We need Texas because they are one of the positive net taxpaying state. The nation has to support the negative net states, most of which are red states, Alaska is prominent on the negative list
Also, it's not that Texas wants to leave. Even Gov Perry says he's against it (now, recall before he seemed to indicate he'd be okay with it). Some citizens started a petition and they got enough signatures that it requires a response by the govt.
Many other states have the same thing going on - citizens starting petitions. That includes the Red states, but also some fools in Colorado and other places.
I heard Texas is the only red state that pays more fed tax than it receives.
A measly $1.06 for $1 returned. Let em go. They cost the us a lot more than they are worth. They give us republican lawmakers. 23/ 32 congressmen and both senators. 38 presidential electoral vote.
I have also heard that they are the only state with the right to secede.
Crimper, the petition thing is not a goverment function, it is a Whitehouse project, if a petition gets 25k signatures then the president will respond to it.
Many states have signed petitions to succeed havent they?
And if you ask me its GOOD to see the states saying ENOUGH IS ENOUGH! What happened to states rights-- Ron Paul wanted to know and wanted to transfer back the power that the feds have stolen from them. This is a form of protest.
I signed the Texas petition. I hope they and the rest of the confederacy don't let the door hit them on the way out. Let's see how they like paying for their own goddamm stop signs.
Som,e of you seem to take it personally that states are unhappy.. Did you think this was going to magically change after the election?? Un employment and foreclosings are going up in many states- i know they are here in NV.
And WHO wants a law like the NDAA 21013 shoved on em?? Certainly no one that enjoys freedom,, freedom of speech , internet forums and the like.
Less than a week after a New Orleans suburbanite petitioned the White House to allow Louisiana to secede from the United States, petitions from seven states have collected enough signatures to trigger a promised review from the Obama administration.
By 6:00 a.m. EST Wednesday, more than 675,000 digital signatures appeared on 69 separate secession petitions covering all 50 states, according to a Daily Caller analysis of requests lodged with the White House’s “We the People” online petition system.
A petition from Vermont, where talk of secession is a regular feature of political life, was the final entry.
Fun as it would be to let them secede, the 1869 US Supreme Court case Texas v White established no state has the right to unilaterally withdraw from the union. http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Texas_v._White
And WHO wants a law like the NDAA 21013 shoved on em?? Certainly no one that enjoys freedom,, freedom of speech , internet forums and the like.
I don't like what that says either, but if Red states think that they would be getting more freedom, then they probably need to do a reality check. Just like they needed a reality check when Obama won even though every last one of their polls said Mitt would win and many of them said by a land slide. They even said Mitt would win the popular vote and he didn't do that either. So their heads are basically up their asses. The Bush government pushed through one of the most restrictive new sets of laws and government entities in many years, the Patriot act. Gave it a nice pretty name though. I feel like I'm being disloyal if I'm against the "PATRIOT ACT".
So if they think that their Republican leaders are for freedom, then they got a surprise waiting for them. Their Republican leaders are for giving the leadership the freedom to do whatever it wants. Not for the populace to have freedom.
Lolli, I'm certain that you are aware, but that original letter was written as a joke to counter all the Red states saying how terrible blue states were. Red or Blue, I hope we don't really go down this path.
No one thinks the republicans will do any different in regards to the NDAA. This has been an on going effort by both parties fro many years to obtain executive powers. Its not a red or blue issue. Its an issue of the fed govt obtaining powers that they were never meant to have. Powers that were used by such countries as NAZI Germany, N Korea, even Russia.
I say let Texas secede on a trial basis and join the european union..Then the EU can grab that weasly ass Bush and try him for war crimes and letting 911 go down on his watch...
I like that a state level dissatisfaction is being finally talked about. After all the laughter..
then there are the people who signed who really think it can happen. Fine with me. Please surreneder your US passport and apply for one from your newly founded State. Unfortunately, I doubt the US will be able (or particularly interested) to provide military support in the event that the rest of Mexico decides to cross on over. You will have no FCC, infrastructure support, postal service. Good luck defending your borders Texas!
edit: and you all better pray when a natural disaster hits your coast that magically it doesn't do any damage.
Was Tejas ever really a part of the USA? I remember as a young 'un driving
by Billy Sol Estes' place and marveling at his front yard - it was completely
asphalted and painted a lovely Lawn Green! LOL!
Sorry for the thread drift, but since Ron posited this in support of or at least to explain what goes on in the mind of a Texan:
Its an issue of the fed govt obtaining powers that they were never meant to have. Powers that were used by such countries as NAZI Germany, N Korea, even Russia.
Such as?
BTW, if you're talking about the Patriot Act, I think everyone agrees it overreaches, though I don't see any Red Staters concerned when its directed toward minorities and Muslims.
Fat Dad, do yourself a favor and google NDAA 2013...
