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Captain...or Skully
climber
or some such
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Apparently, he thinks it's worth 10-12 Grand.
Yeesh.
It's just a pin, after all.
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Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Topic Author's Reply - Jul 4, 2011 - 12:23pm PT
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There are a few of these missing from established collections that show up with a cloud around them occasionally. I hope this isn't one of those.
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Caveman
climber
Cumberland Plateau
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$100.00 shipping via usps priority mail. At least the shipping is reasonable.
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Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Topic Author's Reply - Jul 4, 2011 - 12:49pm PT
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No diamond "P" no Salathé...
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MisterE
Social climber
Bouldering the Gnar
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It has the diamond P with "CV" below it - looks authentic.
Anyone know what the CV stands for?
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Off White
climber
Tenino, WA
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Is MTucker the seller?
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steelmnkey
climber
Vision man...ya gotta have vision...
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This piton was hand made by Anton Salathe and has his trademark Diamond P logo clearly stamped into the piton’s chromemoly steel.
Who the hell is ANTON Salathe?
Must be Anton Nelson and John Salathe's love child...
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Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Topic Author's Reply - Jul 4, 2011 - 02:46pm PT
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Too funny...I didn't catch that detail!
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Doug Robinson
Trad climber
Santa Cruz
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Interested that it's located in the Valley.
For that kind of coin it could become tempting to have a diamond-P stamp made up and hand, uh, "forge" some of that "chromemoly." Was that the metal in old Model A axles, the supposed source of "Anton's" metal stock?
If you were a legitimate seller, wouldn't you want to tell the story of where you came across that sucker? Something beyond "may well have been used on the first ascent of Sentinel Rock"? More than one party has hiked all the way up Little Yosemite Valley to climb Sugarloaf Dome, for instance, on the hope that Salathe might have left a pin on his FA in 1951.
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Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Topic Author's Reply - Jul 4, 2011 - 03:15pm PT
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Chouinard and Frost swept those old Salathé routes for hardware back in the early sixties. “We were interested in his routes for more than just the climbing. Yvon had a Salathé piton but I didn’t, so we were out scouring the place looking for them. As far as Salathé pitons left in climbs, those guys weren’t too shabby, they didn’t leave much laying around. We did Sugarloaf. We did Church Tower. We did the Northeast Bowl on Sentinel. I finally climbed by a Salathé ring wafer on the South Face of Rixon’s and Harry Daley liberated it for his own collection. He even stamped his own initials on it. Sacrilege!” -Tom Frost
"Salathé saw the need for tougher pitons- thin, reusable ones that could be forced farther into bottomed cracks and pounded into contorted cracks without buckling. He wanted a piton that would dominate the granite, not the other way around…Salathé simply used bars of 40/60 carbon and vanadium alloy steel, which he could have obtained easily and cheaply…The resulting hand-forged and heat-treated pitons, beautifully fashioned into the standard horizontal shape, were far tougher than the European pitons of the day. Most of these handsome objects bore an imprint, a tiny “P” inside a diamond, the logo of his Peninsula Wrought Iron Works."- Steve Roper Camp 4
The notion that John started out with actual axles as metal source is pretty well put to bed by Roper. Same sort of alloy however...
If you were a serious collector that mark would have to be authenticated.
E- Chris Vandiver isn the only CV that comes to mind...
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Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Topic Author's Reply - Jul 4, 2011 - 03:41pm PT
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Because of the ease of driving and cleaning a horizontal style piton in granite corners and flakes, John didn't make very many vertical pitons other than wafers that I have come across personally.
More likely WWII era surplus with an RCS stamp on it and nothing else visible.
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Peter Haan
Trad climber
San Francisco, CA
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Stevie, I have emailed Vandiver just now. I am almost certain this pin was not his at some point---I don't recall him ever taking the time to actually effing stamp his stuff like this. Anyway, I am sure he will reply very soon. Did you know he lives in Bainbridge Island now?
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Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Topic Author's Reply - Jul 4, 2011 - 05:58pm PT
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That is news to me Peter!
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Lambone
Ice climber
Ashland, Or
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Crazy, I mean it's a cool piece of climbing history (assuming it's real),but 10 grand? WTF?
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JEleazarian
Trad climber
Fresno CA
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It would amaze me that anyone who knows what a Salathe piton is would be able or willing to pay $10,000 - $12,000 for one, unless the income levels of dirtbags his risen a lot since my day.
John
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Captain...or Skully
climber
or some such
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Perhaps they think that History is valuable. In a creepy, opportunistic way, perhaps.
They're half right. ;-)
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Mighty Hiker
climber
Vancouver, B.C.
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It sounds like provenance is a significant issue - authentication.
