Politics, God and Religion vs. Science

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Messages 17701 - 17720 of total 22349 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
AndyMan

Sport climber
CA
Dec 7, 2013 - 09:39pm PT
Dr F. - Global Climate Change is a perfect example
why do they fight the science

Exactly what science are you talking about? Science is based on EVIDENCE. In your own words, what is the EVIDENCE that man's CO2 has caused any of the warming since the Little Ice Age ... the warming that stopped 2 decades ago.

Without evidence there is no science, only belief and religion.

Which is natural and which is man caused?  &#40;IPCC's Hadcrut3 data&#41;
Which is natural and which is man caused? (IPCC's Hadcrut3 data)
Credit: AndyMan
MH2

climber
Dec 7, 2013 - 10:10pm PT
It surfaces in what we DO.


Today I killed a giant and rescued a fair maiden.


Or did I slay a fair maiden and rescue an ogre?


Good for me either way.


Anyway, on tomorrow's to DO list:

1. Eat breakfast
2. Walk the dogs
3. Apply for residence at the Home for Broken-down Heroes
Byran

climber
Yosemite
Dec 7, 2013 - 10:27pm PT
Which is 1895-1946 (Nature); Which is 1957-2008 (Us?)

Well since both those periods are well after the launch of the Industrial Revolution I'd say that's an easy one! Lol
jgill

Boulder climber
Colorado
Dec 7, 2013 - 10:45pm PT
. . . but move it to the experiential realm and viola, students and teachers are no longer engaged in an empirical discipline, but in wuwu and mind-melding and fairy dust - (JL)

OK, that broke me up. Good one!


;>)
TGT

Social climber
So Cal
Dec 8, 2013 - 11:57am PT
It took artists a long time to find perspective. Literally.

Not really.

The steps and columns of the Parthenon are subtlety curved and tapered to produce an illusion of near perfect rectilinearity from selected vantage points.

They understood it, just applied it differently. In both meanings
Dr. F.

Trad climber
SoCal
Topic Author's Reply - Dec 8, 2013 - 12:00pm PT
Credit: Dr. F.
BASE104

Social climber
An Oil Field
Dec 8, 2013 - 01:26pm PT
Why do some people believe anything that they are told?

How do you know that you know?
MikeL

climber
SANTA CLARA, CA
Dec 8, 2013 - 02:42pm PT
Statistics.

Watching the Lions vs Eagles snow bowl right now, I see a 30-second spot about a how smoking could keep a guy from enjoying his children when they grow up. Then they show the following words against a black background:

"Tobacco will still kill 1out of 5 Americans this year."

I laugh.

Death will kill 1 out of 5 Americans this year.
MikeL

climber
SANTA CLARA, CA
Dec 8, 2013 - 02:55pm PT
Perspective.

It's probably not until the Italians put their energies to the task that artistic perspective gets systematized successfully. Michelangelo.
Ward Trotter

Trad climber
Dec 8, 2013 - 03:42pm PT

dear lord!
how the f*#k them greeks get anything write?!?!?

There goes the neighborhood.
Malemute

Ice climber
the ghost
Dec 8, 2013 - 04:09pm PT
Credit: Malemute
Remember these Base104?
I bet you haven't seen this particular mode of display recently.
paul roehl

Boulder climber
california
Dec 8, 2013 - 04:46pm PT
Actually, both the Greeks and then the Romans had some understanding of linear perspective but it isn't until the Italian Renaissance and Massacio that the first true one point perspective image was created... somewhat ironically, an image of the Trinity done as a trompe l' oeil fresco.

The Florentines were fascinated by the idea and the Bishop of Florence even wrote a treatise on the mystical nature of perspective as a contemplation of the infinite and salvation itself.
Ward Trotter

Trad climber
Dec 8, 2013 - 04:55pm PT
The camera obscura was somewhat central in the development of perspective in art, science ,and engineering, going back as far as perhaps the Chinese in 400 BCE.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Camera_obscura
FortMentšl

Social climber
Albuquerque, NM
Dec 8, 2013 - 05:00pm PT
It took artists a long time to find perspective. Literally.

Not really.

The steps and columns of the Parthenon are subtlety curved and tapered to produce an illusion of near perfect rectilinearity from selected vantage points.

They understood it, just applied it differently. In both meanings

To go back even further, you'll see evidence of foreshortening compensation in the cave paintings of Chauvet. Michaelangelo was a master at this, though preceded by some 30,000 years.
BASE104

Social climber
An Oil Field
Dec 8, 2013 - 05:14pm PT
No, malemute, we still look at wavelets. You can do a ton of cool stuff with 3D seismic and modern computing power.

I still look at 2D data when nothing else is available.
Ward Trotter

Trad climber
Dec 8, 2013 - 05:17pm PT
evidence of foreshortening compensation in the cave paintings

Observationally, for that matter, Primates have been aware of foreshortening for millions of years. Most tree-dwelling species are required to possess tremendously well-developed stereoscopic depth perception in measuring and discriminating distance and relative position---either that or end up on the forest floor 100 ft. below.
This evolutionary facility was probably augmented even to a greater extent when hominids emerged onto the open non-forested areas , started to hunt far distant and fast moving game--- and thus began to colonize the globe.

Lemur
Lemur


Edit: Sooooo , to put it mildly ,our line evolved from a bunch of arboreal free soloists, specializing in an incredible repertoire of highly dynamic moves. An acute sense of perspective was central to this story..
Malemute

Ice climber
the ghost
Dec 8, 2013 - 05:17pm PT
but did you recognize it as a film lookalike?
WBraun

climber
Dec 8, 2013 - 07:08pm PT
Socrates was genius and brilliant not like modern today's wannabees ......
Largo

Sport climber
The Big Wide Open Face
Dec 8, 2013 - 07:19pm PT
No, malemute, we still look at wavelets. You can do a ton of cool stuff with 3D seismic and modern computing power.
-
My youngest daughter is doing petroengineering (almost through undergrad school) and the computer arrays of seismic are like some kind of cosmic art. Couldn't tell you what it means, though.

JL
paul roehl

Boulder climber
california
Dec 9, 2013 - 01:36am PT
This thing about perspective is interesting to me.

How is it that eastern approaches to perspective, whether in Iran, India, China or Japan were historically based on conceptual notions of space, using isometric or herringbone approaches to spatial representation, representations of a narrative sort as opposed to veristic depictions, where as in the west, that is Europe, perspectives were/became exact representations of visual perception based on the precise geometry of orthogonal lines and vanishing points ultimately based on a methodical and mathematical representation of how we see and a desire for visual accuracy in the illusion?

In the west the perfected illusion of space in art became the great goal and gift of the Renaissance.

Artistic representations of space in the west have traditionally, that is prior to the twentieth century and with the birth of the Renaissance, been based on an accuracy of representation based on sensual experience, the experience of vision, including both linear and aerial perspectives .

In the east those representations are subordinated to the mindís desire for an authoritative influence with regard to ideas and culture.

That is: in the east a naturalistic depiction of space was historically always subordinated to the narrative quality of the image.

Why the dichotomy between east and west? Does the depiction of an imitated reality interfere with the mythological narrative of eastern culture?

East is east and west is west and I wonder to what degree a similar dichotomy exists generally in mythological and cultural thought as well. Iím thinking of the very linear nature of religious thought in the west and the very circular notions in the east.
In eastern thought there seems to be almost a celebration of the ambiguous and imprecise where as in the west the celebration is of absolutes.

You could say exactly the same with regard to spatial representation.
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