Bruce Kay
Gym climber
BC
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Jun 22, 2012 - 02:53pm PT
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One hand slapping on the what?! Too much Captain Beef Heart for you.
Hey Todd I just figure best opinion wins and most of Anders and FOSC blow. If they came up with some good ones I'd say good one. At this late stage in the game I don't think you can blame me for not holding my breath!
Mickey Mouse was a Joe Turley and Ted Marks mega classic. Local boys do good . Well maybe not that good but there's a little trivia for you anyway.
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gf
climber
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Jun 22, 2012 - 03:27pm PT
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I think Ryan takes best post for the name of the gondola cat house -the G spot -that was funny.
Anders wins the pilgrim award -or at least gets to wear the scarlet G
Bruce wins the rush limbaugh award for bombastic delivery
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Mighty Hiker
climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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Jun 22, 2012 - 04:57pm PT
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From: Minister, ENV ENV:EX [mailto:ENV.Minister@gov.bc.ca]
Sent: June 22, 2012 4:52 PM
Reference: 169517i
June 22, 2012
Dear (sir):
Thank you for your letters of May 23 and 29, and June 1 and 13, 2012, regarding the Sea to Sky Gondola Corporation’s application to adjust the boundary of Stawamus Chief Park.
This email is to acknowledge the receipt of your correspondence and to assure you that a detailed response will be provided once I have had the opportunity to review with ministry staff the issues you have raised.
Thank you again for taking the time to write.
Sincerely,
Terry Lake
Minister of Environment
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gf
climber
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Jun 28, 2012 - 08:24pm PT
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All in good time, grasshopper. Tomorrow there will be a meeting that may resolve some of these matters. I'll report so soon as I can, though it may not be right away. Patience!
As to the possible responses of FOSC and its allies to various outcomes, we've considered that also. You'll learn soon enough what is decided.
You're a climber - you know determination and tenacity are important. Plus the opera ain't over until the fat lady sings, eh?
Any updates for the gondola singers anders?
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Bruce Kay
Gym climber
BC
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Jun 28, 2012 - 08:27pm PT
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Anders is off deciding important things. He'll let us know when the time is right until then we must entertain ourselves with things of no consequence
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Tami
Social climber
Canada
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Jun 28, 2012 - 08:41pm PT
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Thank you again for taking the time to write.
Oh, god.
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gf
climber
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Jun 29, 2012 - 04:54pm PT
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For your friday night flaming pleasure....
http://www.straight.com/article-718381/vancouver/sea-sky-gondola-rezoning-approved-squamishlillooet-regional-district
Sea to Sky declined to give an interview or provide the project’s environmental reports to the Straight at this time. Ministry of Environment staff also didn’t make a B.C. Parks representative available for an interview today.
It would seem the S2S folks are adhering to the same PR principles as the folks running the pipeline campaign -when requests for transparency come in -get into a defensive crouch.
However in fairness to the S2S folks, I understand they gave a 2 hr interview to the straight last fall that they never published; so they may be feeling a little burned....
Pity BC Parks seem to be working off the same playbook.
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gf
climber
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https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=389155191133869&set=a.139943299388394.21010.139836976065693&type=1&theater¬if_t=photo_reply
recreation management
squamish style
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Bruce Kay
Gym climber
BC
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half decent run down in the Tyee this a.m. Its still a little vague on describing the BC Parks asessment process but better than any effort by The squamish Chief so far.
http://thetyee.ca/News/2012/07/05/Sea-To-Sky-Gondola/
This is a bit weird:
Though Lake repeatedly emphasizes the project's consistency with the park's management plan, Ourum claims the proposal is actually contrary to that plan. Ourum says he was involved with the study team that led to the original creation of the park in 1997.
**While the team was creating the master plan, someone actually mentioned there are "gondolas on things like this in Europe," and that the team might want to consider allowing for a similar development in Stawamus Chief park, Ourum said.
That idea was "turned down without much discussion."**
The management plan's Visitor Services section describes one of its major themes as providing "non-mechanized recreation opportunities" for visitors to experience the park. Ourum points to that line (at the top of page 32 of the document) as proof that the gondola proposal goes against the master plan of the park.
Minister Lake, however, is focusing on the main goals outlined in the plan. He says there are different types of parks under the management of the province, and while some are mainly for conservation, the Stawamus Chief Management Plan lists recreation as one of its main values.
"This is a park that has recreation high on its goals," Lake said.
yeah we know it was turned down - in context of a tram landing on the Chief which we all (I thought) know by now isn't the case now even remotely. As for it betraying the principles of non mechanized recreation anyone can see that the tram is a means of transport up into an area wherethe opportunities for self propelled recreation are great, none of it involving existing Parkland. In essence, the mandate of BC Parks non mechanized recreation is vastly expanded all at little effect to the existing park.
