Why are Republicans Wrong about Everything?

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Messages 38861 - 38880 of total 52563 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
Karl Baba

Trad climber
Yosemite, Ca
Nov 14, 2012 - 12:43pm PT
Karl are you talking about the Exogen device? Low frequency pulsed ultrasound for bone healing? I'm curious 'cause there's one for sale on eBay now for $49.95. I'm sure they make high priced one's too but they appear to be the patent holder and make a huge line of products.

You see them for sale on ebay cheap but it's actually illegal to sell them as they are a prescription medical device and the company promises to try to get authorities to go after sellers. If you buy one illegally, you can't get the battery replaced.

People get around trying to sell these device by writing

"The sale of this item may be subject to regulation by the U.S. Food and Drug Administration and state and local regulatory agencies. If so, do not bid on this item unless you are an authorized purchaser. If the item is subject to FDA regulation, I will verify your status as an authorized purchaser of this item before shipping of the item."

Yeah, right

It's deep Bullshit cause the devices could be used for years but if you have a broken bone, you only need it for a month or so. You can't sell it, recycle it or legally sell it. Total waste and graft.
jghedge

climber
Nov 14, 2012 - 12:57pm PT
"So Hedge, I can quote you that you believe it is a legitimate role of government to drive companies out of business?"

Our health care has to be reduced from it's current % of GDP to a level commensurate with the countries we compete economically with, or it will bankrupt the US economy - in fact, it's already doing so.

If you have any ideas to achieve this with gov't involvement, love to hear it, because the free market obviously ain't it.
k-man

Gym climber
SCruz
Nov 14, 2012 - 01:02pm PT
News flash to Papa John’s CEO John Schnatter: Obamacare isn’t the only thing costing your business money.

...

We're guessing Obamacare won't impact life at Schnatter's lavish home, a 40,000 square-foot mansion in a tony suburb of Louisville, Kentucky, that features several swimming pools, a private golf course and a 22-car garage among other amenities, according to CelebrityNetworth.com.


Schnatter is just one of many company heads using Obamacare as an excuse to make changes at his company. Murray Energy's CEO laid off 160 workers the Wednesday following President Obama’s reelection, claiming his company was in “survival mode” due to regulations and taxes Obama put in place. The reality: the coal industry, of which Murray Energy is a part, is in decline thanks in large part to a recent influx of natural gas into the U.S., according to the Washington Post.


Scums, the lot of 'em.


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/11/13/papa-johns-obamacare_n_2123207.html?utm_hp_ref=business
Ksolem

Trad climber
Monrovia, California
Nov 14, 2012 - 01:02pm PT
Joe the market ain't free when insurer's cannot compete across state lines and when Dr.s cannot treat patients as they see fit but rather feel that they have to practice defensive medicine. And if I understand Karl's situation correctly, there is not a free market if a provider cannot own a bunch of those units and rent them out to patients thus amortizing the cost over a period of time.

I gotta go...
Silver

Ice climber
Nov 14, 2012 - 01:08pm PT
Just curious what if this doesn't stop at healthcare. Whats next they seek to do the same to John Deere or Cashman or cars or food or whatever. You really think they will stop at healthcare?

Puppets your all a bunch of pawns in a giant puppet show.
Dave Kos

Trad climber
Temecula
Nov 14, 2012 - 01:18pm PT
[List of negative press releases from a few healthcare companies.]

One could come up with a list negative news articles for any large industry at any time.

In an industry as massive as healthcare, a few anecdotes with some anti-Obama spin simply does not make for objective evidence.

A better measure of the impact of ACA on the healthcare industry:

http://finance.yahoo.com/echarts?s=IYH+Interactive#symbol=iyh;range=20100323,20121112;compare=%5Egspc;indicator=volume;charttype=area;crosshair=on;ohlcvalues=0;logscale=off;source=undefined;

The chart shows that since ACA was passed, the industry has grown consistently with the market as a whole. Of course many of the provisions haven't taken affect yet, but Wall Street investors don't seem to be very concerned about the future profits of healthcare companies - and they have a big incentive to look at all the facts.








Bruce Kay

Gym climber
BC
Nov 14, 2012 - 01:30pm PT
click on "the Plutocrats:

http://www.cbc.ca/thecurrent/?cmp=keymatch
JEleazarian

Trad climber
Fresno CA
Nov 14, 2012 - 01:32pm PT
Our health care has to be reduced from it's current % of GDP to a level commensurate with the countries we compete economically with, or it will bankrupt the US economy - in fact, it's already doing so.



On that point we can agree, at least in part. I question whether percent of GDP is the correct measure, because Americans desire more health care -- particularly later in life -- so it does not follow that spending more on health care makes us worse off, all other things being equal.

I also agree that our health care and senior entitlements, viz. Medicare and Social Security, are currently insolvent on an actuarial basis. It does not follow, however, that price controls (which is a very different animal from cost controls) will solve the problem.

