Lance is a Saint !

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donini

Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
Jan 18, 2013 - 12:47pm PT
You're right.....people like Lance only fess up when EVERY single other option has been expended.
Even his confession is only partly true and contains a lot of lies and half truths.

This is common with pathologically self-absorbed people.....could be why it's so commonplace with elite atheletes, and politicians.
zBrown

Ice climber
chingadero de chula vista
Jan 18, 2013 - 12:48pm PT
Bingo

So obviously he could not complete with those doping until he started doping too.
crunch

Social climber
CO
Jan 18, 2013 - 12:50pm PT
he problem is creating an even playing field. Drug deception technology always seems to be ahead of drug detection technology.
If you had two classes, one for users and one for clean riders, the class for clean riders would become the most prestigious. That being the case, it is likely that someone would cheat and use drugs in order to win.
The only way to create an even playing field is to have no restrictions on drugs. It could be a devil's advocate sort of thing. The rider has to decide between powerful, but dangerous, performance enhancers- the more performance enhancing the more dangerous and, perhaps, life shortening.

That's naive, Jim. It was some top cyclist, decades ago, using basic amphetamine-type speed, dying during a race that provoked the idea of drug-testing.

The temptation, the pressure, is too strong on young, impressionable athletes.

I think the drug testing is starting to get ahead of the dopers. Not by much. One of the things that caught Armstrong out was re-testing old urine samples with testing methods that did not exist when he supplied those samples. That's an open-ended threat for all current and future dopers.

Others may have doped, but Armstrong took it to a new level and in doing so has done enormous damage to his sport. I'm glad he never tried climbing

The Chief

climber
Climber from the Land Mongols under the Whites
Jan 18, 2013 - 12:52pm PT
So obviously he could not complete with those doping until he started doping too. This is the point you miss in your tirades. All top level riders were doping in that period (and now most likely) or they were not at the top level.

Great excuse to do so.

Exactly why he and others did so.

Perfect.

Again, love the condoning of it all.

Probably why it all continued as long as it did.
The Chief

climber
Climber from the Land Mongols under the Whites
Jan 18, 2013 - 12:55pm PT
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

That too is an another excuse to shet on all the people Lance did and totally fk em over to achieve his personal agenda.

Beautiful.

Good to see that you condone this behavior as well Nome.

http://www.cyclingnews.com/news/betsy-andreu-furious-and-close-to-tears-after-armstrong-interview
Gorgeous George

Trad climber
Los Angeles, California
Jan 18, 2013 - 01:00pm PT
I think Lance and Greg Mortenson should hook up and form a new charity, "Looking for Mr. Gullible," something like that. Imagine what a powerhouse team they could make?
donini

Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
Jan 18, 2013 - 01:01pm PT
Not naive Crusher. If Lance and crew were using more drugs than everyone else, how is it that he never ONCE tested positive. That being the case, absolutely evey cyclist on the Tour is under suspicion......there is simply no way to know.

The Tour is such a prestigious event and so important to a cyclist's career the temptation to cheat must be enormous. More so because cyclists know that many (likely the majority) of their competitors are doing it and they don't want to be left at a disadvantange.


edit: Crusher, are you ABSOLUTELY SURE that Bradley Wiggins is clean?
rockermike

Trad climber
Berkeley
Jan 18, 2013 - 01:04pm PT
Se careful what you post here. Lance may be reading, and he doesn't take criticism lightly. Got a pink slip recently? Wonder who's pulling the stings. Found you rope soiled with acid? It could be payback time...

At least when a climber bolts his way up the A4 section the truth comes out eventually. lol

But I must confess, I've been known (or I should say, not known) to hang on gear surreptitiously mid crux. I'll have to give back my onsight awards.
locker

Social climber
state of Kumbaya...
Jan 18, 2013 - 01:07pm PT


There are MANY here on ST that should be wiping their chins...




All along it was fuking OBVIOUS that Lance Loser is just that...

Bruce Morris

Social climber
Belmont, California
Jan 18, 2013 - 01:09pm PT
Lance got molested when he was a little kid, and, in order to compensate for it and express his inner rage, he turned into a hyper, over-achieving endurance athlete that would go to any extreme to improve and win. Just the same kind of psychopathic personality you find so often in corporate America, except Lance went into professional sports.

But, my oh my, isn't LA starting to look old before his time, like he really trashed his core and is going to pay for it earlier than most? The vision and the price!
hb81

climber
Jan 18, 2013 - 01:09pm PT
The only way to create an even playing field is to have no restrictions on drugs. It could be a devil's advocate sort of thing. The rider has to decide between powerful, but dangerous, performance enhancers- the more performance enhancing the more dangerous and, perhaps, life shortening.

This has already been tried, it's called 1960s pro cycling.
crunch

Social climber
CO
Jan 18, 2013 - 01:42pm PT
Not naive Crusher. If Lance and crew were using more drugs than everyone else, how is it that he never ONCE tested positive.

