Politics, God and Religion vs. Science

Search
Go

Discussion Topic

Return to Forum List
Post a Reply
Messages 10201 - 10220 of total 22772 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
Jingy

climber
Somewhere out there
Oct 21, 2012 - 02:52pm PT
Christianity is not in the business of providing empirical evidence. I'll leave it to your imagination what they do rely on.

 which is the only reason I have for making the claim that christians (or insert any religion here) have imaginary friends… (for more detail please see Werner)


DT Edit:
Only that the soul does not appear to have anything to do with explaining boiling water or radioactivity , for instance.


 Who has said the should boils water or is what gets radioactivity contamination? Or are you making things up like Werner does too?


Bwaahahah
go-B

climber
Hebrews 1:3
Oct 21, 2012 - 02:55pm PT
photo not found
Missing photo ID#269376
Donald Thompson

Trad climber
Los Angeles,CA
Oct 21, 2012 - 02:59pm PT
which is the only reason I have for making the claim that christians (or insert any religion here) have imaginary friends… (for more detail please see Werner)

Fine. You are free to criticize religions or Werner's friends (imaginary or not) but do not claim that Science made you do it.

Now I do know that Werner can't save your soul but he could have a hand in saving your body one day....your mechanistic, material, corporeal body.LOL

Who has said the should boils water or is what gets radioactivity contamination? Or are you making things up like Werner does too?

Ooooooookay Mr. Jingy.
WBraun

climber
Oct 21, 2012 - 03:03pm PT
That's exactly what I've said for years.

We SAR have never saved anyone.

We're just tow truck drivers picking up bodies and bringing them in to the repair shops.

When the bodies are too damaged the owners leave and thus we have what's termed "death" ........
Donald Thompson

Trad climber
Los Angeles,CA
Oct 21, 2012 - 03:11pm PT
Here is a close-up of the aforementioned SAR saved body just moments after leaving the repair shop


Credit: Donald Thompson
BASE104

Social climber
An Oil Field
Oct 21, 2012 - 03:13pm PT
Face it. This is not a fair fight. Despite trying to maintain a facade that this is an intellectual debate, it is not.

I'm still sitting on my hands waiting for someone to describe what a soul is. This is a touchy subject, the kind that I wouldn't even debate publicly because it might cost me some work down the road. I'm not kidding about that, either.

There are so many religious prejudices at play here that even asking for a simple example of the soul is very touchy ground.

For all practical purposes in this day of rather profound theism:

THE EXISTENCE OF THE SOUL IS IMMUNE FROM SCRUTINY

OK. I said it. If you tread too close to the edge of cherished spiritual beliefs, you are going to get slammed. I turn my head and cringe every time Largo throws out a made up weasel word such as "scientism." What the f*#k is "scientism"?

It is like getting pissed off that a compass points north.

"Hey! I looked around, and it looks like this planet is a whole lot older than we thought!"

"No Shit? I've been looking through my telescope for several hundred years and the whole Universe looks even older than the Earth!"

Crowd: "Burn him!!!!"

It really is like that. Theists think that either some of this very basic observational science is wrong, although they have no way to refute it, or they think that there is some global cabal of, cringe, SCIENTISMIVISTS
Donald Thompson

Trad climber
Los Angeles,CA
Oct 21, 2012 - 03:17pm PT


Face it. This is not a fair fight. Despite trying to maintain a facade that this is an intellectual debate, it is not.

Sounds like the peanut gallery seats are getting a little uncomfortable.
WBraun

climber
Oct 21, 2012 - 03:18pm PT
Study yourself and not outside of yourself for understanding your real self .......
Dr. F.

Ice climber
SoCal
Topic Author's Reply - Oct 21, 2012 - 03:42pm PT
Like I said, there are scientific theories (models) that complete the big picture

1) Where did the universe come from? check
2) How did the first life form on earth come into being?, check
3) Where does consciousness come from? check

These are models that can be tested and shown to hold up to the data.
THEY do not explain every detail, and may never be able to, but these theories exist, and are the only models on the table.

You have no theories that can be tested and shown to fit all the data.

here are the answers
1) Big Bang
2) chemicals on earth mixed together in the right environment, and a life form was created that was able to multiply, and evolve.
3) The material brain produces consciousness, pull the plug, and consciousness seizes. Look at more primitive life forms, they have consciousness too, it is a product of evolution

I can get into the details if you want,
What other questions haven't been answered to complete the Big Picture.
WBraun

climber
Oct 21, 2012 - 03:42pm PT
There is no scientific experiment to prove that scientific knowledge is the only true knowledge.
MH2

climber
Oct 21, 2012 - 03:49pm PT
Thanks for that, Werner.
Dr. F.

Ice climber
SoCal
Topic Author's Reply - Oct 21, 2012 - 03:53pm PT
These religious folks can't even describe what the soul is, that's why science can't find it.
And never will.

The problem being "the soul lives on after death"
Show what lives on, and we will investigate it find out what it is.

But since nothing lives on past death, we would say all your soul is "is you", and you just think it is something more that you can't explain.
MH2

climber
Oct 21, 2012 - 03:55pm PT
I'm still sitting on my hands waiting for someone to describe what a soul is.


