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MH2
Boulder climber
Andy Cairns
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I'm sure you recognize the value, Bushman. There is no need to be silent. In my opinion you make what you say here count for something.
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BLUEBLOCR
Social climber
joshua tree
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^^^For SURE. Compared to my spews are mostly like a happy baboon squirt'in all over the place
Namaste
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BLUEBLOCR
Social climber
joshua tree
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That was solitaire. Then I got my own room in population for 9mo. My neighbor was a dungeons&dragons freak, that time was breeze. Wish I could have recorded those conversations.
Edit: btw, I never actually sold any. I had just brought it on base in the trunk of my car (which had a taillight out) for the petty officer in charge of my shop. Hey I was only 18 :-( I was discharged as a felon, have never been able to vote, posses a gun, or be bonded which disqualifies me from holding a contractors lic. Guess I deserved it
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BASE104
Social climber
An Oil Field
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your meditative zombie state.
It was Gill who said that, not Healyje.
He said, and I'm not taking a side here, because I don't really care about this question, the following:
But there will come a day when you make the leap of faith and declare that this "no physical extent" is the no-thing you experience - the open awareness field - in your meditative zombie state.
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cintune
climber
The Utility Muffin Research Kitchen
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Funny though, to think how the response might have been parsed if he'd had his act together enough to know who he was responding to.
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MikeL
Social climber
Seattle, WA
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Jammer: Does this somehow not apparently exonerate us all from morality? I personally cant see any other point to this way of thinking.
“Not” . . . “exonerate” . . . . Huh??
I think you’re saying that my notion apparently DOES exonerate us all from morality.
Exoneration seems to imply that people are "guilty" of being immoral. That idea cuts a broad swath, for if everyone is guilty, then no one is guilty . . . No?
I think you’re really asking whether or not there is such a thing as morality. In a conventional sense (legally, in terms or cultural practices and values), then sure, there is morality. But if you ask whether or not there is morality OUTSIDE of those confines, then no.
How could there be appropriate, inappropriate, right, wrong, moral, and immoral outside of any cultural system? How could you come to such a thing?
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jgill
Boulder climber
The high prairie of southern Colorado
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Because whatever your thinking it is, zombie states or otherwise it ain't. It all ooze tumbling out of your own brainpan - We can easily see why
I feel badly about setting the stage for this denigration of Joe's comments.
Zombie is a bit of a stretch, although to the non-meditative world it looks a little like it. Maybe my choice of the word reflects the attention devoted to this fascinating thread.
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tolman_paul
Trad climber
Anchorage, AK
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Two monks were arguing about a flag.
One said, "The flag is moving."
The other said, "The wind is moving."
The sixth patriarch happened to be passing by.
He told them, "Not the wind, not the flag; mind is moving."
Werner, thanks for sharing. Hard to see when we get wrapped up in our own persepctive.
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MH2
Boulder climber
Andy Cairns
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Yep. They are all right. Did they run it past 5 other patriarchs to get opinion #6?
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son of stan
Boulder climber
San Jose CA
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You cannot know Mind without knowing Un-Mind.
Like the attempt to see the Light without knowing Darkness. Foolhardy noobishness.
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WBraun
climber
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DMT -- " It will move whether you have a mind or not."
Your wild guesses from your agitated mind shows why you're simply not even ready for this subject matter period.
Also shows why you're having so much trouble understanding Largo.
If you'll quiet your run a way mind for just a short period long enough you'll come to the full real realization of the mind .......
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tolman_paul
Trad climber
Anchorage, AK
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The flag is not the point.
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MH2
Boulder climber
Andy Cairns
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A pointless point.
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jgill
Boulder climber
The high prairie of southern Colorado
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You cannot know Mind without knowing Un-Mind
Is that the same as no-thing or open awareness? And I thought quantum theory was complicated . . .
