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Bad Climber
Trad climber
The Lawless Border Regions
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Topic Author's Original Post - Sep 27, 2016 - 06:04am PT
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Just ruminating on the loss of some young climbers in the Sierras. This is meant as no slight or attack on them. I've been at this game long enough to know I could have gotten the chop plenty of times, but is there anything to my perception that soloing is maybe a little TOO hot right now? With the proliferation of high quality videos showing our sport's best doing the rad unroped, with constant inputs from the Web showing all manner of conquests, is soloing getting too good a rep?
I remember last year I was getting some java at the Black Sheep coffee house in Bishop, and a young woman was effusing about going on her first solo! I guess some friends were going to do a mass unroped ascent of Cathedral Peak. I think of the young man who died on Matthes Crest last year, the two young women dead in the Sierras this year. To cop a line from Whymper, look well to each step, young climber and old. That loose hold doesn't care if you can on-sight 5.13. It really doesn't. No lives matter to that teetering block. Is that quick ridge traverse worth the happiness of a lifetime?
BAd
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Gunkie
Trad climber
Valles Marineris
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Sep 27, 2016 - 06:40am PT
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Personal decision. I tried to solo a very moderate route once and found that "I just don't have it." But I'm still here and climbing 30+ years later.
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cat t.
climber
california
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Sep 27, 2016 - 07:38am PT
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I think the collective perception of what is "normal" can and does shift. Perhaps because the grades being soloed by a few have been pushed really high, it feels more and more reasonable for the average decent climber to solo easy things. But, like you said, no lives matter to loose blocks. Strength and mountain sense are entirely decoupled, and of course even "mountain sense" matters not at all to the probability governing some crumbling rock.
I suspect the intense marketing of "lifestyle sports" affects how we (the 20-30 somethings) think about our own climbing. I'm sure someone will roll their eyes and say people are stupid for letting the social environment affect how they think--but that's sort of missing the point. Community perceptions permeate the atmosphere of any intense activity. We don't exist (and climbers never really have) in vacuums where decisions are made entirely independently of outside influence.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Sep 27, 2016 - 07:41am PT
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The true soloist is a misanthrope.
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Gary
Social climber
Desolation Basin, Calif.
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Sep 27, 2016 - 07:46am PT
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Right. We all solo, it's just a matter of degree.
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cat t.
climber
california
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Sep 27, 2016 - 07:54am PT
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Of course we all somewhat inadvertently end up soloing 5th class terrain at some point--probably a lot of points, on approaches, descents, or just while playing around on hikes. Perhaps this adds further to a (misguided?) sense of security. We've been unroped on technical terrain without incident so many times, it's easy to start thinking that means that we're skilled and safe. Just because we all do something (originally for the sake of the speed on mountain routes) does not mean we should glorify it or imply that it's more casual than it is.
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Sep 27, 2016 - 08:08am PT
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I had a partner who was super relieved when I got the rope out a couple times on the slabs approach to Half Dome. Likewise, another partner when I didn't unrope as early as many would on the West Ridge of Conness. Likewise when I refused to unrope a threesome near the top of, what is it, Black Magic in the Needles when it gets easy up high?
Yes, people are too casual about it.
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steve s
Trad climber
eldo
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Sep 27, 2016 - 08:42am PT
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For the climber doing the soloing, it should be casual.
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micronut
Trad climber
Fresno/Clovis, ca
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Sep 27, 2016 - 09:05am PT
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I think the OP is right in many ways. There are way too many out there who aren't ready to be soloing who think it is a "rite of passage" or who get pressured to solo along with the "rad kids." I hold soloing in high regard for those who really really have their act together. Nonchalance is a slippery slope.
Our books portray and glorify this, our videos, the history of the Stonemasters, etc...Sketchy solos, bold solos....they are aprt of the history and DNA of our sport.
Its not anybody's fault other than the climber who gets in over his/her head for not doing some real soul searching before heading up there without a rope. True soloists are a rare breed. They possess the skill and the mind for it. Most of us don't. Doing it "sometimes" or when pressured by a group to come along and be rad is a recipe for disaster in my opinion. Freaks me out when I see it.
Watching an amateur solo is a frightening thing to watch.
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RyanD
climber
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Sep 27, 2016 - 09:22am PT
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How do we stop them?!?!?!
Edit-
a life lived soloing on the edge is a shallow life
Lol, k.
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Branscomb
Trad climber
Lander, WY
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Sep 27, 2016 - 10:12am PT
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I used to solo quite a bit when I was considerably younger, stronger, crazier but now, going on 65, don't do much beyond class 3 that way. I don't feel I can trust my body and my head as much as I used to.
One thing I noticed when I was doing more was that there was an element of showing off when other people were around. It was subtle and I came to think of it as a real danger...it would be easy to be sucked in too far over your head...esp soloing with someone else, which I did a few times with Vardanega and I didn't like that aspect of my head...I thought this is what gets you and maybe both of you killed.
