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Messages 3921 - 3940 of total 6517 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
A5scott

Trad climber
Chicago
Mar 21, 2013 - 08:36pm PT
hey norton, thanks for the name calling. I don't think that's how my name is spelled


scott
Toker Villain

Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
Mar 21, 2013 - 08:43pm PT





























(didn't mechrist say he was out of here?)
jghedge

climber
Mar 21, 2013 - 08:45pm PT
"A suicide is a murder?"

Sorry, that's already been tried.

That stat is homicide only, not suicide.


"In 2010, guns took the lives of 31,076 Americans in homicides, suicides and unintentional shootings. This is the equivalent of more than 85 deaths each day and more than three deaths each hour."

Source: Natíl Ctr. for Injury Prevention & Control, U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, Web-Based Injury Statistics Query & Reporting System (WISQARS) Injury Mortality Reports, 1999-2010, for National, Regional, and States (Dec. 2012), http://webappa.cdc.gov/sasweb/ncipc/dataRestriction_inj.html (hereinafter WISQARS Injury Mortality Reports, 1999-2010.


Hope this helps.


Norton

Social climber
the Wastelands
Mar 21, 2013 - 08:48pm PT
Oopps

It was NOT intentional

Just quick dumb typing

My apologies
A5scott

Trad climber
Chicago
Mar 21, 2013 - 09:06pm PT
no worries norton

I understand it's off topic, and this is the last I'll say about the abortion thing... I'm just trying to wrap my head around how its totally fine to end well more than 1 million lives each year in the US through abortion, while 30,000 die by guns and that's the worst thing ever. I understand that it's legal, and i fully support that. that's the answer then i guess.

I haven't read all of the posts here, and when I picked it up, the conversation was tilted toward murder

scott
jghedge

climber
Mar 21, 2013 - 09:30pm PT
"I think up to and including full auto firearms, which lots already do legally own. "


In case the gov't wants to kill you, like they did in Russia in China, and which you cited as reason for owning them?

That's gonna stop the US Army? Or who are you planning on using them against? And then, after you shoot it out with them, what then - they're just going to leave you alone?

And this level of "reasoning" is your justification for owning them? Something that would get you laughed out of a 3rd grade classroom?



Really?






Norton

Social climber
the Wastelands
Mar 21, 2013 - 09:34pm PT
I'm just trying to wrap my head around how its totally fine to end well more than 1 million lives each year in the US through abortion, while 30,000 die by guns and that's the worst thing ever. I understand that it's legal, and i fully support that. that's the answer then i guess.


ah, now I understand

you are saying WHY is the outrage over ABORTION not the SAME outrage as mass gun murders, right?

yes, abortion has long ago been decided as legal and constitutional, as is the 2nd Amendment

and this clearly bothers you, because if I read you right, abortion to you is "murder", just as the murders caused by guns

you have every right to feel that way, and your view on this is increasingly in the minority

this country has evolved on this issue and no longer defines "murder" as ending an unwanted zygote

Scott, I guess you won't be getting much sympathy for your position on this thread, I am sure there are lots and lots of religious web sites that agree with your abortion position to visit
paul roehl

Boulder climber
california
Mar 21, 2013 - 09:37pm PT
Fascinating thread... guns and abortion! In the meantime look what I came up with.
Happiness
Happiness
Credit: paul roehl
A5scott

Trad climber
Chicago
Mar 21, 2013 - 09:42pm PT
I'm non practicing catholic and 100% pro choice

The comment about full auto guns was more about having fun shooting targets than self defense. I don't own any guns, but do enjoy target shooting
Sympathy is useless, not looking for any

Scott
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Mar 21, 2013 - 09:45pm PT
Scott,, youve entered the "twilight zone" where the absurd becomes the normal..Youll see..;-)
jghedge

climber
Mar 21, 2013 - 10:04pm PT
"I'm non practicing catholic and 100% pro choice"


You're 100% pro-choice, but you think abortion is murder

Making you pro-murder


Hahahaha, no wonder you're pro-gun
A5scott

Trad climber
Chicago
Mar 21, 2013 - 10:12pm PT
I never said I thought abortion was murder. It's not. I said why I brought it into the conversation. Nothing more to read into it.

Scott
jghedge

climber
Mar 21, 2013 - 10:26pm PT
" here is a map showing numbers of murder by country. The US is on the LOWER end of the scale at about 5 murders per 100,000. Mexico is more than double that. Some countries are nearly 10 times the US numbers. "

And why not cite the countries that are actually comparable to us in terms of culture, development and gov't, where guns have been outlawed, and gun murders have been virtually eliminated?