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Bushman
Social climber
Elk Grove, California
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'Our Own Way'
Everyone to no surprise
On 'What is Mind'
And so in kind
'Religion vs Science'
Repeats their stated points
In time with little change
For year on end
There's nothing strange
About the show
Or parts we play
We dare not budge
Or show our cards
But waffle and equivocate
To hedge and then prevaricate
The madness we express
So stultifying to the glass
The broken mirror swept away
To grind the crystal into dust
Like beige white grey
The summer sands
Along our summers highway
We have to have it our own way
Returning to the same crossroads
We championed in our youth
Holding fast to places fixed
Foot stuck in the mix.
-bushman
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WindRiverWildman
Trad climber
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A geology professor of mine once said:
"We are the Earth looking at itself," but I think it should be generalized to "We are the Universe looking at itself."
Perhaps the mind and consciousness are intrinsic properties of the universe and the universe is trying to understand itself...
We are trying to understand how our physical body can lead to a mind and consciousness.
But our physical body limits the potential of our consciousness so we will never be able to fully understand our mind and consciousness - until our consciousness is freed from its physical limitations.
I recently read a book written by a Neurosurgeon - "Proof of Heaven - A Neurosurgeon's Journey into the Afterlife," who experienced a NDE. One of the interesting things he says is that when his consciousness was freed from his body, he was shown and came to understand things like parallel universes and multiple dimensions.
But as his consciousness returned to his body, his understanding dissipated. He could remember understanding these things but couldn't bring them back - and believes that was because of the limitations caused by our physical body.
The book is an interesting read - he was a professor of neurosurgeon at Harvard Medical school. He states "Consciousness is the Most Profound Mystery of the Universe."
As a neurosurgeon, he struggled with the question of how the physical body gives rise to consciousness - and how to rationalize the perspectives of science and spirituality.
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MH2
Boulder climber
Andy Cairns
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Glad to see no progress has been made.
When someone shows an interest in getting nothing done, I'm the man for the job.
Not everyone shares my inclination.
I heard Geoffrey Hinton interviewed yesterday. I remember him from the early days of excitement over the potential for artificial neural networks. Hinton's perspective was that the unsupervised type of machine learning would be the most broadly applicable. Also, Hinton was mindful that the human brain does not work like conventional computers.
Conventional computing gave us machines that could beat humans at chess and Jeopardy. Geoffrey Hinton kept working on his very different kind of machine. According to him, the real problem was that machines had to get fast enough and big enough before his approach could have advantages over programs written for each task.
The breakthrough for Geoffrey Hinton was not supercomputers. It was graphics engines built for video gaming. According to Hinton, Google Translate got significantly better a few years ago thanks to him.
I don't suppose Moosedrool would have noticed, but I was impressed about a year ago in what seemed like an improvement in the back-and-forth with my imaginary Polish girlfriend.
In the interview Hinton also spoke about what machine thoughts are in his devices and about the future applications of his system. On the record, at least, he does not see a human-level artificial intelligence happening in the foreseeable future.
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cliffhanger
Trad climber
California
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GENIUS
We were all geniuses once when we were little children. Without books, special teachers, or anything we learned a language like a dry sponge soaks up water. And to perfection, prefect pronunciation everything. And we were much much better than just one language, we were capable of learning 4 or more at once and keeping them all straight and separate. But as we aged that ability faded away and by the time we were 12 we were severe mental retards in the field of language (and remain so). What was going on?
I think that part of the answer is that the young child's soul was open and awake, enabling it to directly see the meaning of what was being said as the feelings from the speaker's soul just before the words were formed. As the mind developed over the years, an ever increasing stream of rational thought drowned out the soul. I posit that a child would not be able to learn language from a robot, no matter how good, because it lacks a soul.
Perhaps by stopping the mind through meditation this language genius may be reawakened. I found that when I stopped talking to myself in my mind while working math problems I did several times better. I think all genius of all types resides in the soul. The mind is only capable of more mundane things.
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WBraun
climber
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Rare intelligent person posting ^^^^^
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WBraun
climber
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What's up, Duck?
It's raining!!!!
Water is falling from sky right now.
Or is mind raining .....?
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