Real photojournalism

Search
Go

Discussion Topic

Return to Forum List
Post a Reply
Messages 1 - 27 of total 27 in this topic
tradmanclimbs

Ice climber
Pomfert VT
Topic Author's Original Post - Feb 22, 2013 - 04:49am PT
Why are there so few real photos from the war on terror? Even a photo of a flag draped coffin is outlawed today.. Larry Burrows showed the real face of war in these photos for Life magazine.
photo not found
Missing photo ID#290921
photo not found
Missing photo ID#290922
photo not found
Missing photo ID#290923
photo not found
Missing photo ID#290924
photo not found
Missing photo ID#290925
photo not found
Missing photo ID#290926
photo not found
Missing photo ID#290927
photo not found
Missing photo ID#290929
tradmanclimbs

Ice climber
Pomfert VT
Topic Author's Reply - Feb 22, 2013 - 07:03pm PT
Photos by Nick Ut.
photo not found
Missing photo ID#291000
photo not found
Missing photo ID#291001
Wade Icey

Trad climber
www.alohashirtrescue.com
Feb 22, 2013 - 07:05pm PT
I don't believe there is any longer such a thing as "journalism."

ed- contemporary examples welcome.
tradmanclimbs

Ice climber
Pomfert VT
Topic Author's Reply - Feb 22, 2013 - 07:12pm PT
My point is that when it comes to us troops if it is not heroic generic whitwashed patriotic propoganda photo it usually does not get published. Not looking to make our guys look bad but the simple fact is that war is bad and if you do not report the hard truth you facilitate more war.
sharperblue

Mountain climber
oakland, california
Feb 22, 2013 - 07:39pm PT
what, you forgot how to Google - ? there's plenty, just nothing in the War Machine Press. look elsewhere

http://www.cryptome.org/info/ikm/index.html
tradmanclimbs

Ice climber
Pomfert VT
Topic Author's Reply - Feb 22, 2013 - 07:43pm PT
Show me a shot of a seriously wounded or dead US troop that was published in mainstream media?
telemon01

Trad climber
Montana
Feb 22, 2013 - 07:45pm PT

Here is a great example of real contemporary journalism-

http://www.nytimes.com/projects/2012/snow-fall/#/?part=tunnel-creek
Dingus Milktoast

Gym climber
And every fool knows, a dog needs a home, and...
Feb 22, 2013 - 08:00pm PT
Why are there so few real photos from the war on terror? Even a photo of a flag draped coffin is outlawed today..

Its very simple - the stay-at-home moms who started the war and then declined to personally go fight it can't stand the guilt they feel and prefer starbucks to the reality of what they personally wrought.

Therefore there is no market for the bitter truths of the war they started (for nothing but cowardice and fear)

DMT
Wade Icey

Trad climber
www.alohashirtrescue.com
Feb 22, 2013 - 08:16pm PT
Thanks Telemon...The NYT no less. I stand corrected.


As far as matters Political/Corporate. I'll stand by my original comment.

What DMT said.
telemon01

Trad climber
Montana
Feb 22, 2013 - 08:33pm PT

political / corporate- totally true

snowhazed

Trad climber
Oaksterdam, CA
Feb 22, 2013 - 09:01pm PT
thats some nice html5
mouse from merced

Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
Feb 22, 2013 - 09:25pm PT
Bach at you, Telemon.

Local journalism thrives, at least around here, and it's free in such as the locally-produced weekly, The Merced County Times, inserted with the "Free Times." And it was in another, now defunct, freebie called The Scoop, basically a one-man gig, and more oriented to music, but fun to read and a decent vehicle for downtown local advertising.

It's what's more important to one and what's available for one to see that ultimately determines the quality and the genre of journalism, photo or otherwise, coupled with reasonably competent editing. It seems to me that local news and announcements get better responses because it's not covered elsewhere. The local daily doesn't do nearly as much as the County Times, in my opinion.

