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Messages 6181 - 6200 of total 7233 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
Tami

Social climber
Canada
Sep 3, 2013 - 10:53pm PT
just bein a weenie smokin bowls in the backyard


That's the best kind !
hamie

Social climber
Thekoots
Sep 4, 2013 - 12:22am PT
I don't think that we have had any discussion about the ethics of renaming routes on this thread. Personally I think that it is totally lame, and seems to be more of a Squamish "thing". Other than changing the "East Face of Washinton Column" to "Astroman", I am not aware of any other name changes in Yos, although there are probably some. The EFWC was named at a time when there were very few routes on each cliff [2 or 3 on El Cap], and they were named as geographic features rather than separate lines. It made sense to later change those names [very few] to something with a more specific identity. It is worth noting that, as far as I know, none of the routes which have been freed on EC have been renamed. The FFAists are all bigger than that, and don't need the ego trip.

If the person who makes the FFA feels entitled to make a name change, how about the person who makes the first roped solo? and the first free solo? and.........

Perhaps we should make renaming a timed event, like speed records on the Nose. Then whichever party sets a new record gets to change the name. As for all of these minor variations which now seem to require a new name, the Brits have a good solution. They just refer to them as variation starts/ finishes or direct starts/finishes.

Did I mention that I think renaming is lame, lame, lame?
Bruce Kay

Gym climber
BC
Sep 4, 2013 - 08:03am PT
It may be lame but at least it is fun. I propose that route names have a time limit of say ten years. Most route names are anachronistic and irrelevant after a while. For instance Beers are Not Enough. Before that it was Petrifying Wall due to a knicker clad Kon Kraft nailing expanding blocks - hardly relevant by the time the trees started falling, But Beers Are not Enough was a perfect moniker for the transition of the era.... psych ledge debauchery was no longer a sound foundation for the looming challenge of the next step of the evolution of Squampton. Also a great rip on a notable socio political event of the day which has now lost all relevant meaning to the current crop of metro sexuals.

So I propose we keep some of the finer traditions but release our assets to the next generation. The current puritan body nazi athletes should get drunk and sleep in their own vomit on the decaying pavement of psyche ledge at least once a year, where around a raging fire of fir rounds and tires a selection of old played out route names can be debated, discarded and named anew with something up to date. A good start was Klootch Buttress - not a particularly PC but probably relevant then moniker - turning into Welcome to Squampton ( or something sort of gangster like that) .

Here's a proposed list:

Uncle Bens - no body knows what that piss water is any more. Good thing too. Young Marc needs to do some meth, fire it off and rename it Petriflying Wall or something.

Smell of Fat Chick - Jesus what screw ups named that one? Back then there was half a chick to fifty guys so you can hardly blame them for their mysoginistic uncouthness. Now it ought to be renamed Stench of Unemployable Male.

Clean Corner - Well if Firmer ever comes back long enough to clean it properly and boot off the old stump and fire in a few select bolts maybe we can keep that name.


Token Brits, Perfidious Albion - Robins not quite dead yet but when he is the era of expat Brit is well over. Token Arcteryx Toque and Perfidious Trustafarian is with the times man.

Seasoned in the Sun - lets get with the times. Anders Bum would be like recycling and what better way to honor the most stalwart friend of the chief?



I'm sure there are others, but thats what psych ledge is for....



RyanD

climber
Squamish
Sep 4, 2013 - 08:41am PT
Perfidious trustafarian lol
MH2

climber
Sep 4, 2013 - 08:54am PT
I like the Bruce Kay point of view. He is Edward Abbey as in, "Abbey considers John McPhee 'a first rate reporter, but too mild, too nice, too cautious -- no point of view.'"

Not saying HM is John Mcphee AT ALL. I like the HM view on renaming routes and it is not too mild.

I am just putting together the parallel universe history of Squamish provided by BK.


Tami

Social climber
Canada
Sep 4, 2013 - 12:08pm PT
SPecial K :-D

Thanks for chiming in HM. :-)
Reilly

Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
Sep 4, 2013 - 12:18pm PT
You people up there are so quaint!
But you'd be more entertaining if you weren't so damn civil.
Mighty Hiker

climber
Vancouver, B.C.
Sep 4, 2013 - 10:21pm PT
I'm also quite unenthusiastic about renaming of routes, other than in exceptional circumstances. There's something of a spectrum, but to my mind, route re-naming simply isn't on unless most or all of the following are satisfied:

 Community consensus.
 Isn't confusing.
 Consent of those who made the FA, if feasible.
 Route has had few if any ascents.
 Route is not considered of any historic or other significance.
 Much time has passed, and the route has become overgrown.
 A great deal of work was needed to restore the route.
 Substantial variations were made.
 The route's history and original name and climbers are consistently identified. Simple respect.

Too often many of these aren't met, and those involved don't come off well.

(I'll omit comment on routes that had early, transitional names, and were soon given permanent names, with the consent of the FA team. For example, "Willmott's", now named Snake, and "Willmott-Strachan Chimney" - guess which that one was?)

There's a long history of accidental and deliberate re-naming at Squamish, starting perhaps with Fred's 1959 attempt to rename the Chief "Goose Rock". No one knows why. Some other notable examples:

Artificial Land: Inadvertently renamed Sentry Box sometime between the 1962 Baldwin guide, and the 1967 Woodsworth guide.

South Arete: The original name for Squamish Buttress, now the name for a route that wasn't part of the original buttress route.

North Arete: The local name for it, but Fred insisted it be called Angel's Crest. As it was his route, his call. A bit of poetry, from Fred.

