Board lasted shoes + plantar fasciitis

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strangeday

Trad climber
Brea ca.
Topic Author's Original Post - Oct 21, 2011 - 10:32am PT
I've been having some recurring trouble with plantar fasciitis, and my normal shoes, 5.10 moccasyms, just aren't working for me. My first pair of shoes, years ago were red chilli "sausalitos" and were super stiff, and fit great. Those shoes are too broke down to re-sole, and I actually cracked the board in the sole. I'd get another pair, but it's been 12 years since I had those, and bone spurs make it difficult to find lace up shoes that fit. Any suggestions on modern, stiff soled shoes? And is anyone aware of a company making a board lasted slipper?

Thanks, John
Studly

Trad climber
WA
Oct 21, 2011 - 10:33am PT

http://www.outdoorgearlab.com/Climbing-Shoe-Reviews/La-Sportiva-TC-Pro
Dingus Milktoast

Gym climber
And every fool knows, a dog needs a home, and...
Oct 21, 2011 - 10:35am PT
Boreal still makes Ballet Golds, you can mail order them from Neptunes. I did recently and was completely pleased with their customer service and speed of delivery. No deals to be had though, they are the sole (haha) us importer that actually has stock these days, it seems.

http://www.neptunemountaineering.com/neptune/product.asp?prod_name=Boreal+Ballet+Gold+Rock+Climbing+Shoe&pf_id=PAAAAAOFAKCNJOPP&dept_id=3128&s_id=0&

That's one of the last board lasted hand made shoes, anywhere, so far as I know.

DMT
eKat

Trad climber
BITD3
Oct 21, 2011 - 10:48am PT
Credit: eKat

Do yourself a big favor and get one of those. . . and stretch out your calf - EVERYTIME you think of it.

Trust me!
strangeday

Trad climber
Brea ca.
Topic Author's Reply - Oct 21, 2011 - 11:00am PT
I know that a board lasted slipper is a pipe dream, but I have a bone spur behind my big toe, and most shoes, the laces, or Velcro straps sit right on it. With a limited amount of stiff shoes out there, I'm hoping one will fit. The Tc's look awesome, but spendy, and it's way more shoe than a punter like me needs.

Thanks for the tip Ekat.. I'll definitely look into that rocker thing. I spend a lot of time at work climbing silos, with runged ladders, and it's destroying my feet.
Srbphoto

climber
Kennewick wa
Oct 21, 2011 - 11:04am PT
the i'mgreenwithenvybecauseshelivesnearmtshastaandidon't lady is right, those are the best calf stretchers out there.
jfailing

Trad climber
Lone Pine
Oct 21, 2011 - 12:03pm PT
I know that a board lasted slipper is a pipe dream, but I have a bone spur behind my big toe, and most shoes, the laces, or Velcro straps sit right on it. With a limited amount of stiff shoes out there, I'm hoping one will fit. The Tc's look awesome, but spendy, and it's way more shoe than a punter like me needs.

Wishing for a non-existent shoe isn't going to get you anywhere.

If you want a good climbing shoe, you're going to have to spend money. I initially thought the TC pro's were way too expensive, until I put them on, and now they're my favorite shoe.

[Attempts to sound like less of a TCProFanboi]

Go out and try shoes on. The comfort from a better shoe will be worth the dough.
Dingus Milktoast

Gym climber
And every fool knows, a dog needs a home, and...
Oct 21, 2011 - 12:04pm PT
Attempts to sound like less of a TCProFanboi

Lol I had one of those noobs lecture me on how I simply had to discard my worthless golds and run, not walk, to get a pair of these.

I was like... whatever.

DMT
strangeday

Trad climber
Brea ca.
Topic Author's Reply - Oct 21, 2011 - 12:15pm PT
J-- true words.. I'll take a look and see if nomads has them, I got a birthday this weekend, and if they fit good, maybe I can talk the Mrs. Into letting me score a pair. A friend also recommended Acopa merlins, although I haven't seen them anywhere in So. Cal. Mammoth mountaineering had a few back in august, but none big enough to put my giant flippers into.
Studly

Trad climber
WA
Oct 21, 2011 - 12:26pm PT
Dingus, I can climb all day in my TC Pros, day after day. Edges as good as my Miura's did, and I have never ever any foot pain or problem since I've had them. Just had them resoled in fact. I have never had a climbing shoe in almost 40 years I can say that about, so....whatever!
Karen

Trad climber
So Cal urban sprawl Hell
Oct 21, 2011 - 12:39pm PT
Question for you guys; I don't understand what the shoes that bow upward do? Can you explain?

