better communicate data since the area had no source of sending or receiving signals like “Can you hear me now” If you live in outer area of Groveland there are areas with no service.
Guy is stopped by Sheriff and told to turn around. Tried to explain it to the sheriff but had no proper papers to show. Guy turned around and parked and tried to get through on his cell phone but was jammed or overloaded.
The delay in not getting that equipment or tower in where it was to go did help with fire spreading since more communication could have helped.
And again not confirmed info: Rumors? disinformation take your pick.
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lostinshanghai
Social climber
someplace
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Aug 28, 2013 - 05:15pm PT
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Told my girlfriend something weird just saw four fire guys having all the same face. Told her what would be the odds in that four brothers and having the same height, dark hair? No biggie she said. She also said most likely too much smoke from the fire getting into your head. So I agreed until this morning saw even more, wait a minute something is going on so had to check it out:
I asked and they said yes this is where we are getting most of our help from.
Anyway looks like the party is over for the big boys staying at the Casino which has been closed for a week they opened the road so now looks like they will be open for taking your money.
In our local paper said some Groveland people complained and were suspicious of couple of guys knocking on their doors and saying that they need to be evacuated. Both Couples thought kind of strange and reported it, sheriffs looking for a white pickup with small water tank and ages between 17-18.
Plus a drone is also hovering the area.
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Aug 28, 2013 - 05:35pm PT
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saw the backfire today down below paper cabin.
they've re-opened tuolumne road.
duckwall held-- much better situ on the north side today. hope the dozers are getting good lines in coming down from dodge ridge.
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pyro
Big Wall climber
Calabasas
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Aug 28, 2013 - 05:40pm PT
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does anybody know if the "iron-door bar" is open?
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ontheedgeandscaredtodeath
Social climber
SLO, Ca
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Aug 28, 2013 - 05:56pm PT
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FYI, Lost's picture is probably for a tent in fire camp where they are cloning radios, i.e., making sure everyone is on the same frequencies (air ops, ops, logistics, division freqs, etc.) Radio traffic can be out of control on big fires.
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lostinshanghai
Social climber
someplace
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Aug 28, 2013 - 06:31pm PT
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This is just across from that door.
And these guys are apologizing for taking our space up.
They did some back fire burns and there was one they did not recognize as of theirs. Four? there only suppose to be three, you could see them and you knew what they were doing, some feared it was coming but you had to say no; controlled burn. Anyway the forth one that was not theirs, guy intentionally burned down his barn for insurance. He said it came from their ashes and landed on roof. They looked and saw how come it looks like it started from this corner and a little gas smell. Idiot, do not know if he will be charged for fraud.
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nita
Social climber
chica de chico, I don't claim to be a daisy.
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Aug 28, 2013 - 06:58pm PT
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Mr K, I had a fire refugee at my house...He told me that the park service was making an exception with the retardant for this extreme fire event...
I also saw this memo . ..ssshhhh
From the IR flight this morning, the acres in the park are 43,310. Of note would be the burnout operation near Aspen Valley, and the isolated heat that was detected east of the fire, both of which are visible on the maps. The park did have a fire called the Pate which was lightning ignited last week in the area of that far eastern heat detection point.
The overall shape of the fire didn't change too much due to the uncertainty about its location yesterday. It looks as if perimeter stayed the same on the far eastern edge of the fire as it moves towards White Wolf, with the intense heat 'catching up' to that edge.
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Aug 28, 2013 - 08:57pm PT
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wow, just found out that when the fire rushed paper cabin, it was my neighbor running that crew. they ran for their lives and called in air. i was listening on the scanner, but didnt know it was him.
lower 108 is looking a lot safer today-- several days of good conditions, at least so far as winds go, means things look a lot better despite the air quality.
drove up to p-crest and surround. at least 8 or 9 fully loaded logging trucks passed me, headed down from cutting line up below dodge ridge. i couldn't see any backfires up there, but the smoke was fairly bad and visibility marginal.
i also saw three leos-- 2 suburbans and a crown vic -- tooling 3 very unhappy looking youths along 4n06. not a good time to be tending crops or just burning one back in there. darwin award territory.
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monolith
climber
SF bay area
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Aug 28, 2013 - 09:28pm PT
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Here is a surface wind map. Probably not too useful for smoke prediction.
http://hint.fm/wind/
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mtnyoung
Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
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Aug 28, 2013 - 09:46pm PT
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Dingus, for most of the week the cool early, early morning air and little or no breeze has resulted in heavy, heavy smoke blanketing all of Jamestown and Sonora and the whole hill up to past Twain Harte (bad stuff) at daylight. Then, most days by mid-afternoon, breezes have blown most of the smoke to the northeast, resulting in almost clear skies in these same areas and huge plumes in that direction.
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Strider
Trad climber
ಠ_ಠ
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Aug 28, 2013 - 09:50pm PT
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Here are some pictures from Tuesday when I drove in. Also got the call that I MIGHT be allowed to go home on Friday to relieve the guy we have there and before they reopen to locals. We will see if it works out.
Smoke plume from evacuation day
Headed back in a few days later, the view at Rim if the World where the fire started
On hwy 120 on the way in
Bridge on 120 at Rainbow pools
Fire crews at work on Evergreen rd...
To stop this...
Ackerson Meadow untouched and Bald Mountain getting a workout
Dozer on Aspen Valley rd
Peach Growers still there
Between Dimond O and The Lodge
Still there
-n
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 28, 2013 - 10:57pm PT
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hey there say, QITNL...
oh my, i saw a small article about that drone thing, oh my...
say, on a side note, that i thought WAS VERY CUTE,
it was written about THIS WAY, at the end of the
article:
It's already helped, alerting firefighters to at least one flare-up way earlier than normal, reports AP.
awwwww, :)
:) i thought i was most 'unperfected-journalism-wise', as to saying stuff like:
'way earlier' (which i use such, as)
and way often, too, i thus add...
though it is far too early to tell if i say it far too less,
if i will sound far more fetching, ;))
well, it is way early in the eve still, so i hope to
visit back, soon :)
just wanted to make sure folks like khanom, etc. are still
okay...
and, posting a huge thank you again, for all those in harms way, that are working so hard...
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 28, 2013 - 11:05pm PT
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hey there say, strider!!!! oh my... just seeing the fire makes you get those 'danger' twinges that startle the brain, :O
far more real, to see what you have SEEN... we just see smoke, :O
i am so very glad, too, that i can now see the evergreen lodge...
plays a nice part in my life, though i never get there...
god bless to all, thanks for these great photos...
hope you get to go back, for 'your turn' as it seems it will be...
:)
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Dr.Sprock
Boulder climber
I'm James Brown, Bi-atch!