And then we Mercedians have the Downtown Life Mag, the DLM, which is very slickly done and free, but again it is supported by downtown businesses, most of which are not struggling, but going along very well. Nothing reads as well as success at a basic level. Everyone gets word of nationally-reported stuff. But today, nothing is truly "local" for long, as it all seems to end up on the www shortly after it's mentioned.
tradmanclimbs

Ice climber
Pomfert VT
Topic Author's Reply - Feb 22, 2013 - 09:41pm PT
Huh?
tradmanclimbs

Ice climber
Pomfert VT
Topic Author's Reply - Feb 22, 2013 - 09:55pm PT
I am talking mainstream media. Not one of them will run a real news photo if it is uncomfortable. look what happened with the subway pusher story. the PC police jumped all over the news for running the video so they pulled it and apologized. It was real so we are not allowed to see it yet we can watch a movie 100 times worse or play a video game where we kill thousands of people but one shot of a real corps and the public must be protected from that reality? the news these days is all about blowing a little snow stome way out of puportion and whatever the latest celebrity gossip is....

If i see one more 'Killer Storm" headline for a routine 12 to 24" of snow i am gonna puke.... Hello.. it's fckin winter allready. it's supposed to fcking snow.......
froodish

Social climber
Portland, Oregon
Feb 22, 2013 - 10:05pm PT
One word: embedding
Lynne Leichtfuss

Sport climber
moving thru
Feb 22, 2013 - 10:07pm PT
tradmanclimbs, if we saw the truth we might actually get off our fat, Walmart, comfortable, RV butts and DO something about it.

Whoops, (as IZ says) did I say that?

Yep, and that's how I feel and I try in as many ways as I can to do something about the horror. lynnie
John M

climber
Feb 22, 2013 - 10:09pm PT
This news report tries to suggest its not the media, but rather pressure from the government that has created the antiseptic appearance of our current wars.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2008/jul/29/iraqandthemedia.usa
tradmanclimbs

Ice climber
Pomfert VT
Topic Author's Reply - Feb 22, 2013 - 10:16pm PT
Read A Cat from Huy
John lawrence i believe? it gives a great account on how the news gets compromised in the name of staying on the good side of of the govt so that you are allowed access to the news. Run a story that makes us look bad and good luck getting permission to join a unit in the field. pat our backs and we will let you ride along with the troops.
tradmanclimbs

Ice climber
Pomfert VT
Topic Author's Reply - Feb 22, 2013 - 10:20pm PT


Comment is free

Cif America
Iraq's unseen violence

The US government and military are preventing the public from seeing photographs that depict the true horror of the Iraq war

Share 2
inShare0
Email

dan
Dan Kennedy
guardian.co.uk, Tuesday 29 July 2008 11.30 EDT
Jump to comments (20)

Even by the squeamish standards of the American media, the photographic record of the war in Iraq is remarkably antiseptic. The paradigmatic images are not of combat or of bodies in the street but, rather, the digital snapshots taken by US soldiers of Iraqi prisoners being humiliated at Abu Ghraib - that is, a consequence of war rather than the thing itself.

To an extent not appreciated by the public, the shortage of photographs depicting the dead and dying is not an accident. This past Saturday, the New York Times reported on the plight of Zoriah Miller, a freelance photographer who was banned from covering the Marines because he posted several photos of their dead bodies on his website. Miller, the Times added, is hardly alone in being pressured not to show the world anything too graphic.

Questions about war photos are as old as photography itself. More than a century ago, Mathew Brady and other photographers shocked a nation with their images of dead soldiers in the American civil war.

More recently, it has become an article of faith on the political right that grisly images of the Vietnam war - including the famous pictures of a street-side execution and of a naked young girl running from a napalm attack - undermined public support and led to the American defeat. Subsequent administrations have made it increasingly difficult for journalists to cover war in all its horror.

That effort has reached its nadir during the presidency of George Bush. And though its roots lay in the White House's desperate attempts to maintain some level of support for its failed policies, its censorious campaign is now being waged on behalf of Bush's preferred successor, John McCain. Unpopular as the war is, it would be more unpopular still if the public could truly see it.

