Rain Gear for Big Wall

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Messages 21 - 40 of total 49 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
Googlymoogly

climber
Nov 20, 2012 - 01:01am PT
I would really wish everone would rethink things as such this. But then the trip reports would be mediocre, and not epic after epic. See the thread about rappelling the nose. Stuff happens on it's own, starting with a probable problem built into the plan. Epic at best case.

You definitely don't want to be one of the guys who got rescued rappelling the nose...
Captain...or Skully

climber
Nov 20, 2012 - 01:08am PT
Or ever. Getting rescued sucks.

Oh, yeah. CRICKETS!
Clint Cummins

Trad climber
SF Bay area, CA
Nov 20, 2012 - 04:43am PT
Besides staying dry, you also need to stay warm. One of my partners (DES) met a guy who got desperately cold on Zodiac. He said he put every piece of clothing he had on, but could not get warm. And he wasn't even wet.... Being stuck at a belay for awhile and not being warm enough is bad.

Also, make sure you know how to descend when you can't simply rappel. I.e. the first person downaids the overhangs and the second person cleans and gets pulled in with the rope. I haven't seen this in any books, but it was on Andy Kirkpatrick's website at one time.

Dan's photos of the iced-up wide crack above Peanut - yikes!!
RP3

Big Wall climber
El Portal/Chapel Hill
Nov 20, 2012 - 08:48am PT
If your buddy can indeed climb The Nose in under 4 hours (WOW), and you are reasonably capable, then I bet you guys can find a 2 day window of good weather and you wont need to worry about bringing a drysuit!
Don Paul

Big Wall climber
Colombia, South America
Nov 20, 2012 - 10:08am PT
Always remember, bring an ice axe to chop the ice out of the cracks. AND a guantanamo bay outfit and one of those box spring ledges. I want to do a winter ascent someday, too.
Roger Brown

climber
Oceano, California
Nov 20, 2012 - 10:14am PT
I have been the Belayer/Jug-Monkey on several walls and Clint is so right. You cannot believe how cold you can get just standing or hanging there, usually for hours at a time. Then it is your turn to go to work and you are sweating like a Pig by the time you get to the Anchor. I have cleaned in the rain and I have cleaned in the snow. The rain is the worst. The Jugs act like a Dam and the water runs down your sleeves and then out you pants legs. Then you are back belaying again, freezing your Ass off. I use a layering system. Icebreaker bottom layer, quality fleece mid layer, Gor-Tex top layer, and a hat that covers most of your face. That system has worked for me. You are going to be wet, (one way or the other) you just have to keep from becoming Hypothermic. One thing for sure, it will be a great adventure. Let us know how it goes.
nutjob

Gym climber
Berkeley, CA
Nov 20, 2012 - 10:47am PT
I haven't seen any stories of using a 2-piece diving wetsuit (for easier pee/poo), but someone must have done it. Any stories?

Issues with skin pruning after a few days in a wetsuit? I grew up routinely wearing a wetsuit all day, but never continuously for days.

BASE104

Social climber
An Oil Field
Nov 20, 2012 - 10:49am PT
One thing that I ALWAYS preach about taking is an extra large lawn garbage bag. No, you don't use it as your first line of defense on a wall, but they weigh nothing and you can crawl into them and crouch while staying dry.

I actually got that idea from reading that story about Bridwell and Mugs doing the Moose's Tooth.

I've used it a few times up in the arctic and it can be a life saver if you are caught with nothing else.

So always take a few extra garbage bags. I found this roll of them that is super thick and durable and huge. It still weighs only a few ounces. This isn't a replacement for your regular beefy gear recommended above, but it would save the lives of a fair number of day hikers if they just put one in their daypack.
Mark Hudon

Trad climber
Hood River, OR
Nov 20, 2012 - 10:51am PT
Check the weather, prepare adequately and have a really good plan for bailing or lasting through a storm.
WBraun

climber
Nov 20, 2012 - 10:58am PT
If your buddy can do the Nose in 4 hours then you'll probably do the Zodiac in 8 hours.

You won't need anything going at that speed except a pair of shorts and a bandana on your head to keep the sweat off ......

:-)
climbski2

Mountain climber
Anchorage AK, Reno NV
Nov 20, 2012 - 11:04am PT
I havn't had a chance to look at all the ledge flys in a few years. Who is making the most bombproof, water tight fly's these days? I had pretty good faith in my old BD heavy storm fly BITD but never really had to test it other than using the garden hose on it.

You guys are making me think of neoprene cuffed arm gaiters. Seem simple to make.
Brian

climber
California
Nov 20, 2012 - 12:16pm PT
Good God, Dan's photo above looks grim. I climb mixed alpine routes all the time, but to get that high on Zodiac and to find that pitch in that condition armed with some nuts, cams, atriers, hooks, and the like? That must've been a truly, truly frightening discovery.

Dan: Let's hear the story of that lead!

Brian
BASE104

Social climber
An Oil Field
Nov 20, 2012 - 12:19pm PT
I had a Fish that was liberally gooped in all kinds of sealant and even plasti-dip on the contact edges.

