Giant Goldfish in Tahoe.

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Brandon-

climber
The Granite State.
Topic Author's Original Post - Feb 20, 2013 - 04:32pm PT
http://news.yahoo.com/video/monster-goldfish-breeding-lake-tahoe-064642553.html
labrat

Trad climber
Auburn, CA
Feb 20, 2013 - 04:36pm PT
;-(

Just a matter of time untill we are done.
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 20, 2013 - 04:38pm PT
The last two fisheries biologists for the Basin, and good friends of mine, told me about those over the last 5 years. I've even seen pictures!

BUT to be sure...

we will have to ask Rong if he has seen any on his species identifying fish finder.

Otherwise, how do we know it isn't part of the grand Obama-TRPA conspiracy!
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 20, 2013 - 04:59pm PT
just another carp- they are every where. meanwhile,, i can go harvest commercially the chubs they so worry about. And them lobsters too...still havent caught a bass. I used to in the keys though. But then i see in the vid,, its a TRPA thing..

Ill bet those big brown trout LOVE those goldfish..
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 20, 2013 - 05:04pm PT
idiot
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 20, 2013 - 05:07pm PT
limp wristed punk ass snot nose.


I wonder how many people i know that have fished with goldfish over the years? Hmmmm I caught a two pound Koi a few years ago. Thankfully it was no where near the TRPA.
Brandon-

climber
The Granite State.
Topic Author's Reply - Feb 20, 2013 - 05:31pm PT
So, you're ok with invasive fish?
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 20, 2013 - 05:40pm PT
Depends Brandon.

This is whats known as a mountain out of a pimple. Those are MOST LIKELY ALL bait fish that were released by careless fisherman at the end of a day. Ive seen that maneuver a thousand times. The temps of tahoe arent going to proper any population of warm water fish to any level that would endanger any fish there. The macks are typically DEEP there as will be balls of bait- or the chubs the TRPA seems to be worried for. I can show you graph tapes with massive amounts of said bait. What they did was ruin a very popular fishing spot and a special one, in the keys. End of story. Those fish were there for more decades than ive been alive.
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 20, 2013 - 05:45pm PT
No, this is what's known as someone who doesn't know jack sh#t about sh#t insisting they understand ecology better than those who have spent their lives studying it.

But whatever, Rong isn't in charge of anything (thank god), so he can continue blathering on and nothing will ever come of his uneducated opinion.
McHale's Navy

Trad climber
Panorama City, California & living in Seattle
Feb 20, 2013 - 05:48pm PT
I went to a carp fish fry that featured carp (whitefish) caught in the Boise River back in the 70s. Those people knew what they were doing and it was pretty damn good - have not forgotten.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 20, 2013 - 05:49pm PT
Defending the track record of the TRPA isnt going to get you anywhere.

The WORST thing to ever be let into the basin,,, T>R>P>A......And wessie, ive spent my life studying bass in particular. Good enough to be in the top 40 pro western fisherman for a few years. Good enough to have trilene sponsors.


MOUNTAIN out of a PIMPLE that has been there longer than the TRPA.
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 20, 2013 - 05:50pm PT
Well there you have it... another government conspiracy confirmed by a sponsored sport fisherman.
Chim-Chim

climber
Feb 20, 2013 - 05:52pm PT
If you don't like the fish go catch them otherwise you're just whining.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 20, 2013 - 05:55pm PT
And Brandon, there are some cases of invasive fish being REAL problems. However its seldom the case. At Davis lake, they poisoned it numerous times in an effort to get rid of Northern Pike. Now,, the lake was doing GREAT with lots of LARGE healthy trout, and a thriving population of largemouth in the shallows. I had fished it many times, and specifically for northern yet never even saw one. They were infrequent to say the least. BUT because a shocking produced a few, the HAD to be a problem.. Against the wishes of the locals, residents, business folk and sportsman, they went ahead and poisoned the whole shitaroo. TWICE...At Cal tax payers dollars.

STOOOOOOOPUD!
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 20, 2013 - 06:07pm PT
If you don't like the policies of TRPA go change them, otherwise you are just whining.
michaeld

Sport climber
Sacramento
Feb 20, 2013 - 06:09pm PT
That researcher chick is cute.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 20, 2013 - 06:13pm PT
Hey wessie,, can you tell me the native fish of lake tahoe,, you know,, the ones they are worried about?? Just species general. will be fine..And approx populations?
monolith

climber
SF bay area
Feb 20, 2013 - 06:13pm PT
Not so stupid, Ron. They eventually got it right. with community approval. The northern pike in Davis Lake was cleared out in 2007, with thousands of gallons of rotenone in a drawn down lake.

You forgot to mention that. Not surprising considering your goobermint hate.
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 20, 2013 - 06:21pm PT
As far as I know, the LCT is the only threatened native species in LT.

Now, you tell me what "MOST LIKELY" means... hint, it doesn't mean you just pulled it out of your ass because it sounds truthy and supports what you already believe, despite studies that show otherwise.

Those are MOST LIKELY ALL bait fish
Chim-Chim

climber
Feb 20, 2013 - 06:27pm PT
Aren't Kokanee salmon an introduced species? No one complaining about those fish.
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 20, 2013 - 06:28pm PT
Yes, but Kokanee are pretty.
Chim-Chim

climber
Feb 20, 2013 - 06:31pm PT
And tasty! German browns taste like brautworst. Doesn't the fish and game have a problem with trout eating frogs in high lakes?
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 20, 2013 - 06:44pm PT
Yep, trout are voracious predators.
FRUMY

Trad climber
SHERMAN OAKS,CA
Feb 20, 2013 - 07:47pm PT
Are Kokanee Salmon introduced? I don't think so, but I am not sure.
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 20, 2013 - 07:54pm PT
Yes, they were introduced. They've been in the lake for 50 or so years, but they don't seem to be hurting anything, so they are left alone. Plus they feed the bears.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 20, 2013 - 08:59pm PT
The natives were Lahaton Cuthroat trout and the mtn whitefish. Seems the lake is CHUKED FULL of "invasive" species.
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 20, 2013 - 09:03pm PT
...and chub and some suckers and some dace and some others.

Yes, Lake Tahoe has a bunch of invasive species, some doing WAY more damage to the native fish populations and ecosystem than others.
FRUMY

Trad climber
SHERMAN OAKS,CA
Feb 20, 2013 - 09:10pm PT
Live & learn. I always thought they were native.
Dingus Milktoast

Gym climber
And every fool knows, a dog needs a home, and...
Feb 20, 2013 - 09:29pm PT
Seems the lake is CHUKED FULL of "invasive" species.

Humans, most of all.

DMT
Srbphoto

climber
Kennewick wa
Feb 20, 2013 - 09:30pm PT
wouldn't want to hurt those native black bass either!
WTF

climber
Feb 21, 2013 - 09:07am PT
F*#king retards all of you. We're weeks from the TRPA dissolving after the f*#ktards of Tahoe (aka friends of Tahoe) and of course the f*#king Sierra Club retards filed suit last week to stop the new TRPA development plan.

While told by both Barbra Fienstein and Harry doucchebag Reid not to. The end result will be a big f*#k you by the TRPA which will dissolve and there will be no rules as to development.

Yeah the Kokanee are planted and so are d#@&%e bags like Wes and his bro bras on the west shore the same bunch of sh#t bags complaining who all own second homes or primary homes around the lake.

So Wes you love the lake so much move away from the lake tear down the shack you live in and make an effort to tell the rest of those d#@&%e bags around the lake to,do the same.

Tahoe while easy on the eye is a pile of sh#t lake with house casinos and f*#king retard,enviromnazis living all around it complaining about development but only after their houses were built ,

I look forward to a huge fire on the west shore one day where all those house are well destroyed and not rebuilt.

Gold fish are the least of,the lakes problems.

the czar

climber
meyers, ca.
Feb 21, 2013 - 10:53am PT
Mmmm. i kinda want some sushi now, but its so early...
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 21, 2013 - 10:53am PT
hahaha, my house up here is my 3rd home... dumb ass.
Hardman Knott

Gym climber
Muir Woods National Monument, Mill Valley, Ca
Feb 21, 2013 - 11:00am PT
LOL!

WTF is WTF so angry about?
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 21, 2013 - 11:52am PT
Non-native trout have occupied nearly every habitat in all Lake Tahoe tributaries. Native fish,
like the mountain whitefish and Tui chub, historically known to occur in Trout Creek, were not
found anywhere during the 2010 field season, indicating a significant impact on their
distribution. It is known that introductions of non-native species have greatly reduced
populations of native forage fish within Lake Tahoe. Establishing a foundation of information
and continued monitoring will explore the impact of non-native fish on native non-game fish.



This is part of the below reports:

http://www.fs.usda.gov/Internet/FSE_DOCUMENTS/stelprdb5286033.pdf



The native climax species was the Lahaton Cuthroat trout which was extirpated from the lake in the 1930s.

