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moosedrool

Trad climber
lost, far away from Poland
Jan 6, 2013 - 04:23pm PT
Some info on “religion is in our genes”.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/11/15/weekinreview/12wade.html?_r=0

Religion has the hallmarks of an evolved behavior, meaning that it exists because it was favored by natural selection. It is universal because it was wired into our neural circuitry before the ancestral human population dispersed from its African homeland.

http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn7147-genes-contribute-to-religious-inclination.html

The team gave questionnaires to 169 pairs of identical twins - 100% genetically identical - and 104 pairs of fraternal twins - 50% genetically identical - born in Minnesota.
The twins, all male and in their early 30s, were asked how often they currently went to religious services, prayed, and discussed religious teachings. This was compared with when they were growing up and living with their families. Then, each participant answered the same questions regarding their mother, father, and their twin.
The twins believed that when they were younger, all of their family members - including themselves - shared similar religious behaviour. But in adulthood, however, only the identical twins reported maintaining that similarity. In contrast, fraternal twins were about a third less similar than they were as children.
"That would suggest genetic factors are becoming more important and growing up together less important," says team member Matt McGue, a psychologist at the University of Minnesota.

There are many more studies like that and even attempts to isolate the genes that make us religious. Of course we are not 100% slaves to our genes. They just make as more susceptible to religious believes, that’s all.
WBraun

climber
Jan 6, 2013 - 04:30pm PT
It's impossible to ever be separated from God.

The only separation occurs due to losing ones constitutional consciousness due to contact with the inferior material energy, ie Material nature.

We are part parcel of God.

We have all qualities but not the quantity.

Atheists just plain are in absolute ignorance of their real constitutional position ......
Bruce Kay

Gym climber
BC
Jan 6, 2013 - 04:58pm PT
Werner -

God is one thing.

Religion is something else all together
Ksolem

Trad climber
Monrovia, California
Jan 6, 2013 - 10:05pm PT
Werner -

God is one thing.

Religion is something else all together

Yes.

My earlier post was in reference to organized religion which I think is bs. But when I look at the world and life and beyond I am not an atheist, I am like an ant on a beach.
Tony Bird

climber
Northridge, CA
Jan 6, 2013 - 10:19pm PT
let's get back to your very advanced aliens with godlike abilities, moosiedroolie. i find some compelling evidence for this myself. the possibility that this is the "reality" we must all ultimately deal with has given rise to some intense, far-out speculation in a "new" field dubbed exopolitics. here's a sampler of this crowd:

http://exopolitics.org/

http://projectcamelotportal.com/

http://www.exopolitics.org.uk/

http://exopolitics.blogspot.com/

before the predictable supertopo stoning begins, take a look at the first report on that first thread. michael salla, who came into exopolitics from a rather solid academic background, examines reports that dmitry medvedev, the current prime minister of russia and not exactly a political lightweight, is taking these ideas quite seriously too.
Mighty Hiker

climber
Vancouver, B.C.
Jan 6, 2013 - 10:21pm PT
I am like an ant on a beach

Or a bug on a wall?
go-B

climber
Hebrews 1:3
Jan 6, 2013 - 11:33pm PT
I am like an ant on a beach

Or a bug on a wall?

photo not found
Missing photo ID#282612

Hubble Captures a Collection of Ancient Stars
http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/hubble/science/ancient-stars.html

Psalm 39:4 “Lord, make me to know my end,
And what is the measure of my days,
That I may know how frail I am.
5 Indeed, You have made my days as handbreadths,
And my age is as nothing before You;
Certainly every man at his best state is but vapor. Selah
healyje

Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
Jan 7, 2013 - 12:22am PT
...let's get back to your very advanced aliens with godlike abilities, moosiedroolie. i find some compelling evidence for this myself.

You may want to think so, but in reality there is no scientific evidence even vaguely broaching 'probable', let alone"compelling".
moosedrool

Trad climber
lost, far away from Poland
Jan 7, 2013 - 12:52am PT
Tony B, I was into those Daniken speculations when I was in my twenties. Not so much now. I think it was a withdrawal syndrom after I quit religion. Conspiracy theory is very close to religion. I blame our religious genes for that.

Miedwiediew has a good sense of humor.

Edit: Donini is probably thinking " what the heck have I started?". But he can't delete it. He is not a tosser!
Riley Wyna

Trad climber
A crack near you
Jan 7, 2013 - 06:23am PT
Edit: Donini is probably thinking " what the heck have I started?". But he can't delete it. He is not a tosser!


nah - it's show and tell
Tony Bird

climber
Northridge, CA
Jan 7, 2013 - 09:22am PT
there has been much speculation about whether medvedev was joking. it's interesting that his reference to men in black seems to have nothing to do with the string of spielberg movies, but a serious russian documentary by that name which was released last month, which is linked on michael salla's report. you might take a look at that, moose--it's subtitled with english, but there's a lot more that's being said that wasn't translated.

if you're still back there with daniken, you have a lot of homework to do. i would recommend beginning with jacques vallee's books. incidentally, vallee has reported a conversation he had with spielberg during the time of producing close encounters of the third kind, a movie which inserts a character, a french scientist, as a tribute to vallee and his disciplined ufological investigations.

vallee has taken a differing view of what most of the world considers visitations, interference and harrassment of ETs from other star systems. he finds the material identical to what we have from folklore and mythology, and has speculated that it's some sort of built-in "discipline" to the human milieu. at the very least, it involves other dimensions and "spiritual" aspects which our modern science cannot engage.