Waterproof as a mo-fo.

I have been through storms, but never a bad cold one. I have always heard about how the wind can pick up your ledge and toss it around. In those situations water can come at you from below.

Which ledges currently are fully covered top to bottom? My old Fish wasn't. My old Grammici wasn't.

Believe it or not, the old Grammici original portaledges had a rainfly made out of superlight fabric that would fit in a tiny little stuff sack. I got rained on all night once and not a drop made it inside.

The rainfly is in the red stuff sack with "Grammici Products"o n it in black just to the left of my head. We always kept it clipped there in case you had to get up in the night and put the fly on. It is amazing that these things worked in little run of the mill rainstorms. We didn't know any better.


Vitaliy M.

Mountain climber
San Francisco
Nov 20, 2012 - 12:41pm PT
If you are even thinking of YOSAR as a backup then you have already failed ....

GAWD! I would NEVER EVER climb in the valley if YOSAR wasn't there! That would be plain stupid!


(sarcasm)
briham89

Big Wall climber
san jose, ca
Nov 20, 2012 - 12:43pm PT

GAWD! I would NEVER EVER climb in the valley if YOSAR wasn't there! That would be plain stupid!

YER tellin' me! I would have never gotten the balls to climb after six if i didn't know they were there!!!111!
Vitaliy M.

Mountain climber
San Francisco
Nov 20, 2012 - 01:23pm PT
After six would be impossible if Werner's caring eye was not watching me while I move up that slippery thing.
Russ Walling

Social climber
from Poofters Froth, Wyoming
Nov 20, 2012 - 02:33pm PT
I havn't had a chance to look at all the ledge flys in a few years. Who is making the most bombproof, water tight fly's these days? I had pretty good faith in my old BD heavy storm fly BITD but never really had to test it other than using the garden hose on it.

Not sure what the other guys do or use... but here is a quick shop test of the SuperDuty fly material we use on the FISH SuperDuty ledges. The biners tore through at 40lbs. That is an exceptional amount of weight. Some fly type fabrics will tear with as little as 4lbs hanging on them. I have more of this stuff kicking around and will at some point post a more thorough look-see on the FISH Blog.




Of note is that getting a truly waterproof product with a high non-tear aspect is tough. It is sorta involved, but basically if the fibers of the base material can't knot up to stop a rip, the material will tear very easily. The waterproof coating hinders this knotting. Not enough waterproofing and your hole may not get any bigger but the fabric is also not going to be waterproof. There are fabrics available that can do both, but the price is astronomical. The stuff in the pics above is crazy waterproof. Don't have the numbers on me at the moment, but basically a firehose is not going to force water through the coating. Rain stands zero chance.

And not to drone on here, but rain and getting wet is a problem no doubt, but almost any fly will offer protection from rain. Condensation will still get you soaked while hanging out inside the fly. But what I always worry about more than the just getting wet part is the fly getting damaged in a storm and leaving you unprotected. Remember that sh#t will be washed off the summit and crash into your taut fly. Small rocks, sticks, ice etc. On a tight fly these items can slice your fly pretty easy. Once you get a tear like that, it will be almost impossible to save the fly if the wind is howling. That is why you MUST bring a bivy sack. This is also why I like using two ledges for a team. If one ledge gets whacked, you still have another one to bail into. This is mostly advice for cold weather climbing where big cold storms are going to rain on your parade.

The big 5 to stay alive in your ledge:
1. Make sure your equipment is in top shape
2. Hang your ledge in a steep area away from runoff
3. Know how to get your fly on and get it on early
4. Have a bivy sack
5. Have dry spare clothes
cliffhanger

Trad climber
California
Nov 20, 2012 - 05:03pm PT
A good idea mentioned here years ago is to wrap a blue foam or ensolite ground pad tightly around your torso for waterproof insulation. Cut some notches for your arms.
climbski2

Mountain climber
Anchorage AK, Reno NV
Nov 20, 2012 - 06:42pm PT
Thank-you! Mr FISH himself.
BASE104

Social climber
An Oil Field
Nov 20, 2012 - 06:59pm PT
Every fall there are a few (or quite a few) teams up on the wall when the first big badass storm hits. That is when Yosar makes its money and people get whacked. Weather forecasts are getting really good.

Check the weather.

How many people have died on the last pitch of the Nose? Have they all been Japanese?

Fish's Native Son TR on his Fish Products page is epic. No thank you. Now there are cellphones and radios and all that jazz.

I know a lot of good climbers who have needed a rescue or at least a rope tossed over the edge to get them off pronto. Those ropes tossed over for self rescue are "micro rescues." If you have ever been to the top of El Cap with 6 feet of snow on top, even that is a nightmare. You get offroute and find yourself walking on top of the manzanitas. Then you break through and it is like falling into a Viet Cong punji stick trap. People ought to use Manzanita for rocket engine parts and stuff. It is some wicked strong material.

I was up there jumping off one early March and the snow depth was crazy.
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