No, I did not mean naive, sorry. But the claim above is not true.

He did fail drug tests, apparently, both at the time of testing (he weaseled his way out of at least one failed test) and, more damningly, when they retesting old urine samples.

It was Lance himself who began and repeated the claim that he never failed a drug test, out of hundreds he took. Just another lie. He was not tested "hundreds" of time.

I forget where I read an analysis of this claim; it was in last few days. I recall something about one failed test being where he was hit up unexpectedly in his hotel room and refused to come out for an hour or so.

I'll add a link if I stumble on it again.
crunch

Social climber
CO
Jan 18, 2013 - 01:44pm PT
The only way to create an even playing field is to have no restrictions on drugs. It could be a devil's advocate sort of thing. The rider has to decide between powerful, but dangerous, performance enhancers- the more performance enhancing the more dangerous and, perhaps, life shortening.

This has already been tried, it's called 1960s pro cycling.

I thought it was called the 1970s East German Olympics squad.....
limpingcrab

Trad climber
the middle of CA
Jan 18, 2013 - 01:45pm PT
Admitting everything on TV must have really taken ball.

I don't think the confession counted though, Oprah was doping when she asked him
JLP

Social climber
The internet
Jan 18, 2013 - 01:48pm PT
I recall something about one failed test being where he was hit up unexpectedly in his hotel room and refused to come out for an hour or so.
WTF is an hour going to buy? He was probably busy banging the Olsen twins.
Jebus H Bomz

climber
Reno, Nuh VAAAA duh
Jan 18, 2013 - 01:51pm PT
You're right.....people like Lance only fess up when EVERY single other option has been expended.
Even his confession is only partly true and contains a lot of lies and half truths.

This is common with pathologically self-absorbed people.....could be why it's so commonplace with elite atheletes, and politicians.


That is why playing into the public shaming is just as much a part of the machine as the undeserved adulation we pay these figureheads. Congrats, the ad machine tooled another rube!

In a sport aided and abetted by technology (just lookit their weightless bikes and sperm like time trial helmets) and high strategy, I don't really see the fuss over a little blood doping. So what? Lance is still the best athlete because if you just add a little of the same rocket fuel they're all using, he comes out on top almost every time. King of the Dopers in the sport of dopers. That's what you get for worshiping a bunch of pedal pushers, ya weenies!
JLP

Social climber
The internet
Jan 18, 2013 - 01:52pm PT
His natural abilities never met the mark required to be a true Champion
This argument has gone stale.

It appears that in 2009, as an old man, he took 3rd place, behind at least 1 doper, w/o doping...
tooth

Trad climber
B.C.
Jan 18, 2013 - 01:58pm PT
Imagine that pro climbers were on TV.


Imagine that every network in the world would camp out every year and the eyes of the world would watch as PTPP and others ascended El Cap.


Imagine if they were making millions and millions of dollars off of our sport - advertising and televising.



Imagine if they had pink and yellow polka-dot jerseys that Pete had to wear each day.


Imagine if you grew up thinking that the top climbers got to be in on this circus.


Imagine if that was the pinnacle of the sport, revolving around $$$$$$.





Nike was 'shocked' that LA played the greed game that they have going. Professional sports are about $, and I don't think the players shouldn't get a slice of the pie. There isn't a lot of ethics in making $$$$ off of a poor sports person committing 6 hours a day to training, or 24 hours a day on the wall - they are doing the work but the network gets the ad revenue? Why shouldn't Dean Potter get the majority of the money produced by his climbing, rather than those promoting the climbing?




So while cheating and lying about it is wrong - I see it as the game of competitive cycling. Be as fast as you can get away with. Make your share of the pie. It isn't shocking at all to see this happening in every competitive sport. The people that love to ride just ride. The people that play the game win - until the multitude of governing bodies make it too complicated to hide the lies.




You would see this behavior somehow in climbing as well if you turned climbing into the circus that pro cycling has become. Instead, I see guys like Honnold and others doing beautiful things with the sport, pure, esthetic lines, BASE mixed in there, clean ascents and more and more alpine style stuff and when we are lucky enough to see some gopro footage it is inspiring and amazing to see. I'm enjoying it while I can!
dee ee

Mountain climber
citizen of planet Earth
Jan 18, 2013 - 08:31pm PT
'92 He finished 97 after DNFing after stage 12
'95 He finished 36
'09 He finished 23

Hey The Chief, you think he was clean for those races?

Fool.
Sierra Ledge Rat

Mountain climber
Old and Broken Down in Appalachia
Jan 18, 2013 - 09:31pm PT
I don't need to use drugs like NO to last a long time. I prefer natural methods.

Here is that natural device that I use:
LAST LONGER
LAST LONGER
Credit: Sierra Ledge Rat
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