Invasives include Kokanee salmon, Rainbow trout, brown trout, brook trout, mackinaw as the PRIME predator fish. THOSE populations are thousands of times greater than any warm water fish that leave the keys to wander in near by shallows.

bjj

climber
beyond the sun
Feb 21, 2013 - 11:56am PT
Holy shitballs! That's amazing. WTF @ the one from France?! That CAN NOT be real. Looks like it weighs 25 lbs!

Maybe I shouldn't have dumped my aquarium into the water on the beach at hurricane bay when I moved away in '99

Sorry! My Bad!
FRUMY

Trad climber
SHERMAN OAKS,CA
Feb 21, 2013 - 11:59am PT
Nice Ron, tfpu.
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 21, 2013 - 12:10pm PT
THOSE populations are thousands of times greater than any warm water fish that leave the keys to wander in near by shallows.

Ron, glad to see you are doing some reading. Tell me, where do the LCT spawn? What time of year? And what species are hanging around those areas during that time... eating all the new fry?
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 21, 2013 - 12:18pm PT
Your welcome Frumy..

Also, as a side note, the economy of the basin is added to quite a lot from the guided fishing on the lake. Stores, gas stations and motels all benefit from the fishing for those non-native salmanoides. The keys attract fisherman from all over the west- just for the pleasure and oddity of catching largemouth bass there. The crappie were some of the best eating fish ive ever had from there.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 21, 2013 - 12:44pm PT
As far as i know, one of the main locations the LCT has been active in spawning would be Glen Allen creek.. Around 1980, plans were made for re-introduction of the lahaton cutthroat ans stocking programs have gone on since- but not every season as the availability of fish arent always there.

Cutthroats will feed on their young, and any other fish they can get in their mouths. Ive wathced that at marlette lake.
Now there may be occasional warm water fish that feed upon fry as well- but ONLY in those shallows that warm enough for actual feeding activity by warm water fish.

Ndow has also tried planting sterile trout in tahoe, so they dont spawn. However,,these fish tend to grow rapidly as all they do is swim and EAT.
Just like the "wipers" in Lahaton that have now grown to nearly 30 pounds. They are eating machines.


So far all the grief those few warm water fishies receive, it is only a scratch off the real sources of native bait species declines. That and the fact the lake has warmed slightly- and of course that is most noticeable in water five feet deep or less. So the non game species are making movements to be in their preferred temperatures.

Plantings of salmanoides way back when was the start of this all. The decimation of LCTs from the 1800s to around 1930 were a huge mistake. Introducing sterile eating machines arent the answer either.



And this from the "About lake tahoe" website.


Lake Tahoe - Big Blue is best fished from a big boat. There are a number of fishing charters available as well as plenty of rental boats. Additionally, shore fishing is good at certain places most of which are on the east shore. Cave Rock is among the most accessible of these. Lake Tahoe has Brown and Rainbow Trout as well as the mighty deep dwelling Mackinaw and the land-locked Kokanee Salmon. Lahontan Cutthroat Trout are no longer viable since their young are predated by the Mackinaw, which is not a native fish.


edit: fyi, bass are notorious of feeding on their own. After spawning, its the smaller males that guard nests. Big females will cruise them swallowing as many as they can every pass. And as far as i know, no spawning has been seen outside the keys from these warm water fish. The fish seen in studies were only around for a two month period for the most, then vanished from those other areas. (The warmest two months of the year-July and Aug.)


Toker Villain

Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
Feb 21, 2013 - 01:14pm PT
Damn! With this title I was hoping for a Godzilla thread.

So,.. if they are so good to eat why do you call them crappie?
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 21, 2013 - 01:16pm PT
Crappie: "CRAW"ppie,, knott "CRAP"pie..;-)
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 21, 2013 - 03:08pm PT
Another lake that has been "messed" with by F&G in Cali is THAT lk at the bottom of Sonora pass.

A long time known brook trout producing lake- spring fed with abundant fresh water shrimp. It was THE perfect brookie habitat and produced fish over 8 lbs routinely. Yet, with the shrimp, the brookies were only vulnerable to lures during the start and end of the fishing season. It was hard to catch them during the summer months. So the "studies" were done, and they introduced a sub of Cut throats into the small alpine lake for a "summer" fishery. Cut throat being very varacious on the offspring of the brookies. Now, that lake isnt nearly what it used to be, and those GIANT brookies are far and few between now.
brotherbbock

Trad climber
Alta Loma, CA
Feb 21, 2013 - 03:13pm PT
I blame Obama and the Republicans for this one. Its errbodys fault.
ruppell

climber
Feb 21, 2013 - 03:37pm PT
Ron

Can we not mention Kirman or Poole. LOL I don't know whether introducing cutties is the real issue or not. That lake used to receive almost zero fishing pressure. Now it's packed every time I head up there. I've only been fishing it for the past 8 years so I can only imagine how good it was back in the day. I personally like the stocking of the cutties and hope that they will one day offer fish as large if not larger than the brooks. I'm sure you know this but keep in mind those brookies wouldn't be there either if someone hadn't stocked them. Do you know any of the history on when and who introduced them? Either way those lakes up in that area are great places to fish.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 21, 2013 - 03:51pm PT
Well, as far as i know they were milk bottle plants in the 30s and 40s.
I fished it mostly in the 70s. It was a secret really.. Then in the mid eighties, it appeared in the FISH SNIFFER magazine! Things went to hell after that.

Credit: Ron Anderson

Credit: Ron Anderson

Credit: Ron Anderson
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 21, 2013 - 03:56pm PT
Now, that lake isnt nearly what it used to be, and those GIANT brookies are far and few between now.

Clearly due to management and not the fact that the human population of CA has doubled. We'd still have huge fishes is it weren't for that meddling guberment.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 21, 2013 - 04:05pm PT
Yet im willing to bet youve never even been there, clearly..
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 21, 2013 - 04:10pm PT
yeah, never been there... don't give a fuk about the place. it is out of my jurisdiction. but I'm confident it is all the guberment's fault.
atchafalaya

Boulder climber
Feb 21, 2013 - 04:15pm PT
Maybe overfished by ignorant as#@&%es who didn;t catch and release? You know the ones, they like to eat wild stuff, but it is more likely to be thrown out after being wrapped in newspaper in their freezer for a year.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 21, 2013 - 04:20pm PT
atchafalatio,,youve no idea of what we released there. And each of those fish in the pics that weren't released were consumed usually the following night. Light oil, battered in crushed ritz crackers flour, , pepper and garlic and a pinch of lowerys. Sometimes an added drip of lemon juice was added as they cooked.
ruppell

climber
Feb 21, 2013 - 04:22pm PT
atchafalatio,,youve no idea of what we released there

LMAO. I see what you did there. Nice.

And no one uses newspaper anymore. Ziplocks are the new thing. What are you 80?
atchafalaya

Boulder climber
Feb 21, 2013 - 04:23pm PT
Ron, not sure why you thought that post was directed to you. Do you fish?

Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 21, 2013 - 04:25pm PT
every chance i get. And isnt that how you usually refer to me? Those are my pictures.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 21, 2013 - 04:30pm PT
Credit: Ron Anderson

Credit: Ron Anderson


CC river catches,, all released. Ive released an easy 70% of the fish ive caught. I take what i will eat in short order.
atchafalaya

Boulder climber
Feb 21, 2013 - 04:35pm PT
Hand tied clousers at dawn
Hand tied clousers at dawn
Credit: atchafalaya
Cool. You could use some of these in tahoe to get rid of the goldfish...
Credit: atchafalaya
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 21, 2013 - 04:36pm PT
they would POISON the whole lake upon finding that striper in Tayhow...

kinda looks like near franks tract.
Dingus Milktoast

Gym climber
And every fool knows, a dog needs a home, and...
Feb 21, 2013 - 04:52pm PT
Ron fishes this board a couple dozen times a day.

DMT
atchafalaya

Boulder climber
Feb 21, 2013 - 05:33pm PT
East Delta, near Hog and Beaver Sloughs on the Moke.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 21, 2013 - 06:17pm PT
I get trolled occasionally too DMT..;-)


And Atcha,, ive fished most of that area- ran up the old river past TRACY once with a guy in a tournament. Had to stay on the gas to avoid shallow sand bars. The fish up in that current were STRONG! A three felt like a ten. One of the most white knuckle rides ive been on in the delta. I once saw a small bayliner crest the bow wave of an outgoing tanker in the main channel, and it broke in half upon "re-entry". Tossed the two guys like skippin stones across the water. They were just bruised up a bit..The boat,,well it was out there for a long whole after that.

