risking his life to tell you about NSA surveillance [ot]

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couchmaster

climber
pdx
Jun 24, 2013 - 12:31pm PT
As a follow up and corollary to your Bushco point then, anyone who voted for Obama voted for extraordinary murder of US citizens? It's the voters fault? As the murder of citizens for thought crime was initiated and expanded by Obama, can't blame that on Bushco.

I don't recall Bush running on the "lets go insane and invade some middle eastern countries" platform and I don't recall Obama running under the "It's time to execute Americans for thought crime" banner either. But that's what you have. So should voters of those men be blamed or is it more likely that parts of the government are too big and out of control? That's what Snowdens point was.
TradEddie

Trad climber
Philadelphia, PA
Jun 24, 2013 - 12:42pm PT

Someone's being blackmailed by the gov't, based on data mining, but without a whistleblower telling them it's happening, they wouldn't know it?
I'm sorry, but there's just no sense or logic in that assumption.
I mean, wouldn't I know I was being blackmailed, without Snowden telling me? Why do I need him to tell me that?

If a voyeur looking in your bedroom window was discreet enough that you don't see hims, have you been harmed? Better yet, he might scare away burglars, so in fact he's doing you a favor?

Personally, I don't have a big problem with billing records, I never felt they were private in the first place, and anyone who did was deluded, but where there is a reasonable expectation of privacy, I don't want anyone looking or listening. If national security requires it, then let us know we're been listened to and let us decide.

I think this whole thing is a clever interim solution. Remember when Saddam Hussein realized it was far cheaper and easier to pretend he had WMD? Far cheaper to pretend the NSA has the ability to monitor and accurately catalog every phone call, email, google search and run facial recognition software on every CCTV and traffic camera in the nation. Eventually they will be able to, but in the meantime potential terrorists are afraid to even stand too near a phone or computer.

TE

Reilly

Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
Jun 24, 2013 - 12:50pm PT
There's a new cell phone game out - 'Where's Snowdon Now?'
WBraun

climber
Jun 24, 2013 - 12:55pm PT
Zero Dark Thirty

What pure bullsh!t movie.

Hedge you're a tin foil hatter ....
Marlow

Sport climber
OSLO
Jun 24, 2013 - 12:56pm PT
The pattern:

"In the immediate aftermath of the atomic bomb, the allied occupation authorities banned all mention of radiation poisoning and insisted that people had been killed or injured only by the bomb's blast. It was the first big lie. "No radioactivity in Hiroshima ruin" said the front page of the New York Times, a classic of disinformation and journalistic abdication, which the Australian reporter Wilfred Burchett put right with his scoop of the century. "I write this as a warning to the world," reported Burchett in the Daily Express, having reached Hiroshima after a perilous journey, the first correspondent to dare. He described hospital wards filled with people with no visible injuries but who were dying from what he called "an atomic plague". For telling this truth, his press accreditation was withdrawn, he was pilloried and smeared - and vindicated."
Curt

climber
Gold Canyon, AZ
Jun 24, 2013 - 01:17pm PT
Zero Dark Thirty

What pure bullsh!t movie.

Right. Like you were there. pffft.

Curt
ncrockclimber

climber
The Desert Oven
Jun 24, 2013 - 01:35pm PT
The pattern:

"In the immediate aftermath of the atomic bomb, the allied occupation authorities banned all mention of radiation poisoning and insisted that people had been killed or injured only by the bomb's blast. It was the first big lie. "No radioactivity in Hiroshima ruin" said the front page of the New York Times, a classic of disinformation and journalistic abdication, which the Australian reporter Wilfred Burchett put right with his scoop of the century. "I write this as a warning to the world," reported Burchett in the Daily Express, having reached Hiroshima after a perilous journey, the first correspondent to dare. He described hospital wards filled with people with no visible injuries but who were dying from what he called "an atomic plague". For telling this truth, his press accreditation was withdrawn, he was pilloried and smeared - and vindicated."

Great post!

It is sad how soon we as a society forget the past. There is little new under the sun, and the pattern repeats. It is transparent if you really look, but it is always easier to believe the lie and go along with the crowd... Meet the new boss, same as the old boss.
Don Paul

Big Wall climber
Colombia, South America
Jun 24, 2013 - 01:41pm PT
Well there's Cotopaxi, Sangay, indigenous people living in the amazon and overall, a natural environment, but I think after about 6 months I'd want to go home. What's he going to do for a living, live off wikileaks donations?
JEleazarian

Trad climber
Fresno CA
Jun 24, 2013 - 02:08pm PT
'Am I the only one here who finds it ironic that the leaker seeks aid and asylum from countrys [sic] far more oppressive of their citzens [sic] freedom than the USA'


Nope.

Joe, it's nice being on the same side for once.