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Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Topic Author's Reply - Jul 4, 2011 - 07:42pm PT
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Cept nobody here is buyin'...LOL
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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The gauge that Bird hammered off Maestri's compressor sold at auction over a decade ago for $800.
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guido
Trad climber
Santa Cruz/New Zealand/South Pacific
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I think we will have to get either Tom Robbins or Royal Frost to verify the authenticity of this offering.
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Peter Haan
Trad climber
San Francisco, CA
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Vandiver checks in, saying this was not his piton and not his mark.
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Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Topic Author's Reply - Jul 4, 2011 - 09:42pm PT
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Even Gear Freaks Get The Blues!
Another Roadside Gear Auction!
Skinny Stamp And All!
Still Life With Steel Forger!
P Is For Peninsula!
Robbins Is In!
Thanks for checking Peter.
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guido
Trad climber
Santa Cruz/New Zealand/South Pacific
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Spell Checker
Pin Wrecker
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Dick Erb
climber
June Lake, CA
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I think that is a CW stamped under the diamond P. That would probably be Chuck Wilts. I once heard him say that Salathe sold some of his pitons, but climbers thought the fifty cent price was high.
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couchmaster
climber
pdx
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full quote from the auction for longevity:
This is an authentic and very rare Salathe piton. This sale is only for the very serious collector of climbing history. This piton was hand made by Anton Salathe and has his trademark Diamond P logo clearly stamped into the piton’s chromemoly steel. This piton may well have been used on the first ascent of Sentinel Rock.
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GDavis
Social climber
SOL CAL
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10k? Sounds like someone loves blow.
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john hansen
climber
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I know that Ken Yeager has an original rack of Salathe pitons,,
perhaps he could shed some light on this pin.
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Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Topic Author's Reply - Jul 5, 2011 - 12:13pm PT
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If that pin belonged to Chuck Wilts then the valuation is starting to climb toward the icy $10,000 summit! LOL
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Doug Robinson
Trad climber
Santa Cruz
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Right up in that thin, cold air with the gauge off Maestri's compressor, eh Steve?
A bit more of a positive memento, though.
On belay?
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Peter Haan
Trad climber
San Francisco, CA
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Vandiver has pointed out that the "CV" may actually be "CW" in which case it would be Chuck Wilts.
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Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Topic Author's Reply - Jul 5, 2011 - 12:32pm PT
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The difference is that I couldn't care less about Maestri's compressor parts and couldn't care more about Salathé's handiwork.
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stevep
Boulder climber
Salt Lake, UT
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Let's assume it is a Salathe pin that at one point was owned by Wilts. What would be proof? Wouldn't it have to come with some sort of a provenance? i.e. this guy bought it from Royal, who got it from Wilts, and Royal is willing to verify in writing that this is the case.
Absent something like that, asking for this kind of a valuation is ridiculous, even assuming that someone might be interested enough to pay.
Did I mention I have a pin stamped EW that I found on the Matterhorn?
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Spider Savage
Mountain climber
SoCal
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I'd pay $100.00, no more.
Anyone else cleaning Salathe gear off their rack?
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Brian in SLC
Social climber
Salt Lake City, UT
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Hmm. Kinda looks like the real deal to me. I've seen a number of those pins. Seems like the ones I've seen under close inspection may have had the diamond done in pieces, though? Like, four stamps of a straight line individually done in the shape of a diamond? That one looks solid. Maybe a different vintage, though.
The "CW" initials might make sense if it was Wilts. Hmm. Looks like a "CW".
The shape is pretty good.
Be interesting to check its hardness. That might nail it (so to speak, ha ha) a bit more. If it were soft iron, wouldn't be "that" hard. Easy to compare its hardness with other pins that were hard iron, instead of soft.
I think not all of his pins were stamped with a "diamond P", though.
I think it'd be hard to fake patina over an old pin. Stamp would look newer.
A closer photo of the stamp might be interesting. Especially to compare with a more known pin.
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Peter Haan
Trad climber
San Francisco, CA
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Everyone's right in wanting the provenance of this item established. Fine if it was cheap but the valuation is so tremendous that honest-to-goodness provenance has to be established----and oddly the seller offers absolutely nothing. Very strange, even if it was something the seller knows nothing about, like it was inherited, found on the trail, was in a sofa etc. The seller sells climbing stuff among other things and obviously knows there is great value but offers no information. Listing lots of info on your selling listing page is free, by the way.
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Pretty funny people are talking about $10k and written authenticity for a pin. I support collectors, but that's ridiculous. Surely someone with $10k could find a more benevolent use for their cash than this.
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steelmnkey
climber
Vision man...ya gotta have vision...
