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Feb 10, 2011 - 12:21am PT
Keep the magic alive, Crag!



Mountain climber
Feb 10, 2011 - 12:23am PT
That took serious compassion and honesty, cheers bro, that puts you in a high echelon of our society. I sincerely hope you two can mend that friendship.


Ice climber
Happy Boulders
Feb 10, 2011 - 12:30am PT
thanks for that Dean. You put it very eloquently.
It takes guts to go on a public forum and express remorse.

Social climber
Wolf City, Wyoming
Feb 10, 2011 - 12:32am PT
That was a very brave way to open up. We all have things we need to deal with directly, and maybe that will help us do so. Thank you and good luck.

Sport climber
mammoth lakes ca
Feb 10, 2011 - 12:35am PT
Cragman...Sh#t happens...We all go off on wild tangents and do stupid things in the name of pride which we may regret later....It seems the downfall comes shortly thereafter...? If you need some good ideas for some pranks watch Grumpy Old Men....rj

Social climber
Feb 10, 2011 - 12:48am PT
hey there say, dean... you know...this is what is known as loveing others, from god's standpoint--when our 'self' does not get in the way at all...

say, you are stepping up to, and onto, solid ground here...
edit: say, remember that part of a famous song:
lord lift me up and help me stand, by faith, on heaven's stable land...
a higher plane, that i have found, lord plant my feet on higher ground... :)

and you know what, this honest open share, of yours, will bless and humble many hearts... we are here to be friends in life, and sometimes being friends, means to die to ourselves, and live in such a way that others blossom... the blossoming only means that there is that much more sweetness, in our life, and we in turn, get rid of our 'stinky old petals' and we TOO then, are free to blossom and the 'ball rolls on'...

god bless to you, dean/cragman...

may you and doug now have many wonderful years being neighbors, as his body heals, and your 'share' here, heals, within you...

wow, supertopo sure is a place of very speical climbers... all taking many different climbs, but all knowing that the view is something mighty powerful and beyond us--though each new climb, makes sure to let us know, that, "the view is really there to cherish"...

god bless to you this eve...
say, this night, to your family, as they are the ones that see you daily, as you grow--you are NEW man...


A long way from where I started
Feb 10, 2011 - 12:52am PT
There are a lot of mysteries in this life, but one thing I know for sure is that you don't get to redo the past. So keep your focus on the future, and keep helping your friend. That's what counts.

Social climber
Feb 10, 2011 - 12:55am PT
hey there say, ghost... wow, i was just adding an edit and i saw your post...

wow, that is for sure... what a sweet note...
well, god bless all... it is nite-nite for me, here, earlier than usual...
em kn0t

Trad climber
isle of wyde
Feb 10, 2011 - 12:56am PT
"a heart is like a parachute, it only works when it's open"

touched by your words, and your open heart


Mountain climber
Okinawa, Japan
Feb 10, 2011 - 01:01am PT
Regret is a useless emotion and every day presents new opportunity.
Thank you for sharing. I love your statement that transparency is part of the road to integrity.
Sometimes integrity demands that we part with old friends as well.
I'm glad that in your case, you were able to reunite.

Feb 10, 2011 - 01:09am PT

You should draw strength from your humility and transparency, should all of us be so gracious with friends we have fallen out with.

Social climber
Portland, Oregon
Feb 10, 2011 - 03:22am PT
One of the most heartfelt things I've ever read. Thanks.

Cheers Cragman,


Big Wall climber
A Token of My Extreme
Feb 10, 2011 - 05:00am PT
Nice Dean.
I've had a couple falling outs that were recovered from and a couple that probably never will.

Good on you for making the effort to make this one go away....
Dingus Milktoast

Gym climber
Who'll stop the reign?
Feb 10, 2011 - 09:18am PT
Facing the fall line, one turn at a time.....

Lynne Leichtfuss

Trad climber
Will know soon
Feb 10, 2011 - 09:56am PT
Peace from lynnie.....may we work together.