Nice stippers by the way..
atchafalaya

Boulder climber
Feb 21, 2013 - 07:07pm PT
Thanks, hard to believe, but we caught about 30 to 40 that day from 3 to 12 pounds, all on flyrods. Every cast was another pig. Birds were diving on baitballs. The arms were worked. The only thing that stopped us was darkness. Those things eat 3 to 4 pound fish!
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 21, 2013 - 07:15pm PT
They ARE fighters. I always hit whites first thing during stockton tourneys- usually good for a few nice fish,, unless the strippers are there- then its hold on to yur jig rod. then we would boogie outta there! Never have fished much just for the strippers. We have kept one or two for eating though. But the large mouth always had a "twang" to em from the delta.

The bass have made a huge comeback from the eighties size and populations. It was hard to fish back then. Or hard to FIND fish. The place is LOADED with structure and cover .. I can only guess as to how many have gotten totally LOST out in that mass o water ways...? The tiny hidden islands with the ancient cabins are cool- as is the ancient ship ruins scattered all over.


Those had to be hell on FLYRODS...!
Toker Villain

Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
Feb 21, 2013 - 07:54pm PT
Story just made NBC evening news.
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 21, 2013 - 07:56pm PT
That's only because Obama controls the liberal media.
atchafalaya

Boulder climber
Feb 21, 2013 - 08:06pm PT
8 and 9 weights feel like they will snap.
Sorry for the thread drift.
Cheers,
Crackslayer

Trad climber
Eldo
Feb 21, 2013 - 08:35pm PT
This is what happens when you flush fish down the toilet. No but, seriously? This is news...Giant goldfish live everywhere. I've seen some pretty big goldfish in ponds and marshes. I've also seen huge turtles and other invasive species that are thriving. I used to raise big goldfish in aquaponic systems. They are great fish to use but not really as a food source. Talapia other fish are better but goldfish are really easy to take care of.
Srbphoto

climber
Kennewick wa
Feb 21, 2013 - 08:36pm PT
Crappie: "CRAW"ppie,, knott "CRAP"pie..;-)

It depends how big they are.
Brandon-

climber
The Granite State.
Topic Author's Reply - Feb 21, 2013 - 08:40pm PT
Maybe the sushi restaurants around the lake should start serving some of the more edible invasives.
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 21, 2013 - 08:53pm PT
Some of you don't seem to realize the importance of protecting Lake Tahoe... as the LARGEST and CLEANEST source of water for thousands of miles... the largest lake in the Sierra... and uphill of major cities and agricultural areas... like the Central Valley, you know, the area that supplies the country with the majority of fruits and vegetables. It ain't just a fishing spot... it is one of the most important natural resources in the west.
WTF

climber
Feb 21, 2013 - 10:48pm PT
^^^^^ bullshit^^^^^

If you love it so much asshat then pack your sh#t and get your car and your trash and everything that goes with all you retards up there and get the hell out

It's the biggest lie ever and what Tahoe needs is less of you people and more bulldozers and restoration of your removed piles of house.

See Wes for those of that have lived in this area for generations the problem has always been people like you who's show up and never leave. You pretend to care so you can bilk some grant fora check or get a phd in some sort of bullshit associated with preserving the lake and in the end you get very little done other than some bullshit report on how all the cars and sand are polluting the lake.

No sh#t it took you a few hundred K of research to figure out the problem is you and your car and your wood burning stoves and your answer is to put in more infrastructure to catch the dirty runoff you create by just being there.

Save Tahoe by tearing down your houses and leaving.
Dingus Milktoast

Gym climber
And every fool knows, a dog needs a home, and...
Feb 21, 2013 - 10:50pm PT
Tahoe doesn't drain into the central valley last I checked. I should introduce you to a hydrologist friend of mine, he can explain how that sh#t works in layperson's terms!

DMT
jstan

climber
Feb 21, 2013 - 10:52pm PT
Somebody PM me when WTF stops holding back.
dave729

Trad climber
Western America
Feb 21, 2013 - 11:08pm PT
Golden trout ever been introduced to L Tahoe? Fun to catch. Like a little gold bar that swims.
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 22, 2013 - 01:32am PT
Tahoe doesn't drain into the central valley last I checked.

And the Owens Valley doesn't drain into the LA basin. Nor does the Feather.

)*(
nature

climber
Boulder, CO
Feb 22, 2013 - 01:43am PT
07:53am PT
Mmmm. i kinda want some sushi now, but its so early...

agreed
kunlun_shan

Mountain climber
SF, CA
Feb 22, 2013 - 02:10am PT
Pretty big goldfish.

from http://www.kcra.com/news/-/11797728/18991232/-/u25jv2/-/index.html

Credit: Christine Ngai/University of Nevada, Reno - http://www.kcra.com
Researchers are finding a growing number of giant goldfish in Lake Tahoe and they are questioning the ecological impact they could have on the lake

Credit: Christine Ngai/University of Nevada, Reno - http://www.kcra.com
Christine Ngai of the University of Nevada, Reno, was among the researchers who found the first goldfish during a survey of invasive fish in the lake.
grover

climber
Northern Mexico
Feb 22, 2013 - 02:27am PT

http://www.foodnetwork.com/recipes/guy-fieri/tex-wasabis-koi-fish-tacos-recipe/index.html

Your welcome






Chim-Chim

climber
Feb 22, 2013 - 12:31pm PT
Tahoe drains to the north and east... does not supply water to valley agriculture. Echo lakes has water diverted to the west, that would naturally flow into Tahoe. So the cleanliness of Tahoe doesn't affect California agriculture. That said, keeping Tahoe clean should be a priority. The TRPA doesn't really care about the lake. It cares about itself and the fees it collects period. The head of the TRPA makes about 100,000 dollars a year... a big salary in this area. The officials of this organization are not elected officials, but reign like they;re royalty. Sure there are good members of that org but they're very few. Dan
Reilly

Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
Feb 22, 2013 - 12:35pm PT
All bureaucracies eventually become self-serving and next-to-useless, no matter
their lofty initial goals and mandates.
Dr.Sprock

Boulder climber
I'm James Brown, Bi-atch!
Feb 22, 2013 - 12:38pm PT
move everybody down to clear lake, let them enjoy that algae infested stink pond,

tahoe needs a few 1000ft turnovers, kill them goldfish quicker than a hatchet,
The Call Of K2 Lou

climber
Squamish
Feb 22, 2013 - 12:47pm PT
When will Obama release the photos of his "giant gold-fishing" trip? Why is he using chemtrails to create these biological abominations?
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 22, 2013 - 01:00pm PT
I see a new company in Tahoe,,the "TAHOE KOI" sushi bar....
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 22, 2013 - 01:44pm PT
I get a kick out of people telling me which way Lake Tahoe water flows... lolz for sure. As if natural drainage networks mean anything for future water distribution in CA. But can any of you tell me which way the money flows? Hint, lots of federal land being sold to private developers down around Vegas. Lots of money from those sales being pumped into scientific research to keep Tahoe blue. I'm sure when Vegas gets desperate for water they will make us an offer we can't refuse... and if there was any connection to Vegas.

I'm glad TRPA exists. I can't imagine what a shithole this place would have become if development went unchecked since its formation in 1969. I wonder what the cultural and political scene around the Lake was like back then.

Until the end of civilization... cheers!
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 22, 2013 - 01:52pm PT
Thank the TRPA for the Angora fire...They were TOLD that would happen back in the late 70s/early eighties.
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 22, 2013 - 02:02pm PT
You could just as well thank the Forest Service Fire crews. If the Showers fire or any of the other South Shore fires had not been suppressed the fuels would not have built up like they did.

But yes, I thank TRPA (and the bro bra d#@&%e bag who started the fire) VERY much for the Angora fire. I'm sorry for those who lost their worldly possessions, but that is part of the price you pay for living in the mountains. It opened some eyes and burned some areas that were in desperate need. I'd like to see more fires in the Basin actually.


Wow, really Ron... someone predicted a forest fire would occur within 30 years... ASTONISHING INSIGHT!
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 22, 2013 - 05:45pm PT
Well wes,, the T R P A back then said we were full of it when we told them their stands were at the zone of immanent mortality. We gave them all the proof in the world, and they rejected us and the plans we had already done in region four. And with great success. They said those stands were "natural" and would stay that way. - Thats their words bub. Heard em myself in the mid 80s again..When again they rejected our strong suggestions- and the beetles were already hard at work. And since all you type of people have moved in every where around Tahoe,, let burn policies can HARDLY be the norm. Its peoples homes and lives at stake now. And Wes, consider that YOUR part of THAT problem.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 22, 2013 - 05:50pm PT
but back to lake Tahoe fishing heres a TYPICAL report from a fishing site:


Tahoe Keys Lagoon Fly Fishing
Safari-Theme Home


Enjoy superb fishing on America's largest alpine lake with salmon (kokanee), rainbow trout, mackinaw (lake trout), brown trout , brook trout and cut throats.
Tahoe Keys lagoons are filled with bass, crappie, trout and even enormous goldfish. Fishing from a small boat or from a private dock gives you the chance of catching a Keys Grand Slam (rainbow, brown, crappie, large mouth and bluegill).

