Discussion Topic |
|
This thread has been locked |
couchmaster
climber
pdx
|
|
|
Jan 30, 2013 - 12:19am PT
|
"....so much goes on that 99 percent of America doesn't know about - there is a big news black out. If folks write about it they end up dead real fast."
Scary stuff there Riley. The Mexicans have to figure this out for themselves. Certainly NAFTA was an attempt to help the economics of the issue, but the price of drugs and the lure of fast/easy money are hard to compete with.
Fortunately, Hillary has been able to get them to sign a Memorandum Of Understanding (a MOU) between the Department of State of the United States of America and the Secretariat of Foreign Relations of the United Mexican States for the Promotion of Gender Equality, the Empowerment of Women and Women's Human Rights. Sometimes you just have to take the first important steps. Maybe next, say in 30 or 40 years, we can help them with these killings.
http://www.state.gov/p/wha/rls/2012/197907.htm
|
|
zBrown
Ice climber
chingadero de chula vista
|
|
|
Jan 30, 2013 - 12:31am PT
|
"worship at the altar of a stagant pool"
|
|
Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
|
|
|
Jan 30, 2013 - 12:33am PT
|
"....so much goes on that 99 percent of America doesn't know about - there is a big news black out"
And a lot of what we think is true, is not necessarily so.
This time last night I was reading up on what is going on in Syria, and what I found out led me to Mexican drug gang activity.
Remember that Mexican drug cartel chainsaw beheading video? The "Free Syrian Army" got a hold of that voieo and broadasted it saying that the guys lopping off the heads were Syrian Government goons, which could not have been farther from the truth.
The more I look into these kind of things, the less sure I am as to exactly who is responsible.
Everything I see is automatically considered to be bullsh#t, until proven otherwise.
|
|
healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
|
|
|
Jan 30, 2013 - 12:45am PT
|
The violence really escalated when ex-Spec Ops guys got involved with and, in some cases, commandeered the cartels. They took the violence to a whole new level that it just hasn't backed down from and likely won't any time soon.
I actually agree with this statement:
Couch: It's institutionalized poverty and corruption, and a mindset of the people.
And I too sometimes wonder about the country's hyper-violence being somehow rooted in their Mayan heritage.
|
|
WBraun
climber
|
|
|
Jan 30, 2013 - 01:04am PT
|
The Maria Santos Gorrostieta story is so heartbreaking.
Sh!t like this just kills me .....
|
|
Rolfr
Social climber
North Vancouver BC
|
|
|
Jan 30, 2013 - 01:30am PT
|
Another climbing area in jeopardy, just legalize drugs and remove the billions of dollars profit the cartels fight over.
Canada is still a safe place to climb, your always welcome here . So sad when innocent people get caught up in this sh#t.
|
|
Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
|
|
|
Jan 30, 2013 - 01:37am PT
|
Even though I'm all for drug legalization - and it is the right thing to do, even if it makes things worse - I don't see how that would reduce the demand for drugs.
As long as demand remains high, the folks in Mexico will still fight over who manages the supply.
Legalizing drugs here won't do one damn thing to encourage the Mexicans to find a non-violent way to divvy up their sh#t. It may even make things worse down there, by injecting more money into the mix.
But legalizing drugs is still the right thing, and I'm not being facetious.
|
|
mechrist
Gym climber
South of Heaven
|
|
|
Jan 30, 2013 - 01:49am PT
|
A couple legal plants per dirty hippie stoner and demand will plummet. Treat it like home brewing.
|
|
Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
|
|
|
Jan 30, 2013 - 02:03am PT
|
For the guys I know who smoke, having "a couple plants" means they're about out of weed.
A couple dozen plants would be more like it.
But it would be much more effective to simply steal someone else's plants, just like people steal avocados in the night.
|
|
climbski2
Mountain climber
Anchorage AK, Reno NV
|
|
|
Jan 30, 2013 - 02:11am PT
|
Riley.
Thank you for Maria's story.
You are right I simply do not understand. I said so in an earlier post.
What an amazing brave woman who saved her child. Maybe her nation a little.
There ARE things worth dying early for.
|
|
Chaz
Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
|
|
|
Jan 30, 2013 - 02:56am PT
|
The cartels might even take over legal industries.
Witness our own history of The Mob back east, being in charge of such things as trash disposal and concrete delivery.
The Mexican cartels could just as easily move into American street-legal drugs.
|
|
Rolfr
Social climber
North Vancouver BC
|
|
|
Jan 30, 2013 - 03:04am PT
|
Drug trafficking is and always has been about money, the probation in the 1920’s against alcohol created similar gang violence.
This isn’t about anything but pure monetary greed and intimidating your competition. The increase in gun trafficking is a direct byproduct of the defense of the cartels marketplace.