Feb 10, 2011 - 02:19pm PT
Good on ya for taking the high road, Crag.
Ricardo Cabeza

All Over.
Feb 10, 2011 - 02:22pm PT
Thanks man, very humble of you. It brings to mind a couple of very important fences that I need to mend.

Big Wall climber
So Cal
Feb 10, 2011 - 07:55pm PT
A very touching read. I too have had differences with others & over time, I have rekindled those friendships with those whom I had really connected with in the first place.

Life is way too short to hold grudges.

Thanks for sharing some humility with us.

Big Wall climber
Feb 10, 2011 - 08:42pm PT
thanks cragman, you just talked me into getting ahold of one of my old buddies that i kinda butt heads with (alpha dog thing)
thanks bro
High Fructose Corn Spirit

Gym climber
Full Silos of Iowa
Feb 10, 2011 - 09:16pm PT

That was the BEST thing I read all day. Thanks for posting up. (TFPU) If ever I were to break a leg on Third Pillar, say after an unexpected lightning strike, just sayin, :) and then partially eaten by tuolumne vermin, I'd want you - a man of passion and integrity - to be among my rescuers.

Good luck with everything.

Take care.

Social climber
State of decay
Feb 10, 2011 - 09:28pm PT
That took a lot of sand to publicly express yourself open and honestly like that Dean. At first it seems like a risk to be that open, but in the final analysis it really comes from a place of strength and love.
Although we have only briefly met, I'm proud to call you a friend!
Wade Icey

Trad climber
Feb 10, 2011 - 09:49pm PT
Well said Dean.
Jim Brennan

Trad climber
Vancouver Canada
Feb 10, 2011 - 11:48pm PT

It's a good thing you can offer real friendship.

Things that are prickly shouldn't change obligation to someone you love regardless of all that water under the bridge.

Catastrophic change waits for every one and that is when the real test of your friends occurs. Take it easy, the facts are deep and rising to the challenges takes heart, courage and firm politeness.


Trad climber
Yacolt, WA
Feb 11, 2011 - 12:17am PT
You made me think. I've been mourning a friend who seems to have abandoned the friendship, and wondering if I could open the door to that friend when the doorbell rings again someday. Yesterday is never as important as right now. Thanks.

Trad climber
from the place of breath
Feb 11, 2011 - 02:32am PT
Peace to you Dean... Thank you for sharing your journey... I think it goes beyond helping you and Doug (huge in itself) but also seems to be inspiring others as well.

To paraphrase eKat: the magic is alive and well!

Charlie D.

Trad climber
Western Slope, Tahoe Sierra
Feb 11, 2011 - 09:24am PT
There's a whole lot of stuff or baggage we collect on this journey, your core is what really count's. You're a good man Gragman and I hope to meet you along the trail some day. In the meantime continue to Live Well, Love Much and Let Go!

Charlie D.

Trad climber
washington indiana
Feb 11, 2011 - 11:08am PT
Great post Cragman. I had a similiar falling out with the guy that taught me to climb and with whom I had many wonderful adventures. It was a difficult situation at times and I did not really understand it. We worked in the same building but not the same area and when I would run into him it was awkward. I took it hard because basically he was somone I considered like a Brother at times and finally I realized it was his personality and way of handling life. I moved on past it and we were just casual friends from there on out. During those years I suffered major heart isues and he remained very healthy and in a way I was jealous of that. Three years ago Thanksgiving week I arrived at work to hear that Mike had been killed in a wreck on his way to work. It shook me to my core.
Going to the funeral home with my son Joshua who knew Mike also I was nervous about how it would go because I had not spoken to Mikes wife Nancy
in a few years. By the casket was a collage of drawings I had an artist make from photos I had taken over the years of Mike on variuos climbs from Whitney to Seneca to the Red River Gorge. I had given him this as a Christmas present a number of years ago. When I hugged Nancy I cried for five minutes and could not let go. Last year Mikes Daughter Amber got married and I sat there thinking how sad it was that Mike was not there because he loved Amber very much. My gift to her was a photo album of fifty some pictures of Mike on climbing trips. I wrote a little something by each photo. A couple of months later I received a wedding photo from Amber and on the back she wrote that it was the most meaningful gift she had received and she would treasure it. I felt that the circle had been closed and that somehoe Mike was smiling at us.

