Time for the FIRE FALL!

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Dingus Milktoast

Gym climber
Why'djya leave the ketchup on the table?
Topic Author's Original Post - Feb 17, 2010 - 10:18am PT
From a Sacramento Bee article about Yosemite's new boss, comes this delightful image:



Photo credit ERIC PAUL ZAMORA / Fresno Bee, states it was taken on this past Sunday. Is this natural or a 'shopped' photo???

DMT
Gunkie

Trad climber
East Coast US
Feb 17, 2010 - 10:23am PT
New volcano emerging along the ring of fire. It just happens to be near the top of Zodiac. New rating on Zodiac: 5.7 A2 VI LAVA
Maysho

climber
Soda Springs, CA
Feb 17, 2010 - 10:26am PT
Can't say for sure on possible alteration, but the natural effect does happen like that. Chris Falkenstein has caught this, as did Rowell, i think Ed Hartouni got it on the same day last week as well:
http://www.supertopo.com/climbers-forum/1089120/Its_a_wonderful_day_in_the_valley

How's it going DMT? Corn snow up here now, but a little more fresh might be on the way!

Peter
Dingus Milktoast

Gym climber
Why'djya leave the ketchup on the table?
Topic Author's Reply - Feb 17, 2010 - 10:30am PT
Going well Peter. Spent the weekend in LA with my kid at University. No climbing but the "LA Thing" was fun.

Ready to shred again, now.

I recalled the Rowell image. My buddy Stu had a proof image of it on his living room wall. What I did not recall is how Rowell got the photo. Good to see Ed's image there too, thanks.

Thanks!
DMT
SteveW

Trad climber
The state of confusion
Feb 17, 2010 - 10:50am PT


I wuz hopin' it was Ed's photo. . . see below thread. . .

http://www.supertopo.com/climbing/thread.php?topic_id=1089120&tn=0
susan peplow

climber
www.joshuatreevacationhomes.com
Feb 17, 2010 - 11:10am PT
Beautiful photograph. I was hoping we were going to find ourselves with the old tradition of "let the fire roll" back for public viewing.

My mother as a child through young adulthood spent summers in Yosemite with my grandparents. She often regales me with tales of the fire fall in the evening summer programs.

http://firefall.info/

Next time I'm digging around the slides I'll pull and scan the slides of her old Yosemite photos and neighboring Bass Lake.

A little OT personal note...my parents have done and seen some cool stuff. To think, when I was a kid I'd get bored with the multi-week vacations. At the age of 9, I claimed I had hiked every waterfall in west of the Mississippi. I wish those endless, free, and interesting vacations were available today!

~Susan



Ed Hartouni

Trad climber
Livermore, CA
Feb 17, 2010 - 11:14am PT
the images are probably all Photoshopped at some level to enhance the qualities... I was probably very close to this same person on Sunday.

here is another version of my photo on that other thread


to my "naked eyes" the falls were not as red as is depicted in this image.

Rowell writes about his 1973 image in his 1986 book Mountain Light: In Search of the Dynamic Landscape on page 23:

"One evening when Chris Vandiver and I were driving around Yosemite after a climb, we spotted this phenomenon, and I rushed across the valley to photograph it, arriving as the light was fading. I had not heard of it or seen it before, and I had no reason to expect I would ever see such light again, but on the following evening there it was."

He describes his incredible, ranger escorted race to a spot across the valley near "the concessioner's woodlot." I don't recognize this particular place in the current valley, anyone remember where this was?

The photo Rowell took was on Kodachrome 25, using a 300 mm lens in the fading night light... probably not "Photoshopped"... but that film had very good red saturation.

I'll try to get another shot this year from a slight different vantage point, with a longer lens, on digital and film (though the days of Kodachrome have passed, I think I can get some Velvia 50 still)...

In the image above I was shooting with an ISO of 320 because of the fading light, the exposure was f8 and 1/160 with my 180 mm lens, which on the DSLR I was using is more like a 270 mm lens, so close to Rowell. I suspect that he was a bit farther east than I was, looking at the pictures and especially the perspective of the top of the Horse Tail Falls area.

I can only assume that Rowell used the Nikkor 300 mm f2.8 EDIF lens... which was available then. Assuming he was 3 aperture stops down, that takes the ISO 320 to an equivalent 40, the next factor of two would be in speed so down to 1/60.... guessing he was at f2.8 and 1/60s exposure on his ISO 25 Kodachrome.

