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PD
Big Wall climber
Reno, NV
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Oct 22, 2008 - 09:04pm PT
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Here's basically what happened:
The team was climbing as 3. They climbed pitches 3 and 4 separately but decided to link the hauls in one shot. Matt was at the top of pitch 4, James and Perry were at the top of 3, and the bags were hanging on the haul line near the top of pitch 2. Matt had finished pitch 4 and fixed the haul line onto a pro traxion and backed it up. James was to jug the haul line while perry cleaned pitch 4 because the rope was in reach of the 3rd belay, albeit weighted already with the bags. I'm pretty sure they were using James' 9.5mm 70 m static line -- the same one we used on the Salathe a week before with no issues.
James somehow malfunctioned the attachment of his jumars to the taught haul line, but after he had released his daisy chains from the anchor. He began sliding down the haul line until one of his jumars finally engaged some 30 feet later or so. There was a sheath piling found on the scene, so we know he broke the sheath first, initiated a sheath fall, and finally the core broke after the sheath fall ended and shock-loaded the system. He and the bags fell 300 feet to the base. Other details are not known yet. We do not know how James failed to attach the ascenders properly, but we do know that he is used to using the new BD ascenders and for just that pitch he used the petzl jumars.
Please folks, understand that jumaring taught haul lines is not safe and should always be avoided. I had a close call on the Nose in 2003 when my partner jumared a taght haul line and we broke a pro-traxion in half during the lower out. It cut the sheath, and the backup knot I tied saved his life. I only use pro-traxions these days with a full strength swivel and a big locker in the bottom hole.
When climbing as 3, the second should always jumar the slacked haul line first so he can be backed up with knots or a gri gri, then the bags can be lowered out. In their case, it was not possible because they linked the hauls. If you link hauls like that, the second should clean the upper pitch first, then the third should jumar the lead line after it's been cleaned rather than grabbing the taught haul line and comitting to it. Plus, linking hauls like that is usually not possible anwyay because the haul line hardly ever hangs within reach of the intermediate belay. And also, saving time by linking those hauls is counterproductive when you consider that to get the other two up safely, you'd need to wait until the upper pitch is cleaned before the third can come up.
If a taught haul line is going over a lip, you cannot pass it with 2 jumars and because you cannot be backed up with a gri gri or knots, you are only on one jumar during the maneuver. It's also too much strain for the hauling device and is more likely to chop ropes going over sharp edges. It doesn't save time to do it this way either. Just avoid it no matter what. I've climbed many walls with 3 people and always jug an unweighted haul line. The one time we did otherwise (on the Nose) my partner almost died.
--Pete
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WBraun
climber
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Oct 22, 2008 - 09:08pm PT
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Thanks Pete for the information.
Wow!
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Holdplease2
Big Wall climber
Yosemite area
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Oct 22, 2008 - 09:12pm PT
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Pete, thank you for posting up.
A question would be, does the weighted line lay against the rock during that haul? Is it possible that his ascender problem occurred from the challenge of trying to move on the weighted haul line, as it lay across rock outcroppings? This might have involved unclipping an ascender to pass it over an outcropping. Difficulty reattaching could result in a static fall onto the bottom ascender, and no other way to be attached to the haul line during the pass.
Condolences to his friends and family.
-Kate.
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Oct 22, 2008 - 09:17pm PT
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Sad.
I've jugged weighted lines but was always careful to keep it at 25Kilo or less.
Just to be clear, with pitch numbers does "4" end on the ledge after the first less-than-vertical pitch?
That would involve a swing.
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, Ca.
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Oct 22, 2008 - 09:20pm PT
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That really sucks...God bless him. My condolences.
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nick d
Trad climber
nm
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Oct 22, 2008 - 09:31pm PT
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My condolences to the bereaved. And thanks to Pete for posting this information. I have not really thought enough about the added danger of jugging a tensioned line.
An equipment question I might pose; does this case make a good argument for not using static lines in actual climbing? I don't know if it would have made the difference here, but I wouldn't want to fall 30 feet onto a static rope.
I have always thought every rope I am carrying should be able to be used as a lead line if necessary. Thoughts?
Again, my best to his friends and family.
