Discussion Topic |
|
This thread has been locked |
ricardo
Gym climber
San Francisco, CA
|
|
|
Topic Author's Original Post - Aug 10, 2005 - 08:23pm PT
|
Got me a new FISH double ledge ..
.. my previous ledge (old school A5 single) had a rapid deploy fly.. (you could clip it above the ledge without removing it from the bag) ..
.. the FISH one does not have this nifty feature .. (i'm considering making a hole on the bottom of the sack for the fly to make it have this feature!) ..
.. does anyone (Russ?) have any tricks on how to setup the FISH ledge fly in case you might get rain .. -- ready to deploy,
|
|
bringmedeath
climber
la la land
|
|
|
Aug 10, 2005 - 08:36pm PT
|
Hmm, I think when I used it, I just pulled it out of the bag and clipped it in, the clipped the ledge into it. Seemed to be pretty easy.
On a similer note, who knows the best way to use a Diamond fly? I barrowed one for my next trip and plan to set it up every night with it!
|
|
Russ Walling
Social climber
Bishop is DEAD, long live JT
|
|
|
Aug 10, 2005 - 09:14pm PT
|
Hey ya,
You can cut a slit in the bottom of your bag. Fair to poor method. Or, you can (this will be impossible to describe) clip a biner into the top loop on the outside of the cone. clip a biner to inside the cone loop where you hang the ledge. Now, the idea is to get all of one side of the fly between these two biners (Or maybe 3?). Roll it up and then clip the biners to each other. Stuff the rest of the fly back into the bag. Now you can clip the fly to your anchor and the ledge into the fly and the bagged fly will hang out like a tumor off to the side. If it rains, just undo the keeper biners and the fly will roll down. Try it on the ground first.
|
|
ChrisW
Trad climber
boulder, co
|
|
|
Aug 11, 2005 - 12:33am PT
|
I am not taking chances anymore. First cloud i see i am going to use that beta. Rainfly ready to be deployed!!! Is there any beta for keeping the condensation to a minimal? That's what gets you and everything else wet and kills you.
|
|
Russ Walling
Social climber
Bishop is DEAD, long live JT
|
|
|
Aug 11, 2005 - 01:38am PT
|
I've found that for almost zero condensation inside the fly, just tell your body to not heat up, not give off any moisture, and then don't breathe.
|
|
ChrisW
Trad climber
boulder, co
|
|
|
Aug 11, 2005 - 11:18am PT
|
I was thinking of using a snorkel sticking the end out the rain fly and sticking the other end in my mouth. For body heat maybe rap myself in plasitc wrap.
|
|
mike hartley
climber
|
|
|
Aug 11, 2005 - 06:49pm PT
|
Ricardo,
I did the slit in the bottom of the stuff sack thing. Even then I found the internal webbing loop, that you hang the ledge from, was a little too short to make the quick deploy method reasonable. I had to girth hitch a quickdraw to the webbing loop to extend it. Works fine that way.
|
|
Russ Walling
Social climber
Bishop is DEAD, long live JT
|
|
|
Aug 11, 2005 - 07:44pm PT
|
That is the fatal flaw with all that quick deploy stuff. As Mike said, you extend the loop. Now the clip in biner etc is not under the protective cone. Oopsie... my fly just got worn away right at the anchor and water is pouring in. Oh well, this just quickens the process if your number is up.
|
|
deuce4
Big Wall climber
the Southwest
|
|
|
Aug 11, 2005 - 08:36pm PT
|
can't let this design clusterf--k go on too much longer...
There is a good system, and it works, and you can modify your set up by sewing in a good strong quickdraw into the bottom of your stuffsack, that reaches the opening of the stuffsack.
Here's some pics of the 1996 quick-deploy A5 design:
As you can see the cone is still intact. Simplicity in design was always our goal.
|
|
'Pass the Pitons' Pete
Big Wall climber
like Oakville, Ontario, Canada, eh?
|
|
|
Aug 12, 2005 - 03:01am PT
|
"Is there any beta for keeping the condensation to a minimal? That's what gets you and everything else wet and kills you."
I just spent my 246th night on El Cap, almost all of which were in my Fish double ledge which I bought in '95, except for a few nights I was sleeping on a rock ledge. I have weathered my share of storms, which fortunately has been a very small share, because I choose a more friendly place [El Cap] during decidedly friendly times of the year [usually].
