Why are Republicans Wrong about Everything?

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Dr. F.

Big Wall climber
SoCal
Topic Author's Reply - Apr 7, 2013 - 06:41pm PT
Credit: Dr. F.
For old times sake!
Curt

climber
Gold Canyon, AZ
Apr 7, 2013 - 06:44pm PT
President Hillary Clinton--get used to the sound of it.

Curt
Dropline

Mountain climber
Somewhere Up There
Apr 7, 2013 - 07:27pm PT
It would be very entertaining to have Bill back in the White House. This time he will be unimpeachable. :-)
bookworm

Social climber
Falls Church, VA
Apr 8, 2013 - 07:28am PT
trends:

hopenchange
hopenchange
Credit: bookworm


wapo finally wakes up to smell the coffee burning down the house:

http://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/vanishing-workforce-weighs-on-growth/2013/04/06/2bc46116-9e20-11e2-9a79-eb5280c81c63_story.html


note: "vanishing" workers refers to people who have stopped looking for work, meaning they are not counted among the unemployed, meaning the real unemployment rate is much higher--over 20%

http://www.wnd.com/2013/01/heres-the-real-unemployment-rate/
jghedge

climber
Apr 8, 2013 - 07:34am PT
That chart shows the effect of the housing bubble bursting

Nobody is investing in real estate anymore, therefore less construction

Nobody's dumb enough to hope there's going to be another housing bubble


Well...almost anyone, apparently
Gary

Social climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
Apr 8, 2013 - 08:18am PT
What bookworm's chart show is the gradual dismantling of the New Deal over the last 40 years. Said dismantling being perpetrated by the rise of the conservatives since the late '70s. Conservatives both Republican and Democratic.
Ron Anderson

Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
Apr 8, 2013 - 08:21am PT
RIP Margret Thatcher..
bookworm

Social climber
Falls Church, VA
Apr 8, 2013 - 08:30am PT
could there be a more depressing graphic than the last one?

here you go:

http://rossieronline.usc.edu/u-s-education-versus-the-world-infographic/


the lib solution? spend more money, of course


and where does that money go? NOT to the classroom:

http://greenheritagenews.com/kids-fail-while-school-administration-prospers/

http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/supervisor_bloat_hikes_overhead_gnbt3xbRu6hnqPRqrCTZvO


here's a personal anecdote...a few years ago, our principal made it his goal to put a smartboard in every classroom, whether teachers wanted them or not...what was the result of our technology boost? dozens of unused smartboards--essentially $5,000 screens...i can do more with a $150 document camera, but nobody ever asked what i needed

by the way, the principal was promoted, in part, because of his "success" in improving the school through technology
Dr. F.

Big Wall climber
SoCal
Topic Author's Reply - Apr 8, 2013 - 08:42am PT
Bruce Kay posts in the Climate Change thread


Gym climber
BC Apr 8, 2013 - 08:27am PT

Everybody with an interest in this thread topic should take a few minutes to read the paper posted up thread by Hoser. It provides a pertinent perspective on the psychology that drives the climate change debate (anyone who thinks that climate science drives it is as naive as a babe in the woods).


In terms of the political divide, the most revealing defining factors are found under the heading
"Moral Tribalism". In my opinion the most pertinent observations are the following:



Part of this difference may be explained by the different moral priorities that liberals
and conservatives endorse; liberals tend to base their moral priorities on two foundations of individual welfare — harm and fairness — whereas conservatives supplement these with three additional foundations focused on **protecting the in-group — in-group loyalty,
authority respect and purity/sanctity**.



Loyalty is among the most powerful characteristics of the right wing authoritarian personality, which of course is the best way to describe the political right wing. Loyalty is first and foremost ascribed to ideology rather than to the physical group or individuals (loyalty is directed at individuals only so long as they represent the ideal, which if they fail at are immediately killed and eaten). This is the primary reason that right wingers are unswayed by reason or factual evidence. Their allegience lies in first priority with whatever mythological ideal they subscribe to ( libertarianism, fascism, various religious doctrines, etc) which requires by default that all conflicting values must be discarded or adapted to support the ideal. This characteristic can be found in numerous socio political situations, climate change policy just being one of many.

