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moosedrool

climber
Andrzej Citkowicz far away from Poland
Dec 15, 2014 - 03:44pm PT
Jonnyrig, maybe you are a responsible gun owner. I don't know you.

Why would I take a chance?

When I drive on a public road I know that most people have passed a driving test. That's a lot more that I can say about the gun owners. And I still don't trust the drivers.

Moose
jonnyrig

climber
Dec 15, 2014 - 03:53pm PT
Given the way people drive, regardless of having a license, why would you expect gun owners that have passed a test to be any more capable than the drivers?

Once again, I'll say that a licensing scheme wouldn't be horrible for gun owners. Unfortunately, as in California, it doesn't stop there. Call it a slippery slope if you like, but while Cali requires handgun owners to get certification, they also limit what guns you can buy there, and not necessarily based on what the state considers safe or appropriate. They allow exceptions. You see the gun I just built? So did my buddy in the great state of Cali. Only his runs a 7inch pistol barrel and pistol stock. And he's completely legal. Now, Cali requires a "bullet button" which is a device that is supposed to limit the ability of a person to change magazines in quick fashion. When he brings his gun up here though, a neodymium magnet does a fine job of rendering the bullet button operation to exactly that of a regular mag release. No hi-cap mags in Cali? True. So you buy a "parts kit" instead, which amounts to a disassembled magazine.

Pass all the laws you want. Just don't forget to close the loopholes. Take the placebo with three quarts of beer, but don't call ME in the morning...

And if you want to consider whether or not I'm a responsible gun owner, just ask yourself if you'd ride in my truck with me...

'cause around here, that's probably a greater risk to your personal well-being.
Meanwhile, I'd be happy to give you a belay. I'll even bring the beer.
moosedrool

climber
Andrzej Citkowicz far away from Poland
Dec 15, 2014 - 05:50pm PT
Cool Jonnyrig, looking forward to climbing with you. Driving is optional.

Since those laws you mentioned don't work, how about this:

You can own up to tree rifles, single or double barrel, no magazine, max caliber .45. Should be enough to go hunting, right?

Don't shoot moose!

Moose
fear

Ice climber
hartford, ct
Dec 15, 2014 - 05:56pm PT
Oh My God Johnny!!!

A GHOST GUN!!!!!

The horror.... the horror...

Now, keeping with the spirit of federal laws, is it true you can't sell a firearm (the receiver) you make yourself?
TGT

Social climber
So Cal
Dec 15, 2014 - 06:15pm PT
All those stringent gun laws worked for the Ausies today, didn't they?
Fossil climber

Trad climber
Atlin, B. C.
Dec 15, 2014 - 07:42pm PT
Back before I moved to Canada I had a beautiful little K22 Masterpiece with a 1.3x Phantom scope on it. You could drive tacks with it. Used it to hunt blue grouse on the Olympic peninsula. When we moved to Canada, the restrictions on handguns were so severe that I sadly left it with my brother. I was also offered the gift of an early Hi Standard .22 by a friend of my fatherís, but had to decline.

However, once the initial pain was past I found I didnít miss the handgun. Rifles were plenty, and I fed the family moose for ten years with a pre-64 30-06, a knife, saw, canoe and pack frame. However the Cdn. government, ever eager to please whomever holds the most votes, has flipped back and forth with licensing and registration, then no registration, and I suspect with a change in parties, back to registration again. Thundering pain in the ass, especially for people like us who live in or near a relative wilderness.

This fall, not too far from here, a rogue grizzly came in through a window, chased the occupants out, and killed the lovely woman before her husband could shoot it.

http://www.yukon-news.com/news/grizzly-mauls-teslin-woman-to-death/

So much for being required to have guns and ammo locked up, separately.