"you're probably right," came spielberg's reply at the end of a very weighty conversation. "but this is hollywood, and people want to believe in ET, and i'm going to give them what they want."
dirtbag

climber
Jan 7, 2013 - 09:24am PT
Some people just naturally gravitate towards kookery.
Tony Bird

climber
Northridge, CA
Jan 7, 2013 - 09:48am PT
you and healyje get on my case like flies on sh#t, dirtbag. remember, when it comes to flies and sh#t, that the attraction does not reflect well on the flies.
dirtbag

climber
Jan 7, 2013 - 10:05am PT
Chemtrails, aliens, and illuminati (oh my)!

Tony Bird

climber
Northridge, CA
Jan 7, 2013 - 10:24am PT
it's probably worth noting that this very thread was begun by jim donini, who loves to come onto chemtrail, illuminati and other off-topic "nonsense" and scold supertopoans for not posting enough about climbing. somehow, he couldn't live by his own rules. admit it, dirtbag, you're fascinated by the sh#t, like any self-respecting housefly out there.
moosedrool

Trad climber
lost, far away from Poland
Jan 7, 2013 - 10:50am PT
Posting that early, people? Well, I can't sleep either.

Tony B. I will read some more. Curiosity got the best of me, like always.
Tony Bird

climber
Northridge, CA
Jan 7, 2013 - 11:01am PT
we call it an alpine start. i don't suppose you need those in the tatras. :-)
moosedrool

Trad climber
lost, far away from Poland
Jan 7, 2013 - 11:20am PT
Tony B. Since I am reading your material, It is fair you read some of mine. You said I didn't have original thoughts. You hurt my feelings. hehehe Would this be original enough for you:
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0003269708000729

Tony Bird

climber
Northridge, CA
Jan 7, 2013 - 12:02pm PT
you must first interest me in your material, moosedrool, which you have thus far--how can i say this gently--failed to do.

how would you do that? by exhibiting knowledge of things i'm not aware of. but you're a little ahead of the stoning committee in that department.

apart from my interest in these subjects, i'd very much like to improve the nature of discussion itself on supertopo. the posting of photos, links, extended quotations and the like can become quite burdensome when it's done in lieu of a directed discussion. reference is one thing, but expecting everyone to click and read--so they can think exactly the way you do--is quite another.

the best way to melt through the mess is to put things in your own words. the more you understand the material, the better you're able to do that. yes, i've been an editorial professional, so i've honed those skills, but i think the convenience of computers makes people lazy.

i believe you've come lately to supertopo, so you may have missed the notorious ark-on-the-moon thread by klimmer, going on three years ago:

http://www.supertopo.com/climbers-forum/1156814/The-Massive-Ark-on-the-Moon-very-OT-but-of-high-interest

this is something i paid no attention to for the longest time. i wasn't interested in ufology then, and the avalanche of links in that thread made it impossible for me to get a handle on what was going on. eventually i got interested in ufology for other reasons, and i came to respect klimmer for standing his ground, probably taking more heat than anyone has ever gotten on supertopo.

i assume you're the andrzej attached to that paper. i've done enough science reporting to know how to put such things in laypeople's language. if it's something significant, it ought to be even easier. pardon me if i'm not impressed by technical language.
moosedrool

Trad climber
lost, far away from Poland
Jan 7, 2013 - 02:11pm PT
Tony B, questioning my sincerity?

OK. A little bit of a background info. In my own words:
Proteins in human bodies are made according to the instructions encoded in our genes (stretches of DNA). So called genetic defects are the damages to the cell's DNA that render the cell unable to make a key protein. If one could restore the DNA in that cell, the cell would be cured. The trick is to find a "vehicle" that would deliver the DNA into a specific cell.

When I was a scientist at Bayer in Richmond, CA, I joined the Gene Therapy group. Our project was to create a vehicle that would deliver a gene (DNA) into specific human cells. At the same time, the vehicle had to protect the DNA from enzymatic degradation (if you just inject DNA to your body, it would be degraded by the enzymes). To create the vehicle, we used a protein (called VP1) from the polyoma JC virus. This protein can create a ball-like structure (about 50 nm diameter) when 360 of them join together. Inside the ball there is enough space to put a piece of DNA encoding a small protein. My tasks in our group were to: find a way to purify the VP1 protein and assemble them around a piece of DNA. In addition, I created analytical methods that monitored that process and then showed that the vehicle was properly assembled. The project was successful. Using the vehicle, we delivered the green fluorescent protein to a target human cells (on a dish). After the cells expressed the gene, the cells turned green. Also, the gene was protected from the enzymes.
Shortly after that, the project was shelved. At least I could write an article about it :). My work draw enough interest to be cited in the Encyclopedia of Life Sciences.

Man, I love to brag!
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