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steve s
Trad climber
eldo
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FYI...The road thru the town of Eldo is privately owned by the Eldorado Springs water Company. They do as they see fit in regards to road maintenance. The state park merely has an easement and no maintenance rights. The locals have no say what so ever on the road.
On a lighter note it is interesting to hear the "whining" about the road being "bad". And You folks call yourselves climbers???!!Its all of about 1/4 mile of gravel that gets graded twice a year.A Porsche 911 can drive up it. Lord help ya if you ever have to go to Moses ,or many other climbing areas that are on dirt roads. If you whine about the road it does not seem like you are really a "climber". Does it? Please lets drop the road talk and focus on the debate about the proposed AAC hostel. Also I respectively ask that you put your real/legal name on your posts so that we can "all" take your comments seriously. This goes for both sides of the debate. Thanks ,Steve Sangdahl
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goatboy smellz
climber
Nederland-GulfBreeze
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There is plenty of parking in front of the post office,
that should not be an issue to anyone who has seen the layout.
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Jon Beck
Trad climber
Oceanside
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From Google Maps
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goatboy smellz
climber
Nederland-GulfBreeze
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They could squeeze a few more in that side yard or park up at the overflow pool parking. NBD.
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JLP
Social climber
The internet
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That's not how codes work...
A second look at that building makes me wonder about 20+ people, legal bedrooms, egress and fire code...
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goatboy smellz
climber
Nederland-GulfBreeze
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Codes can change if you have the right lawyers.
In this town conservation takes a back seat to money & developers.
Just look what happened within the last 20 years on University Hill, North Boulder, etc.
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maldaly
Trad climber
Boulder, CO
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I love the idea of a climber's hostel in Eldo. I'm always uncomfortable when climbers, known and unknown, can't find economical climber's accommodations in the Boulder. A hostel would go a long ways towards easing that need. I am concerned about the parking situation though. I hope the AAC, the town of Eldorado Springs and the country can come to an adequate agreement on that.
Thanks Phil and the AAC and thanks Christian and the Eldo locals who are providing input.
Mal
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crunch
Social climber
CO
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If the model for the hostel is the Tetons Ranch, then there will be need for parking for up to 20 cars. (rental cars from DIA, or else road-tripping visitors).
Climbing visitors will walk into the canyon from the hostel, so leaving their cars parked all day. This might be tricky (Eldo town parking is always tricky), though they can always park along the roadside to the east of any of the houses, it's pretty unlimited that direction.
But if the visitors will have cars (and at the Teton Ranch, that is pretty much always the case) then the location is not so critical; visiting climbers can drive into the park and park there during the day.
The world has changed since the 70s. No one hitchhikes any more. Rental cars are cheap. Through word of mouth and the internet, most visiting climbers can find a floor to sleep on in nearby Boulder with friends of friends for a short stay. That's how it's been for decades--no camping near here, but anyone who really wants to seems to find a way to visit and climb. So I'm not sure a hostel needs to be within walking distance of the park.
The location near the gas station out by the main road might work equally well. The landowners out there, just north of the gas station, have been (I think?) struggling to attract renters for many years. The office building across the road from the gas station was eventually demolished after no one rented it in decade or more.
Though Eldo itself has long been a destination resort kind of place, so all the noise and bustle and dogs and kids go with the territory, and when I first climbed there a major hazard was the rabid dogs and their drunken owners living in school busses parked just east of the Bastille. Occasional street parties and events I've been to, with sometimes many dozens of people, there's been parking. And a 20-person hostel is not THAT big!
But, whatever. Main point is that times change (and so does Eldorado) and I wonder if the walking-distance, hostel-style bunk-bed climbers' accommodation might not be as good an idea as it once would have been.
Crusher
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Crackslayer
Trad climber
Eldo
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Everyone calling eldo residents "elitist" is a bonehead. Fact is us eldo locals like the fact that eldo hasnt changed. It's the same small town it's always been. There are many children in town and hence the speed limit and dirt. If we pave the road people will drive fast putting little kids in danger. Well spoken words Steve S. I hope the AAC does the right thing and does not build the hostel.
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goatboy smellz
climber
Nederland-GulfBreeze
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^^^Eldo has changed considerably, you must be new in town if you think it hasn't changed.
I've renovated 20 different homes in that canyon and all of the new owners were multi millionaires buying out hippies that bought in the '70s, '80s and '90s.
I drive slow when I go through there but you decided to live in an entrance to a state park with limited access so you better deal with the consequences. Spare us the save the children attitude.
Teach your kids to look both ways or run faster.
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JLP
Social climber
The internet
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Rental cars are cheap... Yes, exactly, and they'll need them. There's more to climbing here than Eldo. They're going to go to Pearl, Southern Sun and the Hill, too.
A couple other things about the Ranch - it's a place to find partners, have social gatherings, etc. People come and go 24/7.
This Post Office thing sounds like an endless rathole. It's going to be a super expensive and lengthy process for a little nugget of nothing in a congested hippie commune. Seems like that kind of money and hassle could do a whole lot more good just a couple miles away.
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ms55401
Trad climber
minneapolis, mn
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wow, I would expect this kind of nimbyism in Greenwich or Edina
if the townies really want to pull the drawbridge, just buy the f*#king lot and make it a park or whatever
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Janet Robinson
climber
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Hi Mark
Thanks for your post and your promise of transparency. I am both a climber and an Eldo homeowner.
Please can you share the AAC transportation study ?
Please can you describe how you plan to accommodate parking for 20 guests, employees, and post office patrons?
I encourage all involved to look at the google view of the building in conjunction with the survey on the Boulder County Land Use web site LS-11-0156, sorry I could not paste it on to here.
