Why are Republicans Wrong about Everything?

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dirtbag

climber
Sep 24, 2013 - 08:30pm PT
Norton,, you go goolge up about a hundred pages of info on who obama supports there now. Muslim Brotherhood, thats who. Same crapfest he tried to shove on Egypt and weve seen how that worked out. Same crapfest that arms through Benghazi were going to. Funny that the Christians there all prefer Assad to the alternative. In fact we have a lengthy history of supporting these snakes- worked out well for us when we armed them against the russians in afghanistan now didnt it.

Wow...your sources are as solid as jackalope glue fumes.

You're the one who posts preposterous sh#t. Prove it, hillbilly, or stfu.
Dave Kos

Social climber
Temecula
Sep 25, 2013 - 09:55am PT
It's kinda fun to watch Ted Cruz's presidential aspirations spiral down the toilet bowl.

These guys just don't get it.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Sep 25, 2013 - 09:58am PT
Hey Dirt,, sorry the truth upsets you soo much.. I hear a squaw rock can help with attitudes.
JEleazarian

Trad climber
Fresno CA
Sep 25, 2013 - 10:18am PT
"Wiped out"? Why? GM stock is worth 37 times as much as in 2008. How were the shareholders "wiped out"?


Why be a piker? GM stock is worth infinitely more than it was prior to plan confirmation, because existing holders of GM stock received nothing in the reorganization. Read the Plan and 11 U.S.C. Section 1129(b)(2)(B)(ii). The initial GM stockholders post-reorganization did not receive any stock on account of their pre-petition interests. Many of us in the reorganization business think even with the stockholder wipe-out, the GM plan still violated 1129(B)(2)(B)(ii) but, as the saying goes, hard cases make bad law,

John
Norton

Social climber
the Wastelands
Sep 25, 2013 - 10:27am PT
good point, John

and consider the alternative, IF GM went into total bankruptcy with no hope of reorganization, which is exactly what would have happened without Bush's 15 billion initially, then the shareholders
would have........nothing.....zero.....just like the bondholders

free markets for "free men", the mantra of capitalism

Risk is sometimes rewarded with gains, and sometimes not.

No one "forced" anyone to buy GM bonds or shares, and in fact there was plenty of time to exit those positions as their market share and profitability was very clearly in a decline

those that "lost out" were those that continued, blindly and willfully, to hold their GM positions

you can't protect people from themselves, often their own Worst Enemy
Elcapinyoazz

Social climber
Joshua Tree
Sep 25, 2013 - 10:38am PT
Not necessarily, because Ford's suppliers did not necessarily supply GM or Chrysler

I think you're being a little simplistic and contrary for the sake of being contrary. This is not a one-level deal. The suppliers themselves have suppliers, who again have another level of suppliers and so on down to raw materials. The idea that since Delco supplies GM but not Ford, so ergo Ford wouldn't be affected is kind of ludicrous.

Without an analysis that neither you nor I have the info to perform, it's a guessing game. But when an industry grows up around a specific geographic location -Detriot and region -upper midwest, it's reasonable to expect that both Ford/GM suppliers are sourcing some components from the same sub-supplier(s). Not many companies in that chain could weather the disruption.
jghedge

climber
Sep 25, 2013 - 11:29am PT
"Why be a piker? GM stock is worth infinitely more than it was prior to plan confirmation, because existing holders of GM stock received nothing in the reorganization."


Honestly trying to figure out what that means...so if you held GM stock in 2008, and you still have it, it's worthless today? Or that same stock you had in 2008 is now worth $37 a share?
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Sep 25, 2013 - 11:32am PT
i thought you were on a govt TIT if you had GM stock? has that changed??
survival

Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
Sep 25, 2013 - 11:32am PT
Ted Cruz is an idiot.
Curt

climber
Gold Canyon, AZ
Sep 25, 2013 - 11:41am PT
"Why be a piker? GM stock is worth infinitely more than it was prior to plan confirmation, because existing holders of GM stock received nothing in the reorganization."


