America the Ignorant...on topic for this forum

Search
Go

Discussion Topic

Return to Forum List
Post a Reply
Messages 301 - 320 of total 533 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
High Fructose Corn Spirit

Gym climber
-A race of corn eaters
Jan 2, 2013 - 10:05pm PT
Mech, I find myself in envy of the enthusiasm you showed in your last post. Do you recall when I had that level of energy a couple of years ago now on this site?, lol! What's the secret, a few months sabatical?

P.S.

Yep, I know your kind. You can argue about anything really...

As tired as I am, I loved this one.

.....

http://www.samharris.org/blog/item/the-riddle-of-the-gun
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Jan 2, 2013 - 11:26pm PT
HFCS, the sabbatical helped for sure. Nothing convinces you that the world needs help like teaching a undergrad core class! And nothing convinces you that it is beyond help like the stupidtaco. So many obstinate #$%@^#^'s around here unwilling to consider anything but what they already "know." And so many who take life soo seriously (the extra 'o' is a little piece of flair I like to throw in for smart people who know the difference between the twos). Typing a few paragraphs here between dissertation pages is actually kind of fun... I don't get to use "idiot" nearly enough in my dis. But fair warning, if my models don't start behaving I could have another total melt down and freak out and sh#t.
WBraun

climber
Jan 3, 2013 - 12:08am PT
You're already losing it here wes.

You're projecting bullsh!t that was never said .....
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Jan 3, 2013 - 12:15am PT
Forgive me honorable one, for whence have I projected? Certainly not in respect to anything you have said or done. As frustrating as your seemingly flippant and intentionally confounding retorts may be, I have grown to enjoy them.
jogill

climber
Colorado
Jan 3, 2013 - 12:31am PT
People study things to get ahead (power, politics, money) and to solve technical problems that appear to be in their way

Sometimes your overly broad generalizations get in the way of your arguments. This is one.
WBraun

climber
Jan 3, 2013 - 12:32am PT
I've never made any mutually exclusive claims.

The greatest rishis have all been very advanced scientists ,very advanced in mathematics and astronomy and knowledge among all the other needs of mankind to live in perfect harmony simultaneously both with material nature and the spiritual nature.

No real bonafide spiritual scholar would ever condemn science, education and technology.

Having only academic knowledge of the two will cause poor fund of understanding .....


mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Jan 3, 2013 - 11:13am PT
The phrase I was referring to was "In this regard, Werner is correct" and I was sure to include a "?" after your initials, as I did not see you write anything in particular and figured you knew better... but I couldn't be sure since "it is all so arbitrary" ya know.
Tony Bird

climber
Northridge, CA
Jan 3, 2013 - 09:47pm PT
worth a mild bump here. it seems the esteemed eeyonk doesn't want to continue, although i'm heartened that sullly posted.

through supertopo, i was interested to learn that teilhard is considered a "process" philosopher--the same category as alfred north whitehead. this came out in a go-around with largo a couple years ago.

i could never understand all the fuss about "process". it was interesting that largo picked up on it in graduate school through the center for process studies at claremont school of theology, which kinda led me to wonder whether these process types actually believe in a standard, church-issue divinity. rather, it seems, they suggest that god is a process, or coming about through a process. goodbye big daddy in the sky, hello something i've got a personal investment in, and it may or may not bring a decent return.
Tony Bird

climber
Northridge, CA
Jan 3, 2013 - 10:37pm PT
i just finished a book i found quite interesting, craig, which had a lot to do with the critique of egyptology i was giving--fingerprints of the gods by graham hancock.

most people are familiar with chariots of the gods by erik von daniken, who easily attracts criticism. where von daniken is a bit of a lightweight, hancock is a heavyweight, bringing a knowledgeable education to the anomalies he tries to make sense of. he builds his case on some pretty solid facts, beginning with the piri reis map.

ever hear of that? how did a turkish admiral in the 1500s get reliable geographical information on antarctica? there are a number of other early maps as well, which show in uncanny detail features which are now under ice. these old maps have provenance. teachers of standard history/archaeology wish they didn't exist. this is what werner is talking about. the evidence is compelling.
WBraun

climber
Jan 3, 2013 - 11:19pm PT
You are saying that it's way more important to know about the coat than the person.

Modern science has made great advancements in studying the coat and all it's attributes while completely neglecting the person (living entity).

Our materialistic science will make you happy in the future.

Meanwhile the whole fuking world is miserable.

Here ... have a nice coat, while the man in the coat is sick, from separation.

In the future.

The post dated check they've been handing out ......

Tony Bird

climber
Northridge, CA
Jan 3, 2013 - 11:32pm PT
hancock is proposing a timeline with an extraordinary leap backward. i'm not ready to buy everything he says, and, to his credit, he only suggests--he's not out to sweep everything away at once. but the pyramids are kind of a key element. their very immensity suggests that their builders employed forces over matter yet unknown to our modern time. there are supposedly only two cranes in the modern world capable of lifting the biggest stones.

werner's comment reminds me of things i'd always hear growing up in the boom times of the 1950s. so much progress, so many new inventions and conveniences. somehow this would translate to better living for everyone. somehow, it never did.
healyje

Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
Jan 3, 2013 - 11:40pm PT
Re Hancock's book...

