johnboy
Trad climber
Can't get here from there
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Jan 24, 2013 - 09:36pm PT
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^^^^^
I just lost my place as the stupidest American.
You never stood a chance Dave.
Lose your ability to read and comprehend facts, maybe then toss your hat in the ring.
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Ron Anderson
Trad climber
Soon to be Nipple suckling Liberal
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Jan 24, 2013 - 09:42pm PT
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oh yeah,, thats right Apogee they are only on administrative leave cuz they CANT legally fire em...
and Nature,, go suck some blowfish..
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froodish
Social climber
Portland, Oregon
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Jan 24, 2013 - 11:32pm PT
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This response baffles me. You're a smart guy. Why is it so hard to think that initial reports from a chaotic situation were only partially correct?
Indeed. The fog of war.
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Ken M
Mountain climber
Los Angeles, Ca
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Jan 25, 2013 - 12:08am PT
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Her "What difference does it make now?" rant was a transparent evasion. I could only imagine what would have happened if anyone in the Bush administration answered that way about the absence of WMD in Iraq, yet the only thing we saw on the major networks and major internet sites was Hilary's rant, with no response or commentary. I guess the government giving us knowing misinformation only matters if a Republican administration does it.
For shame.
John, I am surprised that you throw over the railing, the advanced business concept of production.
What do I mean?
When I was a youth, something made in japan was synonymous with junk.
Today, it is synonymous with quality.
Why? Because they adopted quality improvement standards that were oriented to getting RESULTS. The watchwords were:
"Fix the problem, not the blame", and they marvel at what we do.
So are you are you oriented to fixing the blame, or fixing the problem? And if you want to spend millions doing both, then there goes your premise of small and limited gov't....or is that a ruse, too?
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jghedge
climber
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Jan 25, 2013 - 12:33am PT
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"I could only imagine what would have happened if anyone in the Bush administration answered that way about the absence of WMD in Iraq,..."
As if any answers were ever provided, or losing 4 diplomats is the same thing as losing 3000 soldiers
How many diplomats were killed during the Bush admin? Around 70, right?
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nature
climber
Boulder, CO
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Jan 25, 2013 - 07:18am PT
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stating that benghazi is the worst tragedy since 911 clearly shows how desperate the repugs are. Hillary did a great job. The blind and dumb still continue to feed off of this. It's sort of entertaining to watch.
The good news is Dumbf*#kistan is shrinking.... slowly.
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apogee
climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
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Jan 25, 2013 - 07:44am PT
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Ron, you're wrong.
November 21, 2004
Bush's New Cabinet: Changes in Attitude
By: Paul C. Light
George W. Bush is almost sure to break the presidential record for the fastest cabinet shake-up in history. Every second-term president in history has made cabinet changes, if only to put fresh tires on the administration. But with six secretaries gone in two weeks and more resignations sure to come, Bush has already bested Jimmy Carter, who replaced five secretaries during his 1979 "midsummer massacre," and will easily best Bill Clinton, who replaced seven secretaries in the two months following his 1996 reelection.
http://www.brookings.edu/research/opinions/2004/11/21governance-light
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apogee
climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
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Jan 25, 2013 - 07:49am PT
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Bush cabinet changes due to resignations
November 18, 2004
With six cabinet members stepping down in the past week, the Bush administration is facing substantial turnover before its second term, an effect associate professor of political science Rod Freitag said is not uncommon.
“Bush seemed to have a backlog of cabinet members that wanted to leave but didn’t want to leave before the election,” Freitag said. “I think most presidencies probably see more turnover during their first term than Bush had.”
http://www.spectatornews.com/campus-news/2004/11/18/bush-cabinet-changes-due-to-resignations/
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apogee
climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
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Jan 25, 2013 - 08:27am PT
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Whatsamattah, Ron....have a few facts incapacitated you?
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nature
climber
Boulder, CO
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Jan 25, 2013 - 09:11am PT
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don't worry apogee... in no time he'll dust of the truth like it doesn't exist, get back up, and push forth with an agenda based on lies.
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jstan
climber
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Jan 25, 2013 - 09:54am PT
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FDR and WWII got us out of the last contact the US population had with reality. Since that time one can do and say anything one wants. Fame and infamy both get you noticed so they are the same. Truth has something to do with living in a real world- and we no longer know there is a real world.
It was good to see Karl Rove, the ultimate non-reality practitioner, melting down on TV when he bumped up against something real. But that was only one moment.
The really dangerous part is there are a lot of other people in the world who are dealing with reality. They tend to ignore people like us who roll mindlessly in our own lies.
We are losing our credibility.
Something one must not lose.
For it can be regained only at horrendous cost and pain.
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apogee
climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
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Jan 25, 2013 - 09:56am PT
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Funny thing is...Ron's around this morning....he's posting on other threads...no doubt he's just waiting for the subject to change in this thread before he comes back.
You're wrong, Ron.