Right now, the American health care system strikes me as a combination of the worst ideas of the Democrats and Republicans. It has almost none of the virtues of either a market or a single payer system, and the vices of both. It has some expensive procedures that most people find economically inaccessible, and the bureaucratic headaches that makes most single payer systems seem efficient by comparison. It uses an insurance model for what, in many cases, are not traditional insurable risks, and compromises the patient-provider relationship.

Since elections have consequences, and the ACA therefore is not going away, I say Republicans should work with intelligent Democrats to fix as much of this as we can given the presence of the ACA. Doing so would not only help the country, it might even help the participating politicians.

John
Dr. F.

Ice climber
SoCal
Topic Author's Reply - Nov 14, 2012 - 01:34pm PT
Complain to the Heritage Inst.
Obama used their plan because he thought the Republicans would go along with it.
Who would have imagined they would turn on their plan and demonize it so hard after Obama decided to use it, hypocrites.

I think it's just a Huge cash giveaway to the Insurance Companies

Apparently, now all the whining Republicans want the lowest cost Health Insurance possible, and it should not be associated with your employment, which is single payer, but they want to make sure we don't call it socialism
froodish

Social climber
Portland, Oregon
Nov 14, 2012 - 01:59pm PT
Just curious what if this doesn't stop at healthcare. Whats next they seek to do the same to John Deere or Cashman or cars or food or whatever. You really think they will stop at healthcare?

Who is "they"? I haven't seen anyone advocating a government takeover of the tractor industry. Did I miss something? Sounds pretty much like the fantasies of Obama sending the UN blue helmets out to collect all your guns.

My desire for reforming our health care industry is entirely pragmatic. I don't think it would even be possible to design a more broken system that what we have today. There are plenty of models out there in the world that work better (I would say the French system seems to be the one to look to currently) that illustrate that it is possible to have good health care, with everyone covered, and not bankrupt the country.

I guess first though you have to be open to the idea that not all markets are the same and that health care is fundamentally different than tractors. There are some things I think governments do better (read: more efficiently), say: interstate highways, bridges, health care; and some that the private sector does better. If you believe that all markets are the same and that there are never market failures, no such thing as friction, and all actors are equally informed and rational I guess you'll never have those options to ponder.
k-man

Gym climber
SCruz
Nov 14, 2012 - 02:00pm PT
Since elections have consequences, and the ACA therefore is not going away, I say Republicans should work with intelligent Democrats to fix as much of this as we can given the presence of the ACA. Doing so would not only help the country, it might even help the participating politicians.


I think you mean intelligent Republican should work with Democrats.

You see John, it's hard finding intelligent Republicans, because as we have seen, most can't do even elementary math. (And yes, it is easily find sources that back up my claim. I need look no farther than the lot who predicted Romney would win by looking at the polling numbers, or look to those who say Ryan's budget would balance the deficit.)


So we need to round up the intelligent Republicans, and ones who are not afraid to buck the staunch GOP agenda for fear of being outcast, to work hand-in-hand with the Democrats.

Now, mind you. I am not trying to say all Democrats are intelligent. It's just that we can plainly see that it's the Republicans who have shown the lack of this critical substance that is needed to move the ball forward.
Dr. F.

Ice climber
SoCal
Topic Author's Reply - Nov 14, 2012 - 02:05pm PT
John, where are these intelligent Republicans, that want to work in a Bi-partisan manner with the President???

They must have left the Country in 2009, because the current Republicans just work against bi-partisanship, and for them, any compromise means my way or the highway.
John M

climber
Nov 14, 2012 - 02:09pm PT
Who is "they"? I haven't seen anyone advocating a government takeover of the tractor industry. Did I miss something? Sounds pretty much like the fantasies of Obama sending the UN blue helmets out to collect all your guns.

My desire for reforming our health care industry is entirely pragmatic. I don't think it would even be possible to design a more broken system that what we have today. There are plenty of models out there in the world that work better (I would say the French system seems to be the one to look to currently) that illustrate that it is possible to have good health care, with everyone covered, and not bankrupt the country.

I guess first though you have to be open to the idea that not all markets are the same and that health care is fundamentally different than tractors. There are some things I think governments do better (read: more efficiently), say: interstate highways, bridges, health care; and some that the private sector does better. If you believe that all markets are the same and that there are never market failures, no such thing as friction, and all actors are equally informed and rational I guess you'll never have those options to ponder.

Thank you for an excellent post Froodish.
Mighty Hiker

climber
Vancouver, B.C.
Nov 14, 2012 - 02:29pm PT
Since elections have consequences, and the ACA therefore is not going away, I say Republicans should work with intelligent Democrats to fix as much of this as we can given the presence of the ACA.