Cacodemon Crack: The first half of what Fred later called Unfinished Symphony.

Bastille: Renamed Rock On, for a route that covers much of the same ground, plus at the top intersects with an unrecorded route named Pioneer, plus the original line of Squamish Buttress. I don't know if the Rock On party knew their first pitches were on Bastille/Basteal.

University Wall: It made sense that the FFA party kept the name, although they did two significant variations (<10% of the total). A significant, well-established route. But when they returned and freed the original line, and renamed those two pitches only (#2 and #5), it just confused me. (Probably no one has ever freed the entire original line of U Wall.)

Black Bug's Blood: It probably wasn't climbed much, but was an established route. The so-called "One Scoop" route uses 75% or more the same line, plus added a large number of bolts. Without any mention of the history.

Freeway: Notably, Dean and Randy didn't purport to rename this, when they cleaned it up and completely freed it ten years after the FA. Neither did those who freed Cannabis Wall a few years ago rename it. Genius Loci is an exception, in that most of the route is independent of Ten Years After.

The list of "renamed" routes is now quite long, even allowing that some are largely new routes, use and tidy up part of an existing one, then give the whole thing a new name. Particularly on the Apron, the Papoose, and other lower-angle bits. Modern equipment and techniques allow climbers to "see" routes that may not have been feasible in the past. You end up with a patchwork grid.

There may be a place for some renaming of routes, but IMHO much less than some have attempted.

Speaking of which, Jeff and Hamish Thomson, Tami, and I recently did a new indirect start to Slab Alley. We didn't "rename" Slab Alley - that would be beyond rude, even with all the work I put into restoring that climb. And that's what I'd like to suggest - if you must, just restore existing routes, maybe with variations. (Our guidebooks now even give credit for same.) Enough of this renaming nonsense. We're thinking of naming the new variation "Due Diligence - FTG".

As for the left side of Yosemite Pinnacle, even I got up it (sort of) without the chicken bolt. Why in the world would anyone add bolts to Clean Corner? Enough of this "plaisir" climbing crap. A short, steep slippery slope, often promoted by those with motives other than protecting the experience of climbing.
gf

climber
Sep 4, 2013 - 10:34pm PT
Anders, so good to have you back at the campfire; most pleased to have proof positive that the reports you were just resting were spot on. I'm with you on banishing this renaming thing, lets fire up the birdwalk bandwagon and get with the times rather than tilting at the Moody Blues windmill.
yours in revisionism
gf
Tami

Social climber
Canada
Sep 4, 2013 - 10:43pm PT
I'm with you on banishing this renaming thing, lets fire up the birdwalk bandwagon and get with the times rather than tilting at the Moody Blues windmill.
yours in revisionism


Huh????
Wayno

Big Wall climber
Seattle, WA
Sep 4, 2013 - 10:47pm PT
lets fire up the birdwalk bandwagon and get with the times rather than tilting at the Moody Blues windmill.

I had a class in college where we analyzed stuff like that to figure out what it really meant but that was a long time ago.
Bruce Kay

Gym climber
BC
Sep 4, 2013 - 11:08pm PT
Moody Blues - 1970 - Question of balance. Yes, I think Greg is proposing a retro bolting and renaming of a particular slab haul on the upper Apron.... Not so fast buddy. Mustn't avoid due process and all but worry not - tribal council is just next week

Now what was Anders going on aboot? Something about nefarious dark forces slinking about threatening no less than complete and utter destruction of the experience of climbing? Damn! Sounds serious.
Tricouni

Mountain climber
Vancouver
Sep 4, 2013 - 11:11pm PT
Artificial Land: Inadvertently renamed Sentry Box sometime between the 1962 Baldwin guide, and the 1967 Woodsworth guide.

Don't look at me! I'm not responsible for that renaming!

I saw no reason to rename Crap Crags (Europa, I think). Why Europa??? What was wrong with Crap Crags???

Bruce Kay

Gym climber
BC
Sep 4, 2013 - 11:17pm PT
What's wrong with Crap Crags????


Totally. Such a title is eternal, like Freeway..... or Danish Dirt
hamie

Social climber
Thekoots
Sep 4, 2013 - 11:19pm PT
I have been pondering this renaming conundrum.......and have come up with 2 suggestions:

1. Anyone who does a new route in the alpine is then entitled to rename the WHOLE MOUNTAIN, at least until the next new route is established.

2. It's time to rename Squamish. There are already 2 possible choices, Squish and Squampton. Any other ideas?
Tricouni

Mountain climber
Vancouver
Sep 4, 2013 - 11:22pm PT
2. It's time to rename Squamish. There are already 2 possible choices, Squish and Squampton. Any other ideas?

How about Goose Rock? That has a nice ring to it.....
Wayno

Big Wall climber
Seattle, WA
Sep 4, 2013 - 11:25pm PT
O.K., O.K., I got it. We get more yanks up there and they start renaming all the routes with their favorite dribble. Whoa. Stop me.
Relic

Social climber
Vancouver, BC
Sep 4, 2013 - 11:30pm PT
I can't wait for some good old yankee carne asada on Psyche Ledge this weekend. See y'all at The Goose!
Bruce Kay

Gym climber
BC
Sep 4, 2013 - 11:34pm PT
There are already 2 possible choices, Squish and Squampton. Any other ideas?


Well I've always kinda liked Newport. Or Skunk Hollow.
Lurky Lurkington

Trad climber
eh?
Sep 4, 2013 - 11:35pm PT
I vote for Goose Rock!
I vote for Goose Rock!
Credit: Interwebs
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