risking his life to tell you about NSA surveillance [ot]


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J man

Trad climber
morgan hill
Jun 20, 2013 - 03:52pm PT
American reporter feeling big brothers eye watching


It’s a fear. You don’t really cower under the desk.
But its a nagging fear, a trepidation.
Something that never goes away. Obama is watching you, monitoring
whatever you do.

If you make a mistake, you will pay for it. Eventually. Some day.
Your future is bleak.

Basically, you are being silenced. Everyone is. Purposefully or not, they are trying to shut you down and shut you up.

They say they’re not, but they are.
They say they don’t believe they are, but they are.
They have protective password mechanisms in place, but who has access? Someday your enemies will.

We have to rely on the beneficence of our overseers, but only a fool should rest easy.
How can we believe in anything? Everything is too big. We are just cogs in
the big wheel of the surveillence state.

And here’s the big problem: it’s only getting worse as every little
detail is being recorded into the searchable database.

So live in fear. There is a Bad Santa watching you. And he decides if
you've been bad or good.
J man

Trad climber
morgan hill
Jun 20, 2013 - 04:01pm PT
Credit: J man

Social climber
So Cal
Jun 20, 2013 - 10:06pm PT

Sport climber
Jun 21, 2013 - 02:20am PT
The secret rules that allow NSA to use US data without a warrant

"The Fisa court's oversight role has been referenced many times by Barack Obama and senior intelligence officials as they have sought to reassure the public about surveillance, but the procedures approved by the court have never before been publicly disclosed.

The top secret documents published today detail the circumstances in which data collected on US persons under the foreign intelligence authority must be destroyed, extensive steps analysts must take to try to check targets are outside the US, and reveals how US call records are used to help remove US citizens and residents from data collection.

However, alongside those provisions, the Fisa court-approved policies allow the NSA to:

• Keep data that could potentially contain details of US persons for up to five years;

• Retain and make use of "inadvertently acquired" domestic communications if they contain usable intelligence, information on criminal activity, threat of harm to people or property, are encrypted, or are believed to contain any information relevant to cybersecurity;

• Preserve "foreign intelligence information" contained within attorney-client communications;

• Access the content of communications gathered from "U.S. based machine[s]" or phone numbers in order to establish if targets are located in the US, for the purposes of ceasing further surveillance.

The broad scope of the court orders, and the nature of the procedures set out in the documents, appear to clash with assurances from President Obama and senior intelligence officials that the NSA could not access Americans' call or email information without warrants."

The whole article: http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jun/20/fisa-court-nsa-without-warrant

Trad climber
Jun 21, 2013 - 02:49am PT

using encription is "the same" as being under suspicion as far as their allowing themselves to think


Social climber
Portland, Oregon
Jun 21, 2013 - 03:10am PT
And Use of Tor and e-mail crypto could increase chances that NSA keeps your data/ this is why everyone should use GPG or similar to encrypt their email. At least make them pay (computer time) for accessing email communication.

My key is here: http://pangram.org/steve/pubkey.txt


Jun 21, 2013 - 09:43am PT
This is cool I'm just taking pictures of buttholes and lips encrypting them and letting NSA open them to discover my secret message.

Kissssssss my assssss


Sport climber
Jun 21, 2013 - 11:10am PT
"Asked about US surveillance programmes in an earlier interview with a Spanish technology news site, FayerWayer, Steve Wozniak said: "All these things about the constitution, that made us so good as people – they are kind of nothing.

"They are all dissolved with the Patriot Act. There are all these laws that just say 'we can secretly call anything terrorism and do anything we want, without the rights of courts to get in and say you are doing wrong things'. There's not even a free open court any more. Read the constitution. I don't know how this stuff happened. It's so clear what the constitution says."

He said he had been brought up to believe that "communist Russia was so bad because they followed their people, they snooped on them, they arrested them, they put them in secret prisons, they disappeared them – these kinds of things were part of Russia. We are getting more and more like that.""
Dingus Milktoast

Gym climber
And every fool knows, a dog needs a home, and...
Jun 21, 2013 - 11:12am PT
Yes and a majority of Americans SUPPORTED THE PATRIOT ACT including some on this board who now rail against this sort of intrusion.



Social climber
So Cal
Jun 21, 2013 - 11:13am PT
Just replace "national interest" with "regime interests" for most of the story and it reads correctly.


Why do the FDA, Dept. of Agriculture NOAA and the Peace Corps have to do with legitimate national security interests?
Karl Baba

Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
Jun 21, 2013 - 01:37pm PT
Seeing someone in the position of James Clapper - the Director of National Intelligence - baldly lying to the public without repercussion is the evidence of a subverted democracy.

Not just lying to the public but lying to Congress, which is supposed to oversee them! Why doesn't he go to jail instead? How would we know he was lying without a whistleblower. Kill the messenger? Screw that~! Even Clinton got impeached for lying to congress about a MUCH smaller issue


Karl Baba

Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
Jun 21, 2013 - 03:34pm PT

Funny, and shows the dude lying to congress



Sport climber
Jun 21, 2013 - 08:00pm PT
Insider Threat Program June 2013

whats this?
President 'Leak Plugger's unprecedented initiative, known as the Insider
Threat Program gives the NSA authority to increase monitoring of all
communications to hunt down leakers.