The ACA ain't "broken", and by many accounts is better than what you had. It could still be improved, of course. Still, perhaps the Republican attitude should be "We lost, and have a responsibility to all Americans to not only keep the other party honest, but also to help it do a better job." If their starting point is that "it's broken", it suggests that they simply plan more obstruction. As the ACA is largely derived from Repubican initiatives, it's a little late for them to disown it anyway.

And why would Obama want to send his UN henchmen to take the guns from workers in tractor factories in Texas, anyway?
JEleazarian

Trad climber
Fresno CA
Nov 14, 2012 - 02:34pm PT
Well, I couldn't resist the "intelligent" comment, because I knew several would take the bait. That's about as far as I can get myself to troll.

As for substance, I think intelligent members of both parties need to work together on the issues regarding the ACA, Medicare and Social Security, but I have little objective evidence that this will happen. The Republicans' public stance of "no tax increase" and the President's public negotiation stance disappoint me for two reasons: (1) meaningful negotiations don't take place in the press; and (2) they represent a negotiating tactic that resembles that used by the old Soviet Union.

For those who study negotiating tactics, the "Soviet Style Negotiation" starts with an outrageous or impossible demand. When it gets rejected, they substitute an even more outrageous one. The "no tax increase" and the double down on taxing only the rich are both ridiculous as final solutions. Neither lies within the possible realm of agreement. Let's just hope that the private sessions are less unreasonable. Otherwise, get ready for a downturn that will make the last one look miniscule by comparison.

John
JEleazarian

Trad climber
Fresno CA
Nov 14, 2012 - 02:38pm PT
Anders, the Republicans lost the presidency, but won the house. Neither party won or lost everything. The reason this election determined the fate of the ACA was that without the presidency or a veto-proof majority of Republicans in both houses, it will not be repealed.

The jury is very much out on whether it's better or worse, but the experience of Massachusetts doesn't make me hopeful that we've improved things. Why not at least deal with its known imperfections, rather than leave it as the "all or nothing" legislation under which it was enacted?

John

Edit: I think a very large portion of the US is, at best, ambivalent on Texas's secession.
Norte_Caroliña_Climber

Gym climber
BigWall Baller From the Holler
Nov 14, 2012 - 02:40pm PT
Our DEFENSE SPENDING has to be reduced from it's current % of GDP to a level commensurate with the countries we compete economically with, or it will bankrupt the US economy - in fact, it's already doing so.


Fixed that for ya.
Bruce Kay

Gym climber
BC
Nov 14, 2012 - 02:55pm PT
Oh by the way, when Obama takes over the tractor industry, could you please send back this one to your good neighbor to the north? This decades mexicans underbid us.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/michelinemaynard/2012/02/06/canada-scowls-indiana-cheers-over-caterpillar-moves/


the "Soviet Style Negotiation" starts with an outrageous or impossible demand. When it gets rejected, they substitute an even more outrageous one. The "no tax increase" and the double down on taxing only the rich are both ridiculous as final solutions.

So you are saying that the Republicans are soviet acolytes? I agree.

As for your last statement,

A) they can afford it so there is no problem there.

B) They owe it to their country so no problem there.

C) They will chose to leave the country if you do so they are mercenary traitors. let em go live in Angola. No problem there either.

OK so I'm being a little facetious with that last one but roughly its all true. They can handle it easily in practical terms. They owe it in moral and / or patriotic terms. That leaves the always unstated but completely implied veiled threat that they will take their business elsewhere. This is a problem no doubt but why not come right out and state this as the only significant problem?

I'll tell you why. By stating it they would be aknowledging that they are more than willing to put their corporate interests ahead of those of the country. Its a free world so be my guest. Go ahead and put your unpatriotic self interest up on full display. Ayn Rand / Paul Ryan would applaud you.

Welcome to globalization
Dave Kos

Trad climber
Temecula
Nov 14, 2012 - 04:18pm PT
The Republicans' public stance of "no tax increase" and the President's public negotiation stance [...]

We've been through this before, but there is a major false equivalence in there.

The Republicans signed the Grover Norquist pledge and paraded it around like a badge of honor in a ridiculous display of political theatre. The pledge borders on treason - a pledge of allegiance to some "cause" rather than the interests of the country. It allowed no room for compromise.

The president is stating his position and principles. But he also has qualified his statements with saying he's "open to ideas." History shows that the president has been willing to compromise (often too much, but he's less likely to give up ground this time around.)

The Republicans are the only ones who have escalated their extremism. Note that it is their faction calling for secession - like children stomping off the playing field in a temper tantrum because the game isn't going their way.



jghedge

climber
Nov 14, 2012 - 05:21pm PT
"Whats next they seek to do the same to John Deere or Cashman or cars or food or whatever. You really think they will stop at healthcare? "

You think food isn't gov't subsidized?

You think cars aren't 100% dependent on things the gov't builds called "roads"?

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