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nocogear.com
Sport climber
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Topic Author's Original Post - Apr 1, 2017 - 12:45pm PT
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Hi all, just rummaging through our gear boxes and came upon this KB, just wondering if you think it is a Chouinard? No markings and very thick stock.
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Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Not a Knifeblade per se due to the thickness but it certainly looks like an early Bugaboo style Chouinard piton with no stamp. The shape of the eye is distinctive. This piton doesn't appear to be cut by hand and likely was punched from sheet material using a profile die which would put it in the mid 1960s when Tom Frost started working with Yvon. I would have to check some catalogs to really pin this down, excuse the pun.
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nocogear.com
Sport climber
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Topic Author's Reply - Apr 1, 2017 - 12:59pm PT
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Thanks! Yup good call, should've Bugged this one too, not just KB'd it.
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EdBannister
Mountain climber
13,000 feet
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possibly a first edition from Camp of Premana, Italy, they eventually produced the blades of this type for Chouinard Equipment.
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Fritz
Social climber
Choss Creek, ID
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nocogear: Here's some photos of two of my old long medium Bugaboos. One is stamped <c> USA & one has no marking, but is obviously also a Chouinard Bugaboo, likely from from the early 1960's. The thickness of the steel around the eye ( 1/8") seems to be much less than yours, but I'll leave that up to you and folks that have a closer eye for details than I do.
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jgill
Boulder climber
The high prairie of southern Colorado
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^^^ Ditto. I used one of his first blades on a climb we did together. Quite thin and rectangular.
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ms55401
Trad climber
minneapolis, mn
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is there any dif b/w knifeblade and bugaboo?
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Fritz
Social climber
Choss Creek, ID
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Here's a little help for the Chouinard Knifeblade & Bugaboo challeged.
The 1968 Chouinard catalog page on the subject.
Here's a photo of my collection of post 1972 Chouinard Knifeblades & Bugaboos. To me, the tips are all rounded.
And here is the 1972-74 Chouinard catalog page, with the expanded collection of Knifeblades & Bugaboos.
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Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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The two thinnest versions of this style piton (standard and thick) were referred to as Knifeblades and the thicker ones as Bugaboos. Early on there were two followed by three thicknesses (thin, medium and thick) of Bugs offered in short and long versions but over time the thick versions were dropped from the line. The 1972-4 catalog page that Fritz posted shows the broadest selection.
Before the outline was standardized for production with dies in the mid 1960s there were all manner of lengths and thicknesses produced for this offset horizontal type of piton.
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ms55401
Trad climber
minneapolis, mn
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I will pay an imaginary ten dollars to someone who posts a real, non-imaginary personal photo of a kb/bugaboo actually being used in climbing.
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thebravecowboy
climber
The Good Places
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Mongolian Jugf*#kers in Heaven summit anchor, after second ascent (we hadda DC after the first).
I did sink and leave a #1 on lead about a month ago.
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Fritz
Social climber
Choss Creek, ID
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I need to elaborate on the subject of rounded tips on Chouinard Knifeblades & Bugaboos.
The pre-1972 Knifeblades & Bugaboos had more rounded tips & the post-1972 were more squared-off & only rounded at the edges. Same with Chouinard Lost Arrows.
In this photo of 3 Long Medium Bugaboos, the one at left is unmarked & is likely from the early 1960's. the center one is likely from 1968 -1972 & is marked USA, & the right one with a more squared-off tip, has a second hole & dates post 1972, to about 1975-76, when Chouinard dropped that model of Bugaboo.
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Gnome Ofthe Diabase
climber
Out Of Bed
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This thread made me go to the attic, where my pins are molting.
Four things made the trip to my messy desk.
the Buggaboo is on the left, Lmost as thick as the OP's?The Tips Look Square to me.
Then there is one of (of,3) these,? the only markings are the stamped number 21"I'll call it my Tiny knife blade is it a RUP?
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WBraun
climber
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Knifeblades are thin.
Bugaboos are thick.
Why look at these pins?
Stick em into the rock where they belong .......
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jgill
Boulder climber
The high prairie of southern Colorado
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I looked in the garage where I thought I had a few old pitons left, but couldn't find any. The knife-blade I lost in 1959, I think, when Yvon and I were doing a climb in Garnet Canyon, was flat and rectangular, perhaps 2 inches long and an inch wide, and no 90 degree bent section where the hole was. The smaller flat rectangular area where there was a hole was a little thicker than the actual blade. But still not the same as the photos that are posted here. The square tip of the blade was almost sharp. This must have been one of his very early designs.
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Happy Cowboy
Social climber
Boz MT
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My first thought when I saw the pin was "CMI" Bugaboo. They were thicker than Chouinard blades and a slightly different shape. They also would mar more easily than Chouinard, as this pin shows.
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Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Gnome- CMI Cracktacks.
CMI blades have a distinctive rounded eye shape unlike the shouldered anvil shape of the Chouinard blades.
These are some of my earliest unstamped Chouinard blades.
John- Yvon did make some vertical blades early on which seems to be what you are recalling. The blades were drawn out much like the offset blades shown above leaving a wavy surface.
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Tom
Big Wall climber
San Luis Obispo CA
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I agree with the square-tip coming from the GPIW in Ventura. But, wear may have rounded the corners.
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ms55401
Trad climber
minneapolis, mn
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so, are KBs mainly driven in horizontally??? and vertically once in a while?
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Steve Grossman
Trad climber
Seattle, WA
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Since pitons are generally relegated to aid routes and aid routes usually follow vertical crack systems, most KB placements are vertical. The offset eye does help the piton resist shifting if it contacts the rock so the offset configuration is useful even in the vertical orientation.
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