Guns are outlawed in the UK. Last year, 35 gun deaths in the UK - 20 of which were suicides.

15 gun murders - in a country of 60 million. Where guns are outlawed. Other EU countries, as well as Aus/NZ, all have comparable stats. Yet you choose 3rd world, drug-cartel controlled Mexico as the country to compare to the US.

For which, I suppose, you can be excused, because using the countries I cite (ones which actually are comparable to the US) destroys the pro-gun argument.
TradEddie

Trad climber
Philadelphia, PA
Mar 21, 2013 - 10:49pm PT
I don't get it

How exactly am I being "hurt" or "compromised" by any seriously likely to pass federal legislation?

how would expanded background checks effect me, can't see how

how would much tougher penalties for straw buyers effect me, can't see how

I sincerely appreciate a gun owner expressing support for these laws, but since you asked:

Background checks and tighter penalties for straw buyers WILL reduce the number of guns sold to criminals. This hurts the gun manufacturers bottom line. If criminals have less guns, fewer non-criminals will want guns, so gun sales will fall even more. Lower sales volume will make the guns you want more expensive...hopefully.

More seriously, I do think that if effective legislation passes, there could be an increase in burglaries as criminals move to the next easiest source of guns, the idiots who keep guns unsecured in their homes and cars. I wish some of the proposed new laws would require the appropriate level of responsibility that comes with owning a gun.

TE


A5scott

Trad climber
Chicago
Mar 21, 2013 - 11:01pm PT
I compared the murder rate across the map because it's hard to find another country with the sheer number of guns the US has.

If tomorrow, there were no guns in the US, not in private hands, no criminal, no lawful citizen has a gun. What happens to the total murder rate? Non gun murders are about 15,000 now. Which direction will that number go, if it changes...

scott
Jebus H Bomz

climber
Peavine Basecamp
Mar 21, 2013 - 11:04pm PT
Background checks and tighter penalties for straw buyers WILL reduce the number of guns sold to criminals. This hurts the gun manufacturers bottom line. If criminals have less guns, fewer non-criminals will want guns, so gun sales will fall even more. Lower sales volume will make the guns you want more expensive...hopefully.

What you say makes sense. Unfortunately, the people that don't get this habitually swallow the boss man's dick and call it macaroni. They're the same dip shits who think estate taxes concern them and that trickle down works. Repeat the speaking points enough and the apes can actually hoot a few of them out during the course of a normal conversation.


More seriously, I do think that if effective legislation passes, there could be an increase in burglaries as criminals move to the next easiest source of guns, the idiots who keep guns unsecured in their homes and cars. I wish some of the proposed new laws would require the appropriate level of responsibility that comes with owning a gun.

Or how about cleaning up their damn shells and target practice material they leave all over creation? F*#king slobs.

edit: HAhahaha! I really need to go climbing tomorrow, I'm turning into an online beast tonight.
jghedge

climber
Mar 21, 2013 - 11:23pm PT
"I compared the murder rate across the map because it's hard to find another country with the sheer number of guns the US has."


Because, among the 30 or so UN-classified industrialized democracies comparable to the US, there are none.

Neither, in those countries, is there anything near our level of gun murders. In the US it's about 4 per 100,000. In the UK, where guns are outlawed, it's 1 per 4 million.

I'm arguing with actual facts, based on actual results, where guns were actually outlawed. Not hypothetical "what-if's", based on speculation that intentionally ignores those facts. Outlaw guns, and, apparently, gun murders are virtually eliminated.
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Mar 21, 2013 - 11:32pm PT
If tomorrow, there were no guns in the US...

hahahaa... wtf?!
A5scott

Trad climber
Chicago
Mar 21, 2013 - 11:51pm PT
It's not really possible to compare gun murder rate between two countries where one, guns are outlawed and few are owned privately, and the other where there are nearly enough guns to arm the entire population. Which is why I was checking out the overall murder rate

of course without guns, the gun murder rate is zero. I was asking about your opinion of what will happen to the total murder rate.

scott
jghedge

climber
Mar 22, 2013 - 12:02am PT
"It's not really possible to compare gun murder rate between two countries where one, guns are outlawed and few are owned privately, and the other where there are nearly enough guns to arm the entire population. Which is why I was checking out the overall murder rate"


But you certainly can judge what happens to the gun murder rate when they're outlawed. It vanishes - in complete contrast to what gun advocates say will happen, which is that a defenseless population will be murdered wholesale, because only criminals will have them. It isn't happening.



"of course without guns, the gun murder rate is zero. I was asking about your opinion of what will happen to the total murder rate."


I don't have one. I just argue with facts.

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