The Gun debate sandbox


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Gym climber
South of Heaven
Apr 2, 2013 - 07:37pm PT
I know very well real PTSD exits. However it is also diagnosed too often and the ensuing drugs are also given out too often.

Apparently we just can't trust professionals with decades of training and experience. Apparently the only way to get anything right is to consult Ron on all decisions about everything.

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Apr 2, 2013 - 07:51pm PT
As a scientists I am WELL aware that OPINIONS differ. I respect differing OPINIONS when they are supported by data and/or solid theory.

I respect your brother's professional OPINION... along with the other million + mental health care specialists who work with vets. But I'm sure someone else has a brother who has a different professional OPINION, right?

So, how do we determine the proper course of action? (psst, the answer lies in the studies and data... it does NOT involve asking ONE person their OPINION).

Back to (my impression of) Norton's question: You don't deny the horrors and stresses of modern (Nam to now) guerrilla warfare. Given these horrible experiences and the quickness with which modern day vets are taken from society, exposed to the horrors of war, and then thrown back into society... and the fact that WAY more of them survive than in any previous war... is it REALLY that unlikely that more of them suffer from PTSD or similar? Should we stop diagnosing them based on your brother's opinion... or at least consult your brother regarding each diagnosis?

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Apr 2, 2013 - 09:07pm PT
I liked Billy Idol when I was 10.


Social climber
Right outside of Delacroix
Apr 2, 2013 - 09:40pm PT
PTSD has been around a long time.

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Apr 2, 2013 - 10:01pm PT
PTSD has been around a long time.

Very sad.

Anyone know...

Are soldiers with constitutions ill-suited for combat preferentially killed during war? Are soldiers with ill-suited constitutions preferentially affected by PTSD?

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Apr 2, 2013 - 10:14pm PT
John Oliver yesterday

Big Wall climber
Apr 3, 2013 - 11:48am PT
Credit: pyro
hit "like" if u like this picture.
Toker Villain

Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
Apr 3, 2013 - 12:29pm PT
Every fall the ERs are visited by gumby hunters with circular wounds about the eye.

See photo for explanation.

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Apr 3, 2013 - 01:20pm PT
And yet gun nuts argue against requiring some kind of training or demonstration that those buying guns aren't complete morans. If they don't know how to shoot the fuking thing, what makes you think they know how to handle and store it safely? UNfukingREAL.

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Apr 3, 2013 - 01:41pm PT
Wrong again Ron.

A gun nut is someone who loves guns so much that they are incapable of acknowledging the fact that someone who doesn't even know how to shoot a gun shouldn't be able to walk into Walmart and buy one off the shelf.

A gun nut is someone who will talk about government take overs as a legitimate reason to allow essentially unrestricted access to killing machines for damn near everyone, regardless of ability, experience, or competence.

A gun nut is someone who is so overwhelmed by their love for guns that they refuse to acknowledge a certain portion of the population are just too fuking stupid to be allowed to own them... reminds me of hippies who think "everyone must get stoned" only gun nuts are WAY dumber and WAY more dangerous.

Social climber
Apr 3, 2013 - 01:47pm PT
I don't think all gun owners are gun nuts. Target and skeet shooting are fun.

I think people who, say, prohibit taking guns away from people who have restraining orders against them for making violent threats or prohibiting the ATF from tracking sales of the guns favored by cartels are nuts-- in other words congress (aka the NRA).

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Apr 3, 2013 - 02:37pm PT
I have a question,, Why does the gubbmint officially classify, (on their orders for AR 15s), do they label those "PERSONAL PROTECTION ARMS",, yet they label them "ASSUALT WEAPONS" when concerning the public??

I have a question. Why do you think "the gubbmint" is one entity that functions with perfect consistency between departments? Who gives a flying fuk what they call them... idiots who don't know enough about guns to prevent scope-eye shouldn't be able to walk into Walmart and buy them... or any gun for that matter.

Why does the government hold News Conferences sometimes and Press Conferences other times? Why are they held in the Press Briefing Room? I think it is a conspiracy.
the Fet

Apr 3, 2013 - 02:45pm PT
I'm a gun owner and gun nuts are those opposed to reasonable regulation, and,or own dozens of guns and its one of the say three main interests in their lives, can you say compensating for something?

If someone called you a climbing nut or a surfing nut you'd be like damn right! It's telling that people take offense at being called a gun nut because its a pretty weird thing to be.

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Apr 3, 2013 - 02:57pm PT
Yet in an effort to remove those from citizens hands, they re-labeled them "assualt weapons"

THEY? Meaning a handful of idiots who happened to get elected? THEY are the government?

See, SANE people (not gun nuts) understand "the government" is made up of millions and millions of people. Gun nuts think "the government" is some entity that is coming for their guns.

the FET,, many will call you a gun nut too.

Nope, fet is a gun owner. HUGE difference. One that you are either too blind to see or choose to ignore.

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Apr 3, 2013 - 03:09pm PT
fuk Feinstein and the idiotic extremist on both sides... present company included.
Dingus Milktoast

Gym climber
And every fool knows, a dog needs a home, and...
Apr 3, 2013 - 03:34pm PT
So its LOOKS is it? Well in this case looks can kill, but really.... if we pass another assault weapons ban?


I mean if its as you say and these things are merely cosmetic? STOP WEARING MAKEUP.

But if STILL you want your Rambo Wannabee Look Alike Cosmetic Weaponry... ?

I'm laughing at you.






Gym climber
South of Heaven
Apr 3, 2013 - 03:41pm PT
Do you have research,, or is that just an out of-yer-azz opinion..?

It is well documented in this thread.

There are plenty of gun OWNERS voicing their opinions who don't appear to be nuts... michaeld, hillrat, norton, etc.

Anyone who thinks "the government" is coming after their guns... or refuses to move to a state because they can't have the mag capacity they imagine they need... or thinks anyone and everyone should be able to walk into Walmart and pick up a device capable of slaughtering dozens of people in minutes, regardless of competence or knowledge about gun safety... etc... is a gun nut.

Trad climber
Philadelphia, PA
Apr 3, 2013 - 03:43pm PT
A Gun Nut is someone who opposes any gun control legislation on the basis that it wouldn’t prevent all gun crime, yet believes that one guard with a pistol will be guaranteed to run across an entire school campus and successfully tackle an intruder with an assault rifle before they fire a single shot.

A Gun Nut is someone who spends hundreds of dollars and many hours working on tiny improvements to the accuracy of his weapon but opposes spending five minutes and $20 on background checks that would reduce the chances of ever needing that weapon.

A Gun Nut is someone who believes that there are actual threats to his person that only a 30 shot semi-automatic rifle can protect against.


Social climber
So Cal
Apr 3, 2013 - 04:02pm PT
paul roehl

Boulder climber
Apr 3, 2013 - 04:04pm PT
We would go a long way in solving this problem if gun sellers became at least partly responsible for what their sold weapons ended up doing, much in the same way that if you sell drinks to an obviously intoxicated individual in some bar you may become at least partly libel for their actions. In California Bar owners have become libel in such cases.

Take the responsibility, at least in part, away from the government and put it on the shoulders of gun sellers. I can't even purchase a cell phone contract without having a credit check. With technology today background checks are remarkably simple and quick.

I also have to say that freedom is largely a function of population. The founding vision for this country never could have anticipated the contemporary density of population we enjoy.

Because of this there are weapons that are forbidden by the government and rightly so. The question IMO is simply where do we draw the line as we have all already agreed there are some weapons no individual citizen has the right to carry or even own.
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