Okay.

You would first probably need to accept the possibility that a soul, "ain't a something out there."


And I would hope that you aren't awaiting a scientific description of beauty before you accept that it exists.


So, substituting for the moment beauty for soul:







from Feiffer's People: Sketches and Observations, Jules Feiffer
Dr. F.

Ice climber
SoCal
Topic Author's Reply - Oct 21, 2012 - 03:55pm PT
I'm still waiting to for Werner to tell us what the true knowledge is.
All he ever tells us is that we are wrong

What are we missing?
specifically,
Give us some good nuggets of true knowledge
WBraun

climber
Oct 21, 2012 - 03:57pm PT
What are we missing?

Your soul .....
Dr. F.

Ice climber
SoCal
Topic Author's Reply - Oct 21, 2012 - 03:57pm PT
What does beauty and the soul have to do with each other
Can't everyone appreciate beauty?

What happens to the soul after you die?

Werner
No one here is any different from each other as far as a soul goes
SO that is just a ad hominem attack
lame
Jingy

climber
Somewhere out there
Oct 21, 2012 - 03:58pm PT
The material brain produces consciousness, pull the plug, and consciousness seizes.

 Similarly, have we heard much from coma patience telling us "yes I was awake the entire time I seemed to be in that deep sleep state?


MH2

climber
Oct 21, 2012 - 04:01pm PT
What does beauty and the soul have to do with each other


The soul is a beautiful idea.
Dr. F.

Ice climber
SoCal
Topic Author's Reply - Oct 21, 2012 - 04:15pm PT
Credit: Dr. F.
Largo
I think your neurologist friend would agree that the material brain produces consciousness, but she just has no idea how it works.
The details have not been filled in, the theory explains the answer to the question in broader terms.

What is your theory?
I already know the answer, you don't have a theory, you just Don't like the material explanation.

I would rather you offered an opinion on what you think the answer is, we already know what you don't like.
BLUEBLOCR

Social climber
joshua tree
Oct 21, 2012 - 04:18pm PT
JAN, and this is for you to BASE;

I am not hung up on origin of species! I am trying to understand what is it about evolution that makes people want to treat it like a religion... From your explanations and others' you seem hell bent on "proving" there is not a creator. To say that all primates evolved from one cell without a plan installed. (Meaning matter created conscience). you're telling me that matter on this planet floated, tumbled, rolled around and collided enough times to pile up into this body I have today? Without having PRIOR knowledge or need to. Remember you said "matter forms in object and then becomes conscience". ( aware?). However the primate kingdom slipped the cells around, to breed a rabbit. I'm asking?; didn't he know he was a rabbit until he became one? So man didn't know he was a man until he became one? After becoming aware, did he evolve to having emotions? Then why wouldn't he breed out guilt,hate,sadness? Why wouldn't he have evolved to just being happy? why all the hate?

I just suddenly had a realization! How evolution could abide to the Bible. At the time of Adam and Eve the Bible describes other "tribes" on the planet. It calls them "hybrids". A description of part human part animal, species. Angels that mated with human women species. 9 foot tall human species. These species would have been evolving some 10, 20 30,000 years ago.
What if these primates had awareness but no conscience. And it was complete evolution from one cell (provoked by God of course) that led up to Homo sapiens over billions of years?
And when God kicked Adam out of the garden (some 8 to 10,000 years ago) for stealing from the tree of knowledge. God "took away the scales from his eyes and Adam became conscience of his nakedness". THIS is how God describes "the original sin". Maybe After a accumulation of varied species from evolution. God chose Adam as being the best representative of us humans. And God filled him with the Holy Spirit. Then God took a rib(matter) out of Adam and built Eve. Eve being filled with the serpents spirit, conspired with Adam to go against Gods will. Adam was Factually listening to a part of his own body that had been overcome with an hateful spirit. Which caused him to rebel against God's will.
So the Original Sin stems from the soul listening to its bodily(matter) rebellion against a law.
WOW!
Back to evolution. Saying we can look back some 27,000 years and see Homo erectus.
Why in over 20,000 years he couldn't figure out how to write? Or leave something for future generations? Maybe no conscience? And when he did learn to write it was mostly about God.
The early Egyptians carved pictures worshiping God 5000 years ago. Our oldest known handwriting on a clay tablet were pictures pertaining to God some 3500 years ago.
The first hand writing of languages was in Hebrew and Armenian. Transcribing, you guessed it the Bible! And this happen Quitsa dentally right before Jesus taught. We still have over 500 handwritten copies of the original Bible from 100 A.D. Then in the 14th century King James translated the Bible to English. Just about exact time the printing press was invented. And what was the first publicated book the Bible.
I see much more than coincidence here! I see man's soul screaming out through matter declaring there is a God! Hallelujah!!
All that was revelation I hope I got it right...

Jus Revel'in
BB
Messages 10201 - 10220 of total 22772 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
Return to Forum List
Post a Reply
 
Our Guidebooks
Check 'em out!
SuperTopo Guidebooks


Try a free sample topo!

 
SuperTopo on the Web

Review Categories
Recent Route Beta
Recent Gear Reviews