If we had a giant political sorter say, and we threw in 50 climate change deniers and turned it on, 50 people would eventually spill out the the right end. If you were to throw a few buckets of undeniable evidence and compelling reason, the result would be the same.

I'm going to call it the Karl Rove 3000 and sell it to universities to sort out all the incompatible with the scientific process types.

Dr. F.

Big Wall climber
SoCal
Topic Author's Reply - Apr 8, 2013 - 08:55am PT
Insurance and Freedom

By PAUL KRUGMAN
Published: April 7, 2013 NY Times

President Obama will soon release a new budget, and the commentary is already flowing fast and furious. Progressives are angry (with good reason) over proposed cuts to Social Security; conservatives are denouncing the call for more revenues. But it’s all Kabuki. Since House Republicans will block anything Mr. Obama proposes, his budget is best seen not as policy but as positioning, an attempt to gain praise from “centrist” pundits.

No, the real policy action at this point is in the states, where the question is, How many Americans will be denied essential health care in the name of freedom?

I’m referring, of course, to the question of how many Republican governors will reject the Medicaid expansion that is a key part of Obamacare. What does that have to do with freedom? In reality, nothing. But when it comes to politics, it’s a different story.

It goes without saying that Republicans oppose any expansion of programs that help the less fortunate — along with tax cuts for the wealthy, such opposition is pretty much what defines modern conservatism. But they seem to be having more trouble than in the past defending their opposition without simply coming across as big meanies.

Specifically, the time-honored practice of attacking beneficiaries of government programs as undeserving malingerers doesn’t play the way it used to. When Ronald Reagan spoke about welfare queens driving Cadillacs, it resonated with many voters. When Mitt Romney was caught on tape sneering at the 47 percent, not so much.

There is, however, an alternative. From the enthusiastic reception American conservatives gave Friedrich Hayek’s “Road to Serfdom,” to Reagan, to the governors now standing in the way of Medicaid expansion, the U.S. right has sought to portray its position not as a matter of comforting the comfortable while afflicting the afflicted, but as a courageous defense of freedom.

Conservatives love, for example, to quote from a stirring speech Reagan gave in 1961, in which he warned of a grim future unless patriots took a stand. (Liz Cheney used it in a Wall Street Journal op-ed article just a few days ago.) “If you and I don’t do this,” Reagan declared, “then you and I may well spend our sunset years telling our children and our children’s children what it once was like in America when men were free.” What you might not guess from the lofty language is that “this” — the heroic act Reagan was calling on his listeners to perform — was a concerted effort to block the enactment of Medicare.

These days, conservatives make very similar arguments against Obamacare. For example, Senator Ron Johnson of Wisconsin has called it the “greatest assault on freedom in our lifetime.” And this kind of rhetoric matters, because when it comes to the main obstacle now remaining to more or less universal health coverage — the reluctance of Republican governors to allow the Medicaid expansion that is a key part of reform — it’s pretty much all the right has.

As I’ve already suggested, the old trick of blaming the needy for their need doesn’t seem to play the way it used to, and especially not on health care: perhaps because the experience of losing insurance is so common, Medicaid enjoys remarkably strong public support. And now that health reform is the law of the land, the economic and fiscal case for individual states to accept Medicaid expansion is overwhelming. That’s why business interests strongly support expansion just about everywhere — even in Texas. But such practical concerns can be set aside if you can successfully argue that insurance is slavery.

Of course, it isn’t. In fact, it’s hard to think of a proposition that has been more thoroughly refuted by history than the notion that social insurance undermines a free society. Almost 70 years have passed since Friedrich Hayek predicted (or at any rate was understood by his admirers to predict) that Britain’s welfare state would put the nation on the slippery slope to Stalinism; 46 years have passed since Medicare went into effect; as far as most of us can tell, freedom hasn’t died on either side of the Atlantic.

In fact, the real, lived experience of Obamacare is likely to be one of significantly increased individual freedom. For all our talk of being the land of liberty, those holding one of the dwindling number of jobs that carry decent health benefits often feel anything but free, knowing that if they leave or lose their job, for whatever reason, they may not be able to regain the coverage they need. Over time, as people come to realize that affordable coverage is now guaranteed, it will have a powerful liberating effect.

But what we still don’t know is how many Americans will be denied that kind of liberation — a denial all the crueler because it will be imposed in the name of freedom.