"Hammer this fact home . . . leaking is tantamount to aiding the enemies
of the United States,” says a June 1, 2012, Defense Department
oberfurher on strategy for the program.

Requires federal employees to snitch on co-workers. Failure to do so is
now a crime and if the cubical worker across the aisle from you leaks to
the media you could go to jail for not catching him and alerting the
department manager.

So best not to talk to anyone in the office so you have plausible
deniability of not knowing anything, just like the administration.

You have stepped thru the looking glass when it makes perfect sense to get
jail time for not being a mind reader. What school teaches that course btw? Got to sign up.

Hey, let’s get people to snitch on their coworkers.

The only thing they haven’t done here is reward it,” said Kel McClanahan,
a Washington lawyer who specializes in national security law.

I’m waiting for the time when you turn in your manager and
get a $500 reward and take over his job with a higher salary.


Trad climber
Jun 22, 2013 - 12:01am PT
The neverending PR bullshit press show is beyond nauseating.

I don't control any well-armed sheeple thug shows, so I guess I'd better just lay low.

Did you hear about that guy from the sopranos?

Mountain climber
Jun 22, 2013 - 12:01am PT
Pardon Edward Snowden | We the People: Your Voice in Our Government


Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
Jun 22, 2013 - 04:00am PT

Jun 22, 2013 - 04:19am PT
Signed it too. Think it will make a difference if millions sign it?

Sport climber
Jun 22, 2013 - 10:09am PT
"British spy agency collects and stores vast quantities of global email messages, Facebook posts, internet histories and calls, and shares them with NSA, latest documents from Edward Snowden reveal"

"The Americans were given guidelines for its use, but were told in legal briefings by GCHQ lawyers: "We have a light oversight regime compared with the US".

When it came to judging the necessity and proportionality of what they were allowed to look for, would-be American users were told it was "your call".

The Guardian understands that a total of 850,000 (?) NSA employees and US private contractors with top secret clearance had access to GCHQ databases.

The documents reveal that by last year GCHQ was handling 600m "telephone events" each day, had tapped more than 200 fibre-optic cables and was able to process data from at least 46 of them at a time."

The article: http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2013/jun/21/gchq-cables-secret-world-communications-nsa

Topic Author's Reply - Jun 22, 2013 - 12:56pm PT
in case there is any doubt about obama's "evolution." this is from 2007:

obama now equates secret courts making sweeping decisions affecting millions of americans with "transparency." and that's only to focus on what has been confirmed.

i apologize, in advance, for the following rant directed at the american citizen who assumes, without trial, what their gov't tells them: that snowden is a "traitor." my problem is, i have found the u.s. to be such an incredible and inspirational country with regard to much of its history, its land and its people, that it's hard to not have a fair bit of vitriol when it comes to commenting on the path american leaders have led the american public down post 9/11.


i read a der spiegel editorialist who made the following obvious but important point within this context: "The US is, for the time being, the only global power -- and as such it is the only truly sovereign state in existence. All others are dependent -- either as enemies or allies."

if you believe that the head of the current u.s. corporatocracy is concerned about this leak because its spying capabilities were exposed to either china, or europe, or even "al queda" you are being played for a fool.

we now have confirmation that the nsa is working hand in hand with the u.k.'s gchq, and it doesn't take a genius to figure out that there are a lot of other western powers on the same list of cooperating intelligence gatherers [including canada's].

if you don't think the chinese elite knew about what the nsa was capable of, again, wake the f*#k up. china had what was thought to be the largest and most sophisticated state wide censorship and spying infrastructure on the planet. the only reason i put that in the past tense, is because it turns out the u.s. is giving them a real run for their money for the title of "largest and most sophisticated."

and i guarantee osama, et al weren't going to the trouble of using memory keys and runners, because they underestimated the capabilities of the u.s. military/intelligence complex.

no, the primary reason obama, et al are going and will go after snowden with every tool in their toolbox [smear campaigns, legal and possibly even extra legal methods] is that he exposed this to the american public.

because, at this point, the ONLY viable threat to the ruling power structure of the world's sole superpower, is you: the american public.

and while i hate to channel my inner palin, if you think that the bush/obama "led" empire's primary concern is main street, just look at who got bailed out and is already prospering, and who didn't and is still paying for the most recent crisis.

if the american public shoots the messenger and allows snowden to go down, you will prove deserving of everything that is being done to you and will continue to be done to you.

and if the above doesn't make any sense to you, it's okay, just repeat after me:

"War is peace. Freedom is slavery. Ignorance is strength."

Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Jun 22, 2013 - 01:07pm PT
that jackwagon didnt expose anything we werent aware of. Ive been slinging poo at the NDAA2013 since before its passing. Just from looking at the titles of the various sections, one came away with a chilled perspective on our gubbmint. Even those drones they told us wouldnt be flying over head are doing just that..

The commander j-wagon in chief sure has "changed" his tune now eh? In fat a 180 degree turn to be exact. Hope and change, was HIS mantra, and not for us. He HOPED we wouldnt notice his CHANGE....
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