March, April, and May seem to be the best months especially during the evening with a light to moderate breeze. With a breeze creating cover, the fish move around more and appear to be safe from osprey, chasing minnows and crayfish. Mornings are good as well if there is a breeze or cloud cover.

Good flies for trout are wooly bugger and lake chub with a full sinking line. A crawdad pattern also works well from time to time. To catch bass, a surface popper is best once the water warms up. At any other time, a good size streamer will work wonders stripped fast along the docks.

Crappie go after brightly colored bead-headed wooly buggers with a full sinking line. The back sloughs tend to be best for the crappie and bluegill. The bass seem to be spread out all over the Keys with quite a few of them near the Marina. And don't be surprised if you hook a catfish as well.

Kids can catch quite a bit from the docks. Best to use an indicator and a small nymph. Have them cast out and then slowly retrieve the indicator and fly keeping slight movement at all times. When the indicator goes down, set the hook and bring it in!

Lake Tahoe has numerous fishing charter companies that can arrange and outfit your fishing.




edit: Kinda funny that this is just now a "researcher discovery" when good ol fish folks have known this for a loooonggg time.
Brandon-

climber
The Granite State.
Topic Author's Reply - Feb 22, 2013 - 05:55pm PT
Why didn't you tell them?
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 22, 2013 - 05:59pm PT
OMG, you are so insightful. I never realized I was part of the problem. My oh my, what ever will I do now?

The only logical solution seems to be stop studying the natural processes of the place, revert back to that groundbreaking used tire based restoration standards of the 70s, and let the Bay area folks just enjoy their weekend vacation spots in peace.

I'm so glad you people figured out everything that needed to be figured out decades ago. If only the dumb scientists would have just taken your word for it.

As soon as I learn Spanish I will move down to Carson. Thanks Ron.


(Yes, TRPA is a pain in the ass. So are taxes, stop signs, and all those other pesky rools we have to live by. It just isn't fair! I'd rather have a lake full of algae and motor oil than have to deal with their crap!)
abrams

Sport climber
Feb 22, 2013 - 06:04pm PT
who has a recipe for deep fry cajun goldfish? Hungry!
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 22, 2013 - 06:07pm PT
even NDOW knows all about the keys Brandon.. Have for decades now. I really dont understand any of it,, but its hardly news. But it seems ,, in this case,, the "researchers" should have just asked the fisherman whats up with the lake. They "discovered" nothing new..Any goldfish lucky enough to spawn shall see their bright orange gold progeny eaten as fast as you could blink. Especially in Tahoe waters. Thats fisherman knowledge though.. Bay area folks used to often bring up feeder goldies for bait. They would dump any unused at the end of those trips. Thats ol fisherman knowledge too. The fortunate ones make it to a larger size. But they are still far and few between when considering the overall surface acre feet of the lake.

The KEYS has always been a special fishing spot. I was catching bass there in 1976 when i knew someone that lived there- had a nice dock and we would suck suds and catch fish. Those fish are excellent in taste- and as beautiful as any of their species. None of this was ever a secret either, as the keys was almost as popular as the main lake at times.
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 22, 2013 - 06:10pm PT
Ron, man the fuk up and email that cute little researcher. Ask HER why they are making the claims they are making. Maybe the news will interview you in a piece that exposes the cover up... Goldfish Gate. You can tell them how you know everything about everything from timber management to aquatic ecology and you learned it all using your species identifying fish finder.

Or... you can just sit there and act like you already know everything and everyone else is a dipsh#t... it works for me.

The KEYS has always been a special fishing spot.

No it hasn't. It didn't even exit until the 60s. Half a century is nowhere near ALWAYS.


Invasive fish, such as the goldfish, are gathered and removed from the water. Ngai said the program will look to filet invasive fish and donate them to local food banks.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 22, 2013 - 06:16pm PT
Always FOR ME wes...Since 76..

And Maybe i WILL e mail channel 8 and give em a fishing report or two from the past lmao! Ask them if they ever actually research anything?

Wes,, you tell those youngster braniacs to just pick out the oldest curmudgeonest looking guy at the doc in the early am,, and have a chat with HIM to find out shyt.. It will save tax payers countless hours of "research"...
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 22, 2013 - 06:20pm PT
find out shyt

I'm sure that's the case more often than not.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 22, 2013 - 06:26pm PT
Well,, the "scientists" didnt "discover" ANYTHING now did they..

Fisherman knew of those for decades.

pffffff..But then these book smart youth have an ability to ignore the obvious- especially when considering resources. I worked with MANY such youngsters in the USFS.. And it appears, "aint nuthin changed"...

I wont say a WORD about my other "koi spots"...
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 22, 2013 - 06:34pm PT
Did Ngai claim she "discovered" anything? Or did the news? Are you passing judgement on a researcher you have never met based on her research you will never read? Then applying that to every other researcher out there? Sounds kinda hedgey to me.

Face it, if you knew half the sh#t you claim to know you would be making a positive contribution to the world. Instead you are stuffing dead things and blaming all the worlds problems on whatever source you disagree with.

A group of researchers from Davis, the University of Nevada at Reno, and the fish and wildlife departments of both California and Nevada were the first to study the presence of goldfish in Lake Tahoe, beginning an annual survey in 2006.

They knew they were there before the study, otherwise they would not have developed a study to look at the impacts. Do you already know what impacts they have on the native fish, algae, water quality, etc? If so, contact her... I'm sure she could find some money in her budget for useful information.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 22, 2013 - 06:39pm PT
Ive MADE my contributions wes,, and then some. And i still do. How ever,, YES there are all manner of GOLDFISH DISCOVERED titles in the news, which suggests the discovery of said bait. The news is wrong again,, shocking,, i know..

Wes, did you know bluegill, crappie and bass and catfish ALL eat algae?
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 22, 2013 - 06:46pm PT
Here's one... no need to read the whole thing or try to understand, just read the title.

"People carrying assault weapons pose a clear and present danger to others"
wilbeer

Mountain climber
honeoye falls,ny.greeneck alleghenys
Feb 22, 2013 - 06:49pm PT
Hey Ron ,those were nice brookies you showed earlier.Did you know that they are an invasive species in your western habitat,introduced from that government you dislike.just sayin,those er big brookies
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 22, 2013 - 06:49pm PT
Depends where your at. I was in line at the gun show with 10,000 other folks about half had assualt weapons with them to sell. Peaceful as could be, that line of folks..


edit: Wilbeer,, Yes i know,, brookies were planted, in jugs in backpacks,, from planes and more. A lot of those went in waters vacant of other fish.
Kirman being one of those. It had shrimp, then the brookies were added and a viable trophy fishery born.

But to try and blame anything on a few wandering goldfish or bass in Tahoe other than the keys is hilarious. And the keys was a great fishery of its own. Too bad they have to mess with it. Many an youngster was introduced to catching a nice large mouth there. There are six other strains of very predatory fish in tahoe in abundance.
Brandon-

climber
The Granite State.
Topic Author's Reply - Feb 22, 2013 - 06:49pm PT
You know, I should have realized that this would turn into a pissing match between Ron and Wes.

Anything involving nature in that area causes you two to argue. You're both very stubborn.

Carry on.
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 22, 2013 - 06:55pm PT
Yeah, it sucks always having to set that old goat straight. But hey, I learned some things about guns, so I figure I should return the favor.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 22, 2013 - 07:00pm PT
Wait till i announce my "discoverys" wes! They will be saying,, Dr WHO?

But then again,, maybe ill just sell the info to the highest bidders? Gotta think capitol these days.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 22, 2013 - 07:06pm PT
Credit: Ron Anderson

here i am with something you may never see again,, a Walker Lake cuthroat.

No cuts have been seen in the lake since 2009...RIP Walker Lk..


even the goldfish are gone..
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 22, 2013 - 07:18pm PT
You took the last one?!?!?!

I wonder if their decline has anything to do with the 150 foot drop in lake level over the last few decades. Nah, probably has something to do with Obama and poor management from TRPA.

Good thing we aren't studying the impacts of upstream water allocation. Stoopid government thinking they know how to balance the water needs of society and the environment. Really the best action for conservation is no action at all.
wilbeer

Mountain climber
honeoye falls,ny.greeneck alleghenys
Feb 22, 2013 - 07:34pm PT
just think Ron,we throw browns and rainbows out like chubs when we are brook trout fishing,mink gotta eat just like we do.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 22, 2013 - 07:35pm PT
yeah wes,, like they DIDNT YEARS ago.. Never mind the LACK of snow nowdays.
Never mind there is a Paiute Res right upstream that HASNT had a die off.