Honestly trying to figure out what that means...so if you held GM stock in 2008, and you still have it, it's worthless today? Or that same stock you had in 2008 is now worth $37 a share?

If you owned GM stock prior to the reorganizational bankruptcy, that stock is worth nothing. From the GM website:

The old GM Corporation common stock became Motors Liquidation Company common stock in July 2009, and traded as MTLQQ on the over the counter market until the confirmed bankruptcy plan cancelled the shares on March 31, 2011. The stockholders did not receive any consideration for their holdings and the stock no longer has value.

The current GM stock price of $37 hasn't really changed all that much from the 2010 IPO price of $33.

Curt
High Fructose Corn Spirit

Gym climber
Potemkin Village
Sep 25, 2013 - 11:48am PT
Where is the Clintons 2016 thread, I couldn't find it.

If it doesn't exist, somebody should start it. Hillary Clinton 2016 - with Bill C as backup - a twofer.

Do you part when opportunity comes - help make history!
Norton

Social climber
the Wastelands
Sep 25, 2013 - 12:22pm PT
i thought you were on a govt TIT if you had GM stock? has that changed??

Ron, kindly explain your thought process as to how you came to believe that?



or is this just another in a long string of.....I thought it up.....therefore it just must be true....
k-man

Gym climber
SCruz
Sep 25, 2013 - 12:30pm PT
.so if you held GM stock in 2008, and you still have it, it's worthless today?

Joe, the point is, if you held GM in 2008, that stock went up in smoke with the regorg. The key is in this sentence (my emphasis):

... existing holders of GM stock received nothing in the reorganization.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Sep 25, 2013 - 12:32pm PT
Who "bailed out GM" Norton??
jghedge

climber
Sep 25, 2013 - 01:54pm PT

"Who "bailed out GM" Norton??"

Bush, in 2008. He loaned them $15 billion to keep alive, so it wouldn't go bankrupt on his watch, and he wouldn't have the liquidation of the US auto industry to add to his list of "achievements".

It reorganized under bankruptcy in 2009. Bankruptcy isn't a "bailout". It just wasn't liquidated, which is what Romney effectively proposed, what Bush prevented, and would have almost certainly thrown the US economy, and subsequently the world's economy, into a full-on depression, considering the mortgage meltdown that was happening at the same time. As Bush fully realized.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Motors_Chapter_11_reorganization
locker

Social climber
Some Rehab in Bolivia
Sep 25, 2013 - 02:01pm PT

What "Party" comes to mind???...

"Conservative, uneducated, redneck"...


Just wondering...


LOL!!!...
rSin

Trad climber
calif
Sep 25, 2013 - 02:09pm PT
the party whos base demands corperate slavery

where as an opposition party whos elite ketow to corperate slavery in opposition of their base
Norton

Social climber
the Wastelands
Sep 25, 2013 - 02:56pm PT
Who "bailed out GM" Norton??

the better question, Ron, is why are YOU so damn lazy to look it up yourself?

on issue after issue you rely on others to "educate" you

you know how to read, you know how to use an internet search feature

grow up and take the personal responsibility for getting the truth first, then shoot your mouth off
WBraun

climber
Sep 25, 2013 - 04:13pm PT
Stupid Obumer groupies and zombies along with stupid republicans.

Throughout Obumers tenure, not a single day of peace was achieved. NOT ONE!

Phony stupid Nobel Peace prize poseur and loser.

He prioritizes war. He abhors peace.

He's Netyahoo's stupid pussy slave along with the rest of his administrations warmongering losers.

He tolerates no independent governments.

He wants pro-Western vassal states replacing them.

Hes ravaging one country after another to achieve it.

Hes got lots more death and destruction in mind ......
locker

Social climber
Some Rehab in Bolivia
Sep 25, 2013 - 04:18pm PT


"Hes got lots more death and destruction in mind ..."...

Shouldn't be a problem!!!...

Stupid people...
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