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Aug 28, 2013 - 11:08pm PT
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east side into the granite,
west side has 12 blade width lines cut,
north side slowing down,
south side will hit sparse fuel in a while with good wind direction,
should be 53% containment by tomorrow,
the Clavey is ultra remote above the T river, and a prime location for hooch farming due to water access,
most likely a small operation which means local farmers,
cartel farmers are too good to start fires, don't want caro quintero on their back,
this is a low water year for boaters which means that the clavey was un-runnable when the fire started
so kayakers are off the hook,
in fact, dreamflows has it charted as too low to run for the last 2 years>
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Mungeclimber
Trad climber
Nothing creative to say
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Aug 29, 2013 - 01:38am PT
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thx for the pics Nick
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Brokedownclimber
Trad climber
Douglas, WY
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Aug 29, 2013 - 09:59am PT
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WTF-
Re: the "landing gear" warning is an automatic recording to alert the pilot on a final approach for landing that the gear isn't down.
A wheels-up landing is damaging to the airplane, but not nearly as bad as damage to the pilot's reputation and ego.
"There are 2 kinds of pilots who fly RG (retractable gear) airplanes--those who have landed wheels-up, and those who are going to..."
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Brokedownclimber
Trad climber
Douglas, WY
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Aug 29, 2013 - 11:12am PT
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eKat- ^^^^^
That screeching female voice does what it's supposed to do...get your attention!
It beats the He** out of a landing gear alarm buzzer in the headphones, though. The retractable-gear trainer at the flight school in Casper is presently hors de combat due to a dunce student retracting the landing gear during a touch and go instead of the flaps... Stupid is as stupid does...
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nita
Social climber
chica de chico, I don't claim to be a daisy.
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Aug 29, 2013 - 12:00pm PT
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Hey Nick... Thanks so much for keeping us updated on Evergreen, Mather, Sunset Inn, & Tawonga , really appreciate it.....
Thanks for putting up pictures too...do you have more?
also....Do you know who owns Peach growers and A. Meadows? i have always wondered about the property owners in those areas.
saludos
nita.
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Aug 29, 2013 - 12:48pm PT
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strider-- thabnks for the pix.
q: my neighbor was on the saddle when paper cabin ridge went nuclear afternoon of the 25th. they got out just in time-- big air support basically saved the line that afternoon. only heard the short version, sure ill hear the long version with beer revisions soon enough. assuming that the line jolds.
last i heard, the cabin is still there.
glad they feel good enough to post the briefing map. yesterday's transpo map was already circulating on fb, so maybe they figured they may as well.
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Strider
Trad climber
ಠ_ಠ
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Aug 29, 2013 - 01:33pm PT
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Nita, Peach Growers a bunch of cabins owned by different people (most of whom have owned their family cabin for generations). The Forest Service owns the actual land and homeowners have a 99 year lease type of thing. You are also heavily restricted on how large the cabin is, it has to be the right color, you are not allowed to live there and can only really use it as a summer cabin. There are a bunch of other rules as well.
Aspen Valley is in the park and I imagine rules are the same as Foresta and Yosemite West. But to be honest I don't know much about them
-n
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nita
Social climber
chica de chico, I don't claim to be a daisy.
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Aug 29, 2013 - 02:22pm PT
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Strider, i was actually wondering about home ownership of Ackerson Meadows and cabin ?...Is that a historic name ?.......I love that meadow..and former view...
Thanks for the above answer on Peach growers.... Hey, AspenDoug...Are the Aspen valley cabins ownership similar to Foresta and Peach Growers?
Sorry for the thread drift.
Strider,.....more pictures?
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Strider
Trad climber
ಠ_ಠ
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Aug 29, 2013 - 02:59pm PT
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Ahhh, I see Nita. There are two separate pieces of land around there. The Erickson ranch is the area of land that has a barn and house right next to the road. That land is owned by the Erickson family for years! As the story goes, back in the day, at one time the Ericksons could run their cattle from the Central Valley to Yosemite all on their own land. Doubt that was true but probably not far. I am also pretty sure their land is under the Williamson Act. The Act is complicated but essentially the State agrees to lower your property taxes dramatically and you promise to use your land for agricultural purposes only. It is meant to keep open spaces and prevent development.
Now Ackerson meadow has the lonely cabin and windmill in the middle of the meadow, the Ericksons sold that a few years ago and my understanding it will become a nature preserve. That meadow is Great Gret Owl habitat and there are some Indian grinding holes on some of the rocks. I know for a fact Ackerson is under Williamson. It would be a permitting nightmare to build anything there because of the natural and cultural resources.
I do have more pics but I need better Internet to upload them. It tools me 3 hours yesterday to get those pictures up. Hopefully I will be at the Evergreen tomorrow and can send a few more out.
-n
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Ward Trotter
Trad climber
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Aug 29, 2013 - 05:02pm PT
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A main problem at this stage is the S and SE flank. The wind is shifting to the NW and NE tonight ,and to NW on Friday. We'll see if their lines down there hold fairly well to keep this thing from making more of a run in that S direction.
Otherwise the more this thing is contained overall the more resources they can pour into trouble areas.
Massive kudos to the firefighters who have , and still continue to battle, this truly epochal wildfire.
The entire nation has been watching, and both residents and firefighters deserve all our respect and admiration.
And that's a fact...
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ontheedgeandscaredtodeath
Social climber
SLO, Ca
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Aug 29, 2013 - 05:13pm PT
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That was a good move putting those granite domes on the eastern flank! They should think about that to the south.
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mr p
Big Wall climber
eastside ca
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Aug 29, 2013 - 05:42pm PT
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the perfect storm of fire.. hopefully they can catch it / the south flank at sr 120 tioga road .. this wasn't a question of if but when all the best to the fire crew et. al.
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 29, 2013 - 09:12pm PT
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hey there say, khanom and all... jus checking in to see how everyone is...
*strider, love the history as to some of fire-area lands...
and timid: love the great grey sighting!
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Dr.Sprock
Boulder climber
I'm James Brown, Bi-atch!
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Aug 30, 2013 - 12:19am PT
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if you line up all those honey buckets you can get choppers to suck the grease and urine right out and dump it near pilot hill, retards and fertilizes at the same time, and cheaper than the agent orange,
possible Hep C breakout next spring, but heh, jus sayin,
whats worse, a swollen liver or losin your swiss family robinson play house?
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 30, 2013 - 12:31am PT
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7 PM inciweb update
199, 237 acres!!
You can bet it will be over 200K by morning
37% contained
Looking much better for the 108 people!
and by extension for knanom as well.
The advisory evacuation notice for Tuolumne City, Soulsbyville and Willow Springs has been lifted. Firefighters began burning operations south of Hetch Hetchy and along Old Yosemite Road. Crews continue with line construction near Clavey Meadows near the 3N01 Road. Crews began removing fuels along the Tioga Road and Highway 120 near the Yosemite National Park entrance in preparation for the planned burnout. This work is to reduce the intensity of the burnout. The burnout has begun near Pilot Peak. Night crews will continue with burning operations as long as weather conditions allow, and will construct and improve firelines and provide structure defense.
Crews began removing fuels along the Tioga Road and Highway 120 near the Yosemite National Park entrance in preparation for the planned burnout. This work is to reduce the intensity of the burnout.
egads
I'm betting this will be burning in spots until the first big snow of winter.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 30, 2013 - 12:38am PT
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Latest MODIS on Google Earth
2115 PDT
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mtnyoung
Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
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Aug 30, 2013 - 09:50am PT
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Holy fuk is the smoke bad this morning in Greeley.