So I relegated that aspect of my climbing to strict solitude, where I think it should be, so that I can really consider why I'm doing this climb this way and if the risk is worth it, and have a minimal element of competition in it. I think there's always that latter element in soloing, just because we're human. If you can keep it at a minimum, you're probably a lot better off.
I've heard people bragging about their solo accomplishment(s) and that makes me very uncomfortable, cause I think, wow, I'm going to read about your tragedy, man, and I don't want to. Bragging always betrays a lack of maturity and insight.
What did the person standing behind Caesar say in this ear? All Glory is Fleeting.
I usually tell Kristi where I will be, but not that I will be soloing, because she absolutely hates that. So at least they'll find the carcass. Maybe that's a consolation.
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i-b-goB
Social climber
Wise Acres
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Sep 27, 2016 - 10:19am PT
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Watching an amateur solo is a frightening thing to watch.
Watching a pro solo is a frightening thing to watch, when I think of doing it!
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Matt's
climber
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Sep 27, 2016 - 10:29am PT
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when I think back to the stuff I've solo'd, I think about how I would have climbed it with a rope-- you then realize you'd probably be placing gear every 40 feet--- how much of a safety margin is that actually adding (especially on low-angle, featured terrain)? My point is that, on a climb that you are comfortably able to solo, going from rope to no rope may not be a huge decrease in safety margin....
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micronut
Trad climber
Fresno/Clovis, ca
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Sep 27, 2016 - 10:34am PT
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Obviously we all make our own choices, but those choices are influenced by our friends and community whether we like it or not. If soloing truly has become too casual then we all bear some culpability.
wise words.
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Bad Climber
Trad climber
The Lawless Border Regions
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Topic Author's Reply - Sep 27, 2016 - 10:49am PT
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Interesting points, all, and a valuable discussion, methinks.
I liked Branscomb's observation:
So I relegated that aspect of my climbing to strict solitude, where I think it should be, so that I can really consider why I'm doing this climb this way and if the risk is worth it, and have a minimal element of competition in it.
I think back over my solos. Once a friend convinced me to go unroped on some moderates at Lover's Leap. I was leading mid to hard 10 trad at the time, so I agreed. The hardest we did was The Groove, 5.8. It's got lots of good ledges on it with some interesting moves between. It was okay, but I didn't walk away from that experience thinking, DAMN! I gots to get me more of that! I've soloed some moderate to easy Sierra peaks, stuff like the N. Couloir on Mt. Sill, and I found those much more satisfying, routes where I was totally alone, assessing risks and making my choices without any outside input. I think that process is critical. I've backed off peaks that I found too dangerous or that just FELT wrong, heeding the small voice. My last attempted technical solo was years ago on a 5.7 at City of Rocks, forget which one. I got a few feet off the ground and found something had shifted. An honest assessment told me that whatever I would gain from such a climb wasn't worth the risk. Sharing a route with a rope and a partner, my wife on that trip, was much more soul satisfying than the momentary thrill of an unroped ascent.
This all amounts to some very difficult calculus, and we should not forget in our calculations the hearts of those we leave behind. In my youth, it was almost always just about me. Expected, typical, of course.
"Do nothing in haste; look well to each step; and from the beginning think what may be the end.” Ed Whymper aka A guy who knows what he's talking about....
BAd
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jstan
climber
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Sep 27, 2016 - 10:51am PT
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I suspect the intense marketing of "lifestyle sports" affects how we (the 20-30 somethings)
think about our own climbing.
This specific problem will be self correcting. Affected persons will gradually be winnowed out but in
addition the fad of climbing, like all fads, will ebb. It is what we do to ourselves that is more serious.
Deaths and injuries come as events. We incorrectly think that by having long experience, being good
or by being cautious risk can be made negligible. Events continue to occur no matter how experienced
or able one is. Luck, not you, decides when it will come and when it will not.
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this just in
climber
Justin Ross from North Fork
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Sep 27, 2016 - 11:05am PT
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Anybody who solos for anybody but themselves is missing the point
Yeah, yeah, yeah epic take. If you solo to impress or for a camera you still are soloing for yourself and your ego.
So ekat, what is the point of soloing?
I for one love watching soloing and seeing pics.
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JLP
Social climber
The internet
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Sep 27, 2016 - 11:19am PT
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More soloing deaths = fewer climbers getting in my way.
It's been going on a long time, longer than anyone here. I would say it's NOT scaling with the increase in participants. There will always be dumb asses. Nothing you can do about it but enjoy the show, IMO.
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survival
Big Wall climber
Terrapin Station
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Sep 27, 2016 - 11:45am PT
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John Gill set a bad example....
I love soloing. TAKE!!
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SuperTopo on the Web
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