Reception: Members of the scholarly and scientific community have described the proposals put forward in the book as pseudoscience and pseudoarchaeology.


And on cataclysmic pole shift hypothesis:

It is now established that true polar wander has occurred at various times in the past, but at rates of 1 per million years or less. Analysis of the evidence does not lend credence to Hapgood's hypothesized rapid displacement of layers of the Earth. Although Hapgood drastically overestimated the effects of changing mass distributions across the Earth, calculations show that changing mass distributions both on the surface and in the mantle can cause true polar wander.

All the discussion about a long-gone advanced civilization existing before the Egyptians and Mayans is interesting conjecture, but never makes it out of the realm of sci-fi and is not supported by any evidence.
TomCochrane

Trad climber
Santa Cruz Mountains and Monterey Bay
Jan 3, 2013 - 11:54pm PT
some people here seem to think we (pick your flavor) have it all pretty much figured out


whereas my personal view is that we only have access to a little carefully selected collection of pieces and various flavors of opinions constructed from them



and with very little or no concept of the big picture



obviously it would be politically convenient to accept the current establishment view of the world

it makes for an interesting intellectual exercise to step back through time in 100 year steps and look at what was the politically acceptably view of reality at each of those steps

then, as suggested earlier by Base, try to imagine what might be the accepted world view 100 years in the future...and why?...

also try to imagine just how far we are from really understanding...

(given the tiny glimpses we have from our little blue bubble)

MikeL

climber
SANTA CLARA, CA
Jan 4, 2013 - 01:36pm PT
MeChrist:


You seem angry. Sorry, if I offended you. Nothing I wrote really mattered. We were just talking, my friend. No need to take any of it personally.

My views are the results of being an old professor. The practice of teaching and research in my field of organization, institution, and strategy (along with a little cognitive science) demanded that I go outside my field to study their contexts and how contexts change. That work has encouraged me to see capitalism inextricably tied-up with education and technology. Along the way, I took the looking glass and started to look at the very practices I found myself involved in as an academic.

Congrats on your personal decisions. None of my comments were meant to question the integrity of your decisions.

Good luck on your dissertation. :-) It's a cultural rite of passage. The point of a Ph.D. is to institutionalize you into becoming a recognized member of the Academy. Supposedly then you'll be able to do what you want to do.

Be well.




P.S. Wanna make God laugh? Make plans.
jogill

climber
Colorado
Jan 4, 2013 - 02:59pm PT
The point of a Ph.D. is to institutionalize you into becoming a recognized member of the Academy. Supposedly then you'll be able to do what you want to do

Yep. My dad (a professor) used to tell me to get my union card.

;>)
sullly

Trad climber
Jan 4, 2013 - 03:30pm PT
^^^ My father (a professor) pushed liberal arts and taught a course called Theories of the Good Life. I'm forever grateful my parents were of this mind. Much ado about science these days. The liberal arts man is nearly extinct. Finding a straight one without a paunch nearly impossible here in Silicon Valley.
healyje

Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
Jan 4, 2013 - 03:31pm PT
some people here seem to think we (pick your flavor) have it all pretty much figured out.

Quite to the contrary, most of the distance past is a complete unknown. And, while theorizing variously about how our cultures unfolded over the past 10,000 years is an interesting exercise, what isn't helpful is attempting to pass off unsupported conjecture as science. It's again a matter of having the discipline to resist a desperate urge and need to plug the voids in our knowledge with fantasy, however entertaining.
eeyonkee

Trad climber
Golden, CO
Jan 4, 2013 - 04:04pm PT
If you want an optimistic view on the future of the human race, read Steven Pinker's 'The Better Angels of Our Nature; Why Violence Has Declined'. The gist of the book is that you can take nearly any variable having to do with violence snd show that it has declined over our history. In the end, he offers 5 possible reasons for this trend.

The leviathan (development of the State),
gentle commerce,
feminization,
the expanding circle, and
the escalator of reason.

Ignorance of science, willful or not, may not be directly related to violence, but I'm betting on number 5 for the long view on that one as well.
michaeld

Sport climber
Sacramento
Jan 4, 2013 - 04:05pm PT
Has anyone seen the movie Zeitgeist?

I have a hard time looking at the world like I used to before I watched it.
sullly

Trad climber
Jan 4, 2013 - 04:20pm PT
eeokkee,
It's not an "ignorance of sciencs." Science is just one piece. Look back at Plato discussing the BALANCED human being. Enough with the science hard-on.
Messages 301 - 320 of total 533 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
Return to Forum List
Post a Reply
 
Our Guidebooks
Check 'em out!
SuperTopo Guidebooks


Try a free sample topo!

 
SuperTopo on the Web

Review Categories
Recent Route Beta
Recent Gear Reviews