I feel bad saying this, but for the first time since the fire started we've got a morning over here that is almost smoke free.
The wind patterns must have shifted?
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Aug 30, 2013 - 12:05pm PT
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Funny, my burnouts are never planned. but if you're lucky you can see them coming.
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Charlie D.
Trad climber
Western Slope, Tahoe Sierra
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Aug 30, 2013 - 01:38pm PT
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This thread has been a great way to monitor what's going on. Thanks, much appreciated. A little info regarding the language would be helpful, what's the definition of a "burn out" in the fire fighting world?
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ontheedgeandscaredtodeath
Social climber
SLO, Ca
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Aug 30, 2013 - 01:49pm PT
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Burning out is burning small pockets of green between fire line and the active edge of the fire. Small scale clean-up type of stuff. For example, if you were building line around a "u" shaped area you would simply go across the top of the "u" (rather than down, across, and back up) and then burn out the small area of the inside of the "u".
Back firing involves lighting a fire along a fire line with the goal of burning everything between the fire and the line. Sort of the same as burning out but on a much larger scale.
A control fire has nothing to do with wild fire suppression and is an intentionally set fire for stand improvement, etc.
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monolith
climber
SF bay area
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Aug 30, 2013 - 03:14pm PT
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Higher temps and lower humidity for the weekend.
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 30, 2013 - 09:44pm PT
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hey there say, was just checking on all the folks, khanom...
:)
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Aug 30, 2013 - 10:38pm PT
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abrams, rad image, tx for posting that
and yeah, that actually is a whole frickin lot better.
but upper clavey is under that smoke plume.
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John M
climber
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Aug 30, 2013 - 11:42pm PT
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Am I stupid for thinking the smoke plume should be getting smaller?
Looks thicker then ever.
Some of that is because they are doing burnouts. They establish lines in front of the fire, and then burn in towards the fire.
Fire Update as of August 30, 2013, 6am
Burnout operations continued overnight in the southeastern area of the fire. Fire crews continued construction of fire line along 3N01 Road to stop fire spread to the north. Structure defense continues in Pinecrest, Mi-Wuk Vilalge, Confidence, Cold Springs, and Hodgdon Meadow, and Big Oak Flat in Yosemite National Park. Today's plans are to continue the burnout in the Yosemite National Park south of Hetch Hetchy. If conditions allow, the Duckwall Mountain north of Fahey Meadow burnout will start. Air operations will support all firefighting efforts as needed.
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dave729
Trad climber
Western America
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Aug 30, 2013 - 11:46pm PT
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Every new fire line they make could be an epic mountain bike trail
once this is all over!
That's tax money doubly well spent!
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Charlie D.
Trad climber
Western Slope, Tahoe Sierra
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Aug 31, 2013 - 11:42am PT
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DM88T, am I reading the map correctly, looks like it's actively burning around Crane Flat and both Sequoia groves???
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climbski2
Mountain climber
Anchorage AK, Reno NV
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Aug 31, 2013 - 11:46am PT
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I noticed those hotspots also. I was hoping those were some type deliberately set fires to protect the area. Are they?
How much damage would this fire do to the grove? Aren't sequoias fairly resistant to fire.
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Aug 31, 2013 - 02:53pm PT
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hey there say, khanom... thanks for the update...
oh my, i am learning so much about where all these roads are and lead to, and these lovely areas... sadly, i am learning, through a bad fire, though...
you all are not forgotten, nor the firefighters... in your corner and praying...
god blesss...
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G_Gnome
Trad climber
who gave up and just goes sailing now!
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Aug 31, 2013 - 03:53pm PT
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Tuolumne is completely smoked out!!!
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abrams
Sport climber
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Aug 31, 2013 - 04:09pm PT
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Wind shifting the smoke and fire.
Picture from Crane Flat lookout said its under control there.
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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Aug 31, 2013 - 08:20pm PT
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10b4me
Ice climber
Soon 2B in Arizona
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Aug 31, 2013 - 09:08pm PT
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Mammoth is alo smoked out. can't see the mountain from town.
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Dr.Sprock
Boulder climber
I'm James Brown, Bi-atch!
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Aug 31, 2013 - 11:33pm PT
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how are those dozer lines doing west of pilot hill?
maybe time to start some back fires from the 140, just in case,
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zBrown
Ice climber
Brujo de La Playa
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I remember the smoke from the Otay Lakes fire in 2007 and how we had to wear masks even inside (about 10 miles from the fire).
Can't imagine the smoke in this one. What I'm wondering is how the impact of all the smoke is measured both short and long term.
Have to do some looking around.
Back.
Here's a start.
http://firechief.com/preplan/breathless
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mtnyoung
Trad climber
Twain Harte, California
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It just started raining here at the house. Big drops. If it keeps it up (just half an inch of rain please), it'll help a ton.
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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hey there say, all... just checking on you all...
:)
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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hey there say, bump for khanom...
*if it IS already up here, forgive... my dial up browers
MAY be stalled in 'earlier time' and now 'the here and now'
:O
ps: glad to hear the 60%
finally 'doubling' in a good way...
not like when it grew, :O
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WBraun
climber
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Hwy 120 to Crane Flat will not be re-opening in the original time frame.
The power is completely shutdown to the entire entrance station Hodgen infrastructure.
Until that infrastructure is reestablished as fully operational and fire crews deem the area safe you will see no opening.
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lostinshanghai
Social climber
someplace
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Authorities are investigating the cause of the blaze, but the possibility that it was started by an illegal marijuana growing operation was recently raised by a fire chief in Tuolomne County.
Todd McNeal, fire chief in the town of Twain Harte, west of Yosemite, said at an Aug. 23 community meeting that officials "know it's human caused, there’s no lightning in the area. … (We) highly suspect that it might be some sort of illicit grove, marijuana grow-type thing.”
His comments surfaced in a YouTube video of the meeting.
However, Rim Fire spokesman Brian Haines told NBC Bay Area that at this juncture, the marijuana theory is merely "an opinion."
In June, 15,000 marijuana plants were pulled out the forest to the south and four miles of irrigation pipe were removed, according to the San Jose Mercury News.
The newspaper said a 40-acre wildfire the month earlier in the same area was blamed on marijuana growers tied to Mexican drug cartels.
For one thing the stupid writer should at least spell the city right but wait: we or Tuolumne county is the Meth Capital of the West Coast, this should be interesting. More propaganda on the loose?
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Latest MODIS image, 20 minutes ago.
Looking really hot all along 120 from the Entrance to past Crane Flat. Yosemite Institute? Tuolumne and Merced Groves?
This is going to fundamentally alter the ecology of NW Yosemite for a long time to come.
Still moving up towards Mi-Wuk and Long Barn.
And down past Pilot Peak.
This is now a 4 front fire with big mileage between fronts. A logistical nightmare. At least all fronts are now reachable by mechanized teams.
The Valley bear problem is going to get much worse. All those Ursines are gonna scramble down the road and trails at night.
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JustThatEasy
climber
South Lake Tahoe, CA
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Is the only entrance/exit to the park through Wawona for now?