Next question, how do the board lasted shoes perform on friction climbs?

I have major issues finding climbing shoes that do not hurt my feet, so still climbing in shoes I bought in the 90's, however, performance wise they are shot, keep getting them resoled but they are not long for this world:(
Gary

climber
From the City That Dreams
Oct 21, 2011 - 12:44pm PT

Next question, how do the board lasted shoes perform on friction climbs?

I led 5.9 runout slab in my La Spotiva Megas. It was not a problem. Those were great shoes and I wish I had bought a few pairs.
strangeday

Trad climber
Brea ca.
Topic Author's Reply - Oct 21, 2011 - 12:55pm PT
Karen-not sure what you mean by "bow upward"... Like opposite of a down turned bouldering/sport shoe? I've never seen one..

And as for friction with a board lasted shoe, I tend to prefer it. I feel less strain on my feet with them when climbing slab, and the stiffness helps with the edging, which I tend to try to do to get my weight off my forefoot. The main reason I've been wearing the slippers is my bone spur on my foot. I actually think the slippers are contributing to my plantar fasciitis, but I've not been able to find shoes that don't hurt my spur.
Dingus Milktoast

Gym climber
And every fool knows, a dog needs a home, and...
Oct 21, 2011 - 12:57pm PT
Dingus, I can climb all day in my TC Pros, day after day. Edges as good as my Miura's did, and I have never ever any foot pain or problem since I've had them. Just had them resoled in fact. I have never had a climbing shoe in almost 40 years I can say that about, so....

whatever.

DMT
Karen

Trad climber
So Cal urban sprawl Hell
Oct 21, 2011 - 12:58pm PT
It is the shoes that look as if the toe is pointed downward.
jfailing

Trad climber
Lone Pine
Oct 21, 2011 - 01:13pm PT
I don't understand what the shoes that bow upward do? Can you explain?

It is the shoes that look as if the toe is pointed downward.

Aha! Confused by the first, clarified by the second... In a tight fitting shoe, the downward pointing toe will essentially exert force - from the foot trying to stretch flat in the shoe - onto the toe, providing better and more sensitive edging response.

This can usually be painful though. Precision comes at a price...

There seem to be some shoes around these days that are the best of both worlds. Some that you can fit snugly, still be able to edge, wear (mostly) all day, and not wail in pain when jamming in cracks.
John Butler

Social climber
SLC, Utah
Oct 21, 2011 - 02:30pm PT
I am well into my second year of climbing in the TCs. I bought them because they were the only thing I could find that fit my lame-ass feet besides the Mythos, but I needed more support than the Mythos offer. They are among the most comfortable shoes I've owned.

They climb very well on the type of routes I like to do... slabs and slabby cracks.

The rubber that comes on the TCs is OK... but C4 is much more to my liking as I found after Komito resoled them for me. The rands are pretty fragile for the way I use them. Those are my only complaints.

This year as I started to migrate inside for some gym time, I decided to pick up a pair on gym shoes, so as to preserve my precious TCs for outdoor adventures. I ended up with a pair of Boreal Jokers, which are pretty comfy and climb nicely.

But lo, my first time in them I noticed I wasn't doing so well on some of the 11- plastic routes that are at the upper-end of this old man's sending reality... but just some of them. Specifically the ones that required serious edging... routes I had previously sent in the TCs. So I suit up for the pesky pitching routes in the TCs and suddenly I'm up them. Man do they edge like nothing else.

Yeah, I know... whatever :-)

I'd love to give a pair of Boreal Golds a spin... but with the interwebs being the only place to get them I'm SOL. Seems like Mountain Tools carries them, too... right?

Melissa

Gym climber
berkeley, ca
Oct 21, 2011 - 02:33pm PT
It's not board lasted, but I think the Ace is the stiffest shoe still made. It's all J will wear b/c of his bone spur on the ball of his foot, but they kill my Achilles.

I order his straight from Boreal since no one here carries them, and if you order them through mtntools, they just order them from Boreal first, and the whole process takes longer. Boreal ships DHL. I think I got two pairs in less than two weeks for less than $20 shipping. No sales tax either.
Jaybro

Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
Oct 21, 2011 - 03:38pm PT
What size you wear? Perhaps the Crooning Mr Smooth,aka Scuffyb, can match you up with some Kauk's?

Whatever, Dingus may say, I love my TC Pro (two sizes)and mostly climb in them. But, because they are wider than other Sportiva's they don't edge like Miura's, ( or Ballet golds) for me.

