Haul Lords: rate my 2:1 ratchet

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Messages 61 - 80 of total 140 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
matty

Trad climber
under the sea
Topic Author's Reply - May 9, 2013 - 02:21pm PT
I prefer to rig a 1:5 for light loads!
briham89

Big Wall climber
san jose, ca
May 9, 2013 - 02:25pm PT
Hahaha
micronut

Trad climber
May 9, 2013 - 02:36pm PT
When hauling big loads I like to make sure everything is balanced and packed evenly.

Is this a 2:2 or a 4:4?
Is this a 2:2 or a 4:4?
Credit: micronut
WTF

climber
May 9, 2013 - 02:59pm PT
This topic has been beat to crap here but I have done at least 25 walls, and never once did we use anything other than a wall hauler and the sh#t moved up just fine.

I see the need for more intricate systems for guys like Hudon 5 foot 7 and a 130 pounds of man child. He needs the mechanical advantage as his bags weight almost double his weight. So either go to a 3:1 or don't wall climb with so much crap.

Hudon how did you guys do it back in the day?

Bottom line is the more simple it is the less bullshit cluster f*#king you have.

For guys like me the pig is my bitch and if she can't be hauled then we have too much crap.

I have done walls in three man and four man and never used anything but two pigs and a wallhauler.

Now you all want to take everything up there. We used to take what we needed not what we wanted.



Mark Hudon

Trad climber
Hood River, OR
May 9, 2013 - 03:13pm PT
5'1.875" and 120.

I'm weak, old and need comfort.

I NEED everything I haul up there!

WTF, we suffered hauling! I don't want to suffer anymore. Didn't you read my posts before posting yours? I stated my reasons for climbing the way I do.
'Pass the Pitons' Pete

Big Wall climber
like Ontario, Canada, eh?
May 9, 2013 - 03:35pm PT
"How clever to rig a 1:2 hauling system. That would be much faster."

Big Wall Theory at its finest!

[At least the 1:1 bit is correct]

I think Mark must be shrinking. He is even smaller than I remember. Perhaps he is atrophying? ;)

WTF and Skully should go climb a wall together. They would be so happy being miserable.
coz

Gym climber
Belmont
May 9, 2013 - 03:40pm PT
Funny,

Seems like a 2 to one is the way to go...

Just because we where too stupid to do it in the old days, is no reason we can't do it now.

Belays are more bomber and more spread out, on the trade routes, so why not?

Who brings just what they need, how fun is that...





Walleye

climber
The Hot Kiss on the end of a Wet Fist
May 9, 2013 - 03:48pm PT
Why people haul so much sh!t these days anyways?

Somebody PLEASE post the photo of Mr Braun from Yosemite Climber with him and his gigantic goon rack. You know: "Early probe of the P.O.", or something like that
Moof

Big Wall climber
Orygun
May 9, 2013 - 03:52pm PT
2:1 haul ratchet
2:1 haul ratchet
Credit: Moof

Here is my rig chugging away atop El Cap (name the route if you can). I originally had the mini-trax up one biner, sharing a spot on the big Williams locker with the end knot, but it fought with end knot and made things act funny/scary. Adding one biner for freedom made everybody happy, and hauling bags over the final lip was the easiest yet. In general hauling with a 2:1 is more like an aerobic activity instead of feeling like a weight lifting session using a 1:1. I'd rather be winded at the end of hauling than totally worked. After about a couple days I was able to switch with 2:1 leg hauling and was not even winded after hauling. My skinny partner had to stick to 2:1 body hauling the whole way.

On top I have 2 6" spectra slings to give freedom of movement, yet still be redundant on a high wear spot, other folks seem to have no issues using 8mm cord there, just make sure it never gets cut your your haul bag will funk you hard. I had no issues with using 5mm spectra for the cord, though our bags were not Canadian Assassin sized, merely just past annoying for 1:1. The top pully is a SMC Swiftwater pulley, and was nice and smooth, though one without the bolt heads sticking out so much would have been nice.

Here I am without a 2:1 on top of Mideast Crisis a few years ago, yucko.

Mark Hudon

Trad climber
Hood River, OR
May 9, 2013 - 04:06pm PT
Pete, yes, I am shrinking. In my prime (whenever that was) I was 5' 2.5". I've lost a whole 5/8" in the last couple of years! I'm also the fittest I've ever been in my life right now and have lost 8 pounds. I'm down to about 9% body fat.

Coz, yeah, I know, it must be some badge of honor or mark of Manhood or something to take the bare minimum and then suffer hauling it via 1:1. I don't have that many El Cap routes left in me and on the last few, I'm sure I'll dispense with hauling even 2:1, and just pay someone to come up the route with me and do all the hauling!
'Pass the Pitons' Pete

Big Wall climber
like Ontario, Canada, eh?
May 9, 2013 - 06:14pm PT
How much will you pay?



"I had no issues with using 5mm spectra for the cord"

Holy frig - look at the abrasion in the zed-cord!



That cord is about two pulls away from snapping! I'll tell you what - when those cords snap, it sure wakes you up.