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klk
Trad climber
cali
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Latest MODIS image, 20 minutes ago.
i believe that the hits showing on the far nnw line are backfires.
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Chicken Skinner
Trad climber
Yosemite
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No both 140 and 41 are open. Bad smoke for two days (Friday and Saturday). Good now. We southern folks have been lucky. Park was quiet today. If the wind holds it is a good time to be here.
Ken
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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At @ seven a.m. and @ one minute apart.
Wind @ from southeast.
Wishing all on the lines @ the best you can get.
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Ikat
Social climber
Carson City
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This is what the Yosemite NP website says about the 120 closure:
•The Tioga Road (Highway 120 through the park) is closed from Crane Flat to Ten Lakes Trailhead (just west of Yosemite Creek Picnic Area), for the next five to seven days (as of September 2). The only access to the Tuolumne Meadows area is via Highway 120 from near Lee Vining
In other words, re-opening is not imminent.
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Ikat
Social climber
Carson City
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Increased containment gets a reduction of funding and resources, so I expect a slow slope rather than a steep one.
They've estimated containment at Sept 20 and I think they'll keep it going for another two weeks, at least.
100% containment = no more money for you.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Today's LA Times reports that the Twain Harte fire chief said it appears that it
was man-caused at a possible pot grow.
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Brandon-
climber
The Granite State.
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September 2, 2013 - I never had experienced how much heartbreak and relief could exist along a single street until June 27, 2012, when I stood and surveyed the charred remains of a Mountain Shadows neighborhood in Colorado Springs. The firefight was as epic as the devastation was striking. Some of us who were there that night received awards in emergency response, a few were commended in person by President Obama, and all of us were greeted as heroes by hundreds of sign-bearing flag-waving Coloradans. Even our money was often refused at gas stations and restaurants. We stammered uncomfortably, "Sorry ma'am that's so kind of you, but we can't accept that" or gave an awkward "Thank you so much, sir." I wondered, "How many of these people know that we are not actually recognized as firefighters?"
You see, on paper, we are not called federal wildland firefighters - we are called forestry and range "technicians." To us, it's the joke that's not funny. It comes at a great price that even our government job title fails to recognize us appropriately.
Few Americans see a green fire engine for what it is, know what a hotshot crew or hand crew really does, or has even heard of helitack. Even those closest to us cannot fully grasp what we do, the shifts we endure, and the risks we take. Men and women have many reasons for leaving home and family to battle fire, but none of us do it for recognition or to be a hero. We shy away from media and attention. We do this job because we love what we do, and those who don't, soon find the commitments too many and sacrifices too great.
Put in the spotlight, we revert to the things we learned our first year on the job: keep your head down, keep your minds calm, your composure modest, know your place, don't say or do anything stupid, and above all, do your job with "duty, respect, and integrity." We serve the People. We serve our country.
Image by Lindon Pronto, Bison Fire 7/13, NV
However, over the past few years I have come to realize that this silent, can-do work ethic, has contributed to our predicament. We continue to be treated and paid at sub-par levels relative to our counterparts in private, city, and state agencies. Our low profile has led the media to misrepresent, mischaracterize, and outright lie about who we are and what we do. It often feels like federal firefighters are purposely kept from public view: we don't have shiny red trucks, ironed and tidy uniforms, or enough aggressive public information officers to set the story straight for the headline. This doesn't entirely surprise us: we can be rugged folk by appearance. Many of us enjoy working in the woods and living simply. We don't have extensive uniform budgets (we personally purchase shirts, boots, etc.). We are the soldiers in the trenches; we don't have access or time for showers and razors. Simply put, when we are out there putting in long days, we are happily grimy, dirty, smelly, and hairy.
So, when you consider our culture of "asses and elbows", our diverse appearances, and the fact that the media isn't permitted to enter into our hazardous work zones to fully cover the duties we perform, it is no wonder our faces and voices don't make headlines. Furthermore, it would be a difficult task to sum up the work that forestry and range technicians of the federal land management agencies perform. The fact that we hail from four very separate government agencies, is testament to our broad range of duties and responsibilities. Our work cannot be as easily characterized as driving up in a fire truck, attending to the injured, and running into a burning building with a breathing apparatus and fire hose.
Were I to define us simply, I would say: federal wildland firefighters make up the largest and most professionally trained firefighting force in world. We staff fire engines and earth-movers, work from helicopters and jump from planes, move as 20 person crews of "ground pounders", and comprise complex teams that manage relief efforts beyond just devastating fires; our teams have also dealt with emergencies like 9/11 and natural disasters like Hurricane Katrina.
So what do we do out there? It would take me more than my allowable word count to get into that, but if you are interested in learning more from the front lines of wildland firefighting, I would encourage you to read works by Norman and John McClain. Instead, I will focus on the gist of what a standard work schedule and deployment looks like for us wildland firefighters:
In station we work 40 hour weeks, but most of us average 60 hours. Standard fire assignments are 14 days with extensions to 21 days (travel excluded). A 21 day assignment would approximately amount to 336 hours without days off, or about 8.5 work weeks. After 21 days, policy requires only one mandatory day of rest before reassignment. The norm is to receive up to two days of rest after a 14 day assignment. During an assignment when there is active and uncontained fire(s), federal firefighters (DOD excluded) work in 16 hour shifts, and are unpaid for the remaining 8 hours.
Some of the dangerous and adverse conditions that we encounter on the fireline include: extreme heat, extreme cold, heavy smoke, falling trees, steep rocky terrain, periods of extended physical and mental exertion, uninterrupted shifts in excess of 36 hours, limited rations of water and (very unhealthy) food, night shifts, sleep deprivation... You get the point. And yet, the above conditions combined with adrenaline, a sense of purpose, brotherhood, and duty, are also the exact same reasons we absolutely love our jobs.
We not only accept these aspects of our line of work, we LIVE for them.
There are however, aspects of our jobs that are for the sake of our health, sanity, livelihoods and particularly in supporting our families, harder for many of us to ignore:
We are treated and compensated at a much lesser standard than our private, city, and state counterparts who work beside us on the same incidents. For example, most non-federal firefighters are guaranteed hotels and portal to portal pay on incidents, ironically for which our government obligingly usually pays for. Take Cal Fire for example. They work 24 hours, then rest for 24 hours. If they are out of unit they are paid continuously for all 48 hours. During those 48 hours you can expect 16 hours of work (same shift schedule). In comparison, federal firefighters on the same incident will work 32 of 48 hours, usually are required to sleep in the dirt (alongside the convicts), and are not paid for more then 16 hours per day.
Cost-saving measures, at least in the Forest Service, commonly run rampant. Not being paid for 1/3 of the time we spend away from home and family is only one example. It is common now to be required to take unpaid lunch breaks while assigned to fires or even while out on the fireline. Hazard pay does not apply on prescribed fires, despite requirements of carrying a fire shelter (acknowledgement that our lives are at risk). Another instance: recently my crew was needed to monitor a very active fire perimeter throughout the night. So, less than half a mile from advancing 40ft flames, we crawled into our sleeping bags, which we threw down into ashes that were still warm from the fire having passed earlier. As we had leftover drinking water, our Meal Ready to Eat (MREs) and "appropriate sleeping accommodations" which our policy handbook defines as "paper sleeping bags" or otherwise, we were taken out of pay status for the following 8 hours.