Here are your Dr. Piton Big Wall Portaledge Fly Tips of the Day:
1. Get a shock-corded flexible tent pole. I got mine from Russ. It's quite long, I'm guessing around ten feet. Its ends go into the two back corners of the ledge [some ledge designs have pockets for the ends of the pole] and it bends round the front of the ledge, keeping the fly off of you. Absolutely indespensible in my opinion - makes the storm experience so much more civilized. You shouldn't leave the ground without one. You can see the outline of the pole beneath the yellow fly in Deucey's photo directly above [the pole also doubles as a Lovetron or Tequila Straw]
Tom Kasper belaying from Fish Crab-O-Ledge beneath roofs on Scorched Earth - El Capitan
2. Get a Big Wall Sponge, which beats the hell out of using a sock, or a big wall crab... [Note: You can make an anything into a Big Wall Anything by adding a clip-in cord]
3. Use a synthetic sleeping bag and reliable [i.e. expensive!] Goretex [or equivalent] bivi sack
4. Bring along a Big Wall Stove. You can click here to read my column in Rock & Ice about [url="http://www.rockandice.com/drpiton/dr%20piton.133.html"]how to make a kick-ass big wall hanging stove easily and cheaply.[/url] The stove will warm up your fly and [properly vented] dry out the condensation. If you're going to weather a storm, you're going to need coffee. [HINT] - bring whiskey [the Merrican kind] or whisky [the Hoser kind] depending on your preference, to add a bit of extra Big Wall Cheer
Fish double ledge at The Round Table bivi - Excalibur, El Cap
Pouring from Big Wall French Press, Big Wall Stove shown lower right
5. Make sure you have a sleeping pad to add huge volumes of warmth and reduce condensation beneath you, and don't rely on the blue foamy thing you use to line your pig - it's very difficult to remove from a fully-packed pig, and virtually impossible to replace. I highly recommend a 3/4-length Ultralite Thermarest, which is plenty comfy to sleep on, rolls up to practically nothing, and fits within your bivi sack. I've had mine in virtually continuous use since 1988 - when I finally send it back to Thermarest for its lifetime warranty replacement, they'll have a helluvan endorsement
6. There is NO rule 6.
7. No poofdahs! [I'm serious, not on my bloody ledge, mate...]
8. Keep your windows open as much as reasonably possible, if you have windows
Emerging after the storm - Excalibur, El Capitan
9. Ricardo [with his trademark ellipses] writes, "Got me a new FISH double ledge ... " Good one, mate. Buy a Fish ledge like Ricardo! Russ will keep looking after you and your ledge for years to come.
10. Don't do as I do, do as I say: set up your fly and ledge on the ground first, so you know what the hell you're doing! It's really stupid to hear thunder at 2 a.m. and spend the next hour in the dark trying to get your fully-loaded ledge unloaded, get your rainfly clipped, then get your ledge clipped underneath the fly and your fly deployed, and then get back inside the thing before the raindrops start falling! This is especially difficult when you do like me, which is to take off your harness at night, and tie in using girth-hitched [and tied] daisies round your waist. But it's even harder still when you are as incredibly unbelievably stupid like me, and don't bother to try your new fly setup ahead of time, and experience at least another half-hour of complete and utter frustration in the dark, waiting for the raindrops to fall, while your partner figures out how to put your fly around your ledge, because you're so pissed off you could cry! What we didn't realize is that because my new A5 rainfly has a floor, you have to open the side door and slide the ledge in sideways - you can't just pull the fly down over the ledge like you can with the floorless models. Man, you should have seen the two of us wanking about in the dark - it was truly pathetic. So if it looks like there is even the slightest chance of rain, have your ledge fly rigged ahead of time using some sort of quick deploy, as you have correctly noted above.
A lovely fly, once you figure out how to get the bloody ledge in it!
Check out the hanging stove assembly at right as described in R&I
11. As for 10., try this on the ground first! Make sure your ledge fits under your fly, and make sure the clip-in point beneath the fly is not too long, so your ledge doesn't hang too low! You have to make sure the ledge rests precisely against the reinforced bit on your ledge fly, otherwise you're wear a hole in the fly. Some flies have little buckles in the corners to hold the ledge in place - if yours doesn't, you should add them.
12. You need a separate safety backup rope, so you are not relying 100% on the piece of webbing that passes through the ledge fly. Use your dynamic lead climbing rope to join you to your Power Point, but leave a yard of slack in it so the rope hangs beneath you in a bit of an arc, and therefore doesn't wick water onto you. The best bet is to clip a crab or two of pins to the arc of the rope to keep it beneath you. Afterwards, you can impress the Big Wall Theorists in the parking lot with your rusty pins.
