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Trad climber
South Lake Tahoe, CA
Dec 29, 2012 - 12:10pm PT
You realize, Ron, that your comment doesn't make any sense, right?
The Warbler

the edge of America
Dec 29, 2012 - 12:11pm PT
Can a man who engineered so much death, suffering and destruction Rest In Peace?


Boulder climber
Somewhere on 395
Dec 29, 2012 - 12:25pm PT
Can a man who engineered so much death, suffering and destruction Rest In Peace?

You know, I am not into the whole "war is good thing", but you have to consider, he was only doing his job
Patrick Sawyer

Originally California now Ireland
Dec 29, 2012 - 12:32pm PT
Riley Wyna and Tony, thanks for those articles.

I never saw the general as anything but a service man. He was no hero to me, at least not in his later years. Devoted to his country and his men, but also a willing pawn of administrations and corporations, and if he didnít know that, he is no genius.

But he will be lionized, just like Reagan was (I try, but I still canít understand why Reagan was lionized upon his death, when looking at the overall picture, but then, I never liked him as governor of California either).

Oleí Norm was a soldier, nothing more, nothing less. And nothing wrong with that. But he usually toed the line, from what I can see.

My heroes?

My Uncle Bill Casey (Army), captured in North Africa, escaped from Nazi camp in Italy with two Canadian commandoes and made their way back to Allied (British) lines.

My Uncle Joe Sawyer (Marines), medals for the south Pacific but captured and suffered (along with so many other brave men) in Japanese POW camps.

Having just watched both a documentary on D-Day and the film The Longest Day, the men who landed on those beaches in Normandy are heroes.

The men of the Allied nations, in both the European and Pacific theaters, fighting fascism, they are heroes, especially those that gave their lives. Fascism that still exists in a number of guises.

And while not a hero, I am proud of his commitment. That is, my godson/nephew, Benjamin, who just did two tours in Afghanistan, a placed perhaps we should no longer be. He was in regular firefights, he didnít want to be there but it was his duty.

As well as men like USMC Major General Smedley Darlington Butler, who dared to speak up and challenge the establishment.

There are other military heroes in my eyes, but Schwarzkopf is not one of them.


Ron, you have some good things to say.

Cragman, you should have stated from the start that this thread was a memorial. I highly doubt any Taco Standers would protest at the grave of a soldier, so get off your high horse. If you think that Schwarzkopf was such a great man, okay, that is your opinion, to each their own.

Perhaps you should have titled the thread differently. And also, because your mentor was his cousin, is there some bias there? Just asking.

Some of you here are as bad as those whackjobs that picket soldiers funerals.

I find that quote highly offensive, I am not a whackjob (and I doubt the other Supertopians who question your hero's actions are whack jobs), just giving my opinion, or don't you like the First Amendment? So like I said, get off your high horse.

And Schwarzkopf was not "just some soldier", he had his hand deeply in both military and political dealings/decisions (some of which may have cost needless US and civilian deaths/maimings). And as US citizens we have a right to question somebody in such high authority and his actions (collusions?) in involving our country in questionable wars.

Trad climber
June Lake, California....via the Damascus Road
Dec 29, 2012 - 01:45pm PT
Patrick Sawyer, please explain to me how a thread title that begins with Rest In Peace, could be construed as anything but a memorial thread.

Obviously, haters here never stop....even when a good man dies.
Ken M

Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
Dec 29, 2012 - 01:52pm PT
Well hes ten thousand times more a man for doing what he did that our current president.

Ron, while I was going to be chiming in, basically on your side, with one sentence you stopped me cold.

Yep, there is absolutely no value to society to anyone who devotes his life to helping the poor, when he has the education and training to make the big bucks,eh? You want to spend your life beating the poor, and sullying the name of those who try to help them.

You total f*ck.
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