18 murdered, dumped in portrero chico; climbers are fleeing

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Chaz

Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
Jan 30, 2013 - 09:37pm PT
Damn straight!





jstan

climber
Jan 30, 2013 - 09:37pm PT
An urban myth so that we may appreciate how drastically changed the world is.

Many years ago a certain American climber was imprisoned in Mexico. The story is after eight years
Mexico said they would release him. He opted to stay in prison. There he could get as many cheap
drugs as he needed, and there were connubial visits every week.

Why would I want to leave?

See what the US subsidy for corn production has cost us?
cuvvy

Sport climber
arkansas
Jan 30, 2013 - 10:49pm PT
My dad and I cancelled a trip last year when we heard about some shootings in the Hidalgo main plaza. I know the plaza is still a couple miles from the climbing area, but we thought it might be better to go somewhere else. We stayed in the states and went to Hueco tancos! Which was quite nice.
coz

Gym climber
Belmont
Jan 30, 2013 - 10:54pm PT
Just heard on CNN of the terrible shooting death of the 15 year old girl in Chicago, she just performed at Obama's inauguration, and was known for smiling all the time.

Then Anderson went on to say 41 people have been murder so far this year in Chicago, maybe its time to flee?

Oh, and the 20 some kids shoot down at Sandy Hook , and another shooting today in Arizona, etc, etc.

But hey Mexico, oh my Lord, that place is messed up.
Meatbird

Social climber
Lindsay, OK
Jan 31, 2013 - 05:16am PT
Gallo, I'm I reading the right story in Rock and Ice? The one in the front page news section. I'm bemused by your accusations against Raleigh's reporting. I didnt get the sense it was sensationalist. Frankly, I'm glad to get the heads up on a terrible incident that would give me pause before taking a trip there, especially with family in tow. Unless the facts are wrong, I don't know how he would have presented it any better.
patrick compton

Trad climber
van
Jan 31, 2013 - 05:44am PT
The 'its just as dangerous in LA' argument shows a lack of understanding of the drug war in Mexico. These gangs out gun the local cops, buy them off or kill them and intimidate or pay off the federales. The local reds and blues in the US run drugs, do some drivebys on rival gangs. There is no comparison.

Just because you haven't heard of gangs kidnapping Americans doesn't mean that it isn't going to start happening in the near future. Sure, keep pretending that PC is south Texas, you are perfectly safe, it's vacationland in a sea of bolts, nothing to worry about.
zBrown

Ice climber
chingadero de chula vista
Jan 31, 2013 - 06:24am PT
^It already started several years ago.


Trial Begins of AFO Cell in San Diego, Prosecutor: Victims Kidnapped and Dissolved in Acid

http://www.borderlandbeat.com/2012/02/trial-begins-of-afo-cell-in-san-diego.html

trial ends

http://articles.latimes.com/2012/may/17/local/la-me-drug-murders-20120517
Dingus Milktoast

Gym climber
And every fool knows, a dog needs a home, and...
Jan 31, 2013 - 06:57am PT
I've spent time in Mexico, wandering into places I had no business wandering into. I love it there. I've not been at all intimidated by the cartel wars but perhaps in a few small towns I brazenly roamed, perhaps I should have been. I have 'a look' that could provoke a bad outcome, in certain quarters, I suppose.

Anyway, point is, the threat or risk of violence has not deterred me from visiting some very dangerous places, as a civilian, mind you.

I don't think I would visit Portrero Chico this year. Sorry, but 18 bodies in a nearby well MUST be taken as a warning. If you don't heed it or don't agree its a warning, fine, do what you're gonna do.

I'm just saying, for this traveler - 18 dead bodies in a well sends me a message I will heed.

Sorry Mexico. Sorry we f*#ked up your f*#ked up country a lot worse. You had it bad enough with the Spanish bastards.

DMT
coz

Gym climber
Belmont
Jan 31, 2013 - 10:04am PT
Patrick,

You live in Vancouver, the summer camp of the world. The only danger there is a random over charge for a man purse on Robson Street.

I feel much safer in Mexico than most places in LA.

The media is all over the drug war, it's fairly dangerous, but to pretend you have some understanding that us Yanks don't have, well that's funny and laughable.

When I stayed in Manhattan, NYC, I had three murders outside my apt, a mugging and a rape in three months.

I traveled to Cancun after, and slept out on the beach; heard of no violence and everyone laugh at how scared Americans were by the media. Kids were living in tents and Gringo hitch hiking everywhere.

18 band members, how about over 20 children at Sandy Hook, come on man get a grip.

I have many close Mexican friends who live in Mexico and say you need to avoid certain areas just like anywhere in the world, but by and large its safe. Many Canadian living there as we speak laughing at the fear mongering of the press. I say don't believe the hype.

Sierra Ledge Rat

Mountain climber
Old and Broken Down in Appalachia
Jan 31, 2013 - 12:21pm PT
...more murders in northern Mexico...

Does this really come as a suprise to anyone?

I feel much safer in Mexico than most places in LA.

L.A. is part of Mexico. I would feel safer in Syria than in L.A.

And I grew up in Oxnard.
Jebus H Bomz

climber
Reno, Nuh VAAAA duh
Jan 31, 2013 - 01:00pm PT
I'm just saying, for this traveler - 18 dead bodies in a well sends me a message I will heed.

