Good Anchors, Bad Anchors

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Messages 1 - 20 of total 74 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
Chiloe

Trad climber
Lee, NH
Topic Author's Original Post - Apr 3, 2008 - 11:55am PT
In some places, stainless steel does not last too long.

[Click to View Linked Image]
Steve Grossman

Trad climber
Seattle, WA
Apr 3, 2008 - 11:57am PT
By the sea, by the sea, by the beautiful sea?
hoipolloi

climber
A friends backyard with the neighbors wifi
Apr 3, 2008 - 12:07pm PT
i dont see the problem? Whats the problem here?
L

climber
If only I could remember....
Apr 3, 2008 - 12:10pm PT
You know, Chil, that sort of looks like a piece of art. A beautifully corroded, deadly piece of art.
Chaz

Trad climber
So. Cal.
Apr 3, 2008 - 12:13pm PT
Just rig up an American Triangle Of Death with that one and the one next to it, and call it good.
Grant Meisenholder

Trad climber
CA
Apr 3, 2008 - 12:30pm PT
"You've gotta ask yourself, 'Do you feel lucky?' Well, punk!?"
le_bruce

climber
Oakland: what's not to love?
Apr 3, 2008 - 12:31pm PT
Early this week had to wonder if this would hold a fall. Probably many here have clipped it - Overhang Bypass on LCR.

[Click to View Linked Image]

[Click to View Linked Image]
Chiloe

Trad climber
Lee, NH
Topic Author's Reply - Apr 3, 2008 - 12:37pm PT
By the sea, by the sea, by the beautiful sea?

Steve knows the issue.

[Click to View Linked Image]
morphus

Mountain climber
Angleland
Apr 3, 2008 - 01:10pm PT
[Click to View Linked Image]
Doug Robinson

Trad climber
Santa Cruz
Apr 3, 2008 - 01:29pm PT
Yeah Bruce,

I first clipped that bolt 45 years ago. Then in the early 90s I replaced a ladder of exactly the same, right down to hangers. You may have heard of the spot: the East Buttress of Middle.

So I have a bit of relevant info for you: Can't vouch for the hanger, but the bolt itself is probably bomber.

When I dug into the wall behind what you clipped on the surface, I found 3/8" x 3" Star Dryvin lead shield anchors. Every one of them was a bitch to get out. Pulled hard with the pickel-fork and crowbar, and then had to scrape bits of lead out the hole with a dental tool before we could install new 5-piece.

Feel better?

Doug
Chiloe

Trad climber
Lee, NH
Topic Author's Reply - Apr 3, 2008 - 01:40pm PT
L's remark about my photo,
A beautifully corroded, deadly piece of art
applies to morphus' even more. What was that?
Chiloe

Trad climber
Lee, NH
Topic Author's Reply - Apr 3, 2008 - 01:43pm PT
DR:
When I dug into the wall behind what you clipped on the surface, I found 3/8" x 3" Star Dryvin lead
shield anchors.


I used to place only Star Dryvins on sandstone routes. I know lots of those have been replaced, but
haven't heard whether the old gear was worthless or still had traction.
TradIsGood

Chalkless climber
the Gunks end of the country
Apr 3, 2008 - 02:08pm PT
Stubai Klebehaken and epoxy worked at the one place I climbed in Gulf of Mexico.
Greg Barnes

climber
Apr 3, 2008 - 02:19pm PT
Doug's right on the 3/8" Star-Drives, don't pull straight out and they are fairly good, although that one is really rusty (sooner or later they'll rust to the point where the bolt will fail). I've pulled those in the Valley, Tuolumne, Red Rocks, and the Pinnacles, and as long as you first pull the nail and just the nail (not the sleeve), they're pretty easy to get out. That hanger is another matter though, those are known to snap (cleaned up a few snapped ones off the Nose, they break at the angle change near the biner).

For those who are wondering what's going on with the bolt in the first post, this article explains why titanium is the only option for seaside bolts, especially in warm climates:
http://www.safeclimbing.org/education/deepbluesea.htm
Hardman Knott

Gym climber
Muir Woods National Monument, Mill Valley, Ca
Apr 3, 2008 - 02:28pm PT
Titanium "glue in" bolts are way expensive ($15 last I checked), but they should last at least 30 years...
Here's one I placed on Hot Tuna at Mickey's Beach before chopping and patching the original:


Visit on oceandave.com



Believe it or knott, that old bolt wasn't even stainless; four carbon-steel bolts were placed on that route:

Here's a close up of one of them:


Visit on oceandave.com



What amazed me was how hard it was to break these 1/2" bolts with a 2 1/2 lb sledge.
When I finally got them to snap, you could see that the steel was still shiny other
than the 1/2 mm or so around the outer edge. I don't have the photos handy at the
moment as I am on the laptop - I just grabbed the above photos off my lame-ass website.

In the meantime, check out this cool carbon-steel anchor...


Visit on oceandave.com



-and the titanium replacement:


Visit on oceandave.com



I would also like to point out that when Dirty Kenny and me were doing a bunch of
rebolting at Mickey's, we also chopped and patched a bunch of old 3/8" stainless bolts.

http://www.safeclimbing.org/areas/california/mickeysbeach.htm

Although many of these were 15 years old, they still required a good effort to remove.
I came to the conclusion that Stress Corrosion Cracking (SSC) is knott occurring out
in these parts, as it is in the Limestone sea cliffs of Thailand, Vietnam, Cayman Brac, ect.
Chiloe

Trad climber
Lee, NH
Topic Author's Reply - Apr 3, 2008 - 02:37pm PT
stich:
Titanium glue-ins for them sea cliffs. Only gear that'll be there tomorrow.

A few days ago I watched Lord Slime clean a pitch of not-very-old stainless bolts like the one
on the left. One bolt snapped off under hand pressure. About half of them shattered when
torqued lightly with a wrench. The remainder broke like dry twigs with a few taps from a
hammer.

Ushba Tortuga titanium glue-ins, like the one at right below, seem to be faring a lot better.

[Click to View Linked Image]
Chiloe

Trad climber
Lee, NH
Topic Author's Reply - Apr 3, 2008 - 05:41pm PT
[Click to View Linked Image]
perswig

climber
Apr 3, 2008 - 07:16pm PT
Chiloe, I'm with L. That nut pic ^ is beautiful. Were you tryin', or is that just a happenstance of amazing colors and juxta textures?
Steve Grossman

Trad climber
Seattle, WA
Apr 3, 2008 - 08:20pm PT
Seems like a good test case for some very fat studs and beefy stainless keyhole hangers to keep the exposed metal to a minimum. The Aussies used to employ those tactics on routes routinely way back in the day. Just have to have a big glass jar full of keyhole sets down at the local watering hole for the borrowing! Just a modest proposal. LOL
Raydog

Trad climber
Boulder Colorado
Apr 3, 2008 - 09:32pm PT
cool thread
Messages 1 - 20 of total 74 in this topic << First  |  < Previous  |  Show All  |  Next >  |  Last >>
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