Dr. F.

Big Wall climber
SoCal
Topic Author's Reply - Apr 8, 2013 - 05:36pm PT
Credit: Dr. F.

What happened to our ST Family Bro Riley Wyna???
I'm sure all is well, probably working too hard.
In some hell hole I'm sure
Maybe he will check in

rick sumner

Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
Apr 8, 2013 - 09:24pm PT
The liberals are a bunch of disingenuous sissy's.The railroad cars full of Obamacare rules, regulations, and taxes are busting the rivets, the contents strewn into the wind, page by page, for all to witness with dawning horror.Soon the whole train will disastrously derail.
We will then be left with one choice,the single payer system that the liberals wanted all along but didn't have the courage to pursue.There is a major demographic problem in this country-too many of us baby boomers with two few of our progeny to pay the mounting bills.What will be the outcome?
jghedge

climber
Apr 8, 2013 - 09:31pm PT
"There is a major demographic problem in this country-too many of us baby boomers with two few of our progeny to pay the mounting bills.What will be the outcome?"


Gov't cost controls on medical goods and services, like the countries that spend 9-12% of their GDP on health care have, and like we, who spend 18% and rising, don't.

That, inevitably, will be the outcome.

Gary

Social climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
Apr 8, 2013 - 09:59pm PT
We will then be left with one choice,the single payer system that the liberals wanted all along but didn't have the courage to pursue.There is a major demographic problem in this country-too many of us baby boomers with two few of our progeny to pay the mounting bills.What will be the outcome?

A healthier and more prosperous America. Yeah, I know, conservatives hate that.
rick sumner

Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
Apr 8, 2013 - 10:11pm PT
Well, why didn't the courageous liberals put in cost controls Hedge.Have you read the 42 page Time magazine article with the title of-Bitter Pills; Why Health Care Bills are Killing Us.You should, it is quite eye opening.
jghedge

climber
Apr 8, 2013 - 10:30pm PT
"Hedge.Have you read the 42 page Time magazine article with the title of-Bitter Pills; Why Health Care Bills are Killing Us.You should, it is quite eye opening."

Yes I did, posted links to it on this thread weeks ago

Obama had to use reconciliation to get ObamaCare through a dem-majority congress

Have to wait for the next dem-majority congress (2018) for cost controls.
Ksolem

Trad climber
Monrovia, California
Apr 8, 2013 - 10:41pm PT
Loyalty is among the most powerful characteristics of the left wing authoritarian personality, which of course is the best way to describe the political left wing. Loyalty is first and foremost ascribed to ideology rather than to the physical group or individuals (loyalty is directed at individuals only so long as they represent the ideal, which if they fail at are immediately killed and eaten). This is the primary reason that left wingers are unswayed by reason or factual evidence. Their allegiance lies in first priority with whatever mythological ideal they subscribe to ( socialism, fascism, various political doctrines, etc) which requires by default that all conflicting values must be discarded or adapted to support the ideal. This characteristic can be found in numerous socio political situations, climate change policy just being one of many.

rick sumner

Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
Apr 8, 2013 - 10:48pm PT
What the hell happens in the meantime? In my own case, self employed for 32 years and purchasing as individual, i was already dropped by United Healthcare when they exited all of Alaska because of ACA. I replaced it with Premera-Blue Shield at 21k/yr. for 8k deductible and was informed none of my wife or my own preconditions would be covered for a year.Recently we received notice to expect a large premium increase.
Well, that is not ACA as they sold it. Lots of other people will be in my boat, some of which will neither be able to afford the premiums or qualify for subsidy.I don't worry for myself as i could afford to self insure if necessary but lots of others, probably equal or greater numbers than before, will be lacking adequate healthcare.A real train wreck-a-coming and as the pendulum swings i don't see it likely for the dems to regain control.
WTF

climber
Apr 8, 2013 - 10:55pm PT
Rick I recommend you just go to Mexico go into a hospital have them take care of your needs then stiff their asses and leave. Pretty simple happens here all the time. Let the rich Mexican pay for your health care.

rick sumner

Trad climber
reno, nevada/ wasilla alaska
Apr 8, 2013 - 11:30pm PT
That's a good one WTF. Poetic justice. hahaha
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