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krahmes
Social climber
Stumptown
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Jan 25, 2013 - 10:04am PT
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What noun best describes the current state of this thread?
Echo Chamber or Circle Jerk come to my mind.
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apogee
climber
Technically expert, safe belayer, can lead if easy
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Jan 25, 2013 - 10:12am PT
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the Fet
climber
Tu-Tok-A-Nu-La
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Jan 25, 2013 - 11:21am PT
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It's amazing to me that the Repubs still don't get it. Today Jindal is again saying they just need to fix their message their principles are right.
If anything their message has kept them afloat for the last two decades. they have been masters at twisting the truth to support themselves.
They constantly claim the dems are far left liberals/socialists. Have these people ever read about true socialists? The dems are a little left of center and far more moderate than they are.
They truly believe what they want to believe instead of reality. In the lead up to the election you constantly heard how the polls were wrong, but in the actual election, sure enough the polls were right.
I don't know if they can do anything about it though. A good 40-60% of their voters are pretty far right conservatives. If the party tries to be more moderate/centrist they'll piss them off. But what choice do they have? They've got to become more mainstream and moderate or they'll just continue to dwindle.
California is proving when you get a majority of Dems in charge you CAN balance the budget and make smart choices. It seems gridlock like in Washington is worse than having no checks and balances.
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JEleazarian
Trad climber
Fresno CA
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Jan 25, 2013 - 11:27am PT
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Ken,
Every time I read your posts, I always think "now why can't we always be on the same side?" As usual, your post was thoughtful and thought-provoking. In this instance, though, I think the problem that needs fixing is the government giving us misinformation. Answering what went wrong with the initial public information on the Benghazi attack matters, just as it did when the Bush Administration gave us misinformation.
Now, on a completely different subject, I see that the D. C. Circuit Court of Appeal, in a unanimous opinion, declared Obama's "recess" appointments to the NLRB unconstitutional. http://legaltimes.typepad.com/blt/2013/01/dc-circuit-declares-nlrb-recess-appointments-unconstitutional.html
This should come as no surprise. I had opined previously that:
"Ultimately, I find it interesting that many Obama supporters now argue that CEO-types make poor presidents, because Obama's presidential style, with his expansive use of executive orders and 'recess' appointments when Congress is in session, strike me as much more in line with actions of a private-sector CEO than someone with a sense of constitutionally limited power."
It's gratifying to see a court give such a clear opinion that executive power does, indeed, have constitutional limitations. Unfortunately, Obama's decision to proceed with purported recess appointments when the Senate was in session will now make decisions of regulatory agencies, including, particularly, the NLRB and the Consumer Finance Protection Bureau, void if those decisions required votes of unconstitutional "recess" appointees. Then again, given some of the recent decisions of the NLRB and the recent actions of the CFPB, maybe it's fortunate, rather than unfortunate.
John
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Bruce Kay
Gym climber
BC
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Jan 25, 2013 - 11:34am PT
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Today Jindal is again saying they just need to fix their message their principles are right.
These principles / impulses / instincts are engrained in their DNA. It will never change for most right wingers. The most consistent and fatal flaw is to ever think that Authoritarian personalities can be swayed by logic, reason or other forces of reality. What Karl Rove said about creating their own reality was not said in jest. He meant it and really believes it.
The best possible way to understand right wing politics is to become educated about psychology and personality drivers.
Learning about the improbability of large numbers of people being swayed by logic and reason is at first really unsettling. However the one hopeful fact left to consider is that Authoritarian personalities only amount to about 30 % of any given population. It is up to the rest of us to recognize them for what they are (proto fascists essentially) and never allow them to control political power, whether it is Stalinist Russia or The Theocracy of North Carolinastan.
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Jebus H Bomz
climber
Reno, Nuh VAAAA duh
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Jan 25, 2013 - 11:37am PT
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I saw the Circle Jerks once, Apogee. Unfortunately, it was during their disturbing gnu punk iteration. I think I barfed on my weener.
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JEleazarian
Trad climber
Fresno CA
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Jan 25, 2013 - 11:41am PT
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California is proving when you get a majority of Dems in charge you CAN balance the budget and make smart choices. It seems gridlock like in Washington is worse than having no checks and balances.
I sure hope you're right. I will be forever grateful to the taxpayers of California for the marvelous education I received, at a total tuition of $2,750.00 for nine (9) years in the University of California system. The tuition for one year of a U.C. law school is almost 20 times what I spent total in those nine years. If nothing else, I trust Democrats more than Republicans to make public higher education affordable again.
Unfortunately, though, the jury is still out on what the Legislature will do. Its first act, reinstating Native American Day (fka Columbus Day) as a paid holiday for state workers, does not bode well. Nonetheless, the Democrats have at least not demonstrated that they cannot moderate themselves, now that they have total control. The California Republican party should be a cautionary tale about the relevance of political parties that are unable to moderate their positions.
John
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