I just bought one of those Petzl Prusik Minding Pulleys [91% efficient] to replace my old Petzl Fixe Pulley [only 71% efficient] on the inverted ascender. This should make hauling just a little easier.
WTF

climber
May 9, 2013 - 06:44pm PT
Im not bagging on these systems Im just shocked on how they have evolved and allowed for huge amounts of gear to be moved upward efficiently.

Pretty soon all the belays will be set up to handle a 3:1 system of hauling with a low bolt and three upper bolts spread to allow the best hauling systems. Why not its progress.

Just from the days of take what you need not what you want. I suspect at my age now I would welcome a 3:1 as this old back hasnt laid into a load in over a decade.

Enjoy!
briham89

Big Wall climber
san jose, ca
May 9, 2013 - 08:54pm PT
I just bought one of those Petzl Prusik Minding Pulleys [91% efficient] to replace my old Petzl Fixe Pulley [only 71% efficient] on the inverted ascender. This should make hauling just a little easier.

What are you using for your top pulley Pete?
Moof

Big Wall climber
Orygun
May 9, 2013 - 09:39pm PT
Holy frig - look at the abrasion in the zed-cord!

Get your eye's checked, a few fliers light up due to the flash. The cord is in fine shape.
Ed Hartouni

Trad climber
Livermore, CA
May 9, 2013 - 10:58pm PT
I have a PhD in physics but get this stuff wrong all the time...
rigging predates physics by a very long time, the ancient Egyptians were doing it...

but the middle example in Steve's Fig. 6-46 above is a 1:2 system as shown, so you all were right... the "4:1" is a "3:1"...

you can try to unfold these:


http://www.swe.org/iac/lp/pulley_03.html

a 2:1 system can't be built using the rope to the pig, the pulley that pulls the pig up would have to be on a separate line, e.g.:

Ed Hartouni

Trad climber
Livermore, CA
May 10, 2013 - 12:06am PT
"Why people haul so much sh!t these days anyways?"

that's a 1:1 haul system
'Pass the Pitons' Pete

Big Wall climber
like Ontario, Canada, eh?
May 10, 2013 - 05:41am PT
See that? A real live rocket scientist! Saved by Ed - thanks, mate!

Could you please post that photo from Yosemite Climber that buddy above is referring to? "Early foray onto P.O. Wall" or something like that. Bridwell or Werner is dressed in hippie colours and is behind the block in that little cubbyhole at the Continental Shelf bivi.

I see I have made a number of product improvements since we Mike Clelland! and I drew up the 2:1 Hauling Ratchet diagram:



 I prefer 7mm perlon as the zed-cord. It will last twice as many walls as 6mm. 5.5mm Spectra will only last a quarter as long, and is several times more expensive, but works fine if you don't do many walls

 I use doubled 9/16" webbing which sits "flat" on the top pulley instead of "round" cord

 Use TWO carabiners on your belay donut so you can more easily release the zed-cord after use!

 The Pro-Trax shown in the diagram is a total piece of sh|t for 1:1 hauling and is emphatically knott recommended for hauling large loads. We only used it because at the time it was the most popular device, only because it was the most readily available. Get yourself a Kong Block-Roll if you are serious about hauling

 I still can't get rid of that crab in my system! Although Klaus did take him on an extended vacation to places like Muscle Beach for five walls seasons. Unfortunately he did not come back any stronger, and is not much use for hauling. He is, however, the most patient belayer I have ever climbed with.

Briham89 - I use the pulley marked #9 in this photo as my upper pulley. It's a sweet multi ball-bearing jobbie from SMC:



I should also mention that there is an excellent 2:1 hauling post over at Mountain Project with great photos that you really have to see [if only to see the girl in the Olde English T-shirt]:

http://www.mountainproject.com/v/21-haul-setup---rate-my-rigging/107577488__1

Cheers, eh?

I've got some movies from El Cap on how to operate the 2:1 that I will post up later on Youtube when I have some time. Can someone please explain to me precisely what I need to do to embed the video right here in the McTopo forum, so you don't have to click on a link? The way Matty embedded Mark's video on the front page?
Ed Hartouni

Trad climber
Livermore, CA
May 10, 2013 - 09:14am PT
geeze... I don't even get paid for this...

videos... man...

when you are viewing a YouTube video, the URL shows up something like this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o5ew8FqN79Q

to embed this in STForum, you click the "Video" button above the edit box and put in the "YouTube Video ID:" box o5ew8FqN79Q
make sure you get all of the characters

the YouTube video id follows the "v=" tag in the URL, sometimes it's confusing because there can be a lot of other stuff too, if you can't figure it out, just post the whole URL here and someone can tell you what to do...

or you could just put the tag:

[ youtube=o5ew8FqN79Q] {excluding the space between the opening "[" and "youtube"}

this is explained on the pop-up page you get clicking the "Video" button too
RtFM!

Steve Grossman

Trad climber
Seattle, WA
May 11, 2013 - 09:32am PT
Ed- Are you saying that the middle figure in the hauling systems that I posted is less efficient at 1:2 than a straight single pulley system at 1:1?

Nice to keep the nomenclature straight.
Onewhowalksonrocks

Mountain climber
In the middle of the ocean
May 11, 2013 - 10:18am PT
photo not found
Missing photo ID#302616

Secret boobs spammed this topic
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