Never mind that is the end of that river, therefore will always be the first to go in drying times.
Never mind Yerington pumps GALLONS into that river daily through the Ft Churchill power plant and Mason Valley Hatchery and pond systems from ground water pumps.

Want the rest of the story or just go ahead with your attempt at condescending quirks.



edit: Wilbeer,,MOST of my trout are released.. I prefer warm waters, like crappie, bluegill, yellow perch small mouth and largemouth in that order.
Ive kept a few to barbq,, fo sho.. NOTHING like fresh brookies sizzling away over a small fire -smoke wafting lazily into yur nose,, the scent of garlic and cooking fish...





edit: Hey wes,, from the CAL Fishing regs:


(a) In Donner, Fallen Leaf and Tahoe lakes Lahontan redside, tui chub, Tahoe sucker, Lahontan speckled dace, mountain sucker and Paiute sculpin may be used only in the same lake where taken.



Nev:
In the waters of Lake Tahoe and its
tributaries located in Carson City, Douglas and
Washoe Counties: only Lahontan redside
(shiner), tui chub, Tahoe sucker, mountain sucker, piaute sculpin, speckled dace may be used as bait, and only when taken from tributaries or waters lake Tahoe.
General Regulations Concerning Bait
Chim-Chim

climber
Feb 22, 2013 - 08:06pm PT
Here's a little story about the trpa. I've been a primary home owner for 17 years...gotta great deal, otherwise I would be on the street. I live in a low lying area, aspens, willows abound. Obviously, but to a lesser degree than the keys, the entire area should not been developed. Anyway, since I wanted to protect my property I built french drain to steer any water from my house, in addition to avoid having urban runoff from invading my property, and ruining my foundation. I Effectively installed a mandated (by the TRPA at amuch latter date) a B.M.P. also Aka Best Management Practice waaaaay before it was even an acronym. I applied for a permit to pave my driveway... no deal "that's considered coverage". Several years latter it's a mandated law to have my driveway paved to allieviate the problem of suspended solids from ruining the clarity of the lake. The TRPA doesn't hastle EdgeWood or Cal Trans the real culprits that are ruining the lake, maybe cuz they have alot of money. Maybe after a few millon generations some of the warm water species that live in the keys and other shallow micro climates may make some actual inroads to extending their range. Hopefully The whiners as well as the last of our retched species will have been long gone.
Dingus Milktoast

Gym climber
And every fool knows, a dog needs a home, and...
Feb 22, 2013 - 08:08pm PT
How come the people who live around that lake are so consistently miserable?

It SO must suck to live there.

DMT
Ricky D

Trad climber
Sierra Westside
Feb 22, 2013 - 08:13pm PT
^^^^Of course it sucks - between the bears eating yo peanut butter and the smell of fish sh#t in the air - the place just plain sux!
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 22, 2013 - 08:20pm PT
Never mind the LACK of snow nowdays.

Damn you TRPA! They've even altered the data, making it look like 1924-1978 were even drier!



Never mind that is the end of that river, therefore will always be the first to go in drying times.

Is that so? The first to go? Really? Because people who study hydrology know drought susceptibility is usually inversely correlated with contributing area. Sorry... "the bigger the watershed area, the less susceptible to drought." A terminal lake has the largest contributing area in the basin... by definition. It has to do with the fact that water flows down hill, draining high elevations first and pooling in lower elevations. I'm not saying it won't dry out first, I'm just saying the fact that it is at the end of the river is NOT the reason.

Want the rest of the story...

nah, I'm not much for fairy tales.


The TRPA doesn't hastle EdgeWood or Cal Trans the real culprits

Yes they do... and yes they are.
wilbeer

Mountain climber
honeoye falls,ny.greeneck alleghenys
Feb 22, 2013 - 08:23pm PT
DMT,i dont know how it could suck a high school friend lived there since 79 ,he just sold his place for 1/2 a million.
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 22, 2013 - 08:24pm PT
Oh, it sucks, trust me. In fact, it sucks even worse to visit up here. Trust me. Everyone is way better off staying in the bay area.


TRPA is stopping us from doing what we want to do on our property... but they are also stopping our neighbors from expanding their house.

It is funny when you follow your post with "Hopefully The whiners as well as the last of our retched species will have been long gone."
Dingus Milktoast

Gym climber
And every fool knows, a dog needs a home, and...
Feb 22, 2013 - 08:27pm PT
Was wasn't comparing, I don't live in the bay area and yes you do seem f*#king miserable, all the time. Enjoy.

DMT
wilbeer

Mountain climber
honeoye falls,ny.greeneck alleghenys
Feb 22, 2013 - 08:28pm PT
I quess i was sayin ,somebody wants to be there.
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 22, 2013 - 08:29pm PT
I'm in grad school, of course I'm miserable. Especially when I'm in front of a computer. IRL I'm one of the nicest, most pleasant people I know.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 22, 2013 - 08:31pm PT
Ndot uses water soluble oils on their roads. They use salt/sand and salt brines on their roads. The sewer vent between parking and the Cave used to GAG ya if it was warm.. I imagine it still does.

Then take eight million people pissing in it every summer along the shallows dumping their left overs and dead beers, and left over bait fish..

And the fact its warming up like everything else and yeah cycle time is coming close. (Close being who knows how many years). Tahoe does, but it aint sayin.
Dingus Milktoast

Gym climber
And every fool knows, a dog needs a home, and...
Feb 22, 2013 - 08:38pm PT
I'm in grad school,

I know.

IRL I'm one of the nicest, most pleasant people I know.

Actually I'm sure you are. Im the one being crabby now, sorry. Peace out.

DMT
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 22, 2013 - 08:40pm PT
THEN will come his re-edjumucashun into reality...Ive seen it,, it aint pretty..
Dingus Milktoast

Gym climber
And every fool knows, a dog needs a home, and...
Feb 22, 2013 - 08:42pm PT
Dr mechrist, has a ring to it.

Ron you seem ok too, even though you write the stupidest f*#king things from time to time. Like mocking someone's higher education... for example.

DMT
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 22, 2013 - 08:54pm PT
Dingus always cracks me up!

I've made it a point to balance my edumukashun with job experience. I have 12 years of ed and 8 years of professional experience. By the time I drop dead in 4 years I should be even stephen. Getting a job will be beautiful.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 22, 2013 - 08:58pm PT
Well,,ok,, let me relate a short story.. A grad school masters on Forestry was assigned to the Timber dept to do some studies of art regens we had done the previous year.
She comes in and tells me the plantation we planted just last spring has visible dwarf mistletoe. I said really? R U SURE? Yep-- saw it plainly!

So i explain to the GRAD student that it takes a min of 2 years for any visible signs of that infection. She says but i SAW IT! She was determined, and even told me how i WASNT as highly educated as herself and she resented me questioning her about it.
I said,, ooooook fine,, let us go see this not even 1 yr old plantation with mistletoe. We get there, having to listen to her explain how and why she is more highly educated for over an hour. She scurries over and points to the ground --SEE! I TOLD YOU! I look down to see what is probably a fifteen year old banzai jeffrey that was indeed infested with mistletoe, yet looked NOTHING like the two year old one stem plantaion trees that have been in the ground less than a year., nor did it have the scalp she insisted was there around the tree.
I then explained that it wasnt even in the border of the plantation and was a stunted banzai jeffrey in the neighborhood of fifteen. She ARGUED THE AGE with me..True story.Said it couldnt be that old. I sighed,, shrugged my shoulders, went over to my rig, and brought back my cruiser axe- and with a chop, started counting rings with a magnifier. I was off a wee,, it was 20. The GOOD part of the story was we had a nice quiet ride back...
Dingus Milktoast

Gym climber
And every fool knows, a dog needs a home, and...
Feb 22, 2013 - 09:04pm PT
I once argued that 'stats are meaningless and can be made to read whatever one wants' ....

to a PhD in math, on the internet.

I often make myself look as stupid as I feel, that way. Open mouth, insert foot.

Know what? I can't tell you how much I respect those who put themselves through advanced higher education. There are MANY such individuals on this board. I salute them all.

DMT
Dingus Milktoast

Gym climber
And every fool knows, a dog needs a home, and...
Feb 22, 2013 - 09:08pm PT
Cameron Diaz can rant to me any ole time she wants. About guns or girls, I don't care.



DMT
wilbeer

Mountain climber
honeoye falls,ny.greeneck alleghenys
Feb 22, 2013 - 09:08pm PT
one person generality=all fish the same
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 22, 2013 - 09:10pm PT
Christine Ngai of the University of Nevada, Reno, was among the researchers who found the first goldfish during a survey of invasive fish in the lake.



quote from the news story upthread wes.. That simply is not correct in any way...
And i have indeed contributed wes, each and every time i could. I was part of some very good things too.

Ill take Cameron fishing ANY TIME!
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 22, 2013 - 09:14pm PT
The worst part is you refuse to budge in your uneducated OPINIONS. As far as I can tell, one of two things are going on with you:

1) You know quite a bit. In which case, you are lazy sod who contributes very little of your potential to this world. What a shame.