Jerry Dodrill

climber
Sebastopol, CA
Feb 17, 2010 - 12:23pm PT
The original slide of Horsetail Fall that appears in Mountain Light is just stunning. Unfortunately, after the publisher scanned the film for that book they apparently didn't do a very good job of cleaning it. They used oil to wet mount the film on the scanner. When Galen started the switch to digital fine art printing in the late '90s, the film was re-scanned and many of the those prime select images had developed tiny blue dots in the emulsion. (Other images from the same shoots did not have the dots.) Hours were spent cloning them out. These days people use alcohol based Kami fluid to mount the film - it completely evaporates.

The color and tone of the original slide probably looks closer to what you see in the book (Mountain Light) than the scanned/retouched image on the Mountain Light website, which is how Galen interpreted it:
Ed Hartouni

Trad climber
Livermore, CA
Feb 17, 2010 - 12:34pm PT
I was hoping that Jerry would chime in!

Dingus Milktoast

Gym climber
Why'djya leave the ketchup on the table?
Topic Author's Reply - Feb 17, 2010 - 12:35pm PT
Me too. Thanks guys.

DMT
Jerry Dodrill

climber
Sebastopol, CA
Feb 17, 2010 - 12:41pm PT
:-)

Wasn't the old wood lot over by Manure Pile?
Ed Hartouni

Trad climber
Livermore, CA
Feb 17, 2010 - 12:55pm PT
that's what I thought too... but the lens is pretty big for being that close, I'll play around with Google Earth tonight and see what's what...
Srbphoto

Trad climber
Kennewick wa
Feb 17, 2010 - 01:49pm PT
I am looking at the picture in Galen's "The Yosemite". Based on this copy, it looks like he may have used a warming filter (81A?). The sky is gray but has a hint of orange. If Jerry has seen the actual slide maybe he can elaborate.

Also you younger folk, it was possible to manipulate pictures before Photoshop.
Mungeclimber

Trad climber
sorry, just posting out loud.
Feb 17, 2010 - 02:00pm PT
kewl
Jerry Dodrill

climber
Sebastopol, CA
Feb 17, 2010 - 02:34pm PT
Srb,
Its been ten years now since I've seen the original, and I don't have a copy of The Yosemite, but my recollection is as you say. I don't know about the 81A but sorta doubt he used one with that lens and those circumstances.

John Shaw makes an interesting point that The Chrome Era was interesting and unique in the history of photography in that it was the only time that the image made in camera was so highly regarded. Unlike a film negative or raw digital file which must be developed, it was viewed as the authentic and infallible finished image.

Ed Hartouni

Trad climber
Livermore, CA
Feb 17, 2010 - 02:34pm PT
ask Jerry, don't think he would have had enough "room" in his exposure to use a filter... and the 300 mm aperture is pretty huge (maybe it used those funky little filters on the back end of the lens).

However, when he made the print he might have interpreted it redder, certainly it was "photoshopped" after it was digitized... but that's part of "the performance"
Hankster

Trad climber
Left Hand, CO
Feb 17, 2010 - 03:09pm PT
It had to happen.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6RPoMAhfxDg

Caylor
Srbphoto

Trad climber
Kennewick wa
Feb 17, 2010 - 03:14pm PT
I don't think the filter size would be an issue. I would think the filter size on an older lens would be maybe 67mm or 72mm. Maybe someone has one and can check. Rowell was a big fan of filters:)
edit: the modern 300 f2,8 are 52mm filter size.

Also Kodachrome could easily handle the 1/3 stop loss of a light warming filter. If he shot at the film speed (25) the 1/3 stop loss would probably look better with Kodachrome.

I guess it is all mental masterbation at this point :)

Ed - It would be interesting to see it in Velvia. The increase contrast should highlight the falls and if there is even a hint of red, Velvia will really pop it. Look forward to seeing it!!!
Srbphoto

Trad climber
Kennewick wa
Feb 17, 2010 - 03:25pm PT
Jerry - I always thought it would be cool for someone who shoots, say 8x10, to do an exhibit of transparencies using light boxes. Chromes are so beautiful. There are not a lot people who can bring out that magical "glow" in a print.
Walleye

climber
The Hot Kiss on the end of a Wet Fist
Feb 17, 2010 - 03:38pm PT
These were all shot on Velvia over the course of the last 10 years or so.
I used my 500mm f4 lens with and without teleconverters up to 1000mm.
I also used a polarizer which is a 39mm "drop-in" type.




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