Bolting on stance - ground up - leading

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Messages 181 - 197 of total 197 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
StahlBro

Trad climber
San Diego, CA
Apr 3, 2013 - 11:29pm PT
Credit: Todd Gordon
ghostfromthepast

Social climber
oakhurst ca
Apr 24, 2013 - 02:07pm PT
your post explains why I consider the dispute over whether I freed Hall of Mirrors utterly absurd. Thanks,Chris Cantwell
larryhorton

Trad climber
NM
Apr 24, 2013 - 08:23pm PT
This post and all the talk of hooks reminds me of the time Pratt told me about a bat hook route he had done on the Mount Davidson cross. This is just a ho hum concrete cross on a hilltop in San Francisco — nothing but 90˚ angles, smooth surface, probably 100 feet high.

The idea of climbing it had immense appeal to a young freak in the late sixties, so I set about creating a couple of bat hooks for the job. As I recall, I started with a Chouinard product — I forget what it was called. A cliffhanger? Something like that…

My metallurgical skills were even more meager than my good sense. I hammered and ground until I had a right angle piece that would fit in a small bolt hole. Looked good to me. And I talked Jeff, a climbing friend of mine, into joining me for the excursion.

My memory of the ‘route’ is that it had four empty bolt holes between bolts. And standing in the top loop of my homespun slings was required to reach each hole. I was always impressed at the notion of drilling a hole from such a stance. But most disconcerting was realizing, at forty feet off the deck, that my bat hooks were bending as I ascended. I had not successfully tempered the steel.

My memory isn’t entirely clear if we finished then or not (more than forty years ago). We definitely got to the top of the arm. I seem to have some recollection of trying it in the dark, also. I do recall that the local constabulary arrived and demanded that we come down, but no arrests or tickets were issued, and that was in broad daylight.

That was my last excursion with hooks. Pratt listened to the story in typical, understated amusement.

All respect to those who place bolts from questionable stances!
Tfish

Trad climber
La Crescenta, CA
Jun 16, 2013 - 10:13pm PT
I just bolted a fun 10a ground up and put all 5 bolts in from stances. So rewarding.
Bolting on lead
Bolting on lead
Credit: Tfish
Tfish

Trad climber
La Crescenta, CA
Jun 21, 2013 - 02:53pm PT
2 more routes!

Bolting from a pumpy undercling
Bolting from a pumpy undercling
Credit: Tfish

I forgot my blow tube
I forgot my blow tube
Credit: Tfish
Ksolem

Trad climber
Monrovia, California
Jun 21, 2013 - 04:35pm PT
the most common mess that the GU climber creates is the dead end into a bolt ladder to nowhere..

Got some examples?

When I arrived in Ca in the early 1980's the SoCal areas like Josh, Idyllwild, The Needles, etc., were meccas of ground up climbing, and bolting from stances on lead. I cannot think of one such "mess" as you describe in any of these areas. There are a couple of bolt ladders in Josh but they were not the result of an attempted free climb.

Bolting on lead does require skill and balls, but you are still drilling holes and pounding in metal. The impact on the rock is the same.

Bolting on lead means less impact both in terms of the typical # of bolts on a route and the # of routes which get done.
mucci

Trad climber
The pitch of Bagalaar above you
Jun 21, 2013 - 05:00pm PT
the most common mess that the GU climber creates is the dead end into a bolt ladder to nowhere..

Never happened to me, or anybody I climb with that goes strictly ground up.

I see this as when a climber attempts to bolt beyond his/her capabilities (physical ability, technical ability, and bolting ability). OR did not do a good job scoping the line, and being able to decipher the stone before the first bolt is sunk.

Stay within your limits, master the art of GU.


Mungeclimber

Trad climber
Nothing creative to say
Jun 21, 2013 - 07:07pm PT
Tfish! Looks steep and sik!

Nice job
sac

Trad climber
Sun Coast B.C.
Jun 21, 2013 - 08:04pm PT
g/u adventure @ Khartoum <br/>
g/u adventure @ Khartoum

Credit: sac
Salamanizer

Trad climber
The land of Fruits & Nuts!
Jun 21, 2013 - 08:46pm PT
the most common mess that the GU climber creates is the dead end into a bolt ladder to nowhere..


Got some examples?



I've been stopped dead in my tracks a couple of times on routes I was working on. Hit a tough spot and didn't have the balls or ability to climb through. I left them as open projects and would work on them when I got an inspiration. Eventually I was able to complete every single one. The most recent of which was a project sitting idle for 5 years which had a runnout on difficult terrain I was always unwilling to commit to. Over the years I realized I've developed an ability to drill from increasingly poor stances and found I could actually make use of a particularly bad one. Though it took about 4 hours spread between two days and several dozen falls, I was able to place a bolt where needed to commit to the moves above.

Point is, it may be a blank dead end for now, but eventually you or someone will come along and finish even the most bleak of routes.
Brian in SLC

Social climber
Salt Lake City, UT
Jun 22, 2013 - 11:03am PT
Two pitchs, GU, drilled on lead...fun!

Somewhere in western Utah...photo by EH.
Somewhere in western Utah...photo by EH.
Credit: Brian in SLC
Tfish

Trad climber
La Crescenta, CA
Aug 26, 2013 - 12:56pm PT
When the crack ends the drill begins.

Ground up FA up Angeles Crest
Ground up FA up Angeles Crest
Credit: Tfish
Ed Hartouni

Trad climber
Livermore, CA
Topic Author's Reply - Aug 26, 2013 - 01:11pm PT
http://www.supertopo.com/climbing/thread.php?topic_id=149476&msg=2106130#msg2106130
the most common mess that the GU climber creates is the dead end into a bolt ladder to nowhere

in my experience, the consequences of "uncertainty" is to avoid putting bolts in and just running out the pitch into "X" territory, if the route is worth reporting, you've left a "death route."

the FA is open to all sorts of criticism, failed attempts, trashing up the cliff with dead end lines aka "projects," too much runout, too many bolts... on and on.

the alternatives aren't too good either, such as not reporting routes... which might be best if you can take the criticism when you report that that new n-teenth bolt sport climb saw a previous ascent with no bolts... once you get through the incredulity that it had been done, you get criticized for being reckless...

fact is that few climbers put up FAs and the vast majority that don't fancy themselves credible judges of what constitutes a good climb...



Salamanizer

Trad climber
The land of Fruits & Nuts!
Aug 26, 2013 - 08:39pm PT
^^^^^^^^^

Uhhhhhhh.....
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.
.
.
.
WHAT!!!???
afcb

Social climber
UK , UT
Aug 26, 2013 - 09:33pm PT
New routing with the kitchen sink.
New routing with the kitchen sink.
Credit: afcb
thebird

Big Wall climber
palm desert, ca.
Aug 26, 2013 - 11:35pm PT
I believe it depends upon certain variable such as steepness; a human cannot stand in balance at more than 82 degree angle, what percentage of the route requires bolts, the skill level the leader and the type of route desired. In the final analysis, does the end justify the means?
Personally I would rather do a route where bolts are in the correct location as apposed to how the bolts are placed. After all subsequent assents don't give a damn how the bolts were placed. There is a fine line between boldness and stupidity as there is between prudence and cowardice.
When sport climbing is the aim, rappel bolting is the game. The other variables being whether power drills are permitted and the quality of the rock.
S.Leeper

Social climber
somewhere that doesnt have anything over 90'
Sep 6, 2013 - 08:28pm PT
bump...the bird has spoken.
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