Board lasted shoes kick ass on Friction!
Archie Richardson

Trad climber
Grand Junction, CO
Oct 21, 2011 - 03:40pm PT
TC Pro is not board lasted. Good shoe, though. Boreal is the only maker of board lasted shoes that I am aware of.
strangeday

Trad climber
Brea ca.
Topic Author's Reply - Oct 21, 2011 - 03:42pm PT
A little search turned up that red chili still makes the "Sausalito 2". I think I'm gonna dig my old pair out, and re-check the fit. Found them for $50 at a place called "bent gate mountaineering"... Never heard of this company. Are they decent?

As for the TC pros, I just read that they have sportivas P3 "power rand" like the solutions. I tried a pair of those at a festival and could barely stand in them. Is it the same rand and footbed, or are the TC's less downturned?
Dingus Milktoast

Gym climber
And every fool knows, a dog needs a home, and...
Oct 21, 2011 - 03:42pm PT
Ssssh Archie... let em roll.

Lol

Jay you could out climb me if you were wearing Lady Gaga meat shoes haha.

DMT
Jaybro

Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
Oct 21, 2011 - 04:16pm PT
already knew that archie, I don't think anyone said they were board lasted but Dingus opened that pandora's box... :p to both of you.

They say it's the same downturn, but it doesn't feel as toe grabbing arching as in Solutions or testarossa's


Bent Gate is Big store ala neptunes, only in Golden. Only heard the best of people's interactions with them.

I have a new pair of 38.5 Speedsters (also slip lasted) for sale for $80, btw
tahoe523

Trad climber
Station Wagon, USA
Oct 21, 2011 - 04:18pm PT
+1 on the Aces and stiff shoes in general.

Also consider the Acopa JBs. Stiff *and* comfy. I wish I had a pair. $70 if you're a lucky size 8.

$60 Kaukulators if you're an even luckier size 12!

If you're not opposed to sanitizing used shoes or possibly contracting foot fungus, I think they're the best bang for your buck. You can try many types without breaking the bank. Lots of people that have cash and initial enthusiasm for climbing indoors give up after a few tries and want to off load.

Altrec, Backcountry and REI have a lifetime satisfaction guarantee policy if you want to go the full priced, but returnable route. REI carries the TC Pros. Wishing your feet well. I have that weird bone problem, too. I quite literally feel your pain.
TGT

Social climber
So Cal
Oct 21, 2011 - 05:22pm PT
I had the same problem and now a worse one, Osteoarthritis of the big toes. It's only gonna get worse for me.

I found some Kalkulators here and had them re-randed. Since I do my own resoles, they might outlast me.

A couple of other tricks;

Get some thin aircraft modelers thin spruce plywood and make insoles out of them. Experiment with finishes and thickness!

Think about how big a culprit your approach shoes are. I've gone to using a pair of old Trango IIs that I've slapped C4 on the first couple of inches of. They work well for easier climbs as well. You might consider going back to boots for approaches if it's bad enough.

Choice of routes;

J Tree Slabby dummy domes tear me up. Jugfests or someplace like City of Rocks with generally positive feet or cracks are a lot more tolerable.
Mr_T

Trad climber
Northern California
Oct 21, 2011 - 06:23pm PT
Five Ten Netwons are great stiff shoes.

However, your earlier comment about bone spurs concerns me. Be honest with yourself - are you overdoing it with those feet? Bone spurs are often (not always) associated with overuse. Posting about fasciitis + shoes + bone spurs raises a red flag.

Brokedownclimber

Trad climber
Douglas, WY
Oct 21, 2011 - 07:04pm PT
Once again I'll chime in here and say FIT of the shoe is also important. Admittedly, I'm a "shoe junkie," always questing after perfection.

The TC Pro is a great design, but does NOT fit my foot very well; I have a pair that I bought and are too painful to wear. I still have a pair of little-used Boreal Ballet Gold's that fit me somewhat better. I still haven't broken them in completely, since they were a tad too wide when I bought them many years ago. I'm currently climbing in La Sportiva Trad Masters and are also board-lasted, which seem to be doing very well for me. I also have an old pair of Boreal Ace's that fit pretty well and are fairly stiff.

But-ultimately-it's the shape of your foot, and whether your big toe or second toe is longer. My problem is, mine are almost equal length.