Behind the scenes, groups and lobbyists have been trying for decades to improve our pay and working conditions.
These groups and individuals have won important battles for us. Earlier this year, for the first time ever, seasonal firefighters were finally given access to health benefits. Now I think it is time that the American people demand action too, which is why I am breaking my silence. It is my hope that you will join myself and others in fighting for some of these changes, particularly in demanding that federal firefighters be recognized on paper for what we do and who we are. Fortunately, a bill that would make many of our hopes a reality, and finally address the issues I have described, has just recently been introduced to Congress. The Wildland Firefighter Protection Act may never be signed into law if it proceeds quietly. This is why I am reaching out, hoping that a wave of public pressure and support for these firefighters will carry this legislation through the perilous waters of our gridlocked government.
We especially owe it to those firefighters who made the ultimate sacrifice. That they be honored by increased recognition and funding for agencies like the US Forest Service, that are tasked with keeping our resources and communities safe. This is a complex task, but raising the nation's collective awareness for what we do, and to recognize us as Federal Wildland Firefighters, is a crucial step. To us boots on the ground, it is a painful reality to not be properly recognized, to be denied the same benefits and financial support systems as the other "real" firefighters around the nation. We have no shortage of personal pride in what we do, but we are grossly lacking in demonstrative pride in us by our own government, elected officials, and the public who ultimately pay our salaries.
What H.R. 2858 the Wildland Firefighter Protection Act would do:
1. It would create a new occupational series for land management employees (USFS, BLM, NPS, FWS, and BIA) entitled "wildland firefighter" to more accurately reflect position duties.
2. It would finally introduce a 3-year pilot program for portal to portal pay for federal firefighters.
3. Hazard pay differential (.25%) would be factored in as base pay for retirement purposes.
4. Work performed after 1989 in fire preparedness and suppression may be credited for purposes of retirement calculations. (Many of us work multiple seasons before we receive permanent employment; seasonal work is not counted for pay raises or retirement calculations).
5. Lastly, the bill is designed to affect significant cost savings by addressing 21st century fire preparedness and suppression needs, and address dismal firefighter retention rates resulting from conditions described in this article. Low retention rates are also extremely costly, due to the complex, time consuming process of hiring so many firefighters who leave the agency for one with better pay and benefits.
PLEASE:
Petition the White House : http://wh.gov/lgzu9
Show support through MoveOn Civic Action: http://petitions.moveon.org/sign/wildland-firefighter/?source=search
And sign at Change.org (which helped get seasonals' health benefits): http://www.change.org/petitions/congress-please-support-h-r-2858-the-wildland-firefighters-protection-act
Official H.R. 2858 language:
http://beta.congress.gov/bill/113th/house-bill/2858/text
Thank you for your support.
The opinions and positions expressed in this editorial are entirely my own, and are not representative of the agency I work for.
Sincerely, Lindon Pronto
6-year Seasonal Wildland Firefighter
With the U.S. Forest Service
http://yubanet.com/opinions/Lindon-Pronto-I-am-a-Federal-Wildland-Firefighter-Not-a-Forestry-Technician.php#.UidFlBG9KSP
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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I did think it odd that no evidence was cited. Most pot grows aren't lacking
in evidence, no matter how hot the fire would have been. He did say there
had been no lightning which does seem substantiated.
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Bruce Morris
Social climber
Belmont, California
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Well, the area where the Rim Fire started has been a "prime" pot growing habitat for years and years. No proof yet. Just a surmise, but certainly not improbable given the time of year in late summer when growers hire "watchers" to keep the deer out of their harvest in September/October. Does seem as though public officials do have a decided preference for blaming a whole host of problems on pot growers. Wait for some solid evidence.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Does seem as though public officials do have a decided preference for blaming a whole host of problems on pot growers. Wait for some solid evidence. Public officials and locals.
However, not without reason. There've been two confirmed "pot fires" in my mountain area in the past 2 years. Fortunately both put out within a few hours.
Still no reason to jump to conclusions.
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lostinshanghai
Social climber
someplace
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If I recall years ago they would show on the news: sheriffs and LEO chopping, netting, hanging the loads below the helicopters to be sent where? Evidence, how much and the street price. Then I remember last year when another raid was shown on TV seeing the cache piled up and lit on fire as to burn the stuff there on site, taking a guess easier to do than fly the stuff out or with expense/budget cuts?
Just wondering if this is the case where FEDS burned the stuff and left not realizing they started it. No! tell me I am wrong this would never happen, a mistake from our own government. And would they admit it? No, they will get some cartel member and cut him a deal so he will say yes it was us. National Enquirer needs to investigate.
As for the delay in communication; as in no cell tower delivery to Groveland and beyond where the fire was just starting to get some speed saw right wing Tom McClintoch on local news yesterday saying to the effect that this could have happened but was cut off. ????
Looking for his comments now so far no dice.
So will have to wait it out.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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if this is the case where FEDS burned the stuff and left not realizing they started it. Very unlikely. They "always" lift the loads out by chopper.
They did several thousand plants in my neck of the woods a few days ago.
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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hey there say, thank to all the recent post shares...
as to fire and any other info, stats, etc...
glad to know folks are okay, as well...
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the albatross
Gym climber
Flagstaff
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Here is a link to NASA which map lovers will geek over. Beautiful rendition of the fires progress:
http://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/NaturalHazards/view.php?id=81971
I realize that most people don't think about wildfires unless they are in their backyard or playground or their home is on fire, but thought this informative link by Brandon is worth reposting. Please take the time to read through some of this information. ( I did not write the story below).
September 2, 2013 - I never had experienced how much heartbreak and relief could exist along a single street until June 27, 2012, when I stood and surveyed the charred remains of a Mountain Shadows neighborhood in Colorado Springs. The firefight was as epic as the devastation was striking. Some of us who were there that night received awards in emergency response, a few were commended in person by President Obama, and all of us were greeted as heroes by hundreds of sign-bearing flag-waving Coloradans. Even our money was often refused at gas stations and restaurants. We stammered uncomfortably, "Sorry ma'am that's so kind of you, but we can't accept that" or gave an awkward "Thank you so much, sir." I wondered, "How many of these people know that we are not actually recognized as firefighters?"
You see, on paper, we are not called federal wildland firefighters - we are called forestry and range "technicians." To us, it's the joke that's not funny. It comes at a great price that even our government job title fails to recognize us appropriately.
Few Americans see a green fire engine for what it is, know what a hotshot crew or hand crew really does, or has even heard of helitack. Even those closest to us cannot fully grasp what we do, the shifts we endure, and the risks we take. Men and women have many reasons for leaving home and family to battle fire, but none of us do it for recognition or to be a hero. We shy away from media and attention. We do this job because we love what we do, and those who don't, soon find the commitments too many and sacrifices too great.
Put in the spotlight, we revert to the things we learned our first year on the job: keep your head down, keep your minds calm, your composure modest, know your place, don't say or do anything stupid, and above all, do your job with "duty, respect, and integrity." We serve the People. We serve our country.