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Maybe if they could track down Anton Salathe, they could just get him to say he made the pin. (yeah, sarcasm, but the bungling of the name is clear evidence to me that the seller doesn't have a clue)
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Peter Haan
Trad climber
San Francisco, CA
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Healy, no kidding they will find better uses for their cash. No one is going to buy this item as it is presently offered.
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Owning a piece of Marstri's compressor is like owning Oswald's 6.5mm Carcano.
Curiously, a guy paid six figures for the .38 Ruby used to kill Oswald and then got it confiscated for carrying concealed in Washington D.C.
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k-man
Gym climber
SCruz
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My buddy Toby was visiting from the UK not too long ago. He apparently got off route on the East Butt of Middle. Guess Salathe also got off route in about the same area.
100 bucks for the shipping? I think GDavis is right on the money.
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Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Topic Author's Reply - Jul 5, 2011 - 03:37pm PT
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Ken could certainly ID this piton whenever he comes on. No JS ptions in my collection.
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JEleazarian
Trad climber
Fresno CA
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I think we will have to get either Tom Robbins or Royal Frost to verify the authenticity of this offering.
Guido, when I was in college, one of my non-climbing roommates invented Royal Chouinard, the Famous Carabiner, as an all-inclusive climbing personality. It looks like he was only a little over 40 years ahead of his time.
John
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MTucker
Ice climber
Arizona
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Fine, I took the auction down. Had a private buyer by email.
Live on Salathe'!!
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Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Topic Author's Reply - Jul 5, 2011 - 07:08pm PT
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How did you come by this piton?
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Lambone
Ice climber
Ashland, Or
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MTucker may be the best taco troller ever...
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Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Topic Author's Reply - Jul 5, 2011 - 07:52pm PT
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You mean he's not really in Arizona like he says...
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nutstory
climber
Ajaccio, Corsica, France
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Don't worry Joseph; very fortunately, I don't collect pitons...
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philo
Trad climber
Somewhere halfway over the rainbow
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Well, as I know who has Maestri's regulator and how they came by it I'd say it's provenance is well established. $800.00 seems reasonable for such a significant piece of climbing history, particularly since the proceeds benefited the AAC. But 10 grand for an unknown and unverified (Anton) Salathe piton seems absurd.
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Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Topic Author's Reply - Jul 6, 2011 - 03:56pm PT
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Seems like it works pretty well for the folks that walk away with $700...
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karabin museum
Trad climber
phoenix, az
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I believe that it is probably a real Salathe piton.
I also believe that somebody out there with cash would pay the price.
Didn't a cornflake in the shape of Texas sell for $75,000 years ago? Did Post products or Kellogs products write the buyer an authenticity paper for it? This absurd value if sold could ruin museums if people truly valued it at that price. Ken has many Salathe items and if he has them insured at that absurd value, he then is paying a big cost for his insurance plan every year. Stephane Pennequin once told me that his collection was worth $175.00. He stated that this is all you would received if you cashed it in as scrap aluminum. What a beautiful statement!
All of my Jim Bridwell items, Yosemite bolt hangers and many Dolt items I have have authentic authenticity papers for them. Of course this is because I created the paperwork myself and chased the heros down for the their signature.
If this piton sells for $10,000, then my one of a kind Dolt stamp is probably worth 10 times that! Salathe Piton depending who is looking on Ebay that week should fetch between $300-$500. If it was signed by Bridwell or had paperwork or something it may double that. Other than that I am hungry, I am going back to my cornflake box to look for a Half Dome shaped cornflake.
Rock on!
Marty
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couchmaster
climber
pdx
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Marty! You can buy Bill Gates house now! You're rich:-)
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philo
Trad climber
Somewhere halfway over the rainbow
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The guy should take it to Pawn Stars and ask $10,000.00 for it. That's an episode I would want to catch.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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^^^^^^ HaHaHaHa! I'd love to see Chumlee's (or all of theirs) look of bewilderment.
"10,000 dollars? Yeah, not gonna happen. Bye!"
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philo
Trad climber
Somewhere halfway over the rainbow
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Security!
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Studly
Trad climber
WA
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Dingus, you are way wrong dude. Paying $200- for a old gas station sign is cheap. and its fun. Don't knock it, just because you don't do it. Lots of old gas station signs sell in the thousands. and they are beautiful works of art, back when signs were made of porcelain enamel, and they were built to last. I love the old Mobil Winged pegasus signs, so cool.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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An old Mobil sign is arguably as valuable as a chunk of gold.
Now, rare earth metals or real estate is really where it is at.
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karabin museum
Trad climber
phoenix, az
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Jay Leno has an amazing collection of old signs, cars, and steam engines. I love it! I plan on visiting him someday. Those old signs can fetch a big buck for sure. Check out the prices of some of the old cone top beer cans on Ebay, wow!!!