Did you know, Texas is responsible for bringing back some African antelope species from the brink of Extinction? And those same ranches have had the FEDS step in and all but shut them down. The same ranches that were providing animals to Africa for re-establishing them in their native lands.
Feds telling Texas ranchers what they may raise and or do with said animals on their own lands.
Despite the War of Northern Aggression, in that I am a Texan myself I feel it is my duty to line up every other Texan that signed that petition and march them along I-10 to pick up trash from San Antonio to El Paso.
*Sigh* Yet another excuse for Ron to hate on the government.
Bro, this is the same government that has ruled and protected and provided for you and yours, for your whole life. George and Thomas and Benjamin might have envisioned something a little different. But, they couldn't see 230 years into the future.
Your cuz Davey C. certainly lived under a different government. It has to change and evolve out of necessity.
Stop hating the government and live in the present, or join up with Texas as they hit the bricks.
Ron, simply referring me to a google search is not an explanation of your claim, particularly when it is as overblown as the one you make.
Nevertheless, I did google NDAA 2013, which mostly provided hits to sites complaining about the authority to have indefinite detentions, which has been an ongoing issue in connection with the so-called war on terror. I think that is a problem. However, I don't recall that being a concern of your's when Bush implemented those powers.
Survival,, my cuz is Daniel Boone,, although Fess Parker did play both Daniel and Davy so the confusion happens all the time..;-D
I Dont HATE the Govt as a whole. Never have and ive worked for both Fed and State. And put my nuts on the line.
I did NOT do that to have a law like the NDAA 2013. My Brothers didnt serve to have a law like the NDAA 2013 either.
When the govt stockpiles millions of rounds of hollow point ammo and builds detention centers that set empty, THEN come up with a law like the NDAA 2013, i have to start wondering wtf is going on here. And im not some conspiracy nut. But im quite capable of knowing how things work in govt and able to see warnings.
edit: and as For Benjamin and Thomas and the gang,, they DID INDEED see the future and gave us a direct WARNING of the govt running amuck, which was promptly ignored. And now the NDAA 2013.. UN FRIGGIN REAL!
FatDad,, i wasnt posting on the net then...Im going to have to put that under my avatar...
The exact language is that CITIZENS deemd "belligerents" can be detained by the military indefinitely without ANY due process, and when and if your trial comes to be, it will be by a military tribunal. Im 54 and never thought i would see such a law here. Let alone see the masses put up with it for a second.
Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.
Ron I see no prudence whatsoever in these petitions at this time.
Yes our government is guilty of enacting laws that are evil. However they have not acted on these laws as the government of Britain did a few centuries ago.
Our government is flawed in some severe areas, such as the influence of special interests and their Billions of dollars yet we still retain certain critical rights which if exercised can fix the problem without revolution.
It's all the result of Nixon's Southern Strategy in 1972 when the "solid South" changed from being solid (if Right Wing) Democrat to Republican, which contributed immensely to Nixon's land slide re-election. Naturally, the segregationist, military South hated the anti-war and civil rights movements of the 1960s and figured the Republicans would back the status quo more than the Democrats who had enacted Lyndon Johnson's Civil Rights Act in 1964. That's the same moment the "angry white male" emerged to make his presence felt on the national political scene and paved the way from the extremely reactionary Reagan first Presidency. Of course, standing behind the whole process was the Civil War, Reconstruction and the enactment of Jim Crow laws. Maybe Abe Lincoln and his generals should have just let the South leave the Union in 1861? Would have eliminated a lot of subsequent social problems. The Southern States might have actually asked to come back into the Union when the institution of slavery evaporated due to its economic inefficiency. Can't re-write history and 500,000 casualties between 1861 and 1865. And the USA is supposed to be a "special place" without any history? Ha! Ha! Ha!
When the govt stockpiles millions of rounds of hollow point ammo and builds detention centers that set empty, THEN come up with a law like the NDAA 2013, i have to start wondering wtf is going on here.
I haven't seen any evidence of either claim. One, our most notorious detention center, Gitmo, is not empty, though I don't see you evince any concerns for all the brown Muslim faces there. Two, even if your claim about hollow points is true, so what? Your right to bear arms does not guarantee you a right to a particularly vicious form of ammo.
Ive been to Mississippi. Yes there is still some areas that havent evolved with the rest. But that doesnt mean EVERYONE is like that or thinks that way. I have relatives in LaPlace LA..Good folks that certainly dont match the catch-all desrips often given to the south.
California for example need only to look within their own border - on the nightly news to see race involved shootings EVERY night might i add.
Btw, thanks, survival, for calling me a sweetheart. :-)
Awwww, damn straight. I've never seen you as any other.
BTW Ron, none of us want to see our individual liberties infringed on. It's somehow a balance between everyone mooing up to the trough and everyone waving their own handgun around in anarchy.