I still think this is the essence of the opposition, which is as non-sensical as any of their other arguments:
"I think that this is basically Disney-fication of the area. And unfortunately I think it would sort of take away from what makes Squamish special," she said. "I think it's special because it's kind of rugged around the edges."
Oh its rugged around the edges all right, and getting ruggeder all the time. Just take a wee drive up that crap Shannon creek road to see what passes for a "good" FS road around here. Whats the big deal with taking a tiny percent of the inaccessable ruggedness we are surrounded by and actually making it accessable?
Anyhoo JF, sociopathic capitalist opportunist that he is, makes a good point here:
Faulkner thinks helping as many people as possible experience wilderness areas will help them "see a value in preservation" which will help further conservation efforts.
"If you want to protect wild places, you have to do so with a measured responsibility of getting people to understand why they are important to protect in the first place," he said.
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Mighty Hiker
climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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Bruce, where were you last night, you hoser? I brought your button and everything.
The Tyee article is reasonable, but doesn't say a lot new, although for once both the Minister and the proponent actually spoke. It'd be useful to know when the Minister was interviewed, before or after a meeting on June 22nd. No doubt he's saying what his staff tell him to say, but still, if I were him, I'd be somewhat embarrassed. He's insisting that everything is hunky dory with the park, the process, and the proposal, and there's a lot that says otherwise. And much of what he says in terms of the goals and values of the park is outright revisionist.
As for creation of the park, and the master plan. I was there, and neither you nor the Minister were. The subject of a gondola anywhere in the park was brought up, IIRC by Jim S - he'd been exposed to them in Europe. He wasn't quite laughed out of the room, but close.
Whether hiring Mr. Faulkner does anything for the credibility of the proposal is a matter of opinion.
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Todd Eastman
climber
Bellingham, WA
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Jul 21, 2012 - 11:56pm PT
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Bruce, the assumption that this gondola would actually expand recreation in previously hard to reach sections of the Park complex (Squamish/Shannon Falls) is without merit unless the hours of operation are expanded top allow late returns from high-country trips And/or early starts. Now if BC Parks were to stipulate that hours of operation were to meet nearly all users including early and late arriving backcountry users, the gondola proposal might have a degree of merit. Still, this group of developers has gamed the system to get to where it is now and those opposing it are fully entitled to utilize other means within the system to de-rail it. These chumps are using the same methods to circumvent the process as those chumps building dams further up the coast and the chumps wanting to build pipelines all over this continent.
It is all the same problem. Practice on the small stuff and get good; and then have at the big ones!
I hope summer is cranking up your way. The chores and skiing have kept me from doing anything but bouldering locally, but one of these days...
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Ghost
climber
A long way from where I started
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Aug 25, 2012 - 06:38am PT
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So? Six weeks since the last post and nada? Is the process still ongoing? Is the gondola dead? Already under construction?
We're probably headed up next week and it would be nice to know whether we should be prepared for roadblocks and gunfire, or a massive construction mess, or whether the whole thing has simply been swept into the dustbin of history already.
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MH2
climber
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Aug 25, 2012 - 07:05am PT
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You will slip right through the border and everything else. Let me know if you need accompaniment on Borderline.
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hamish f
Social climber
squamish
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Aug 25, 2012 - 07:42am PT
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Word on the street is the towers are going in this fall...
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gf
climber
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Sep 12, 2012 - 10:08am PT
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Fall is around the corner, yet no public announcements from BC Parks regarding a permit.
As a side show The Land Conservancy has gone bankrupt. It would seem they were robbing peter to pay paul.....
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Mighty Hiker
climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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Sep 12, 2012 - 11:53am PT
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AFAIK, the Ministry of Environment has not issued the required permit(s), and may not for some time.
TLC didn't go bankrupt. Its accounts were frozen by the Canada Revenue Agency, for failure to pay payroll remittances and taxes. It quickly made an arrangement for payment with the CRA, and the accounts were unfrozen. TLC is undoubtedly in serious financial and organizational difficulty, but not bankrupt or in receivership.
(Segue into another 200 ad hominem posts attacking me for daring to suggest that the proposal and the process are anything less than perfect, have not complied with B.C. Parks' policy on such matters, etc etc.)
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gf
climber
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Sep 12, 2012 - 02:23pm PT
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touchy touchy
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Tami
Social climber
Canada
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Sep 12, 2012 - 02:24pm PT
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Anders you bad man.
198 ad hominem attacks to go.
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