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Messages 1 - 16 of total 16 in this topic |
JEleazarian
Trad climber
Fresno CA
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Nov 30, 2015 - 10:09am PT
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To help design a new plan, public comments regarding what should be included are being taken by the park through January 29.
I have been involved in the public planning process for Yosemite for almost 40 years now, and it will probably be a cold day in hell before the NPS takes true public comment into consideration. It does, however, listen to comments of organizations with some lobbying skill. The AAC and Access Fund have done yeoman's work looking out for our interests as climbers. Matters such as this Plan revision underscore how those organizations deserve our support.
John
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c wilmot
climber
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Nov 30, 2015 - 11:06am PT
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I have never encountered a worse culture of nepotism and corruption as I experienced working for the NPS in Yosemite doing trail work.
Its unlikely anything will actually change. The people running the show are shadier than a used car salesman and far more incompetent
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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Nov 30, 2015 - 11:11am PT
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Ah ha....maybe with a little coordinated effort we can get the cables removed from HD. Whoa....time to wake up I must have been dreaming!
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Bruce Morris
Social climber
Belmont, California
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Nov 30, 2015 - 12:13pm PT
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It's like an advertisement for a professorship at Stanford: The law says the university must advertise the position, but the real decision has already been made elsewhere up the hierarchy.
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healyje
Trad climber
Portland, Oregon
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Nov 30, 2015 - 02:45pm PT
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Well, if you want to exterminate via ferratas in NA before they really take hold then you have to start somewhere.
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Risk
Mountain climber
Olympia, WA
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Nov 30, 2015 - 07:23pm PT
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The good news is that any "management plan" for the Yosemite Wilderness will remain irrelevant because few people ever visit most of it, and "wilderness management" is only people management.
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hossjulia
Trad climber
Carson City, NV
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Nov 30, 2015 - 07:26pm PT
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What the heck, I put in my 2 cents worth in regards to stock use and the High Sierra Camps. Time for those babies to go! [Edited to clarify, the camps. Stock use can and should continue in a responsible manner, but supplying those camps via stock use is excessive]
Typical drunk while posting responses I see. Such cynicism changes nothing you know.
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c wilmot
climber
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Nov 30, 2015 - 07:44pm PT
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I put in my 2 cents worth in regards to stock use and the High Sierra Camps
The stock will never go as the trail crews in the backcountry are dependent upon them. The only reason the 800 miles of trails in YOS is kept relatively clear of downfall is because of the parks sawyers who use stock and chainsaws to get the job done
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Risk
Mountain climber
Olympia, WA
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Nov 30, 2015 - 08:07pm PT
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The stock will never go as the trail crews in the backcountry are dependent upon them. The only reason the 800 miles of trails in YOS is kept relatively clear of downfall is because of the parks sawyers who use stock and chainsaws to get the job done
Correct. Trails in YNP were built for and with stock animal support. If you don't like stock, go off trail. It an historic use, well established way before"backpackers" and such. I used to think differently, but did a little research on it back in the 80's.
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c wilmot
climber
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Nov 30, 2015 - 08:13pm PT
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Perhaps you should understand^^^ the NPS packs in gear from the 120/tioga road? they dont go onto sections like that
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donini
Trad climber
Ouray, Colorado
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Nov 30, 2015 - 08:20pm PT
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TMJessie you make a good argument with one notable flaw. Your pictures show true wilderness devoid of people. Unfortunately, the powers that be have seen fit to designate Half Dome and surrounding environs as wilderness...I'm sure you have seen pictures of hundreds of people ass to nose ascending the cable route.
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Risk
Mountain climber
Olympia, WA
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Nov 30, 2015 - 09:02pm PT
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Mr. Donini, Good point. But true wilderness enthusiasts probably needn't worry much about most of the Park. Yeah, Half Dome, LYV, Cathedral Lakes, Vogelsang and Lyell Canyon need babysitting and management. From 30,000' it all looks the same. I'll confess, I'de like to see Half Dome open to a least twice as many, and scrap the "Wilderness" designation,since management as a such is unrealistic. It's managed as part of "Valley District," not the Wilderness Unit, last I knew. Valley LEO patrol the Half Dome Trail and LYV, not the YNP Wilderness patrol; they're separate for obvious reasons.
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mongrel
Trad climber
Truckee, CA
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Nov 30, 2015 - 10:25pm PT
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TMJ, the problem isn't any equestrian use, it's the incredibly heavy use that is needed to run the commercial camps. That can be reduced by a huge proportion; resource values could be perfectly well protected and improved without need to eliminate stock entirely. If you walk the trails up to any of those camps, they're giant wide thrashed highways with rocks etc. exposed. Go 100 yards past the camp, where small groups of riders are regularly encountered, and the trail is just like a hiking trail: narrow, dirt is much more stable, few obstacles.
I'm happy to go off trail all the time, but not everyone can. We had aged in-laws with us once and had to completely abandon hiking on any of the trails in Tuolumne that go to the high camps because they were just too hazardous. The "established use" line is just so much manure: intensive grazing of thousands of sheep throughout the high country was an established use way long ago too, but fortunately we've had the sense to tone that down. Same with the 50-animal pack trains. They're going to go, why not sooner than later.
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Reilly
Mountain climber
The Other Monrovia- CA
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Nov 30, 2015 - 10:30pm PT
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I attended a conference in Yosemit the Park Service put on to this effect
in 1975. I guess they didn't get it fingered out. Of course, that's the
way bureaucracies roll. If they ever did get stuff done they'd be done.
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hossjulia
Trad climber
Carson City, NV
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Nov 30, 2015 - 10:30pm PT
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Thank you Mongrel, that is the gist of what I wrote to the NPS on the subject.
I spent a summer working at a pack station just so I could see what the hullaballo was all about regarding stock use in the wilderness. I love to trail ride and wanted to see for myself.
The High Sierra Camps have served their purpose. Absolutely the concessionaire should be allowed to do private pack trips for folks who can't access THEIR wilderness any other way.
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