Marty
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philo
Trad climber
Somewhere halfway over the rainbow
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A $10,000 (Anton) Salathe Piton.
Perfect for hanging Chumlee's lunch bag from.
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survival
Big Wall climber
A Token of My Extreme
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Some rich fuk paid close to a million for one of Garcia's Doug Irwin guitars. Sits in a glass case and never gets played. What a crime...
The coolest would be to get that pin for a reasonable price and use it on a new route, take pix, and tell us about it!! Use it on many routes, and photo-document them all!!!
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Q- Ball
Mountain climber
where the wind always blows
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Why do folks knock on others for spending their money on whatever they care too? It is their money right?
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philo
Trad climber
Somewhere halfway over the rainbow
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Q-Ball, ever see a person die of starvation literally at your feet? I have. Sometimes life's priorities proceed life's indulgences.
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philo
Trad climber
Somewhere halfway over the rainbow
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Whoa there Bob. I was living in an Arab country at the time and what happens is inshalla. You are NOT allowed to help even to give emergency first aid. Not until the proper authorities arrive. My first experience with this restriction was actually being collared and nearly wrestled to the ground as I was rushing in to administer emergency first aid to a women who had been run over by a bus while riding a MoPed. It was surreal her hips were crushed & squished into the pavement almost flat. Her legs were still kicking and her arms were still thrashing but she was doomed as no one was allowed to assist her. Most everyone on the street just stood there helplessly watching her scream in agony. Unable to help I had to run away. So why does that make me a "self important twit"?
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couchmaster
climber
pdx
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Bob = Matt = AC Crowley. Seems to pee on every thread he posts too. I'm happier to see this stuff valued so highly, it makes it less likely that it will get tossed into the trash by the wife when dude has a sudden heart attack and dies. This Salathe pin isn't worth 10,000 bucks, but it's worth something of significance no doubt.
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couchmaster
climber
pdx
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Jul 10, 2011 - 10:45am PT
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Looks like the details are getting better. Full text from Poster mook424 ( Feedback Score Of 100% Positive feedback, item location: Yosemite, CA, United States:
This is an authentic and very rare Salathé piton, the holy grail of climbing hardware collectibles. This sale is only for the very serious collector of climbing history. This piton was hand made by John Salathé and has his trademark Diamond P logo clearly stamped into the piton’s steel. This piton may well have been used on the first ascent of Sentinel Rock.
"(John) Salathé saw the need for tougher pitons- thin, reusable ones that could be forced farther into bottomed cracks and pounded into contorted cracks without buckling. He wanted a piton that would dominate the granite, not the other way around…Salathé simply used bars of 40/60 carbon and vanadium alloy steel, which he could have obtained easily and cheaply…The resulting hand-forged and heat-treated pitons, beautifully fashioned into the standard horizontal shape, were far tougher than the European pitons of the day. Most of these handsome objects bore an imprint, a tiny “P” inside a diamond, the logo of his Peninsula Wrought Iron Works."- Steve Roper Camp 4
The CW stamped under the diamond P is quite likely the initials of Chuck Wilts who may have been a onetime owner of this particular piton. Salathé sold some of his pitons, but climbers thought the fifty cent price was too high
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MTucker
Ice climber
Arizona
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Jul 11, 2011 - 11:14pm PT
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Come and get it!!
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SGropp
Mountain climber
Eastsound, Wa
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Jul 12, 2011 - 12:01pm PT
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If that pin goes for ten grand, authentic or not, expect to see some counterfeits entering the market.
A couple of bucks worth of alloy steel, maybe a $100 for a custom stamp, a day or less at the forge working out the right sequence for the hot work and a few dollars for the chemicals to give it that aged patina and there you are, a perfect ''artifake''.
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philo
Trad climber
Somewhere halfway over the rainbow
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Jul 17, 2011 - 06:29pm PT
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Probably not Locker. But they could probably work up a Bea Arthur for you.
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Carmel Climber
Mountain climber
Carmel California
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Dec 12, 2012 - 04:34pm PT
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Just checked E-Bay. Anton Salathe? $12,000? No picture? $100 shipping? This guy's got to be kidding?
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sharperblue
Mountain climber
oakland, california
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Dec 12, 2012 - 05:13pm PT
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my brother is quite an accomplished blacksmith; he uses modern car axles all the time as his starter material (as well as bridge bolts...hopefully not salvaged 'on site'); absolutely loves the alloy in them
seriously though; 12k is just as ridiculous as 1k or 100 bucks; it's just a piece of junk metal. anyone who would drop that kind of cash for a pin is suffering from a serious lack of imagination
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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Dec 12, 2012 - 05:55pm PT
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My best offer is a buck fifty. Never have understood the draw of climbing collectables.
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