John
blowersattms

Big Wall climber
Seattle, WA
Jun 24, 2013 - 03:52pm PT
Ironic, just maybe, but hey, all it means is that he's gone to countries outside our reach. Crikey, wouldn't you? It's not like he supports their ideologies, jeez! Listen to his interview. Ends and means, what!
Hawkeye

climber
State of Mine
Jun 24, 2013 - 04:01pm PT
Let's be excruciatingly clear - every aspect of this program was put in place by BushCo and if you voted for them, you voted for the Patriot Act. If you voted for them, you voted for NSA Bluffdale and all it entails.

its amazing that the libtards have thier head so far up obamas ass that they can't smell the sh#t. you guys really think his sh#t is better than W's?

if BO wanted to stop this he would have had Holder write a different opinion up.

no wonders this countrys so f*#ked up. you libtards on this site are as bad as teabaggers and just as brainless.
Curt

climber
Gold Canyon, AZ
Jun 24, 2013 - 04:08pm PT
if BO wanted to stop this he would have had Holder write a different opinion up.

So, you believe that after Congress authorized (and reauthorized) this surveillance and the Supreme Court upheld the legality of this surveillance, all that would be needed to stop it would be a simple opinion letter by the Attorney General? Please do explain exactly how that would work. Thanks.

Curt
abrams

Sport climber
Jun 24, 2013 - 04:08pm PT
The Russians and still mad about Obama's CIA spy caught with the wig there last month.

So Putin is twirling our limp piece of spagettii in the oval office for all he's worth and catching style points from around the world.

And contrary to libtard thinking it is not good when the whole world is smiling at our apparent weakness to get Snowden back.

Hawkeye

climber
State of Mine
Jun 24, 2013 - 04:17pm PT
your the lawyer curt. tell us how it was the supreme court? my understanding was that it was FISA.

or are you saying that obama had no choice and lied during his initial campaign for POTUS, but thats OK with you since his sh#t dont stink?
Dave Kos

Social climber
Temecula
Jun 24, 2013 - 04:19pm PT
So, you believe that after Congress authorized (and reauthorized) this surveillance and the Supreme Court upheld the legality of this surveillance, all that would be needed to stop it would be a simple opinion letter by the Attorney General? Please do explain exactly how that would work.

It would work because Obama is not a president, he is a king.

I've seen pictures of him wearing a crown on this very site.

It's like this:



What is going on here?

Why is the atheist man so upset with the negro man?
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Jun 24, 2013 - 04:26pm PT
BUSHCO was by far NOT the first to "extend" executive powers.. But they DID take it to new levels-check.. Obama then took those levels and added to them- check. NDAA2013 was passed. It will take you over an hour to breeze through the titles alone. In there is all manner of they can do /spy wherever/whatever/howevers..

We need to get those CHANGED in many ways. On ThAT I AGREE 100%.

However, any effort to change them must be done in such a way as to deal with it OURSELVES, not through some foreign concerns of any damm type. Snottfacesnowden in his actions proved he is JUST another spy for sale. He runs to countries with the exact opposite politics, and freedom levels to "help" ? Help Who? The Chinese GOVT-check.. Not you, not me, and not our freedom levels. THOSE ARE up to you and me.

Snottface can suck a scud missile for all i care, and smell ya later, traitor...
Curt

climber
Gold Canyon, AZ
Jun 24, 2013 - 04:30pm PT
your the lawyer curt. tell us how it was the supreme court? my understanding was that it was FISA.

Your understanding just isn't very good--on multiple points.

http://www.thenewamerican.com/usnews/constitution/item/13164-supreme-court-allows-nsas-warrantless-wiretapping-to-continue

Curt
Curt

climber
Gold Canyon, AZ
Jun 24, 2013 - 04:32pm PT
Curt's a lawyer? Uh oh...

At least he's consistently wrong.

Curt
Marlow

Sport climber
OSLO
Jun 24, 2013 - 04:37pm PT
"Glenn Greenwald has appeared on Jake Tapper's program on CNN. Tapper plays the exchange we linked to earlier this afternoon in which NBC's David Gregory suggested Greenwald may have "aid[ed] and abet[ted]" a crime.

......

Greenwald says the underlying premise of the question, that a journalist working with a source to tell a vital story based on sensitive information may be a criminal act, is pernicious to the work of truth-telling and chilling to investigative journalism as an enterprise."
healyje

Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
Jun 24, 2013 - 04:40pm PT
if BO wanted to stop this he would have had Holder write a different opinion up.

As Curt noted, it's way out of Obama/Holder's hands - the NSA's programs are authorized under the Patriot Act. The only recourse the administrations has is not signing intelligence appropriations. Or I suppose they could try and find a member of congress willing to front an Unpatriot Act.
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