13. And be sure to, like, stop in for coffee if you're in the neighbourhood, eh?
Pinnacle of Hammerdom - Never Never Land - El Capitan
14. Don't drop your .... [oh, sorry, we covered that in another thread] And Chris - you do owe Randy a carry to the base of NNL or equivalent...
Cheers,
The Doc
|
|
Ouch!
climber
|
|
|
Aug 12, 2005 - 12:55pm PT
|
Boy! How times have changed. Deploying the fly used to mean writing your name in the snow.
|
|
ChrisW
Trad climber
boulder, co
|
|
|
Aug 12, 2005 - 01:26pm PT
|
Hmmmm, So how much water was up at the base of NNL, before you guys even started carrying anything up there? Was it 6 gallons i carried up there? What's Randy and Paul up to these days, anyways? I think you cured Randy of BigWall "Fever". I am sure Paul is still climbing BigWalls.
Maybe you should bring more water next time and less booze? See my Partner and I brought 4 bottles of wine with us on the Nose. But, We had 2 gallons of water left when we got to the top.
See you in the Valley this fall, Pete.
|
|
Russ Walling
Social climber
Bishop is DEAD, long live JT
|
|
|
Aug 12, 2005 - 02:43pm PT
|
deuce writes: **can't let this design clusterf--k go on too much longer...
**
Glad you put a stop to it... it was waaaaay outta hand.
Anyway: Ricardo et al, here are some pics and instruction on the no bag, super simple, rapid deploy fly.
Pic 1: The key here is to just get the main body of the fly between the outer clip in loop and inner clip in loop. You use a keeper biner on here (rather than your regular ledge clip in biner) that you take off when you clip the ledge in for real.
Pic 2: This is the fly stuffed into the regular bag. Note the clip loop has both ends accessible. Where the ledge is clipped in would have a keeper biner clipped in there when the ledge is not ready for use. The stuffed fly will just hang out like a tumor, ready to deploy. Tip: to save wear and tear on the fly clip in loop, clip your ledge into the keeper biner (not pictured) if you think rain is pretty unlikely. If it does rain, just unclip the keeper biner and you are ready to deploy. You will only need to unweight the ledge for a second to do this.
Pic 3: This is the fly after you pull the bag off. Simple rapid deployment. To get it ready for next time, just bring the ledge clip in inside the cone back up to the outer clip in, attach a keeper biner from inner to outer, and stuff the fly back into the bag.
Easier than it looks and sounds. Try it, you'll like it. And for everyone who has ever bought a FISH ledge, we are offering a free upgrade to this 20 year old system.
Ps: hope this works with the pics and all.... since I have NO EDIT BUTTON, any mistakes will be fixed in later posts.
|
|
'Pass the Pitons' Pete
Big Wall climber
like Oakville, Ontario, Canada, eh?
|
|
|
Aug 12, 2005 - 03:04pm PT
|
Damn. Great job without an edit! Thanks, Russ.
|
|
ChrisW
Trad climber
boulder, co
|
|
|
Aug 12, 2005 - 03:52pm PT
|
Thanks Fish. I will try to give a cool trip report when i get back from the Valley.
|
|
ricardo
Gym climber
San Francisco, CA
|
|
|
Topic Author's Reply - Aug 12, 2005 - 05:30pm PT
|
thanks russ --
thats exactly what i was looking for -- tricks for rapid deployment of the FISH fly ..
|
|
Shack
Trad climber
So. Cal.
|
|
|
Aug 12, 2005 - 05:41pm PT
|
Niiice! I like that.
I was worried about abrasion doin' it the other way.
Thanks Russ.
|
|
Shack
Trad climber
So. Cal.
|
|
|
Aug 13, 2005 - 07:45pm PT
|
Also I noticed you have the mesh bag for your fly.
That would be the shiznit if your puting away the fly wet.
|
|
Russ Walling
Social climber
Bishop is DEAD, long live JT
|
|
|
Aug 14, 2005 - 09:47pm PT
|
The mesh bag is just a medium sized Peek a Boo stuff sack. MIght be good for a wet fly, though once they get wet, they certainly ain't drying out in any bag.
Speaking of bags... anyone going anywhere soon???? A sololist maybe???? Let me know about it. I might have something for you to test.
|
|
Shack
Trad climber
So. Cal.
|
|
|
Aug 14, 2005 - 11:28pm PT
|
A double rope bucket maybe?
|
|
|
SuperTopo on the Web
|
Let us know!