Ron, as usual, you are swimming against the tide. I suspect you would be happier in 1820 America. But then, I do question that just because you claim that Daniel Boone was in your family tree, you have the righteousness to pontificate.
Well, sonny boy, Josiah Bartlett , the second man to sign the Declaration of Independence and Mark Twain are in my family tree. Josiah was a doctor, Samuel Clemens a brilliant satirist and writer.
Daniel Boone was a murderer and adulterer. Killing native Americans at will. Reconcile that Ronnie.
"Remember this about the Alamo: Next time I, General John Houston tell you not to try and defend the Alamo, you f*#king listen. Capice? Goddamned f*#king hard-headed, ignorant, non-order-following glory seekers. Santa Anna f*#ked you good.
How hard was it to just burn the supplies and retreat like I told you to? If you had done that, we could have cut Santa Anna's army to pieces by the time they started starving from our scorched earth tactics. But no, that f*#khead wino Ben Milam had to say, "Who will go with me to the Alamo?" and then what happened? He got his f*#king head shot off by a cannon ball. But did that omen tell you anything? Apparently not.
Patrick,, good for you.
but your full of shite.. D Boone did not kill Indians "at will"...
And the Alamo? Yes,, i went there as a small kid, and remember putting my fingers in the round ball holes left from that famous battle. Kinda chilling really.. It took 18 minutes for Sam Houston to defeat that army that took the alamo -shortly after. That is still a stunning victory to this day. I believe their cry was ,, "remember the Alamo"...
Jim Bowie was a knife fighter with a fearsome reputation. His signature move was to disembowel his opponent. Nice guy. Had a really good cornbread recipe, too.
One time I was eating some of his corn bread with warm goat milk and I think I must have offended Jim in some way, perhaps a slight inflection in the pronunciation of his mother's maiden name, I don't know. Well of course he disemboweled me.
But I simply reached into my steaming intestines and stomach and removed that still-warm cornbread and ate it again.
I'm already in Colorado, but thanks for the invitation to immigrate from Texas. All of my family moved back to Louisiana as well, so that's fine, too.
Just got done chatting with an absolutely lovely lady in Austin who got a part in a production of Richard II at a little Shakespeare theater along the shores of Lake Austin called the Curtain. Yes, people in Texas not only know about Shakespeare they actually build theaters like his Globe Theater. So if you are in Austin, go check it out.
OK, back to the subject of secession. As you have read earlier, other states have their own collection of kooks that also file the same petitions to seceed from the Union. Why does Texas' kook GET SO MUCH PRESS?
I'll tell you why. You love us. You love to HATE us. You love Rick Perry. You want to go have a beer with him and pray over his classic 1955 printing of the Scofield Bible. Face it. You have a Texas fetish.
we love texas. or at least i do! every kid who grew up in america (boy anyway) loves texas. has all that rich history. i'm not really very political. politics change with the wind.
plus, what about texas tea?
edit: oil that is! and the beverly hillbillies. will they have to leave bh's? apply for a visa? they got allot of $$ so they can prollie afford it. just wondering!
anyway, me thinks jim bowie was ambidextrous. cuz fess parker new his shit! prollie was a texan, eh?
ummm, am i the only one taking this seriously? there's a lot at stake here!!!
If Texas can secede from the union, parts of Texas can secede from Texas.
As someone said upthread, perhaps the union should have let the south go in 1861, and instead looked west and north. It could have stopped the south and slavery from expanding any further, and instead formed a partnership with Canada. The 30 states plus ten provinces. As Seward and Lincoln both dreamed of.
Anyway, real (Lyndon Johnson) and faux (the Bushes) Texans have been your president or vice-president for 28 of the last 52 years, so no wonder that they're upset.
actually, after i graduated from college i flew to lubbock, texas for an interview with this company (they paid my way). other than it being rather flat and somewhat isolated, i really liked it. liked the people and the texas solidarity & hospitality!
edit: truthfully, there's allot of weird things going on in the world. the Arab Spring, etc! ya never know what cud happen!! that would be a really big shake up for America!
Youll be met at the border,, by Texas Natl guard,, wearin cowboy hats.. One will stroll up ,, spit some chew onto the roadway and say,,,"you aint from round here,,are yuh"...
they have all those drugs passing thru the border of texas and through texas to elsewhere. maybe they would finally get a handle on that. or they could just tax them and make sure they just kept on moving through. since "america" wouldn't send in the "national guard" when texas requested it!
edit: actually, if they did secede, i suspect a lot more people would flow into texas then there would be people leaving texas. they have plenty of room. and the weather is good. they could develope a lot of territory.
I've lived in Boulder and Denver, so I know just how much people in Colorado "love" Texans. Yes, I've seen the effete sons of Texas oil barons buy their way into the Ivy Leagues with a D+/C- average. Wonderful people, so modest and unassuming! Wonderful to share a frat house with some Texans too. So charming, well-mannered and cultured! But Austin isn't half bad.
