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Messages 3081 - 3100 of total 5834 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
Ksolem

Trad climber
Monrovia, California
Feb 27, 2013 - 02:19am PT
Don't be so naive, okay?

Any government effort to ban guns will be based on confiscating the registered guns they know about. Beyond that they might get lucky once in a while and find, as you suggest, someone driving around with a trunkload of guns.

You ignored my questions upthread:

So tell me, how many persons who practice concealed carry legally commit crimes with their guns? How many criminals who used a concealed weapon in a crime have a carry permit or a registered gun?

You have a big hard on to take away my guns, and you have no effective way to disarm the gang bangers and criminals who have no respect for the law and know how to get guns which are not traceable.

Ksolem

Trad climber
Monrovia, California
Feb 27, 2013 - 02:43am PT
But the "criminals who have no respect for the law" are the very people you advocate arming in the first place, by advocating the continuance of the status quo.

What? I'm not advocating arming them, I am saying that they will be armed by their own volition.

And this concept that something should not be legal if you don't need it, as in who actually needs a gun in Monrovia? How do you know what security issues I have at my home? How do you know the remote places I go where there is no LEO? You don't know squat about me, my home or my travels.

The fact is that taking away my guns, or for that matter simply requiring that I cannot have more than 7 rounds in a gun, will have no effect on a criminals intent on mayhem who will show up with all kinds of firepower acquired through the thriving black market created as an unintended consequence of your wonderful laws.
Ksolem

Trad climber
Monrovia, California
Feb 27, 2013 - 03:20am PT
Hedge you are like a little dog with a sock. I am done with you.
Shack

Big Wall climber
Reno NV
Feb 27, 2013 - 04:16am PT
Chicago's police superintendent admits what gun owners have known for years and non gun owners refuse to believe.

http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2013/02/26/Chicago-Police-Superintendent-Admits-Only-Criminals-Commit-Crimes-With-Guns?
TradEddie

Trad climber
Philadelphia, PA
Feb 27, 2013 - 08:36am PT
The rest stay out there, and more keep coming in.

Just where do you think guns would come from if criminals couldn't steal them from supposedly "responsible" gun owners who leave guns unsecured in unlocked cars or homes, make personal purchases at guns shows or through the classifieds or just get one of the homies without a record, or the homies little sister to simply buy one then claim they "lost" it.

That Chicago cop's statement is meaningless, and statistically wrong, of course most gun crime is by existing criminals, but a significant enough portion is by previously law-abiding persons, those mentally ill or domestic violence situations (for example any one of the recent mass murderers, Dorner, old guy in Alabama).

The more important fact is that those prohibited by law from buying guns face virtually no practical obstructions getting guns because "responsible" gun owners refuse to be inconvenienced in any way. If I needed to acquire a gun without a background check today, it would take less than an hour, I could break into the houses of any one of several people I know who keep guns unlocked at home, or I could randomly pick the first five houses on my street, starting with the guy with two black Chevy pickups, a harley, and the "Don't tread on me" flags. If all else fails, I could go online and actually spend money, that might take me two hours.

You can't grow guns under lamps, or boil one up in a flask and while its very easy to make a crude zip gun, they're not going to kill 10,000 people a year, certainly not 20 kids in a school.

TE




pud

climber
Sportbikeville & Yucca brevifolia
Feb 27, 2013 - 10:04am PT
The manic rants of jhedge simply prove the irrational mindset of the anti-gun crowd.

Frantic dribble.

This is one individual that should never be allowed to own a firearm.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 27, 2013 - 10:13am PT
and that is a fakt^^^^^^^^

That is the ONE thing proven by this thread.
TradEddie

Trad climber
Philadelphia, PA
Feb 27, 2013 - 10:41am PT
http://www.pottsmerc.com/article/20130226/NEWS02/130229530/pottstown-man-charged-after-threatening-ex-girlfriend-with-gun

Here’s your precious Second Amendment rights at work. This previously law abiding citizen has been charged with Aggravated Assault. Since the maximum sentence for a first offense isn’t even one year, he’s perfectly entitled to retain his guns. Even if the bail conditions require him to surrender his guns, in the absence of registration, police have no way to know if he has any, so have no means to enforce that requirement. In the unlikely event that he doesn’t plea to a lesser charge, and is found guilty of Aggravated Assault, the sentence for a first offense wouldn’t even render him ineligible to own or buy guns in the future. It's his rights you are defending when you oppose stricter gun regulation, not just your own.