2) What you think you know is in fact only what you believe and it is a fuzzy reflection of reality. In which case your contributions to the world of taxidermy are appreciated.



...among the researchers who found the first goldfish during a survey of invasive fish in the lake.

It doesn't say ever, does it? My buddy helped with the proposal that got their funding. He was always spewing about the huge gold fish in the keys. They obviously knew about them because they wrote a fuking grant to study them!
Brandon-

climber
The Granite State.
Topic Author's Reply - Feb 22, 2013 - 09:17pm PT
Shit! I had something really profound to say in reply, but it's Friday night and I'm stoned as a mofo.

Say something intelligent!!
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 22, 2013 - 09:25pm PT
taking Cameron Diaz fishing IS intelligent!
Dr.Sprock

Boulder climber
I'm James Brown, Bi-atch!
Feb 22, 2013 - 09:37pm PT
all they have to do is bring in a bus load of po folks like me and that fish problem would disappear overnight,

bergbryce

Mountain climber
California
Feb 22, 2013 - 09:41pm PT
The asian carp invasion in Illinois and Indiana is for real. The Corps is trying like hell to keep them out of the Great Lakes but it's only a matter of time.



One good way to solve a lot of problems at Lake Tahoe is to raze the Keys and return that area as best we can to its natural state. What a fuggin' disaster.
Chim-Chim

climber
Feb 22, 2013 - 09:47pm PT
DMT I love it in Tahoe, no complaints, just responding to someone who has'nt really s-s-s-tarted his life,... aka "gradual school". I'm from a family of educated people' and my fathers (pomposity) a fifty year practicing radiologist (sp?) (i'm not, only a bachelors in Biology). pales in comparison to the arrogance (a more youthful form) someone who calls people stupid. I ain't sayin' names. To the nameless, are you a TPRA employee? Also the TRPA has'nt done a very good job at allowing smaller homes to become giant messes, Just sayin. YRADK
Stewart Johnson

climber
lake forest
Feb 22, 2013 - 10:04pm PT
what aboot the well preserved bodies down there?
Credit: Stewart Johnson
John M

climber
Feb 22, 2013 - 10:05pm PT
Ron.. you are quoting a news story to prove that the researchers are stupid. Think about it. a news story. How often do news stories get it wrong? Eh.. Like Wes said, they wrote a grant proposal to study the problem. so obviously they knew about the goldfish in advance of the study. So when the news report said first goldfish found, they either got it wrong, or they didn't mean the first goldfish ever found, but the first one found during that study.

Dingus Milktoast

Gym climber
And every fool knows, a dog needs a home, and...
Feb 22, 2013 - 10:07pm PT
Ok chim chim, cheers. Its too bad, the thread topic is fascinating, shame its become what it has and I'm sorry for my own noise. Can't help myself some times :-)

DMT
Chim-Chim

climber
Feb 22, 2013 - 10:07pm PT
A washoe women washed up at cave rock a few years ago
Chim-Chim

climber
Feb 22, 2013 - 10:11pm PT
DMT, I've more than sampled your buzz. NN dimeth style style. Love is the sh#t, we're all one. I know that fer sur. Peace, pot, microdot. Dan, Frogs get no love!
Ricky D

Trad climber
Sierra Westside
Feb 22, 2013 - 10:34pm PT
I remember that all the goldfish my kid had eventually croaked from some fuzzy white sh#t that turned them into puffballs.

Find out what that fuzzy sh#t was and lets clear the lake of these overgrown guppies of satan!
Dingus Milktoast

Gym climber
And every fool knows, a dog needs a home, and...
Feb 22, 2013 - 10:43pm PT
The problem with that Ricky D is what I call the "I know an old lady who swallowed a fly". You know that little ditty?

Pretty soon you swallow a spider to catch the fly, and swallow a bird to catch the spider... and soon enough the horse kills the lake.

What kills the fuzzy white sh#t?

Once we intervene, can it ever be undone? I truly do no think so, the genie is out of the bottle. Sadly, its we 'umans that's the problem. What will be our spider?

DMT
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 22, 2013 - 10:46pm PT
One good way to solve a lot of problems at Lake Tahoe is to raze the Keys and return that area as best we can to its natural state. What a fuggin' disaster.

Absolutely!
Chim-Chim

climber
Feb 22, 2013 - 10:49pm PT
YRuaDK, response requestad, por favor.
Chim-Chim

climber
Feb 23, 2013 - 12:04am PT
Hello!
moosedrool

Trad climber
lost, far away from Poland
Feb 23, 2013 - 01:47am PT
A fisherman caught a gold fish. "If you let me go, I will grant you three wishes, but your neighbor will get twice as much" says the fish.
"OK, I want a ferrari" says the fisherman.
He gets a ferrari, but his neighbor gets two.
"I want a beautiful house"
Sure enough, he gets one and his neighbor gets two.
"Damn! I wish I lose one of my testicles!"
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 23, 2013 - 07:58pm PT
NICE! looks to be six to eight pounds! Havent caught one any where close to that football with fins.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 23, 2013 - 08:20pm PT
dear Wes, please inform the study group of a few things. Bass in the keys simply sink into the thickest cover available for the winter- tules, cat tails and any other aquatic weeds can be used mostly for balance in a hibernation mode. There they will lay in a dormancy of a sort, only taking in a small meal every few days as their metabolism is all but shut down by water temps and ice overs. Just like they do in mason valley NV as it too freezes over yet the fish remain year after year. This is one of the questions stumping the "team" it seems from a news report i just saw. As long as there is oxygen the fish will survive until the water warms into the low 50s and their activity picks up . They will spawn any where from 55 to 65 plus degrees- depending on the water and clarity. In any given pond largemouth will tend to eat a good 70% of their own offspring before they reach four inches in length. That from an 8 year study i did on LMB, crappie and bluegill at Mason valley . As for the fish they have lost radio contact with, look in either a mackinaw or a pelicans body. Perhaps a heron gutted it, or a Fisherman caught it and filleted the bass. Theres thirty pound macks in the lake- the same ones that ended the LCTs in the lake after being planted in the 1800s. This news report claimed a "new number one predator" when talking about bass, which made me laugh.. MACKS are the numba UNO..Followed closely by browns..Only in the keys are bass a predator- other wise they probably wonder why in the hell they wandered out of the keys to begin with!



Credit: intarweb
Tahoe mackinaw^^^


credt- intarweb
credt- intarweb
Credit: Ron Anderson

Tahoe Browns^^^swimming monsters in Tahoe. They eat two pound fish.

mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 23, 2013 - 09:51pm PT
Dear Ron, I appreciate your experience based OPINION, but I ain't your bitch. You've seen it, you splain it to them... or stop whining about how scientists are wrong about everything.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 23, 2013 - 09:54pm PT
arent you the one whining about not helping mankind to your potential? Here you are a resident and seem not to be willing to approach your "colleagues" with info for them.. tsk tsk..

"keep tayhowe blu- coo-coo-ca chu!"
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 23, 2013 - 10:48pm PT
Your sh#t ain't science bud, it is YOUR opinion and YOUR experience. It is up to you to explain it. Man up! Don't let the fact that she is a little hottie intimidate you.

If you have any questions about the study methods, statistics, etc. I'd be happy to translate those for you... but no way I'm going to try to translate your subjective experience, presented as universal truth, to other scientists.

And no, I'm not the one whining about wasting money on science when they could just ask some old dude... or whining about TRPA... or whining about a news article claiming a discovery when clearly others had already made enough observations to justify getting a grant for more in depth research... that's you. I whine about your insistence that you know what you are talking about yet consistently misinterpret 90% of the information... which is fine, as long as you aren't the one calling the shots regarding resource management.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 24, 2013 - 12:58am PT
Credit: Ron Anderson

Heres a 2lb Michigan "Koi" caught and mounted by a freind Joshua Knuth, which i got from him in an auction.

dem koi is takin over da planet!!!!Better get studies goin and kill off those rabid KOI in about three hundred cal lakes and ponds!
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 24, 2013 - 02:26am PT
That's silly Ron... there ain't enough money to fund such studies in other lakes... just in Tahoe... you know, the LARGEST alpine lake in N.America... with over 120 million acre feet of fresh water... the most critical natural resource in the west... with 15x the amount of land that the entire Central Valley Water Project irrigates... over 3x the municipal water needs of the entire state of California. Stoopid scientists studying irrelevant sh#t.
GDavis

Social climber
SOL CAL
Feb 24, 2013 - 08:59am PT
Ron... do you HAVE to play the same role in every single f*#king thread?