On the other hand, from observation Iím convinced that a substantial part of the population shouldnít even be allowed to reproduce or vote, much less own a gun.
Hard to find a balance.
jonnyrig

climber
Dec 15, 2014 - 10:11pm PT
I thought it prudent to look it up myself. Here is what ATFE has to say on the subject. About 3/4 down the page under "Firearms Technology".

https://www.atf.gov/content/Firearms/firearms-industry/FAQ-firearms


"Individuals manufacturing sporting-type firearms for their own use need not hold Federal Firearms Licenses (FFLs). However, we suggest that the manufacturer at least identify the firearm with a serial number as a safeguard in the event that the firearm is lost or stolen. Also, the firearm should be identified as required in 27 CFR 478.92 if it is sold or otherwise lawfully transferred in the future."

linky to 27 CFR 478.92
http://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/27/478.92
fear

Ice climber
hartford, ct
Dec 16, 2014 - 07:16am PT
Interesting, although it would seem prudent to perhaps keep things that you manufacture. There's a whole raft of BATF laws and licenses dealing with legitimate manufacturers.

Gary

Social climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
Dec 16, 2014 - 11:01am PT
And when Feinsteins of the world figure out its the UPPER that is the "dangerous" part~~ SO much for no background check on those too.

Good. Maybe I'll drop her a line.
Dingus Milktoast

Gym climber
Maestro, Ecosystem Ministry, Fatcrackistan
Dec 16, 2014 - 02:16pm PT
Heaven forbid you gun hobbiests and the arms merchants that supply you SHOULD REGULATE YOURSELVES.

DMT
jonnyrig

climber
Dec 16, 2014 - 02:18pm PT
Most, Dingus, as in "the majority" regulate themselves pretty well. The minority are the ones you guys take issue with. Only most of the time the anti-gun side goes after blanket bans etc. You're probably more likely to fall off a rock.

Apologies Ron. Sometimes I get to thinking it doesn't make snowball's difference in a blizzard so I just go ahead and pull the posts. See ya.
Dingus Milktoast

Gym climber
Maestro, Ecosystem Ministry, Fatcrackistan
Dec 16, 2014 - 03:09pm PT
Ron and jrig, thank you for your considered replies.

You guys have convinced me, the U.S. government cannot regulate the civilian fire arms market.

My opinion? Despite all you've done to self-regulate, its not enough. Please do more to keep guns out of the hands of whackos and criminals.

Thank you in advance
DMT
jonnyrig

climber
Dec 16, 2014 - 03:12pm PT
You mean I can't hand them out at the soup kitchen any more?

Really, I shouldn't be here posting. But I'm stuck in a damned office all day now, staring at a giant wall poster of Yosemity that belongs to my coworker. Above his desk is Zion. I'm getting fat. Take me climbing, I'll bring some elk burger. None of us is going to settle this f*#ked up debate. To hell with it... let's go after an adventure.
Dingus Milktoast

Gym climber
Maestro, Ecosystem Ministry, Fatcrackistan
Dec 16, 2014 - 03:17pm PT
Of course we won't settle it. :)

I'd like two of those elk burgers please? They're not super low-fat are they?

DMT
jonnyrig

climber
Dec 16, 2014 - 04:18pm PT
Nah... I grind some pork fat or bacon in so they'll stay together.
zBrown

Ice climber
BrujÚ de la Playa
Dec 16, 2014 - 06:41pm PT
Not the guns of NAVARONE. Not happiness is a warm gun. Just another brainwashed [former] cop. Only thing missing is the obligatory "the suspect reached into his waistband" statment.

It's slow to load, but it is what actually happened (happens).

http://www.10news.com/news/investigations/video-shows-former-police-officer-shooting-into-car-with-teenager-inside
jonnyrig

climber
Dec 16, 2014 - 06:46pm PT
Where are all the cut-and-paste reports on murders and violent crimes that go down without a gun?

Oh yeah... Those mean nothing here.
zBrown

Ice climber
BrujÚ de la Playa
Dec 16, 2014 - 06:52pm PT
^Well this is a "Gun" debate thread. If you're saying that these other crimes are relevant somehow, then it is incumbant on you to say what they are and how they are relevant.

jonnyrig

climber
Dec 16, 2014 - 06:58pm PT
Well, it goes back to doing more to solve violent crime in general, not just crimes committed involving the additional use of firearms. So if my contention is that we should be doing more to prevent acts of violence in general, and that those efforts would be more worthwhile than some short-sighted ban on particular types of firearms that doesn't address the underlying causes, then yeah. I'd say they're relevant.
zBrown

Ice climber
BrujÚ de la Playa
Dec 16, 2014 - 07:08pm PT
Fair enough.
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