Image by Lindon Pronto, Bison Fire 7/13, NV
However, over the past few years I have come to realize that this silent, can-do work ethic, has contributed to our predicament. We continue to be treated and paid at sub-par levels relative to our counterparts in private, city, and state agencies. Our low profile has led the media to misrepresent, mischaracterize, and outright lie about who we are and what we do. It often feels like federal firefighters are purposely kept from public view: we don't have shiny red trucks, ironed and tidy uniforms, or enough aggressive public information officers to set the story straight for the headline. This doesn't entirely surprise us: we can be rugged folk by appearance. Many of us enjoy working in the woods and living simply. We don't have extensive uniform budgets (we personally purchase shirts, boots, etc.). We are the soldiers in the trenches; we don't have access or time for showers and razors. Simply put, when we are out there putting in long days, we are happily grimy, dirty, smelly, and hairy.
So, when you consider our culture of "asses and elbows", our diverse appearances, and the fact that the media isn't permitted to enter into our hazardous work zones to fully cover the duties we perform, it is no wonder our faces and voices don't make headlines. Furthermore, it would be a difficult task to sum up the work that forestry and range technicians of the federal land management agencies perform. The fact that we hail from four very separate government agencies, is testament to our broad range of duties and responsibilities. Our work cannot be as easily characterized as driving up in a fire truck, attending to the injured, and running into a burning building with a breathing apparatus and fire hose.
Were I to define us simply, I would say: federal wildland firefighters make up the largest and most professionally trained firefighting force in world. We staff fire engines and earth-movers, work from helicopters and jump from planes, move as 20 person crews of "ground pounders", and comprise complex teams that manage relief efforts beyond just devastating fires; our teams have also dealt with emergencies like 9/11 and natural disasters like Hurricane Katrina.
So what do we do out there? It would take me more than my allowable word count to get into that, but if you are interested in learning more from the front lines of wildland firefighting, I would encourage you to read works by Norman and John McClain. Instead, I will focus on the gist of what a standard work schedule and deployment looks like for us wildland firefighters:
In station we work 40 hour weeks, but most of us average 60 hours. Standard fire assignments are 14 days with extensions to 21 days (travel excluded). A 21 day assignment would approximately amount to 336 hours without days off, or about 8.5 work weeks. After 21 days, policy requires only one mandatory day of rest before reassignment. The norm is to receive up to two days of rest after a 14 day assignment. During an assignment when there is active and uncontained fire(s), federal firefighters (DOD excluded) work in 16 hour shifts, and are unpaid for the remaining 8 hours.
Some of the dangerous and adverse conditions that we encounter on the fireline include: extreme heat, extreme cold, heavy smoke, falling trees, steep rocky terrain, periods of extended physical and mental exertion, uninterrupted shifts in excess of 36 hours, limited rations of water and (very unhealthy) food, night shifts, sleep deprivation... You get the point. And yet, the above conditions combined with adrenaline, a sense of purpose, brotherhood, and duty, are also the exact same reasons we absolutely love our jobs.
We not only accept these aspects of our line of work, we LIVE for them.
There are however, aspects of our jobs that are for the sake of our health, sanity, livelihoods and particularly in supporting our families, harder for many of us to ignore:
We are treated and compensated at a much lesser standard than our private, city, and state counterparts who work beside us on the same incidents. For example, most non-federal firefighters are guaranteed hotels and portal to portal pay on incidents, ironically for which our government obligingly usually pays for. Take Cal Fire for example. They work 24 hours, then rest for 24 hours. If they are out of unit they are paid continuously for all 48 hours. During those 48 hours you can expect 16 hours of work (same shift schedule). In comparison, federal firefighters on the same incident will work 32 of 48 hours, usually are required to sleep in the dirt (alongside the convicts), and are not paid for more then 16 hours per day.
Cost-saving measures, at least in the Forest Service, commonly run rampant. Not being paid for 1/3 of the time we spend away from home and family is only one example. It is common now to be required to take unpaid lunch breaks while assigned to fires or even while out on the fireline. Hazard pay does not apply on prescribed fires, despite requirements of carrying a fire shelter (acknowledgement that our lives are at risk). Another instance: recently my crew was needed to monitor a very active fire perimeter throughout the night. So, less than half a mile from advancing 40ft flames, we crawled into our sleeping bags, which we threw down into ashes that were still warm from the fire having passed earlier. As we had leftover drinking water, our Meal Ready to Eat (MREs) and "appropriate sleeping accommodations" which our policy handbook defines as "paper sleeping bags" or otherwise, we were taken out of pay status for the following 8 hours.
Behind the scenes, groups and lobbyists have been trying for decades to improve our pay and working conditions.
These groups and individuals have won important battles for us. Earlier this year, for the first time ever, seasonal firefighters were finally given access to health benefits. Now I think it is time that the American people demand action too, which is why I am breaking my silence. It is my hope that you will join myself and others in fighting for some of these changes, particularly in demanding that federal firefighters be recognized on paper for what we do and who we are. Fortunately, a bill that would make many of our hopes a reality, and finally address the issues I have described, has just recently been introduced to Congress. The Wildland Firefighter Protection Act may never be signed into law if it proceeds quietly. This is why I am reaching out, hoping that a wave of public pressure and support for these firefighters will carry this legislation through the perilous waters of our gridlocked government.
We especially owe it to those firefighters who made the ultimate sacrifice. That they be honored by increased recognition and funding for agencies like the US Forest Service, that are tasked with keeping our resources and communities safe. This is a complex task, but raising the nation's collective awareness for what we do, and to recognize us as Federal Wildland Firefighters, is a crucial step. To us boots on the ground, it is a painful reality to not be properly recognized, to be denied the same benefits and financial support systems as the other "real" firefighters around the nation. We have no shortage of personal pride in what we do, but we are grossly lacking in demonstrative pride in us by our own government, elected officials, and the public who ultimately pay our salaries.
What H.R. 2858 the Wildland Firefighter Protection Act would do:
1. It would create a new occupational series for land management employees (USFS, BLM, NPS, FWS, and BIA) entitled "wildland firefighter" to more accurately reflect position duties.
2. It would finally introduce a 3-year pilot program for portal to portal pay for federal firefighters.
3. Hazard pay differential (.25%) would be factored in as base pay for retirement purposes.
4. Work performed after 1989 in fire preparedness and suppression may be credited for purposes of retirement calculations. (Many of us work multiple seasons before we receive permanent employment; seasonal work is not counted for pay raises or retirement calculations).
5. Lastly, the bill is designed to affect significant cost savings by addressing 21st century fire preparedness and suppression needs, and address dismal firefighter retention rates resulting from conditions described in this article. Low retention rates are also extremely costly, due to the complex, time consuming process of hiring so many firefighters who leave the agency for one with better pay and benefits.