Gotta say I agree. I mean, we can rationalize it any which way, but a massacre originating a stone's throw away from camp gives me the willies. I am sorry for the people involved and the absolute terror invoked by such acts for the common people of Mexico who are just trying to get by.
Dave Kos

Social climber
Temecula
Jan 31, 2013 - 01:35pm PT
I have 'a look' that could provoke a bad outcome, in certain quarters, I suppose.

Ha! I have that look also.

I'm not pissed at you, really!
Patrick Sawyer

climber
Originally California now Ireland
Jan 31, 2013 - 01:39pm PT
Firstly, I have not been to Mexico in over 27 years. In 1985 five of us went to climb the three main volcanoes. We flew to Mexico City, hired a VW van and set off.

After the night before we were to fly out, we went to a bar/nightclub in Puebla. Rob Grandfield was driving and did not have one alcoholic drink. On the way back to the hotel, two cops in a VW bug stopped us, this is around midnight, saying we were going the wrong way up the street. BS, we were on that streets hours earlier with traffic.

They said they smelled alcohol on Rob's breath and wanted $100 each or else he goes to jail. Fortunately, one of our team, Henry, whose parents were from Mexico, got them down to $50 for both of them.

Got the flight the next day.

But on this trip just about every Mexican we met were good people.

Been to Mexico several times in my life. Only other trouble was in TJ. My brother Mac, his then girlfriend Muffet Hemingway (yes, a granddaughter), my mom and I. Walking down a street some bloke came up and snatched Muffet's purse/handbag. I chased after him (I was 14 with long hair and broken Spanish), Mac behind me. Down an alleyway and gone.

Cop car came up, I tried to explain what happened. No go.

Otherwise I have known a lot of good Mexicans over the years (one team I played with was AC Mexico for a season in the old San Francisco Major Division, at the time the top of four divisions, also with SF Celtic, Major matches at the old Balboa Stadium). EDIT, I also played with a Jamaican team in East London (local league, played at Hackney Marshes). Good footballers, nice guys but they sure liked their ganja.

Loads of dead bodies in Mexico, Syria, Congo, 20 children in Connecticut, child soldiers in Asia and Africa made to kill other children, 77 dead in the Norway massacre in 2011. It is not just endemic to Mexico.

And we call some animals 'beasts'.
Sierra Ledge Rat

Mountain climber
Old and Broken Down in Appalachia
Jan 31, 2013 - 01:54pm PT
...got them down to $50 for both of them...

I spend a lot of time in southern Mexico (Yucatán peninsula) scuba diving and cave diving. I like certain parts of Mexico, and I'd like to retire down there on the Riviera Maya.

The U.S. State Department issued a travel warning for Mexico that went something like: "...Mexico...where stories of police corruption are legendary and true..."

I've had similar incidents with corrupt police in Mexico... One cop actually searched through my wallet and took all of my cash right in front of me.

If you can stay away from the drug cartel havens, and avoid the cops, Mexico is a great place.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Jan 31, 2013 - 01:56pm PT
My buddy who had a motor home down on the coast no longer goes to his 99 yr lease anymore. Getting to iffy on the way down there. And hes a tough SOB..
Patrick Sawyer

climber
Originally California now Ireland
Jan 31, 2013 - 02:01pm PT
Guadalajara has to be one of the most beautiful cities in the Americas.

But if I was to climb in Mexico now, I'd stick to Baja.

But there is so much rock in this world where there is little domestic violence, why risk it?

I find that free soloing 5.15 is risky enough. (Then I woke up.)
pat

Trad climber
estes park
Jan 31, 2013 - 02:18pm PT
There is a current travel warning out against Nuevo Leon.

Los Angeles:

Population - 3,795,361

Murders in 2010 - 293

Ciudad Juarez:

Population - 1,321,004

Murders in 2010 - 3,075

Not really the same.
We have plenty of problems, I know, but when was the last time in the US someone found a mass grave with 50 people in it? Seems a little unfair to the Mexicans to just poo poo the situation.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ciudad_Ju%C3%A1rez#Demographics
http://www.city-data.com/city/Los-Angeles-California.html

To be clear, objectively, I don't think the people in Potrero are in any grave danger, I just find it a little annoying when people make blanket statements. Yes, a massacre at my local climbing area might make me think twice about climbing there, objectivity and rationality be damned.

Big Mike

Trad climber
BC
Jan 31, 2013 - 02:20pm PT
Funny. Alex went anyways. He shoulda stuck to Vegas and went to the fights this weekend! Best of luck.
Dr.Sprock

Boulder climber
I'm James Brown, Bi-atch!
Jan 31, 2013 - 02:22pm PT
does alex honold ever go down to mexico?


never

what is in mexico?

























































mexicans.

(dusk til dawn 1-quenten t.)







they kill all other types.



how many minorities are there in mexico? vietnamese? indians? egyptians?


none.

the ones that went down there are all dead


steveA

Trad climber
bedford,massachusetts
Feb 1, 2013 - 05:04am PT
I just heard from my daughter, who has been climbing down there.

I strongly suggested that she get out of there.

She said that No climbers left and there were many police around, soon after the incident.

Apparently, none of the climbers are concerned, and "feel" safe. Honnold just arrived.
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