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Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Jan 12, 2013 - 05:45pm PT
,many a tactical weapon is a pump action shotgun.. Gee Dave,, you own an assualt weapon! Guess Connecticut is out for you if they pass the barney fife bill eh!
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Jan 12, 2013 - 05:46pm PT
My military service? Zero.

What difference does it make?

A lot of difference. He made a sacrifice to join the Army and protect this country. You gun nuts rant about freedom and liberty and how guns secure that... and then disregard the heroes who ACTUALLY do the work. That's pretty fuking pathetic.
tooth

Trad climber
B.C.
Jan 12, 2013 - 05:48pm PT
Those who are so sure that they can overthrow a "tyranical" government with their private arsenals seem to have no clue about military weapons, tactics, or history.


Do you dislike them because they have no clue, or because of something else? Do they threaten you? Or are you mad because they bring up the possibility that your government may not always have your best interest in mind? That it may one day think that in it's current iteration, that it is more important than the Constitution that you swore to uphold and protect? Are you scared that if that does happen that you will feel alone and helpless to do what you know you should - defend the Constitution and the freedoms and liberties of your fellow countrymen?
Chaz

Trad climber
greater Boss Angeles area
Jan 12, 2013 - 05:49pm PT
Wes,

Your imagination is over-running your reading comprehension.
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Jan 12, 2013 - 05:52pm PT
how so?
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Jan 12, 2013 - 05:52pm PT
All the Vets i know and the current military members, not one of them would ever pull a trigger against an American..Ive said this before - that since Korea, vets have been chewed up for lost causes due to politics, and they havent forgotten one moment of any of it. In this whymsical scenario you all keep mentioning, bear in mind that many a natl guard and current or former military person would not side on a tyrannical govt, due to their oath..
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Jan 12, 2013 - 05:54pm PT
Then why do you need assault weapons and huge mags?

tooth

Trad climber
B.C.
Jan 12, 2013 - 05:54pm PT
I have a feeling you don't know Dave Kos
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Jan 12, 2013 - 05:55pm PT
Wes,,for tactical drills,and competitions, of course...
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Jan 12, 2013 - 05:57pm PT
To what end? Just for the hell of it? Then why not limit them to specific training facilities?
Dave Kos

Trad climber
Temecula
Jan 12, 2013 - 05:57pm PT
Somehow you think it takes military service to have the balls to protect one's self or family?

Oh please......get a dose of reality and grow a pair.


And when your family is being attacked, you gonna hang around and wait for a LEO...or perhaps your fellow military?


Good luck with that.

Dean,

I'm not against gun ownership. I'm against the idea that people need to own a private arsenal in order to match the firepower of the police or the military. I never said that you or anyone else cannot have a gun in their home.

As for my questions about the military, you seem to be very selective about your respect for the military and those who served. It's pretty clear from your posting history here that you don't consistently respect the military - you only use it as a vehicle for "feel good" stories that you use to portray yourself as a patriot. Apparently the "good guys" are only the Americans who agree with your views.

I may, or may not, need to "grow a pair" - but that has nothing to do with how many guns I choose to own.

Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Jan 12, 2013 - 06:00pm PT
The Ihop shooter had an illegal AK 47. Many gang members here have them- and ive seen them at the range using FULLY auto AKs. So yes if you want to defemd your home from all intruders, that means a semi auto weapon on larger caliber.
Cragman

Trad climber
June Lake, California....via the Damascus Road
Jan 12, 2013 - 06:04pm PT
Private gun ownership has NOTHING to do with the military, whether one respects the military, or whether one has served.

It does have EVERYTHING to do with the 2nd Amendment, and my right to protect myself and my family from harm.

I personally feel it is part of Obama's agenda to do away with our rights in this regard.

If you want to rely on your government as your sole means of protection, that is YOUR perogative.

I reserve the right to protect me and mine the way I know how....and the way our founding fathers saw fit.

Your shotgun, as stated by Ron upthread, is just as much of a weapon as any of mine.

You may be willing to let a dictator run your life........I'm not having any.
tooth

Trad climber
B.C.
Jan 12, 2013 - 06:04pm PT
Why would anyone be against their fellow citizens being well armed? Even compared to their military?

In business you learn that half the sale is presentation, appearance. I would rather live in a well-armed country like Switzerland before Hitler went nutz than anywhere else. Keeps your military from getting attacked as much.




If some elected official wanted to become more of a monarch or dictator... do you think that the fact that the citizens were fully armed or not would be taken into his plans? Do you not think that fully armed citizens would dissuade him most guys from planning something like that? Even doing it one little step at a time with the help of the media? History repeats itself, if you don't learn from it, well, fool me once, no twice. ummmmm...