PLEASE:
Petition the White House : http://wh.gov/lgzu9
Show support through MoveOn Civic Action: http://petitions.moveon.org/sign/wildland-firefighter/?source=search
And sign at Change.org (which helped get seasonals' health benefits): http://www.change.org/petitions/congress-please-support-h-r-2858-the-wildland-firefighters-protection-act
Official H.R. 2858 language:
http://beta.congress.gov/bill/113th/house-bill/2858/text
Thank you for your support.The opinions and positions expressed in this editorial are entirely my own, and are not representative of the agency I work for.
Sincerely, Lindon Pronto
6-year Seasonal Wildland Firefighter
With the U.S. Forest Service
http://yubanet.com/opinions/Lindon-Pronto-I-am-a-Federal-Wildland-Firefighter-Not-a-Forestry-Technician.php#.UidFlBG9KSP
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mouse from merced
Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
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F*#k a buncha causes and conspiracy theories, though it's interesting when you put your mind to it, Jay...
"At 371 square miles, the Tuolumne County fire remains the fourth-largest in California since the state began keeping records in 1932. But the wildfire's growth has slowed nearly to a halt in the last few days and was 80 percent contained by Wednesday. Hundreds of firefighters have been sent home, and most area residents have been told it's safe to return home. Full containment is expected within two weeks."
From the last post's link.
Best news out there this morning.
Yay!
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ontheedgeandscaredtodeath
Social climber
SLO, Ca
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Not really that surprising, though when you mix people with hot and dry conditions fires just get started one way or another.
Nor would a pot grow as the source be surprising--I've personally put out a pot farm fire. It was their camp fire they used during harvest. Pretty nice terraced operation in the middle of freaking nowhere.
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10b4me
Ice climber
Soon 2B in Arizona
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Cause of Rim fire could be a hunter.
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aspendougy
Trad climber
Los Angeles, CA
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Dear QINIT:
Suppose it was a hunter with a Mexican/Illegal Alien Father and a Mother from Iran? Then you can stereotype him as triple evil!!
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YosemiteSteve
Trad climber
CA
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Since the fire started on the opening day of archery season for deer and bear, blame the bow nuts.
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Bruce Morris
Social climber
Belmont, California
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Bring back Madame Guillotine and public executions as a form of deterrence. We can all sell Veggie Burgers and commemorative postcards to the crowd in the village square.
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Dr.Sprock
Boulder climber
I'm James Brown, Bi-atch!
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weed farmer too careful,
hunter no good, crap in hole, leave paper all over the bushes,
start fire to roast weeny,
fire get out of control quick,
cost big money,
hunter in trouble,
next time hunter buy Spam at super market, save money, tax payer happy,
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Ikat
Social climber
Carson City
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120 W outside the park and Tioga Pass Road closure still in effect according to Sept 6 am RimFire update:
http://inciweb.nwcg.gov/incident/3660
My guess is that it won't be until middle of next week. Still a lot of backburning going on right along TPR.
Carson City had a merciful, but brief respite from the smoke yesterday and people were joyfull about seeing blue sky and being able to open their windows again. However, that means it's back to hot dry winds and Red Flag warnings for more potential fires.
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Approximately 2,490 structures remain threatened in areas near the fire perimeter to the north, south, and southeast portions of the fire.
There was limited spotting of embers across firelines on the fire's northern flank in the area of Clavey Meadow, and on the southern flank along Tioga Road. Firefighters are having success containing these spotfires. It ain't over till its over.
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Climbnc
Trad climber
Carrboro, NC
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Looks like 120 is open
Great news - Highway 120 west of Yosemite and the Big Oak Flat Road reopens today at noon! Yosemite Valley will be accessible. Along with the road, the Big Oak Flat Information Station will also open. The Hodgdon Meadow and Crane Flat Campgrounds remain closed, as do the Tuolumne and Merced Groves of Giant Sequoias. Additionally, the Tioga Road will remain closed between Crane Flat and 1.5 miles east of White Wolf through this weekend as firing operations continue. View the news release: http://www.nps.gov/yose/parknews/bofreopens13.htm
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Towards the end of that video, the Glacier Point shots. Note how the fire waxes and wanes with the time of day!
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TrackerTodd
Mountain climber
CA
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Awesome picture lost! haha
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Nkane
Trad climber
San Francisco, USA
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So I just got up to the valley after driving the newly reopened 120. It's hard to tell the extent of the destruction at night, but i think it was less than I feared. Lots of scorch marks but the trees mostly still had their needles. Not the apocalyptic hellscape I was dreading. It'll be easier to see heading back on sunday. Smoke was still heavy.
But what really gave me hope was seeing a little fox scamper across the road right in the middle of the fire zone. Made me think that not all the natural beauty was torched by this thing.
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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hey there say, khanom...
thanks for the update...
say, i just heard from matt...
?think the phone lines still may not be working, as, he called from
a track phone...
foggy looking, up there at his place, he said...
but he's got some work, at least... very thankful for that...
say:
man oh man, i just hear his more detailed story of getting his horse out:
FIVE mile hike through NIGHT by moonlighT--and THE SKY was clear, at that... poor horse was balking, turned out he had a bit of metal--must have just happened at the start--in his foot... all is well now, though, it was not in a serious-to-do-worse-damage, type depth... whewwwwwwww....
well, keep up posted, khanom, thanks again for sharing...
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cultureshock
Trad climber
Mountain View
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Drove through the burn zone from yosemite back to groveland on the 120 on Sunday 9/8.
Seems quite apocalyptic. Lots of damage visible on both sides of the road.
Side roads like Evergreen and Hardin Flat are marked Closed due to wildfire, permit required for access.
Valley was clear of smoke on Saturday. Sunday the winds changed and smoke was everywhere.
Sun was super red all day very similar to this:
Regards to those in the burn zones. Looks like it will be quite some time before things are back to "normal".
We spotted quite a few smoking trees along the 120.
 Luke
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mucci
Trad climber
The pitch of Bagalaar above you
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Thanks High T!
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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that animation is WEIRD! Watch the durned thing "breathe" in and out.
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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hey there say, cultureshock...
thanks for the share...
still keeping you in mind khanom...
still praying for the firefighters...
tried to hit a few more taco, pasts, as well, but got to go now...
:)
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TrackerTodd
Mountain climber
CA
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Great pics High T, sure does show some tough people.
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Sep 10, 2013 - 12:17am PT
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hey there say, khanom and all...
wow, matt called me for a bit, on a track phone so they must not have phone service, yet... his voice sounded rough, so i am wondering if it was from the smoke :O
sure hope all these folks will be okay, after all this... wow, hard breathing that smoke, :O
but--what can you do? filter it somehow??
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Ikat
Social climber
Carson City
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Sep 10, 2013 - 12:19am PT
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That is an astonishing photo
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Lambone
Big Wall climber
Ashland, Or
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Sep 10, 2013 - 12:09pm PT
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So 120 is open again? I'm headed down from Oregon this weekend.
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John M
climber
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Sep 10, 2013 - 12:18pm PT
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120 is open if you are heading into the park through Groveland going to the valley. It is closed from Craneflat to Yosemite creek as you head towards Tioga Pass. To get to the meadows you have to enter from the East side.
http://www.nps.gov/yose/planyourvisit/rimfire.htm
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Ikat
Social climber
Carson City
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Sep 10, 2013 - 12:28pm PT
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The WEST entrance 120 from Groveland is open and you can access the valley floor.