All addiction studies come to the same conclusion, a certain portion of the population will always become addicts and that percentage remains constant, the only noticeable difference is that as population centers increase so do the addicts.
As extreme as it may seem , legalizing and decriminalization of all drugs would not increase addiction but would remove the profitability and the criminal element.
Bootlegging of alcohol and overt gang violence significantly decreased after the removal of the probation in the 1930’s
I’m not suggesting that the cartels wouldn’t find other sources of illegitimate enterprises, but legalization would be a major counter offensive.
Arming additional american paramilitary and military organizations isn’t a solution. Violence on begets violence.
As unpopular as this may be, at one point there needs to be restrictions on firearms in the US.
|
|
rockermike
Trad climber
Berkeley
|
|
|
Jan 30, 2013 - 03:08am PT
|
I don't like drugs (hell I don't like alcohol either) If I was God I would simply shoot the (mostly white) users in the back of the head with a 45 (kidding), but the fact is, the US had to legalize alcohol to take the hyper profits out the business and thus away from the mafia. Same thing seems to apply now to drugs in my opinion. Let RJ Reynolds get into pot - millions of acres worth. They are competitive as#@&%es no doubt, but they have a different way of doing business. As it is, my guess is that the cartels are funding the anti-legalization campaigns. And the LA mayor's campaign as well.
Similar story in Bolivia and Peru by the way. Drug lords are only drug lords because they are the only ones ruthless enough to be in an illegal business.
|
|
Don Paul
Big Wall climber
Colombia, South America
|
|
|
Jan 30, 2013 - 09:24am PT
|
His dad told him that the cartel had come to town and taken all the men and young men with them at gun point. They took them to a field and told them that they no longer work int he fields that they work for them and they will carry drugs into the US for them and if anyone has a problem with this they should stand up now and tell them.
We've been through all this 20 years ago in Colombia. What I do for a living is represent a few thousand people killed by Colombian paramilitaries in a lawssuit against Chiquita Brands, who were paying them for protection. In one case, a truck full of paras arrived at a soccer game, and kidnapped about 20 teenage players. They were made to unload about 3000 AK-47s from one of Chiquita's banana boats, then taken to a remote camp and either joined the organization, or were never seen again.
Everything everyone said here has already been said about Colombia too. The only reason things have gotten better is that the problem is moving to Mexico.
|
|
justthemaid
climber
Jim Henson's Basement
|
|
|
Jan 30, 2013 - 09:59am PT
|
Climbski2: Riley.
Thank you for Maria's story....
What an amazing brave woman who saved her child. Maybe her nation a little.
There ARE things worth dying early for.
Ditto that^^^ I really appreciate you posting that story. It stays with me.
Aside from that...
Weed isn't the main problem people.. cocaine is. Pot is one thing, but legalizing an addictive drug like cocaine in the US would be a bad call Ripley.
@Rockermike:
If I was God I would simply..
I would simply evolve a convenient mold or pest that caused every coca plant on the continent to die off. Fortunately for the cartels, I'm not God. Maybe we can enlist Monsanto to do some good for once? They could engineer a coca-specific Round-up to bomb the plantations with. Game over man.
Just fantasizing here.
|
|
Gunkie
Trad climber
East Coast US
|
|
|
Jan 30, 2013 - 10:08am PT
|
The trumpet player made a pass at the wrong girl...
I'm a trumpet player and I'm still here. So that wasn't me.
Has anyone hear from Ksolem? he's a trumpet player, too. Hope he didn't get whacked.
|
|
TradEddie
Trad climber
Philadelphia, PA
|
|
|
Jan 30, 2013 - 10:39am PT
|
20 years ago a good friend of mine was "arrested" by police officers in Mexico City, driven at gunpoint to a dark alley where they were blindfolded and robbed. Things have only got worse since then. Sorry, Portrero will never be on my bucket list.
TE
|
|
Bob D'A
Trad climber
Taos, NM
|
|
|
Jan 30, 2013 - 11:03am PT
|
I driven down into Mexico three times in the last year, twice by my self and never an issue. Been to Mexico maybe 15-20 times and never an issue.
Last time was down deep into Copper Canyon to Urique, didn't have issue.
Mexicans are cool people and quite friendly. It is shame the press they get.
|
|
pelut espania
Big Wall climber
Espania
|
|
|
Jan 30, 2013 - 11:07am PT
|
Amigos! They are Mexicanos and not the cultured Spanish gentlemans so come to my country and see the humans not the criminals of Mexico! Viva Espania!
|
|
High Fructose Corn Spirit
Gym climber
-A race of corn eaters
|
|
|
Jan 30, 2013 - 11:14am PT
|
So they killed her, after all. Maria Santos Gorrostieta.
I remember her story from a few years ago and I remember her thoughtfulness and courage.
Yes, it is heartbreaking. :(
|
|
|
SuperTopo on the Web
|
Let us know!