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MH2

climber
Sep 5, 2013 - 05:05pm PT
Good on Catburglar for entertaining the notion that I might be joking. However, notice that Free Salathe is not, in the beautifully accommodating English language, the same as Salathe free.

If it were up to me, I would just say that I had climbed X route and then let the beneficiary of that news wonder if I had soloed, freed, hang-dogged, or aided the original or any variation. If the listener knew me they would know what was up and if they didn't know me they are free to think what they want. Or they could ask a question or 2. The only blasphemy is to claim a better effort than you gave. Why we care I am not sure but we do. Joking is fine by me, but only works on people who can guess the truth.

edit: maybe catburglar is catbirdseat from cc.com
Oplopanax

Mountain climber
The Deep Woods
Sep 5, 2013 - 05:53pm PT
catbirdseat aka catturdeat couldn't troll even if you spotted him a bridge and three goats
Bruce Kay

Gym climber
BC
Sep 5, 2013 - 06:23pm PT
Catburglar you might wanna cough up your real identity


Uh, somehow I doubt a cat burgler will fall for that one, Inspector Clouseau...

But never mind that. Breaking News - a spectacular new publication has just hit the stores, a guide book to the Squaw or what some more enlightened consensus types refer to as Slahanay. It was written by Barley's dog Splodge, perhaps at the behest of his master Robin who lacks Splodges computer skills. Regardless, the editorial influence of Robin is unmistakable and makes this work an instant collectors item so go snap one up. As an added hook, all proceeds go to Squamish SAR.

But really you buy it for the content which is pure Barley, hardly surprising as he has held an only grudgingly shared claim to the Squaw for thirty odd years to our benefit...... staples and Barley chains not withstanding. In fact if he insists on calling it the Squaw so be it - who's dumb enough to argue with him anyway? And speaking of arguing, much of the content should add spice to our recent tit for tat about route names and ownership and so on. Plenty of ammo within these pages. Maybe Robin ( or Splodge) can do a book signing (and a reading?) for an admiring crowd at the psyche ledge party. Perhaps a panel discussion with Dave Lane or Jimmy Scar. Or a cage fight. Either way it could be entertaining. At the risk of copyright violation, here are a few teasers:

Well sprinkled with photos, many of then scantily clad ladies, like th...
Well sprinkled with photos, many of then scantily clad ladies, like this fellow.
Credit: Bruce Kay

Lots of rare historical references such as this record of the inaugura...
Lots of rare historical references such as this record of the inaugural "March of the Kitchen
Utensils". I recognize the muscle bound beast on the right... anybody else?
Credit: Bruce Kay

More history &#40;anders take note&#41; with various contentious nomen...
More history (anders take note) with various contentious nomenclature interpretations plus a treatise on the original Pipeline epic featuring our own Tricouni and TV antenae.
Credit: Bruce Kay

Splodge is clearly marking his &#40; or Robins&#41; territory here.  I...
Splodge is clearly marking his ( or Robins) territory here. I've heard a lot about Top Shelf these days, but only when I bump into Robin ( and Splodge) do you hear anything about "Dihedral land". Match point goes to Robin and Splodge.
Credit: Bruce Kay

After a long section of yadda route description stuff we get to the re...
After a long section of yadda route description stuff we get to the real goods - an explanation and defense of Splodge and Robins various anchor techniques. Note the chapter title.
Credit: Bruce Kay

Well it turns out the staples are more than just coathangers and bubbl...
Well it turns out the staples are more than just coathangers and bubblegum after all!
Credit: Bruce Kay

If after all that you remain unconvinced, Robin &#40;and Splodge&#41; ...
If after all that you remain unconvinced, Robin (and Splodge) magnanimously provide advice on how NOT to chop staples if you care for the rock at all.
Credit: Bruce Kay

If there is any doubt about the amount of agent orange and napalm that...
If there is any doubt about the amount of agent orange and napalm that goes into creating these masterpieces, he touches on that too
Credit: Bruce Kay

if after all splodge &#40;and Robins&#41; efforts you're still seeing ...
if after all splodge (and Robins) efforts you're still seeing red then read this and realize what its all about - having fun for as long as you can hack it.
Credit: Bruce Kay
RyanD

climber
Squamish
Sep 5, 2013 - 06:33pm PT
Bruce!!


I can't stop laughing!



WTF can i get one of them?!?!?


harryhotdog

Social climber
north vancouver, B.C.
Sep 5, 2013 - 06:49pm PT
Holly cow this has got the posts going!

I think a new name might be warranted If somebody spends the enormous amount of time, effort and money cleaning a mostly new route that includes parts of an overgrown and forgotten line. If it's just freeing some section on a well travelled mostly free route then I think the original name should stand.

Tami, you have a point there.

hamie

Social climber
Thekoots
Sep 5, 2013 - 08:24pm PT
Well, lots to read tonight. My head is hurting.

Catburglar, welcome to the Taco, if you really are new. It's always fascinating to read another pov. I am particularly grateful for your info that the Salathe has now become "the trade route" on EC. I am so far stuck in the past that I still thought it was The Nose. Also thanks for all the info on the various combinations, variations and permutations which you listed. I had no idea. It all makes a fellow, esp an old one, quite dizzy.

You are quite correct that I have a big ego. I have always enjoyed the challenge and excitement of putting up new routes, and still get some satisfaction from seeing my name and the occasional photo in guidebooks, updates and the occasional maggie. Incidentally, I finished a new route yesterday, #53 since I bought a drill 7 years ago. I counted them today, just for you. How's that for ego and bragging? [One advantage of finishing a new route is that I always treat myself to a bottle of wine.]

One question for you. Are you as sneaky as your name implies?

Sorry Tami, I tried to be nice, but I'm still working at it. Note to self: "Think nice".