I lived in New Mexico for many years. There are a few skis areas that seem to attract a lot of Texans. You won't find very many locals at those ski areas, for good reason....
Bruce, forgive me for seeming presumtuous (if that should be the case) or, on the other hand naive, but, are you being facetious?
edit: just kidding!!
effete is a common trait, eh?
"The effete corps of impudent snobs who characterize themselves as intellectuals" Spiro Agnew
Do you recall that ^^ quote?
buy their way into ivey league schools
That says a lot about an IL education/schools, eh?
I went to a state university SJSU and majored in occupational therapy. it was rated as the most difficult college in America for an OT degree at the time. 10-15% of the class of 70 would flunk out/be held back each semester. Out of the 2 year masters program 50% would either fail or be held back a year. It was so difficult and competitive compared to the other two (2) OT programs in the state and elsewhere in the US because it was the cheapest place to go. But it was the hardest school to get into grade wise. The other two schools in California at the time were USC & Loma Linda University!
So, yep, they do depend/favor people who can afford their tuition.
since "america" wouldn't send in the "national guard" when texas requested it!
The National Guard is under the control of the state governor until called into service by the president in a time of war or national emergency. The governor could have called the guard in, but wanted the Federal Government to pay for it.
Yeah, Federal government is a bitch until you need it.
Texas is up to 112,000
0.4% of the population. http://www.examiner.com/article/texas-secession-petition-reaches-over-112-000-signatures
Let them vote with their feet and good riddance.
I know of an area big enough for the lot of them which even has beautiful beaches, desert and plenty of oil beneath the sand.
They'll have to learn to raise camels instead of Longhorns.
They might even have enough guns to hold off Al-Qaeda In The Arabian Peninsula.
If I haven't given enough clues by now, I'm specifically thinking of Yemen. Although Northern Sudan might do if they really want to stick with cattle.
If you really really don't like the way the country is run, either work to change it or get the hell out.
By the way, 8,000 people in Austin and more in El Paso have signed a counter petition to secede from Texas.
From Austin
Peacefully grant the city of Austin Texas to withdraw from the state of Texas & remain part of the United States.
Austin Texas continues to suffer difficulties stemming from the lack of civil, religious, and political freedoms imposed upon the city by less liberally minded Texans. It is entirely feasible for Austin to operate as its own state, within the United States, in the event that Texas is successful in the current bid to secede. It is important for Austin to remain in the union as to do so would protect it's citizens' standard of living and re-secure their rights and liberties in accordance with the original ideas and beliefs of our founding fathers.
We would also like to annex Dublin Texas, Lockhart Texas, & Shiner Texas.
but, maybe he was amberdextrious (or whatever they call it, eh?)!
You don't seem to know your Texacology. Its not amberdextrious, though Amber is pretty dexterous. At least the last time I was in Dallas she were. When you are a Texican its AmbiTEXasterious.
Texas has some GORGEOUS country,, GORGEOUS Gals,,And incredible hunting and fishing. Ive seen lightning storms there that makes the sierras look like weenie storms. Every State has it shytholes,, CALI included...
Not being an American, but having lived in the Northwest corner of your country for over a decade, I do have some sense of what Americans are thinking.
As far as I can tell, the sentiment in Washington (or at least here in King County) is not so much "we want to secede" but rather "It sure would be nice if everyone else seceded."
Has anyone ascertained how many NON-Texans signed the petition hoping they'd leave and figuring that a little from non-Texacans help wouldn't hurt? LOL
Thought process of a NON-Texan: "Oh, some Texan has a petition that Texas should move along out of the union? I'd encourage that. I'll sign it and say I'm a Texan!"
Well, adios, pods, if that's what you really want.
You got enough oil money to not have to worry about your supplies of GooGoos, so more power to you idiots.
Speaking of which, "Dern, Stich!"
And OTEASTD:
USONA. There was a community out of Mariposa in the way-back-when that considered itself autonomous. Usona Road is still part of the greater Mariposa County infrastructure. Such as it is.
Splitter: Lest we forget the Agg-man, the Tricky Dick Bagman, and his eloquence, here's some gems that no doubt Hugh Hefner wrote for him.
"nattering nabobs of negativism"
"pusillanimous pussyfooters"
"vicars of vacillation"
"hopeless hysterical hypochondriacs of history"
Credit: mouse from merced
So let's just forget the Frickin' Alamo, the Cowboys, the Texans, and then Houston won't have no more frickin' problems.
I for one know in my heart that most Texans really could give a s..T one way or another about this issue.
This video needs to be watched in it's entirety by any and every one that thinks they have a clue as to what being a true Texan means[youtube=http://www.youtube.com/embed/zzabmVIU6EQ]!
Let us know!