Tioga Pass Road is closed at Crane Flat and beyond because of active fire spotting, some of which crossed the road. That edge of the fire is not entirely contained.
From Tioga Pass, you can get to Tuolumne Meadows, Tenaya, Olmstead area but no further than Yosemite Creek so east siders can't drive to the valley floor.
Hoping for this weekend.
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superclimber
Trad climber
Houston, Tx
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Sep 11, 2013 - 01:28pm PT
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Any word on current smoke conditions at tuolumne?
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Roots
Mountain climber
SoCal
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Sep 11, 2013 - 04:37pm PT
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From Tioga Pass, you can get to Tuolumne Meadows, Tenaya, Olmstead area but no further than Yosemite Creek so east siders can't drive to the valley floor.
Glad I checked this thread - hope they open 'er up in time for Facelift...coming in from 395. Would hate to have to go around.
Props to the firefighters = badass folks!
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Strider
Trad climber
ಠ_ಠ
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Sep 12, 2013 - 03:21am PT
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Latest RUMOR on Tioga rd opening is SLIGHT chance of this weekend, probable chance of Monday.
We'll see what happens.
-n
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Dr.Sprock
Boulder climber
I'm James Brown, Bi-atch!
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Sep 12, 2013 - 05:34am PT
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just started a backfire in santa cruz,
sierras should be fuel free by christmas,
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Charlie D.
Trad climber
Western Slope, Tahoe Sierra
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Sep 12, 2013 - 08:11am PT
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Got up to TM earlier this week, had a great smoke free bike ride loving the lack of cars/people only to think of what a shame it's been all the way around particularly those business's whose life blood is the highway.
Sure hope it opens soon for their sake, we should all try and help the best we can as we move on into the fall.
Charlie D.
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Arborist
Trad climber
Los Gatos, CA
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Sep 12, 2013 - 11:54am PT
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Thanks for all the great information about this fire. The visuals really put things into perspective. Thank you to all the firefighters who are risking their lives to put this mess into some sort of control.
Blair
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Roots
Mountain climber
SoCal
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Sep 12, 2013 - 03:01pm PT
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How about the 108 - is it open? Tried to find info on internet but it was confusing for my simple mind..
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Ikat
Social climber
Carson City
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Sep 12, 2013 - 03:03pm PT
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108 is open. Some reports have said it was smoke free and beautiful, others have said the western side is hazy, but clears off substantially east of Sonora.
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TrackerTodd
Mountain climber
CA
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Sep 12, 2013 - 11:45pm PT
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Already booked a few nights up at Evergreen and I plan on stopping In Groveland and hitting up as mush shopping as the pocket book will allow.
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Bruce Morris
Social climber
Belmont, California
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Sep 13, 2013 - 02:26am PT
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Tioga Pass Resort announced it was planning on closing early for the season this Sunday (Sept. 15th) due to lack of business because of the closure of US 120 between Crane Flat and White Wolf. No organic burgers or pie a la mode after that. The 2013 Tioga Pass Run was held last Sunday, September 8th and was a great success.
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Ikat
Social climber
Carson City
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Sep 13, 2013 - 02:33am PT
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I notice the Yosemite NP website has a new note about Tioga Pass Road:
•The Tioga Road (Highway 120 through the park) is closed from Crane Flat to 1.5 miles east of White Wolf at least through the weekend.
"at least through the weekend" is in italics on the site.
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Ikat
Social climber
Carson City
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Sep 13, 2013 - 12:45pm PT
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The Yosemite park website still says TPR will be closed AT LEAST through the weekend.
There had been a comment on FB last week about a potential opening for next weekend, Sept 21.
Need to stay tuned for it all. We might have a better idea by Wednesday. The forest service is in no hurry to open this road to traffic. They are actually logging the area and if you have any inkling what that's like you certainly don't want to be there trying to snake around logging trucks and tractors, and they don't want us looky-loo tourons in the mix.
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Stephen McCabe
Trad climber
near Santa Cruz, CA
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Sep 13, 2013 - 02:39pm PT
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When I think of TPR, I think of the Tioga Pass Resort. Referring to it as the Tioga Pass Road, might help head off confusion.
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ontheedgeandscaredtodeath
Social climber
SLO, Ca
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Sep 13, 2013 - 02:44pm PT
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I'm pretty sure the forest service is not logging in Yosemite National Park.
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Ikat
Social climber
Carson City
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Sep 13, 2013 - 03:01pm PT
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The fire fighters have been logging to get access roads and dead timber along the fire lines. The RimFire Indicent page and some other firefighting blogs describe it.
Commercial logging? No. For firefighting, yes.
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Ikat
Social climber
Carson City
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Sep 13, 2013 - 03:02pm PT
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TPR (Tioga Pass Resort) is also closed for the season as of Sept 15.
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ontheedgeandscaredtodeath
Social climber
SLO, Ca
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Sep 13, 2013 - 03:43pm PT
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Cutting down trees for firefighting is called "firefighting," not logging.
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Inner City
Trad climber
East Bay
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Sep 17, 2013 - 02:53pm PT
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Tioga Road now open, 25 mph and no stopping...
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John M
climber
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Sep 21, 2013 - 09:04pm PT
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How much rain have yall gotten over there? We have gotten 4/10s of an inch here in Wawona.
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John M
climber
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Sep 21, 2013 - 10:02pm PT
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Its hard to teach old dogs new tricks. Its still raining here. We are now over 0.7 inches.
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Ikat
Social climber
Carson City
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Sep 21, 2013 - 11:00pm PT
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Tioga Pass closed this evening because of snow.
It will open again.
Highway 108 is also closed because of snow.
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Plaidman
Trad climber
South Slope of Mt. Tabor, Portland, Oregon, USA
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Sep 21, 2013 - 11:38pm PT
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Is the road open. We are on I-5 headed that way tonight. We wanna go 120 into Yosemite Valley. Do we need to detour?
Plaid
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Ikat
Social climber
Carson City
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Sep 22, 2013 - 12:00am PT
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Plaidman- Highway 120 on the west side (through Groveland) into the park is open.
You will be able to access the park from I-5 as usual.
The closure of Tioga Pass won't be for long, just as soon as the snow melts off tomorrow.
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Captain...or Skully
climber
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Sep 22, 2013 - 12:06am PT
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Stupid pass ..hanging in Hawthorne...
Sigh
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Plaidman
Trad climber
South Slope of Mt. Tabor, Portland, Oregon, USA
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Sep 22, 2013 - 12:09am PT
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Thanks for the info. You two are lifesavers. Cherry flavor I think.
Plaid
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neebee
Social climber
calif/texas
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Nov 20, 2013 - 10:24am PT
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hey there say, khanom... just sent you an email...
:)
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HighTraverse
Trad climber
Bay Area
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Nov 20, 2013 - 05:05pm PT
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I'd guess it's closed now for the rest of the winter.
I came over a week ago. Tuolumne is amazing when there are fewer than 50 people along the entire road.
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| Messages 1 - 512 of total 512 in this topic |
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