The building sits on the property line on both the east and south sides. The north side abuts the road, there is a few feet of space between the west side of the building and the neighboring residential lot. There is very limited space for any outside enjoyment without encroaching on the residential lots to the west, east and north of the building. Yes it's a rat hole if you look closely at the lot lines.
Is there any consideration for the school bus turn around spot in front of the post office which has served as many as 30 valley and town kids for over 30 years ? I asked Phil Powers but he's not answered my email.
The post office has a lease until 2017, that's cuts into you lodging space, so you will be cramming 20 guests plus on site management into less than 4,000 sq ft for at least a million dollars before maintenance costs.
So a crammed building on a crammed lot in a crammed town. Please reconsider your proposal.
Thanks! Janet Robinson
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storminjoe
Trad climber
Westminster
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Honestly, my perception is that early on this situation could have been worked out, but it appears that due to the letter and other actions the locals are entrenched. This is going to be a hard one to work out now. Way to get this off the ground AAC. I have a stake here as I climb in the canyon on a regular basis and would rather not have the locals pissed off at me every time I drive through the town. The reception is already less than friendly and I would rather not have it cool further. This also somewhat confirms my apprehension on being a member of the AAC. I haven't had confidence in the the organizations ability to handle its business and operate in a way that doesn't seem entitled and elitist. Apprehension confirmed. The AAC has no idea how to deal with average communities, climbing or not.
I can say this, and policy and grassroots organizing are my area of work, that if someone in my organization broke ranks and message like Burris, they would be gone before the day was over. Period. That might be a good first step in starting to repair the situation. Next hear the locals concerns and develop a plan that actively addresses the main concerns. Address the parking issue as that seems to be the real hangup. Here is a suggestion, hold the right to the parking spaces, but offer the unused spaces to the locals after say, 6:00 p.m. Last, the AAC's reputation is horrible. Its time to bring in someone to help the organization internally understand your place, develop a P.R. strategy and develop a culture that is competent, strategic and relevant to the times. Strategy going forward: Do no more damage to the organizations reputation and do not leave the situation in Eldo worse than when you found it.
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Todd Eastman
climber
Bellingham, WA
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I would guess that nearly all property owners in Eldorado Canyon are enjoying their properties due to being grandfathered into existing code or because of variances to existing code. Perhaps a re-visit to the flood plain map is in order...
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Decko
Trad climber
Colorado
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Phew,
What a pissing match......
Have any (well I know a few have) of the people bitching on here ever been to the Climbers Ranch in the Tetons ??
I've been a few times, read, a few times, and even with a 6 year old and have found the place to be dead quiet after 9pm.......
I spent 2.5 month sport climbing in Tonsai Thailand, and only once went to the beach to party......New Years Eve....
Other than that most visiting climbers are there to climb, climb, climb.....
America is so backwards when it comes to access for climbers it's sad.
Yes "Eldo" is full of well, well off folks that don't climb and folks that well climb really freakin hard.....
Build it and they will come.......
And most will see it's no big deal, and yea I'd much rather hang down at a crowded "hostel" with a six pack and talk sh#t and beta with a bunch of like mined folks than go to a wine tasting at a snotty nosed new home owner....
I say this all from looking down on Eldorado Springs for 15 years of climbing from above, on the rocks, and having driven that potholed hell of a road...
Watching the McMansion sprout up.....
Maybe out by the highway is better for the residence.....
But man when you stay at the climbers ranch in the Tetons and wake up the the views there......
Damn.......
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Janet Robinson
climber
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A petition signed by 100 plus residents of Eldorado Springs was sent to the AAC, here's their response, check out how they sign off, it's classic.
Penn Burris Reponse to Petition
From: Penn Burris <pburris@americanalpineclub.org>
To: AAC Eldorado Springs Petition <aac.eldoradosprings.petition@gmail.com>
Date: Tue, May 28, 2013 at 4:56 PM
Good afternoon-
This is to acknowledge receipt of the email below and the attached "petition". I have circulated this to the Executive Committee of the American Alpine Club and will provide this to our attorneys as well.
It is truly disappointing that such questionable ethics and situational motives has been able to create so much community drama through the peddling of knowingly false information, inflammatory statements and blatant lies. The attached petition, while seemingly "signed" by so many "concerned" citizens, is purely the result of concentrated efforts to promote a self-serving, alternate agenda...as such it is barely worth the paper it is written on and certainly is incapable of capturing any real sense of the community.
The American Alpine Club and myself, personally, have been thoughtful, respectful and transparent in every step of the process. I have honestly answered every question posed (only to have those very emails selectively edited and circulated in an effort to mislead), appeared before the Eldorado Springs Community Association and attended the sewer LID meeting as requested. Most importantly we had begun the process of a Site Plan Review with Boulder County which the originators of this "petition" were fully aware of, yet attempted to conceal from the community. All of these things were done in an effort to be a good (new) neighbor, NOT because they are legally required, as we look to repurpose a neglected building that has been used commercially for more than forty years.
While we respect the opinions and ideas of others, this shallow attempt to bully a small non-profit organization, with nothing but good intentions and clearly serving the needs of others, has left us very much undeterred in our mission and plans.
Shame on you.
L. Penn Burris
Director of Operations/CFO
The American Alpine Club
Petition
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Todd Eastman
climber
Bellingham, WA
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Seems a reasonable response...
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noriko nakagawa
Trad climber
eldorado springs co
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As another Eldo resident, I completely agree with Steve S. Summers are the most miserable time of year when our quiet town is overrun with pool visitors and overflow from the park. The hostel is an ill-conceived idea given other less impactful locations close by. Good thing I renewed my AAC membership.
-Michelle
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