Cheers to Tami, Ryan and MH.
MH2

climber
Sep 5, 2013 - 08:27pm PT
"If there is any doubt about..."

I wish I had my doubt back. At least about how they clean stuff. And maybe about the Squaw in general. I find doubt to be health-preserving.
Tami

Social climber
Canada
Sep 5, 2013 - 08:34pm PT
If somebody spends the enormous amount of time, effort and money cleaning a mostly new route that includes parts of an overgrown and forgotten line.


.....they should be called retarded .


:-)



Damn. Broke my own rule about name-calling.


Sorry to all you who've excavated ancient passageways.


I take back the "retard" and suggest a career change to proctology.

:-)

Ghost

climber
A long way from where I started
Sep 5, 2013 - 08:37pm PT
You are quite correct that I have a big ego.

Which makes you not so different from most of the rest of the first ascentionists in the world. I'm sure there are exceptions, but most people who put up new routes, me included, do have a "big ego." I've never understood why people consider that attribute as a negative. Absent big ego, there'd be a whole lot less climbs in the world. Or less anything that requires creativity, imagination, and the drive to take risks.

I'm sure there are some ego-less folk out there who climb new routes for no other reason than to become one with the fuzzy endlessness of the universe or something, but most of the new-routers I know are strong-willed big-ego types.

But you know what? Most of them are also really nice people.
Tricouni

Mountain climber
Vancouver
Sep 5, 2013 - 10:33pm PT
But you know what? Most of them are also really nice people.
Everyone on this thread is really nice. This thread has been a revelation to me: totally accepting of differing views, climibng abilities, ages, POVs, and so on. Yes, it can get heated, but not nasty. Let's keep it that way, in the spirit the climbing community in general and one of the genuine nice guys, Big Mike (I'm honoured to know you, Mike), who started this thread way back when.

I'm taking an extended leave of absence from this thread. Have fun at the Psyche Ledge party - sorry to miss it - and I'll check in here towards the end of October. In the mean time, keep the discussion going, keep it kind, and keep climbing.

Glenn
hamie

Social climber
Thekoots
Sep 5, 2013 - 11:14pm PT
Glenn
I recall that some time ago you mentioned a fall trip to Peru and Bolivia, and assume that you are now on your way. Buena suerte if you decide to tackle one of the bigs near La Paz.
Bruce Kay

Gym climber
BC
Sep 6, 2013 - 08:19am PT
Ghost and Hamie thread the needle. Ego's are like scotch. Straight up fairly foul but a spot of water and the fury is the milk of life itself. Even straight up is suitable for some occasions, if the occasion is suitably already drunk and not too concerned with the future. A steady diet of it can lead to a short and not particularly satisfying life however.

Then there are blends or Rye, but we're above all that
Ghost

climber
A long way from where I started
Sep 6, 2013 - 08:22am PT
Dang! I was looking forward to seeing you on the ledge. But it sounds like, through some weird twisted logic, you've managed to convince yourself that a trip to Peru and Bolivia is somehow more worthwhile than hanging out on a disused road with a bunch of climbers.

Oh well...
Oplopanax

Mountain climber
The Deep Woods
Sep 6, 2013 - 09:14am PT


Then there are blends or Rye, but we're above all that

harryhotdog

Social climber
north vancouver, B.C.
Sep 6, 2013 - 09:36am PT
Obviously Peder was a fan of The Worlds Toughest Milkman. David Boswell was transplanted Hamiltonian that came to Vancouver just like myself.
Dundas has climbing too, that's where we drank our Owls roost.
Big Mike

Trad climber
BC
Topic Author's Reply - Sep 6, 2013 - 09:57am PT
Yes, it can get heated, but not nasty. Let's keep it that way, in the spirit the climbing community in general and one of the genuine nice guys, Big Mike (I'm honoured to know you, Mike), who started this thread way back when.

This is very good advice. This is why we have discussions here that don't end in name calling and thread deleting. Thanks for the compliment Glenn. It's an honour coming from you. Your support while i was in the hospital meant the world, and i was very lucky to have it.

This thread has been my saviour, in good times and bad, and has contributed greatly in my recovery, from the support of it's denizens who flocked to my side when it was most needed. I will never forget your visits, generous donations or words of support, so thank you to all who were there for me.

Now, this renaming thing. After a few conversations and some diligent reading, I think that if one is simply freeing a previously aided pitch, without any variations, then the original name should stick.

If one is adding new pitches to an existing climb or variations to free the route, then it is essentially a new route, encompassing the old pitches. Therefore it deserves a new name, but hopefully one which will pay homage to the older route, which paved the way for the newer one. Milk "Road" for example. I like the way Marc handled it, including the older names in the descriptions, as well as fa information.

I also think it is a sign of respect for the original FA to leave the name intact on freed single pitch aid routes, as some have chosen to do.

I guess it just comes down to whether the ffa thinks the original name is suitable for the free version.

Nice to see everyone posting again btw. All we need now is a comment from Greg, Hamish and Perry and we'll have a full house! ;)
Chief

climber
The NW edge of The Hudson Bay
Sep 6, 2013 - 05:29pm PT
I'm an irrelevant anachronism and have nothing edifying to contribute to the renaming discussion.
MH2

climber
Sep 6, 2013 - 06:15pm PT
So can we rename you?
Chief

climber
The NW edge of The Hudson Bay
Sep 6, 2013 - 06:35pm PT
Yes, it's done all the time.
People have been renaming me for decades.
Ghost

climber
A long way from where I started
Sep 6, 2013 - 08:17pm PT
What time do the festivities start tomorrow night?

Ummmm. Wait. "Festive" is maybe not the world that best suits my memories of Psyche Ledge. But I still need to know, roughly, what the hours are.
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