Think back to the early, triumphant days of the Iraq war, leading up to the "Mission Accomplished" fiasco. War was reduced to a video game, with action figures racing through the desert and streaks of light aimed toward Baghdad. Once the insurgency began, the war became so dangerous for journalists to cover that they became dependent on the American military units with which they were embedded - a very different scenario from Vietnam, where reporters and photographers were able to operate with little interference.

More than 4,000 American troops have died to protect their country from Saddam Hussein's non-existent weapons of mass destruction, but you'd never know it from the nightly news. In a break with longstanding tradition, the White House even banned the media from observing the flag-draped coffins of dead soldiers when they arrive at Dover Air Force Base, in Delaware.
TGT

Social climber
So Cal
Feb 22, 2013 - 10:24pm PT
The last MSM journalist died suddenly, and early a couple of years ago.





Now it's SSM (State Stream Media)


splitter

Trad climber
Cali Hodad, surfing the galactic plane ~:~
Feb 23, 2013 - 03:53am PT
Real photojournalim
this would probably qualify as such...
vulture & starving child
vulture & starving child
Credit: splitter
1994 Pulitzer Prize winner by Kevin Carter during the Sudan Famine. Evidently he commited suicide 3 months later.
mouse from merced

Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
Feb 23, 2013 - 06:45am PT
Hue, Tradman. As in Way.

I read Dispatches and Rumors and tons of other stuff. The tenor of this last decade's reporting is just pathetic, geared to soft-pedal the gov't line, whatever the hell that is.

Here's the Nixon enemies list, just the media, from 1973. I believe this is the first list of two lists (one revised) revealed a few months apart in 1973...

I don't know how much of this list is due to reporting on the war, or how much is due to campaign shenanigans.


64
Jack Anderson, columnist, "Washington Merry-Go-Round"
Media

65
Jim Bishop, author, columnist, King Features Syndicate
Media

66
Thomas Braden, columnist, Los Angeles Times Syndicate
Media

67
D.J.R. Bruckner, Los Angeles Times Syndicate
Media

68
Marquis Childs, chief Washington correspondent, St. Louis Post Dispatch
Media

69
James Deakin, White House Correspondent, St. Louis Post Dispatch
Media

70
James Doyle, Washington Star
Media

71
Richard Dudman, St. Louis Post Dispatch
Media

72
William Eaton, Chicago Daily News
Media

73
Rowland Evans, Jr., syndicated columnist, Publishers Hall
Media

74
Saul Friedmann, Knight Newspapers, syndicated columnist
Media

75
layton Fritchey, syndicated columnist, Washington correspondent, Harpers
Media