(ignorant fundamentalist conservative)


We have a non-native beetle destroying our californian forests, it isn't a bad idea to study the impact of introducing non-native wildlife that run amok.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 24, 2013 - 11:09am PT
GD,, not sure what yur problem is ,, However i was fighting the beetle problems while you were in diapers. And,, it was the TRPA that let those beeteles FEAST in tahoe.

And your runnin amuk statement reflects the news reports of this- with titles like "NEW THREAT TO TAHOE".. Goldfish are hardly new and IN NO WAY a threat to tahoe. Im simply trying to set the record straight. If you google it, there will be pages of the same story - with all quite damming titles- even made the natl news. And a mountain from a pimple is born..
Brandon-

climber
The Granite State.
Topic Author's Reply - Feb 24, 2013 - 11:28am PT
Well, this turned into a really stupid thread.

Ron, you're a f*#king brick wall. You're right and you always know it. If you'd listen to what people were saying to you sometimes, you might not be arguing with people as often. Did you ever think of that?

Of course not, because anything you say is correct, and should be taken as gospel.

The world doesn't work that way, dude.

Wes is just as bad, but at least the guy can cite references and stuff. And admits that he's simply stirring the pot.

You though, nobody can tell you anything without you feeling the need to argue a point. There are two types of people, in my opinion. There are those who see problems, and there are those who see solutions. You appear to be the former, rather than the latter.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 24, 2013 - 11:42am PT
Brandon you dont know me nor do you know what ive done in my times. But your attitude is typical for your age. Ill say that much..YOU and WES are guys that have little OR NO respect for anyone that has come before you. DO i really give a crap one about that--nope..
But for you to pompously call me someone that doesnt see the problem/solution is much like telling the submarine it will be fine with a screen door. The trouble is,, youth NEVER listens to age and experience.

And if you dont like the message kill the thread.
Brandon-

climber
The Granite State.
Topic Author's Reply - Feb 24, 2013 - 11:51am PT
Just constructive criticism Ron. Don't get all butt hurt, you seem like a good guy.

And really, the age card? I'm an intelligent mid-thirties man. I ain't old, but I ain't young, either.

Also, don't get me going about respect for my elders. Just because I disagree, doesn't make me disrespectful.
crankster

Trad climber
South Lake Tahoe, CA
Feb 24, 2013 - 12:01pm PT
Isn't Ron an invasive species?
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 24, 2013 - 12:09pm PT
im willing to bet dimes to donuts Ron has done more for the ecology round here than any other posters here in this thread. And that also gives me a right to an opinion.

and crank,, since its you with SLT in your avatar,, i do believe,, as far as Tahoe is concerned,, YOUR the invasive species here.


edit: Brandon, i want talking about AGE..
monolith

climber
SF bay area
Feb 24, 2013 - 12:13pm PT
No one said you didn't have a right to an opinion. Everyone's got one.
kennyt

climber
Woodfords,California
Feb 24, 2013 - 12:45pm PT
no need to worry until these guys move in.
Credit: kennyt
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 24, 2013 - 12:48pm PT
couple of those bad boys would make sand harbor a very exciting place to watch! If we can get NDOT to use a bit more salt brine up there- it might just work! daaana dannna dana dana dana dana dana!



seems Wiki agrees with my "non science" opinions as well...



. During winter, goldfish become sluggish, stop eating and often stay on the bottom of the pond. This is normal; they become active again in the spring.
Jebus H Bomz

climber
Peavine
Feb 24, 2013 - 12:57pm PT
No one said you didn't have a right to an opinion. Everyone's got one.


That reminds me of the other thing we've all got and of my morning sh#t this am. There is now a pancake turd resting on Peavine with a little dog nibble out of one side. I should probably shower wipe at some point. And no doggy kisses for a while either.

Considering this thread that ^^^ is a successful contribution!
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 24, 2013 - 12:59pm PT
YOU SHAT on Peavine,, mother goddess of Reno???????
Jebus H Bomz

climber
Peavine Basecamp
Feb 24, 2013 - 01:01pm PT
I prefer to think I fertilized the womb with the nectar from my butt, Ron.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 24, 2013 - 01:03pm PT
knowing the P like i do,, i know your not the first..
Jebus H Bomz

climber
Peavine Basecamp
Feb 24, 2013 - 01:07pm PT
Like you doo? Did you doo something up there we should know about too?
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 24, 2013 - 01:09pm PT
shot my first deer off of the P when it was way out of town..And there was no such thing as lemon valley etc...I dont remember if i made dudu on it though, but ive SEEN THINGS maaaaa-aaaannn!.


Bet you dont know about an old ghost town on its western flank by the name of "Port Aurthur"..?
Jebus H Bomz

climber
Peavine Basecamp
Feb 24, 2013 - 01:14pm PT
Read about that town when I was looking up hikes and such. Lotsa abandoned mines and interesting trails up Peavine. The fishing is terrible though.

Still have yet to do a hike up to the summit. Shoot! This is the weekend I was planning to do that! Now that I'm clambering on the rocks once more, my hiking goals seem like hiking goals again.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 24, 2013 - 01:19pm PT
Glad you feeling like being back at it!

I was stationed in Dog Valley for a few years in the circus..traveled every path and road in the place. Know the history behind most ALL the old ruins , cabin sites , and ancient look out ruins.. It was a bitchin place- and the old buildings, crew quarters and shops( long since torn down) were built by the Oriental folks who were interned there during WW11..
Jebus H Bomz

climber
Peavine Basecamp
Feb 24, 2013 - 01:28pm PT
They interned them here too? Only one I've been to is San Francisco's Angel Island. Yeah, I've been enjoying the mountain too, been trail running and hiking on the sweet single track MTB trails up there.

Reno has a lot of opportunity people overlook. I guess the run down tackiness of downtown and the casino bizz underwhelms the outdoor outlook.

Back at it. Seconded WML's lead of OULD up there at the Fords the other day. In typical Woodfords consensus (something we've discussed before) reports have it at 5.10a to 5.10d. It still felt hard to me, but I got it clean on the follow!

Only Users Lose Drugs, Photo by WML
Only Users Lose Drugs, Photo by WML
Credit: Jebus H Bomz
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 24, 2013 - 01:33pm PT
Yup,, it was a smaller camp, but all the buildings were made by them, and made WELL! They tore them down in the mid eighties which was not only sad but stupid. The HUGE barn and shop they had built was perfect. The crew quarters and office were also well built- right on the edge of the meadow in the nw corner. There are huge grinding rocks there as well from the Piautes and washoes - even the very ancient martis tribe was there in force long ago. The place is loaded with artifacts. And special spots like crystal peak..
Brandon-

climber
The Granite State.
Topic Author's Reply - Feb 24, 2013 - 01:34pm PT
Crystal peak out of Verdi? That is indeed a special spot.
Jebus H Bomz

climber
Peavine Basecamp
Feb 24, 2013 - 01:36pm PT
Cool history. I can't believe I crapped all over it now!

Strange move tearing down those building when every other claptrap structure is left in place in these parts. Seems like a little history editing.

I'm excited to extend my runs now, look for some of those artifacts and such.
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 24, 2013 - 01:46pm PT
Seriously Ron, man up and write a letter. Tell those stoopid scientists what they are missing!

I'm not a fish person anymore and I have never fished in Lake Tahoe. Back in 5th grade my favorite shirt read "Wold's Greatest Fisherman." Yes, even back then I KNEW I was the best at everything I tried! I learned to fly fish at 5 (you should have seen the rig we came up with!) and I tied flies every night with my pa, but there ain't much diversity in Utah trout creeks... book, rainbow, German brown... some cutthroats in some of the reservoirs... caught a few bass, bluegill, perch in some of the warmer southern lakes.. but sitting on a boat was boring as shit! We went fishing at least every other weekend when the weather allowed and in the summer we would do 5 day backpacking trips living primarily off of fish. Turns out, I'm allergic to fish. What I thought was exhaustion from a day of hiking miles on the rivers was just mild(?) anaphylaxis. My fishing career ended after my second emergency room visit when I was 11... but I digress.

Anyway, I'm a scientist now. Science requires answering testable hypothesis. You have some in your rants about how much more you know about the world than everyone else, but they need to be teased out so they make sense and none of them have been tested with proper methods. You might be able to get those dumb scientists to test them for you with a simple letter. Maybe they will bestow you with an honorary degree... you could take it to the shooting range and impress all your buddies.. by blowing it to bits!

Here's a start (remember, scientists like numbers, so use them when you can):



Dear ignorant researchers (you can play with that until it accurately conveys your message of indignation),

I have recently seen news reports about warm water fish invading Lake Tahoe. I have been fishing Lake Tahoe for (number) years and I can assure you warm water fish, including gold fish, have been there for at least (number) years. I have known fishermen to use gold fish as bait for at least (number) years, often discarding the remaining fish into the lake at the end of the day. This seems like a far more likely source of these invasive fish than "emptying aquariums."