I read my local newspaper every day, it's better than Jerry Springer. In that unscientific unrepresentative survey I see 4 or 5 gun crimes every week, gun thefts from houses or cars about once a week, maybe a murder a month, accidental shootings every few months, and in the past year, one single instance of a law abiding citizen defending himself with a legally owned gun. I haven't looked back the entire 230 years, but I'm sure I'd have heard about the overthrown tyrants or invaders repelled by the people after the defeat of the military.

TE
pud

climber
Sportbikeville & Yucca brevifolia
Feb 27, 2013 - 10:50am PT
It's "drivel", not dribble

Yes it is. I'm glad you agree.
Toker Villain

Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
Feb 27, 2013 - 07:46pm PT
More "outrage theater" at the Capitol again today.

Politicians get to showboat (but will pass nothing).
Norton

Social climber
the Wastelands
Feb 27, 2013 - 08:08pm PT
Politicians get to showboat (but will pass nothing).

probably a good prediction, Ron

but what exactly do YOU want them to pass?

or perhaps you don't want any legislation of any kind to become law?
Shack

Big Wall climber
Reno NV
Feb 27, 2013 - 08:46pm PT
Biden is such an idiot...He should just keep his mouth shut about guns since he obviously has no clue about them.


Bruce Kay

Gym climber
BC
Feb 27, 2013 - 10:46pm PT
An interesting little bit of data from gun control in South Africa. This is from an article about Oscar Pistorius suggesting that by regulation he really shouldn't have had a permitted gun in the first place considering his history. You would think if a violent culture like that of south Africa could benefit from gun regulation, maybe a similar culture in America could do it too.


South Africa’s gun-control laws were the product of public debates in the late 1990s, when the country was revising its apartheid-era laws after the birth of democracy in 1994. Six weeks of public hearings were held, and many gun owners lobbied vigorously against the reforms. “It was a huge battle,” recalls Adele Kirsten, a gun-control activist who has written a book about the period.

The new law took effect in 2004, and gun owners turned in more than 100,000 firearms in a national amnesty program.

The gun-control policy, one of the toughest in the world, created a two-step process for getting a gun licence. Before applying for the licence, a would-be owner must obtain a “competency certificate,” including a gun-safety test and background checks to see if the applicant has a history of violence, addiction or other issues.

Even if the applicant does not have a criminal record, a licence can still be denied if the person was “visited by a police official concerning allegations of violence in the applicant’s home” or if the applicant “has been reported to the police or social services for alleged threatened or attempted violence or other conflict in the applicant’s home or elsewhere,” the regulations say.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/world/questions-swirl-around-how-pistorius-got-licence-for-gun-that-killed-girlfriend/article8995608/
TradEddie

Trad climber
Philadelphia, PA
Feb 28, 2013 - 10:55am PT
Current US gun laws don't even prohibit those convicted of many "minor" violent crimes from owning guns, never mind those accused or merely investigated. Another area of improvement that surely all can agree doesn't threaten the rights of any "law-abiding" citizen?

TE
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 28, 2013 - 11:04am PT
ahhh guilty without conviction or trial eh TE...

Thankfully your NO judge or jury or politician..
monolith

climber
SF bay area
Feb 28, 2013 - 11:10am PT
What part of 'convicted' in 'convicted of many "minor" violent crimes' don't you understand, Ron?
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 28, 2013 - 11:13am PT
what part of "merely investigated" dont you understand?
monolith

climber
SF bay area
Feb 28, 2013 - 11:15am PT
That's the comparison to South Africa, Ron. Try to focus. We first need to address those convicted of violent crime.

Don't you agree? Or is that a SLIPPERYSLOPEY.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Feb 28, 2013 - 11:25am PT
there is no comparison of S Africa. There is no comparison with the UK either. THANKFULLY we are neither of those.

Now for all the blabbering going on these days,,and the quite obvious attempts by the mainstream media to exacerbate the issues, our Gun violence has been going down steadily.. But the govt is not happy with that- as they have a long term agenda.
Obviously they know things are better that they were 10 years ago but that is ignored, thrown under that table, and all manner of new laws are now being suggested to do one thing only. Make Innocent law abiding citizens into law breakers.


I just finished a seminar with a member of the CHP. When asked if he would participate in the taking of any ones guns,, he answered with a HELL NO> and further more stated that NOT ONE OFFICER HE KNOWS, throughout the various agencies will ever be involved in such actions.
monolith

climber
SF bay area
Feb 28, 2013 - 11:27am PT
Really, so we shouldn't consider improving our system because another country is doing it?

So you feel those convicted of "minor" violent crime should still be able to own guns?
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