76
George Frazier, Boston Globe
Media

77
Pete Hamill, New York Post
Media

78
Michael Harrington, author and journalist; Member, Executive Comm. Socialist party
Media

79
Sydney Harris, columnist, drama critic and writer of 'Strictly Personal,' syndicated Publishers Hall
Media

80
Robert Healy, Boston Globe
Media

81
William Hines, Jr., journalist; science and education, Chicago Sun Times
Media

82
Stanley Karnow, foreign correspondent, Washington Post
Media

83
Ted Knap, syndicated columnist, New York Daily News
Media

84
Edwin Knoll, Progressive
Media

85
Morton Kondracke, Chicago Sun Times
Media

86
Joseph Kraft, syndicated columnist, Publishers Hall
Media

87
James Laird, Philadelphia Inquirer
Media

88
Max Lerner, syndicated columnist, New York Post; author, lecturer, professor.
Media

89
Stanley Levey, Scripps Howard
Media

90
Flora Lewis, syndicated columnist on economics
Media

91
Stuart Loory, Los Angeles Times
Media

92
Mary McGrory, syndicated columnist on New Left
Media

93
Frank Mankiewicz, syndicated columnist, Los Angeles Times
Media

94
James Millstone, St. Louis Post Dispatch
Media

95
Martin Nolan, Boston Globe
Media

96
Ed Guthman, L.A. Times
Media

97
Thomas O'Neill, Baltimore Sun
Media

98
John Pierson, Wall Street Journal
Media

99
William Prochnau, Seattle Times
Media

100
James Reston, New York Times
Media

101
Carl Rowan, syndicated columnist, Publishers Hall
Media

102
Warren Unna, Washington Post, NET
Media

103
Harriet Van Horne, columnist, New York Post
Media

104
Milton Viorst, reporter, author, writer
Media

105
James Wechsler, New York Post
Media

106
Tom Wicker, New York Times
Media

107
Gary Wills, syndicated columnist, author of "Nixon-Agonistes."
Media

108
The New York Times
Media

109
Washington Post
Media

110
St. Louis Post Dispatch
Media

111
Jules Duscha, Washingtonian
Media

112
Robert Manning, Editor Atlantic
Media

113
John Osborne, New Republic
Media

114
Richard Rovere, New Yorker
Media

115
Robert Sherrill, Nation
Media

116
Paul Samuelson, Newsweek
Media

117
Julian Goodman, Chief Executive Officer, NBC
Media

118
John Macy, Jr., Pres., Public Broadcasting Corporation; former Civil Service Comm.
Media

119
Marvin Kalb, CBS
Media

120
Daniel Schorr, CBS
Media

121
Lem Tucker, NBC
Media

122
Sander Vanocur, NBC
Media


123
Carol Channing, actress.
Celebrities

124
Bill Cosby, actor.
Celebrities

125
Jane Fonda, actress.
Celebrities.


Nor do I know who all these folks are, or whether they are photojournalists or not. I just know things are not the same. Embedded journalists are muzzled journalists. We ought to agree on that, surely.

healyje

Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
Feb 23, 2013 - 07:12am PT
Folks were on those lists for a variety of reasons - most perceived slights, insults, or threats - others relative to stands against the war. They were reminiscent of J. Edgar's lists.

Above posters are all correct - media acquiescing to embedding, media becoming components of larger corporate conglomerates, reduced funding of news organizations, and news now often being rated as entertainment as opposed to news. There has also been an upswing in the murders of journalists worldwide.



And with the advent of the Internet and blurring of lines between professional and citizen journalists, governments and dictators now view almost anyone as a potential threat and as a result press credentials just don't carry the same protective weight as they once did.
tradmanclimbs

Ice climber
Pomfert VT
Topic Author's Reply - Feb 23, 2013 - 07:42am PT
I remember that vulture child shot winning the pulitzer. I was an aspireing photojournalist at the time and followed those sort of things. The bang bang club was quite the bunch. I never realized how much being white allowed those guys to work at the time. Watching the movie educated me on that aspect of it. The climate is way harsher now for western journalists these days. Read the photo credits for what is getting published from the middle east now and you will rarely see western names. The work climate for westerners is simply too dangerous.
healyje

Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
Feb 23, 2013 - 10:05am PT
I was a photojournalist - so very, very happy to not be one. I personally don't need or want that imagery in my head or life anymore so it's not all that hard for me to understand why we don't see much of it in our media.
Loose Rocks

Trad climber
Santa Rosa, CA
Feb 23, 2013 - 10:54am PT
This story has some interesting imagery. Some of the looks on their faces really shows where they're at.

http://www.theatlantic.com/infocus/2013/02/diy-weapons-of-the-syrian-rebels/100461/

mouse from merced

Trad climber
The finger of fate, my friends, is fickle.
Feb 23, 2013 - 11:50am PT
Credit: mouse from merced
Item from the link provided by Loose Rocks.

Dynamite images, no kidding.
Messages 1 - 27 of total 27 in this topic
Return to Forum List
Post a Reply
 
Our Guidebooks
Check 'em out!
SuperTopo Guidebooks


Try a free sample topo!

 
SuperTopo on the Web

Review Categories
Recent Trip Report and Articles
Recent Route Beta
Recent Gear Reviews