You need to try them on and walk around in the store for a while; don't count on the first mail-order pair to fit, either!
Off White

climber
Tenino, WA
Oct 21, 2011 - 07:25pm PT
I'm with Dingus on the Ballet Gold. My foot issue is a neuroma in the right foot, and the board lasted shoe helps a lot. I got a pair of the Boreal shoes from Mtn Tools last spring and they've become my happy pair of all day shoes. Helps cut down on bloody ankles in the cracks too. Sportiva in general and certainly the TC Pro in particular does not fit my version of "feet", so I'll ditto the comment about FIT being the key component.
strangeday

Trad climber
Brea ca.
Topic Author's Reply - Oct 21, 2011 - 07:27pm PT
Thanks again for all the input guys... I do think I'm gonna try the TC pros, I am still scared of the price, but it they fit as good as people say, I'll have to bite the bullet and get them.

I would love to try the Acopa shoes, but I can't seem to find them anywhere. Nomad used to have them, but last time I checked there was nothing.

I'm a pretty big guy, 6'2" about 250.. Not your typical skinny assed climber. I climb 95% of the time in jtree. Due to nagging issues, I've only been doing easier boulder problems the last few years. Feeling a bit better this season, dropping some weight, and feeling ready to tie into a rope again. I've got my list of 40 5.4--5.6 routes for the season, and am looking forward to trad climbing again. I'm used to my shoulder and hip issues, but didn't notice how painful my feet have gotten until I was in Moab a few months ago, and tried bouldering in my slippers. Excruciating shooting pain in my feet. I think I just am too out of shape, but until my feet get a little stronger, I need a way stiffer shoe....
tom woods

Gym climber
Bishop, CA
Oct 21, 2011 - 09:21pm PT
Try the Miura.

It's not like the old shoes, board lasted vs. slip lasted.

I won't use anything else, unless I'm crack climbing.

Get one size that fits and one size that's comfy. You won't be disappointed.

So much power goes into the toe, that your arch doesn't seem involved in the equation. It won't hurt your toes either.
Mighty Hiker

climber
Vancouver, B.C.
Oct 21, 2011 - 11:01pm PT
Acopa seems to have gone out of business in the spring. There must still be some stock of their shoes with retailers, but it may take an effort to track down models/sizes. http://www.supertopo.com/climbers-forum/1242275/Acopa
ezrida

climber
Oct 21, 2011 - 11:24pm PT
Hi
There are many things you can do to treat your plantar fasciitis. I had plantar fasciitis for about a year and I discovered that treatment is individual. Things that work for one will not necessarily work for the other. The good news is that you have many treatments you can try but you must be persistent and patient.
I have followed a good plantar fasciitis treatment review website in this link.
There are many self care treatments ideas in there but I think you should consult a podiatrist before do something.
Take care
Archie Richardson

Trad climber
Grand Junction, CO
Oct 22, 2011 - 04:58am PT
I have found that simply rolling a tennis ball under my foot every day for a few minutes helps loosen up my p.f. a lot. I know it sounds silly.

And yes slab climbing really hurts; edging not so bad.

The rand on one of my TC Pros developed a hole very quickly. I was disappointed considering the cost. That said, they are the most comfortable shoes I own and perform very well. Maybe the rand repair will hold up better than the original.
kc

Trad climber
sj, ca
Oct 22, 2011 - 07:51am PT
LaSportiva's Tradmaster is a pretty good stiff shoe. Super comfortable, and you can do cracks in them quite nicely. For me, the friction isn't as good, but if you are used to a stiff shoe and like the friction one provides, then this shoe might be a good option for you.
Studly

Trad climber
WA
Oct 22, 2011 - 08:50am PT
One problem with the Tradmaster is the toe is really thick and boxy. It will not go in thinner cracks, so when you get in thin fingers/hands where normally you can use the crack for your feet, you're screwed and forced into trying to stem out.
For folks that have had painful fit in the TC Pro, it may be due to the tongue rolling on the edge when you put it on. I have to put the shoes on my feet starting sideways to get them to go in without the tongue rolling on the edges, which is quite painful once you tighten them, and people may think it is the fit when in fact it is a edge of the tongue rolled over. If you are not familiar with the shoe, it is very easy to do, and they take more time and care to put on them a normal climbing shoe.
Rudder

Trad climber
Costa Mesa, CA
Dec 7, 2012 - 12:03am PT
I led 5.9 runout slab in my La Spotiva Megas. It was not a problem. Those were great shoes and I wish I had bought a few pairs.

I wish I had put aside a few new pairs of Megas, too! The toe box is what I really liked!
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