From the news reports (insert the actual news report if you can... that's called "referencing your source") it appears you are stumped by the behavior of bass during the colder winter months. From my experience bass in the keys simply sink into the thickest cover available for the winter- tules, cat tails and any other aquatic weeds can be used mostly for balance in a hibernation mode. There they will lay in a dormancy of a sort, only taking in a small meal every few days as their metabolism is all but shut down by water temps and ice overs. Just like they do in mason valley NV as it too freezes over yet the fish remain year after year. (they can test this)

As long as there is oxygen the fish will survive until the water warms into the low 50s and their activity picks up. Based on an 8 year study i did on LMB, crappie and bluegill at Mason valley (again, cite where they can find details of this study so they can go back and look at what you actually did), they will spawn any where from 55 to 65 plus degrees- depending on the water and clarity. In any given pond largemouth will tend to eat a good 70% of their own offspring before they reach four inches in length. (they can test this, if they haven't already... I think they probably have, but I'm sure they would love to read about your 8 year study)

As for the fish you have lost radio contact with, look in either a mackinaw or a pelicans body. Perhaps a heron gutted it, or a Fisherman caught it and filleted the bass. Theres thirty pound macks in the lake- the same ones that ended the LCTs in the lake after being planted in the 1800s. You can easily test this hypothesis by slaughtering them all until you find the transmitters.

This news report (cite it) claimed a "new number one predator" when talking about bass, which made me laugh.. since MACKS are the numba UNO..Followed closely by browns..Only in the keys are bass a predator- other wise you probably wonder why in the hell they wandered out of the keys to begin with! (this is also testable, but I suspect if they made the claim, especially in any scientific article/report/conference, they have the data to back it up. if the claim was made by the news story, proceeded by "possible" or "potential" or similar word then talk to the news folks about that.)


We will have to work on the last bit as it won't make much sense to anyone sober... much less a scientists, regardless of how many drinks they've had.




Sorry to ruin your thread Brandon.
Jebus H Bomz

climber
Peavine Basecamp
Feb 24, 2013 - 01:54pm PT

Sorry to ruin your thread Brandon.


Haha! Doesn't quite pass the "sniff" test!

You guys have fun with that, I think this post be my last sh#t of the day.

mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 24, 2013 - 02:06pm PT
I like pointing out when Ron is being an obstinate old goat... but I don't like ruining other people's threads. Especially Brandon's.. he seems like such a nice YOUNG fella.
KP Ariza

climber
SCC
Feb 24, 2013 - 02:33pm PT
Ruined? who are you guys kidding? this has definitely been one of the good ones lately. Keep it rolling.....

Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 24, 2013 - 06:34pm PT
sorry,, i was busy changing wheel bearings..

Sooo,, anyhoo.. Did you know any hybirds of goldfish/koi are sterile?
manzanita man

Social climber
somerset, ca.
Feb 24, 2013 - 08:12pm PT
my last fishing trip at tahoe.
Credit: manzanita man
T H

Boulder climber
bouldering
Feb 24, 2013 - 11:31pm PT
Giant Goldfish in Tahoe
$100 a plate at Stateline.
Garibaldi - I used to catch these surf-fishing in Laguna Beach.
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 24, 2013 - 11:59pm PT
Crayfish traps arrived today. Can't wait to suck some head butter.
Cosmiccragsman

Trad climber
AKA Dwain, from Apple Valley, Ca. and Vegas!
Feb 25, 2013 - 12:28am PT
CRAWDADS!!!!!
YUMMMMMMMMMNM


Who need traps.
Some string and cheese work great.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 28, 2013 - 01:24pm PT
Uh HUH... The latest clarity study revealed today that Tahoe is clearer TODAY,, than in has been in 22 years.. Nearly seventy five feet of clarity..

But,,, but,,,, all these gold fishies and bassies poopin in da lake are supposed to be so phosphorus as to make the clarity decline through added algae growth..(yet they EAT algae)


22 years,, the best clarity now. Hmmmmmmm( scratches head)


But but,,,what does THAT mean??? (picks nose)


Could it be,, that the number 22 is also around the time they claim these fish became a problem????

Could it be,, these nare-do-well fishies are actually HELPING the clarity of Tahoe?

Cuz since they been around, its the BEST CLARITY in 22 years..


co-incidence?


mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 28, 2013 - 01:26pm PT
The latest clarity study revealed today that Tahoe is clearer TODAY,, than in has been in 22 years.. Nearly seventy five feet of clarity..


THANKS TRPA!
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 28, 2013 - 01:32pm PT
Thanks bassies, bluegills and carps.. Thanks crawdadies - keep up the good work..;-)

And of course, with added clarity comes added temperature- through sun penetration = movement of fish, and minnows- or changes in patterns.


edit: And isnt all these studies, attempting to "blame" clarity problems in Tahoe on a few wandering warm water species sounding even more ridiculous at this juncture? Isnt the idea of eradicating the keys of its treasured fish a bit questionable at this juncture?

They planted grass carp at Mason valley years ago to fight the encroachment of aquatic veggies..WHA??


Yes,, Tahoe now be clearer than the last 22 years . Any studies with more than a single brain cell should really wonder about the fact that these invasive additions may just be a help, not a hindrance.
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Feb 28, 2013 - 01:37pm PT
Thank you SCIENCE for giving us an alternative to people who believe in species identifying fish finders.

http://terc.ucdavis.edu/stateofthelake/StateOfTheLake2011_Chapter9.pdf


And isnt all these studies, attempting to "blame" clarity problems in Tahoe on a few wandering warm water species sounding even more ridiculous at this juncture? Isnt the idea of eradicating the keys of its treasured fish a bit questionable at this juncture?

Your lack of understanding is astounding.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 28, 2013 - 01:45pm PT
Fish finders are NOT species identifying as such .. Only fisherman can do the id- either by experience ( as to how the fish are aligned with structure, or by simply FISHING to see what they catch). Things considered when looking for fish are temperatures, thermoclines, structure and clarity as well as time of year .(spawn -post spawn,pre-spawn, summer or winter.) Fisherman know what their quarry likes, and when. Those put together narrow a search any any given body of water. Hope that explains a thing or two wes.

Ive sat over fish constantly in my signal,, dropped a jig right down to them as i watched if fall on the graph, and caught that fish. I knew what it was before i lowered the jig, due to how and where it was holding, by experience of fifty years of chasing fish.


edit: Wes,, that IS the news and what those reports are saying. It was suggested by the young Dr that these should be eradicated upon sight.
They arent part of ANY problem,, not the bait fish, not the clarity or any thing else. Thank the TRPA for a LARGE WASTE of yur tax dollars, again...
Jebus H Bomz

climber
Peavine Basecamp
Feb 28, 2013 - 02:14pm PT
I've had the buckeftful of crawdads before in crawdad country. I guess if you've got nothing better to do they're alright. I'm not really into spending a bunch of time cracking bug shells open though.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 28, 2013 - 02:17pm PT
Awwwman,, the tails, butterflied and cooked in butter and garlic are,,orgasmic.
Jebus H Bomz

climber
Peavine Basecamp
Feb 28, 2013 - 02:18pm PT
Are you sure we aren't talking about lobster here? I've had the lil f*#kers, too much work for too little. The corn fritters n sh#t are good though.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 28, 2013 - 02:21pm PT
Tayhowe has some sizable crustaceans a wee deeper. My scuba divin budy knows where they are at..But we wont tell the TRPA...;-)
Jebus H Bomz

climber
Peavine Basecamp
Feb 28, 2013 - 02:23pm PT
I haven't had any out of Lake Biggler yet. Out in Texas. I guess if I eat 'em in Louisiana and don't like 'em then, I can call it good.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 28, 2013 - 02:27pm PT
"I reckon its-so little Bill". ;-)

edit: Note,, crawdads when COOKED like lobsters often turn out the very same. I dont like the boiler jobs myself.
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Mar 15, 2013 - 01:51pm PT
http://www.nytimes.com/2013/03/15/science/earth/algae-blooms-threaten-lake-erie.html?pagewanted=1&_r=1&
Brandon-

climber
The Granite State.
Topic Author's Reply - Mar 15, 2013 - 05:20pm PT
This won the River Ranch snow sculpture contest this year.

labrat

Trad climber
Auburn, CA
Apr 4, 2013 - 06:58pm PT
Report: Asian carp may have reached Great Lakes

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/report-asian-carp-may-reached-145352235.html;_ylt=AwrNUbJsBV5R0mgAO1DQtDMD

;-(
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Apr 4, 2013 - 07:00pm PT
My friend who suffers from Yellow Fever nearly died when I told him Tahoe was being invaded by Asia clams.
TGT

Social climber
So Cal
Apr 4, 2013 - 07:03pm PT
Brandon-

climber
The Granite State.
Topic Author's Reply - May 17, 2013 - 04:43pm PT
http://moonshineink.com/sections/spot-news/saga-quagga

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