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Holdplease2
Big Wall climber
Yosemite area
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Oct 22, 2008 - 10:29pm PT
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One aspect of jugging a weighted line is that, if the load is heavy enough, it essentially turns a dynamic line into a static line, as the "stretch" is removed because there is a heavy load already on the line.
-Kate.
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Caveman
climber
Cumberland Plateau
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Oct 22, 2008 - 10:31pm PT
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Considering that people jug tensioned lines all the time I would venture that this speaks more of climbers and jugging and not line tension.
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Oct 22, 2008 - 10:31pm PT
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Really depends on the line used Kate.
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Holdplease2
Big Wall climber
Yosemite area
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Oct 22, 2008 - 10:35pm PT
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Combination of line and load matter.
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Caveman
climber
Cumberland Plateau
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Oct 22, 2008 - 10:49pm PT
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"Combination of line and load matter."
Cavers on the whole weigh more than climbers and have taken horrendously long falls onto many types of ascenders. One fall I am aware of was in the neighborhood of 80ft. Sheath ruptured and absorbed energy while core held. Cause of fall was glove stuck in ascender. Another fall was about 150ft. This person held their ascending knots open for the duration only letting go to brake their fall with their hands. The act of letting go of the ascending knots caused them to grab saving the persons life.
The falls I have described took place on 7/16ths rope and not 9mm.
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WBraun
climber
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Oct 22, 2008 - 10:55pm PT
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As people try to make sense of this type of scenario, their minds are driven into endless speculations .......
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bluering
Trad climber
Santa Clara, Ca.
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Oct 22, 2008 - 11:08pm PT
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his ascender didn't grab, he took a long slide, then shockloading the rope with ascender 'teeth'.
Okay, Werner? Seems totally plausible to me. Make sure your ascenders are 'on'.
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Caveman
climber
Cumberland Plateau
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Oct 22, 2008 - 11:09pm PT
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Jugging tensioned lines is an accepted practice but there are aspects one must be aware of. One thing to be aware of is that ascenders are rated for specific diameters of rope. If climbers are using a rope at the minimum diameter then maybe tension on the line would reduce the diameter of said rope beyond minimum ascender dimension.
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Oct 22, 2008 - 11:10pm PT
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Hence trying to locate the spot Werner.
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Caveman
climber
Cumberland Plateau
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Oct 22, 2008 - 11:17pm PT
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"As people try to make sense of this type of scenario, their minds are driven into endless speculations ......."
Since my post was just before Werner's I'll say this.....y'all are in our territory now.
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Toker Villain
Big Wall climber
Toquerville, Utah
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Oct 22, 2008 - 11:23pm PT
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Daylight caving?
Why do climbers weigh less?
I've caught some doozies.
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Caveman
climber
Cumberland Plateau
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Oct 22, 2008 - 11:30pm PT
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"Daylight caving?"
The nylon highway....call us 'kings of the road'
"Why do climbers weigh less?"
To keep their tendon/bone connects?
Climbers would destroy themselves or freeze to death caving at climber weight. Not met many cavers eh?
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Anastasia
climber
Not there
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Oct 22, 2008 - 11:51pm PT
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I have jugged up a taunt line. I never had a clue that it was a bad idea. Now that I read this it appears so obvious that I can't understand why I didn't figure it out on my own. Funny how that works...
Big thanks for the information.
AF
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jstan
climber
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Oct 22, 2008 - 11:58pm PT
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Try as I might, I can not resist.
FWIW
Caving:
Small people can get through smaller holes.
When the water was cold and the hole big, I used a dry suit. Wet suits did not exist then and dry suits could be found at army surplus stores. Sports stores carried only baseball equipment then. Never needed a bat in a cave.
Climbing:
Weight: If we routinely walked on our finger tips then climbing weight would not make a difference. As it is we are asking the small muscles in the fingers to carry a load normally carried by the big muscles.
Ascenders: The existence of ropes with widely varying diameter make falling on an ascender a crap shoot. We need some testing on this to see just how bad the problem is. Now.
Taut Lines: No matter how careful you are while jugging, you will have bounce. if the line is also carrying a static load the rope will bear on an edge over a much more limited length of the line. The wear is more local and is more severe.
Hurrying: Mistakes, I have found, are an order of magnitude more frequent when in a hurry.
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