Dave Kos

Trad climber
Temecula
Jan 12, 2013 - 06:06pm PT
Do you dislike them because they have no clue, or because of something else? Do they threaten you? Or are you mad because they bring up the possibility that your government may not always have your best interest in mind? That it may one day think that in it's current iteration, that it is more important than the Constitution that you swore to uphold and protect? Are you scared that if that does happen that you will feel alone and helpless to do what you know you should - defend the Constitution and the freedoms and liberties of your fellow countrymen?

That's quite a contrived strawman you built up there.

The massive proliferation of firearms in the US threatens all of us.

There are tens of thousands of gun homicides in the US every year.

And people conjure up fantasies of how the government will seize power and start killing Americans if we don't have guns - well guess what?

Unlike every other developed country, we already suffer the casualties of a small war, year after year.

Because we have guns.

Dave Kos

Trad climber
Temecula
Jan 12, 2013 - 06:09pm PT
I personally feel it is part of Obama's agenda to do away with our rights in this regard.

Where do people get this sh#t?

Seriously?

tooth

Trad climber
B.C.
Jan 12, 2013 - 06:11pm PT
If you didn't have guns then, you are saying that the rage and evil built up in people would simply dissipate? That they wouldn't do anything? Or that it is guns that creates this rage that makes them go on rampages and kill 38 people a day in your country?

because we have guns
mechrist

Gym climber
South of Heaven
Jan 12, 2013 - 06:11pm PT
Why would anyone be against their fellow citizens being well armed?

Because, as WELL illustrated on this forum... and in Aurora... etc, many of my fellow citizens are bat sh#t crazy. Some live in a fantasy world where Obama is trying to take away their guns and all Mexicans are poachers with illegal AK's. Some are mentally ill but still allowed to purchase guns. Some store them irresponsibly. What don't you understand about that?


History repeats itself, if you don't learn from it, well, fool me once, no twice. ummmmm...

OMG! You are right... wait a second... this sh#t is sounding more and more like veiled threats of an impending civil war... AGAIN.
tooth

Trad climber
B.C.
Jan 12, 2013 - 06:15pm PT
some are mentally ill and still allowed to purchase guns


Yeah, I guess I can see how I support Canada's gun laws that allows you to be well armed while at the same time...

1. are enforced.
2. Don't allow sales unless you are licensed, you have proven that you aren't mentally deranged.
3. Limit of 5 rounds on semi-auto.
4. don't have to take into account illegal immigrants


OMG! You are right... wait a second... this sh#t is sounding more and more like an impending civil war... AGAIN.

I was just in a country in civil war, guess it just doesn't seem like something to be ignored or to scoffed at to me. The two sides are terribly uneven, the people don't have guns except for what China is supplying. I suspect it wouldn't have started if they had been armed in the first place.
Cragman

Trad climber
June Lake, California....via the Damascus Road
Jan 12, 2013 - 06:21pm PT
Fail it ignore history and you will continue to ruin this country.

.



Obama Opposed Gun Ban Exception to Defend One’s Home

by Keith Koffler on January 11, 2013, 9:58 am


As a state senator in Illinois, President Obama opposed legislation providing an exception to handgun restrictions if the weapon was used in the defense of one’s home.

Obama’s vote would have maintained the status quo, which made it a violation of municipal gun ban law to use a firearm to save your own life in your own home. But the bill was passed anyway without his support.

The vote is a sign of how committed Obama may be to strict gun control measures.

The Illinois vote is hardly ancient history, having occurred in 2004 as Obama was running for election to the U.S. Senate. In opposing the measure, Obama lined up well to the left of the mainstream, as the Illinois Senate included 32 Democrats to 26 Republicans but approved the bill by an overwhelming margin and subsequently overrode a veto by then-Gov. Rod Blagojevich.

Obama did not participate in the veto override, which occurred in November 2004, likely after Obama had resigned his state Senate seat in order to prepare for his new role in the U.S. Senate.

The Illinois legislation was passed after a man who shot a burglar in his home was fined $750 by his town for disobeying its handgun ban. The absurdity and injustice of the situation doesn’t seem to have made much of an impression on Obama.

Just eight years earlier, in 1996, Obama answered “Yes” to a survey question asking whether he would support state legislation to “ban the manufacture, sale and possession of handguns.” The Obama 2008 presidential campaign claimed the form had been filled out by an aide who mischaracterized Obama’s position, even though Obama’s handwriting was found on survey
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