Trad climber
Santa Monica, California
Feb 11, 2011 - 11:24am PT
Very moving and touched me in a special place, I'm sure a lot of us have regrets for lost friendships that seemed like they would never end.

What is lost again is found, but not without humility, work and a realization of what are truly the most important things in life, our relationships with each other.

Reading this this morning was a great way to start my day!

Thanks Crag

Trad climber
Feb 11, 2011 - 12:23pm PT
Dean, you've made the world a better place today. Thank you.

Trad climber
Douglas, WY
Feb 11, 2011 - 01:56pm PT

I just picked up on this thread, and you have moved me beyond belief. it's a true honor for us here on S-T to have a friend such as you in our midst.

scuffy b

Three feet higher
Feb 11, 2011 - 02:21pm PT
Thanks, Cragman and Stilltrying.
A couple very moving posts.

We're so afraid of being vulnerable, in any number of ways.
Vulnerability often leads to strength; it allows people to help you.

Remember old friends we've made along the way
The gifts they've given stay with us every day.

Mary McCaslin

Feb 11, 2011 - 04:25pm PT
This, my friends, is why THE TACO FRIKKEN ROOLS!




Trad climber
The Illuminati -- S.P.E.C.T.R.E. Division
Feb 11, 2011 - 07:31pm PT
Cragman, I know I've tried to yank your chain on some of the other threads, but thank you -- God bless you!

Feb 11, 2011 - 10:22pm PT
WOW. . . that's beautiful!

TFPU, Crag!


Pastor Dave

Social climber
Yucca Valley, CA
Mar 14, 2011 - 11:54am PT
Hi, went back over my thread this morning and saw your link. Thanks so much for sharing your spiritual journey through a difficult situation. I have been impressed once agin with the fragility of life as we watch the pictures from the devistation in Japan. I am having some difficulty in focusing while I waite to hear the latest news from Paul. Your story was just the inspiration I needed this morning.

Boulder climber
Lakewood, CO
Mar 26, 2011 - 01:11pm PT
Found this link from Pastor Dave's thread. Thanks for taking the time to explain most of it. Doug emailed me about this falling out, and I could sense a fair amount of angst about it on his end.

We each have qualities that need to be rounded off. Not you, but Doug. I've never met someone as stubborn as Doug. As a Guide, these are great qualities that can be counted on as Doug was stubbornly mister Safety First to the extreme.

But as a friend, trying to connect to the person beneath that thick stubborn as hell interior poseur? It didn't take me but a second to side with you Dean. I assumed that as long as you still had your pacifier you'd be okay! ;-)

I really didn't like Doug's stubbornness because now I had to compete with him in that area too. Be guide like him? No. Be a stronger climber that Mr. Fat Ankles? No. Be stubborner than Doug? Yeah, I'm gonna try and then quickly realized that I wasn't going to win that one either.

But hanging out with Doug has a lot of great positive impacts, just as it does with anyone you share time with, especially in a leading edge of life on the rock. As always, gotta take the lousy with the good.

I've changed since my time with you and Doug. I wouldn't trade it for anything though and I'm very excited to see the thaw between you and Doug happen and even now that I've come full circle with a deeper, richer understanding of faith that I'm sure Doug will disagree with.

The rest I will leave for mano a mano in JT!

Let me add a short note: Marty Snyder visited me a few days after Doug's stroke and we talked 3 minutes out of 3 hours talking about Doug. I said "Doug will make it." Marty nodded in agreement.

I didn't get to say "Doug will make it because he's too freakin stubborn." A stroke like this and for being out as long as Doug was results in a body on the floor, not a guy airlifted to Reno.

As for the rest of it, there would be no more Doug if not for Tobin and Amy.


Trad climber
Santa Clara, CA
Mar 26, 2011 - 02:58pm PT
I ain't going top make it that weekend. But you guys are gonna have a blast!!! This is gonna be pretty epic.
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